Esquestria: The House of the Sun - A pony cultist experience

BirdBodhisattva · Jul 9, 2021

Dear reader! Whether you are new here, archive-reading and whatnot, or you are already someone who has been with us for quite a while, I would like to say a few words that I believe are best kept close to mind.

-This is an MLP quest. And more importantly, none of us are gratuitously cruel. So good things will happen on this quest, and I hope that enough good things have already happened to prove that.
-This is also a horror quest, so bad things will happen. Bad things might happen to good characters if you are not able to protect them, and you most certainly will not be able to intervene if you lack the tools to do so.
-And finally, this is a quest in which you jostle with powers greater than yourself, with all that it entails.

Please, do keep those things in mind as you go forward. But ultimately, this is also a quest in which it is hoped we all have fun! So if any of the above points is not exactly your cup of tea, or somehow make the experience as a whole "not worth it", then this quest might not be for you. Which is fine! Individual tastes are a thing, so don't think any more about it if you don't want to read anymore. And regardless, I hope you have a lovely day!

Kaelor said:
PSA for whoever needs to hear it:

Readers should take their own mental health into consideration when voting and not subject themselves to triggering narrative elements like rape or constant mental torture of a friend just for the Greatest Good of a world that doesn't exist.

If those are fine for you or Regrettable is even more triggering, then GREAT! More power to you. But you aren't a bad or selfish person for picking the option that keeps the characters you've emotionally connected with safe. [REDACTED for spoiler warning]

This is a high intensity quest that doesn't hold back when it comes to horror and negative consequences. Take care of yourself.

(Quote slightly edited to avoid spoilers)

Greymere · Jan 14, 2024

Earth-Destroyer said:
A Mitl can cast reflection of the Tapestry and guard the family and that is about it. We already have 3 people that cast RotT without issues, and we do not need them to Guard the family is we control the town. So they seem overall usless save as expedition fodder. Not to mention the whole 55 bits cost we cannot pay when we have 2 names to summons.

'Controlling the town', whatever you think that means, isn't going to help when Windigos come knocking on our door. MitLs, with their Edge 3 and general status of not being an actual person who would die-die when they hit 0 Health, would. Also you seem to have forgotten that Stormchaser isn't even in Ponyville half the time.

Also 1) there's literally always more stuff we can scry. Specific artifacts, scouting expedition sites, keeping an eye on Copper & Windy, cheating at our job...

And 2) taking RotT duty off of Jade means she'd then be free to do things like research the Memory of Light ritual or work on developing new ones.

Earth-Destroyer · Jan 14, 2024

Pittauro said:
and if they're so low value, maybe they're just not worth pursuing.

Lets see fixing Scootaloo wings requires at least 2 actions, 1 spent on investigating why they don't work, and another of casting the ritual to fix them. The reward for which Rainbow Dash as an instant confidant. We could have done the investigating action at any time, but never have because we have other more important actions to be doing. The ritual to increase Health which we know exists, but have never researched and developed because our existing confidants always have other higher priority tasks to be doing.

Pittauro said:
and again, we're really unlikely to pursue more than 1 of the new good friends we'd get anyway, because turning a good friend into a confidant is a non negligible investment in effort and resources. And I speak as the one who made the plan that made Rarity our confidant.

Velvet assisted by Mareinette rock a full +80 re-rolling to make the jump from Good Friend to Confident, that can handle almost anything even DC 150 have over 60% chance of passing. We could easily raise 2 of the 4 to confidante in a single turn, for the cost of 2 AP from Velvet and 1 from Mareinette.

Greymere said:
'Controlling the town', whatever you think that means, isn't going to help when Windigos come knocking on our door. MitLs, with their Edge 3 and general status of not being an actual person who would die-die when they hit 0 Health, would. Also you seem to have forgotten that Stormchaser isn't even in Ponyville half the time.

Sure would be nice if the the town was fortified by the lores, and warded aginst Windigos, and the new people coming into the town where vetted by people that know about the lores, and can catch trouble makers before they start thing. All of which would be easy to arrange with control over the town.

Pittauro · Jan 14, 2024

Talon TigerDino said:
Also random brain blast: since Bird puts actions in the order that benefits us most, should Twilight be unlocked from Acquaintance, then she would be promptly rocketed up to Good Friend. Which would be insane.

let's be reasonable. She's already invited, that bonus wouldn't apply to her. Even if unlocked it's possible she'd keep at acquaintance. MAYBE at "friend" if we really roll well and/or are lucky.

Talon TigerDino said:
Technically it's a ???, but practically people said, "That's a book," and Bird went, "Yeah, it's a book." I think the ??? is for everything else that happens while exploring the Archives.

Thanks for catching my vote error though, I'll be sure to take care of it.

I wonder... with Cadance being that much closer to us, couldn't we just... ask her for more favours, to get things like lore book? Surely between our position and between the princesses' favour we could just ask us to let them into the Royal Archives for personal research? We have plenty of excuses we could use for why we're in there, things like "I want to research Princess Luna's history" to "maybe there's some past reports about the changelings and other threats, and I'm good at finding out stuff".

And in terms of expeditions, we can find them through Bureau actions too, right?

Void_510 said:
We don't use the spare ap we have now. Rarity has focused on her work for 2 turns and Jade is currently resting.

Earth-Destroyer said:
A Mitl can cast reflection of the Tapestry and guard the family and that is about it. We already have 3 people that cast RotT without issues, and we do not need them to Guard the family is we control the town. So they seem overall usless save as expedition fodder.

We don't know if they have other skills. That said, while both Jade and Baldomare could in theory do Tapestry rituals, in practice we might want to have them do other stuff.

We'll want one of them to work on the MEmory of Light research, for example. Baldomare can also, at the very least, give us scraps of lore.

And if we reach 4/4 scraps of lantern lore (so 2 lessons and one influence), Baldomare can give us Sacrament at a reasonable cost too, so there's that.

and Jade, THE RITUALIST, is obviously the best one suited to come up with new rituals too.

Pittauro · Jan 14, 2024

Earth-Destroyer said:
Lets see fixing Scootaloo wings requires at least 2 actions, 1 spent on investigating why they don't work, and another of casting the ritual to fix them. The reward for which Rainbow Dash as an instant confidant. We could have done the investigating action at any time, but never have because we have other more important actions to be doing. The ritual to increase Health which we know exists, but have never researched and developed because our existing confidants always have other higher priority tasks to be doing.

Velvet assisted by Mareinette rock a full +80 re-rolling to make the jump from Good Friend to Confident, that can handle almost anything even DC 150 have over 60% chance of passing. We could easily raise 2 of the 4 to confidante in a single turn, for the cost of 2 AP from Velvet and 1 from Mareinette.

It's not just a matter of rolls, it's a matter of narrative. Come up with a plan that will make those ponies so grateful they'll become confidants, then we'll talk.

I have some vague ideas if it comes down to it (Cherilee would likely care about school improvements/new facilities, which we might be able to nudge the Mayor into granting. The Mayor might like more funding from Canterlot, which we might nudge Cadance or other nobles to grant as well MAYBE. Filthy Rich MIGHT become a confidant if we push for good deals with our family through Pride...), but nothing I think we're likely to do in the short to medium term anyway.

And I'll remind you that IC we don't know about Scootaloo being connected to Dash.

WHY do we know that a health ritual exists? I mean, I assume it's possible, but how are you certain of it? And if you go by game mechanics you first had to train physically to reach 4 health before using lores to reach 5.

The cost of 2 Velvet APs and 1 Mareinette AP is NOT low. not when we have more mansus exploration to do, the SH sacrament and the following exploration leading to the House of the Moon, the Frangiclave, and so on.

Earth-Destroyer said:
Sure would be nice if the the town was fortified by the lores, and warded aginst Windigos, and the new people coming into the town where vetted by people that know about the lores, and can catch trouble makers before they start thing. All of which would be easy to arrange with control over the town.

this is just wishful thinking. If you want the town to be lore-enhanced, then you DEFINITELY need to first introduce the Lores to the princesses. I very much doubt lore-fortifications are possible without that.

Void_510 · Jan 14, 2024

Earth-Destroyer said:
Lets see fixing Scootaloo wings requires at least 2 actions, 1 spent on investigating why they don't work, and another of casting the ritual to fix them. The reward for which Rainbow Dash as an instant confidant. We could have done the investigating action at any time, but never have because we have other more important actions to be doing.

Said fixing is locked behind the same arguments to why we haven't fixed ourselves, Shining, or Twilight. If modern pony medicine could do it it probably wouldn't be an issue.

The ritual to increase Health which we know exists, but have never researched and developed because our existing confidants always have other higher priority tasks to be doing.
Velvet assisted by Mareinette rock a full +80 re-rolling to make the jump from Good Friend to Confident, that can handle almost anything even DC 150 have over 60% chance of passing. We could easily raise 2 of the 4 to confidante in a single turn, for the cost of 2 AP from Velvet and 1 from Mareinette.

3 AP we're not going to be spending any time soon considering everything else we plan on doing. Between the book, Axe, and whatever Biedde wants we will be locked down action wise for the next 3-4 turns.

Saidoro · Jan 14, 2024

[X] "Cadance, both you and Shining sent invitations to Twilight. But maybe we should… check on her in person?" (???)
[X] "Your dress is good. But it could be better. I know a mare..." (Involve Rarity in dressmaking. Applies Rarity's Lore levels)
[X] You will spend a long time with Cadance. Whisper a few Lore-secrets, here and there. (???)
[X] "Cadance, do you mind if I put a few Names on the list…?" (Invite all Names who are summoned on Turn 19 / ???)

Greymere · Jan 14, 2024

Earth-Destroyer said:
Sure would be nice if the the town was fortified by the lores, and warded aginst Windigos, and the new people coming into the town where vetted by people that know about the lores, and can catch trouble makers before they start thing. All of which would be easy to arrange with control over the town.

Ah yes, I'm sure all these things, which would take a hell of a lot of turns to actually implement if it's even possible in the first place, will definitely help with defending against supernatural monsters sent by people living in a completely different city to attack an estate that's not actually in the main part of town. As opposed to just having guards, which we already know and are capable of summoning, that can kill said supernatural monsters.

Seriously, if you want that level of control over Ponyville's residents, it'd be easier to just have Mareinette found a capital-C Cult that we manage through her. I would argue it wouldn't be a good idea (I'd argue it's a pretty bad one, in fact), but it's more plausible than what you're trying to argue for.

Talon TigerDino · Jan 14, 2024

Also why do people keep saying that the ship has sailed on controlling the town's growth? Keeping the Bureau out and away from any of our personal eldritch shenanigans was an example of controlling the town's growth. It doesn't stop any further shaping of the town in any form, we just haven't received another prompt for such decisions yet. For example we will definitely want to minimize any inflow from Manehatten to keep their "criminal elements" out of Ponyville as well.

Also if there's no Bureau in Ponyville and we get the local government in our pocket then we're pretty free and clear in terms of worrying about Suspicion.

Aranfan · Jan 14, 2024

Solace2117 said:
Also as far I can tell Good Friends do not get AP. They can assist Velvet with what she's doing, but they don't do stuff by themselves until they are Confidants. As I've said I don't think the pick is terrible, just not in a clearing out backlog or controlling Ponyville kind of way. Saves us an action with Applejack. Do we need to reduce suspicion, we can talk to Mayor Mare. Can we think of a local business deal, our good friend Filthy Rich could help. All useful to have, but would still require an action on Velvet's part.
Really it could be in an interesting scene with all the Ponyville people at the party, though I think I prefer the Rarity option a little more. I've made my opinion on the Twilight choice pretty clear. Really the bridesmaid choice I'm not as interested in, but I think it's the one that makes the most sense considering considering Cadence's opinion of Velvet

We get free friendship AP now, which means putting a bunch of people up to Good Friend gets us a steady stream of compents.

Solace2117 · Jan 14, 2024

Aranfan said:
We get free friendship AP now, which means putting a bunch of people up to Good Friend gets us a steady stream of compents.

We get 1 per turn. Which we are probably going to use to raise our current Confidants lore levels. Even if we use it for those in town, we are still talking about investing potentially multiple turns to raise one to Confidant.

Earth-Destroyer · Jan 14, 2024

Greymere said:
Ah yes, I'm sure all these things, which would take a hell of a lot of turns to actually implement if it's even possible in the first place, will definitely help with defending against supernatural monsters sent by people living in a completely different city to attack an estate that's not actually in the main part of town. As opposed to just having guards, which we already know and are capable of summoning, that can kill said supernatural monsters.

Controlling the town when we have the most important political person Mayor Mare, the wealthiest person Filthy Rich, the towns most respected member Applejack, and by extenuation the Apple family the largest industry of the town, and the the School teacher that will be influence the younger generation, and by extension all the parents. That is a Soft power on the level that most dictatorships, wish they had.

Aranfan · Jan 14, 2024

Solace2117 said:
We get 1 per turn. Which we are probably going to use to raise our current Confidants lore levels. Even if we use it for those in town, we are still talking about investing potentially multiple turns to raise one to Confidant.

... no? last I checked we couldn't use the friendship AP on raising confidant lore levels? @Ericwinter did I miss this?

Toboe · Jan 14, 2024

Aranfan said:
... no? last I checked we couldn't use the friendship AP on raising confidant lore levels? @Ericwinter did I miss this?

Yes, Bird changed that. Originally we couldn't, but now we can.

See the social part of the free action in turn 18 options:

BirdBodhisattva said:
Pick ONE social/teaching action, for your free time at home.
-[] [SOCIAL] Spend time with Cheerilee, your daughter's schoolteacher.
-[] [SOCIAL] Spend time with Mayor Mare, the de-factor ruler of Ponyville.
-[] [SOCIAL] Spend time with Filthy Rich, a well-to-do and wealthy businesspony.
-[] [SOCIAL] Spend time with Applejack, daughter of the Apple Clan and older sister to your daughter's friend.
-[] [SOCIAL] Go into town and try to meet somepony interesting.

-[] [SOCIAL] Teach Rarity, and make her a Disciple.
-[] [SOCIAL] Teach Jade, and make her a Seeker.
-[] [SOCIAL] Teach Fluttershy, and make her a Disciple.
~~-[] [SOCIAL] Teach your family the Lores.~~ (Requires "all Lores" to be Level 4 or higher, affects your entire family)

Solace2117 · Jan 14, 2024

Earth-Destroyer said:
Controlling the town when we have the most important political person Mayor Mare, the wealthiest person Filthy Rich, the towns most respected member Applejack, and by extenuation the Apple family the largest industry of the town, and the the School teacher that will be influence the younger generation, and by extension all the parents. That is a Soft power on the level that most dictatorships, wish they had.

We're upgrading them to good friends not minions. Still useful, but not to that extent.

Pittauro · Jan 14, 2024

Aranfan said:
... no? last I checked we couldn't use the friendship AP on raising confidant lore levels? @Ericwinter did I miss this?

Toboe said:
Yes, Bird changed that. Originally we couldn't, but now we can.

See the social part of the free action in turn 18 options:

Ideally I'd like to raise both Jade and Rarity next turn.

Rarity for her career. Jade because we'll either use her for Tapestry or for Memory of Light, and either of those would benefit immensely from the Reroll

Greymere · Jan 14, 2024

Earth-Destroyer said:
Controlling the town when we have the most important political person Mayor Mare, the wealthiest person Filthy Rich, the towns most respected member Applejack, and by extenuation the Apple family the largest industry of the town, and the the School teacher that will be influence the younger generation, and by extension all the parents. That is a Soft power on the level that most dictatorships, wish they had.

1) I think you're severely overestimating their reach, ability, and willingness to do the things you seemingly want them to do.

2) You didn't answer my question, which is how does any of that actually help defend us against the things that are a danger to us? Because I'm not seeing anything that will prevent supernatural monsters from another city (who, as a reminder, have a minimum of a +55 combat modifier vs. your average pony's +8) from bashing in our door? Nor does it protect us or our family from killing rituals.

3) None of this is actually feasible on the timescales we're working with. Even if the "Good Friends" option manages to eke out a win here, we're still talking at least a further 4 AP to actually get them to Confidant, nevermind how much time and effort it would take on their part to exert that much control over the town.

Aranfan said:
... no? last I checked we couldn't use the friendship AP on raising confidant lore levels? @Ericwinter did I miss this?

Well that literally what we used it for this turn so... yes?

Pittauro · Jan 14, 2024

Greymere said:
3) None of this is actually feasible on the timescales we're working with. Even if the "Good Friends" option manages to eke out a win here, we're still talking at least a further 4 AP to actually get them to Confidant, nevermind how much time and effort it would take of their part to exert that much control over the town.

and that's conservative. It might take more.

Void_510 · Jan 14, 2024

Let's take a step back and take a top down view of this.

Ponyville - We have consistently not involved ourselves in becoming a power in town even if we are in a soft way because we're just that good and connected. We chose not to house the Bureau here.

My recommendation is to suborn our little brother and let him run Ponyville however he wants as our confidante because I do not want to switch to playing Simcity this late in the game. This solves so many problems regarding security and doesn't require much AP on our part. I mean it, I would rather leash him than leave him alone.

Friends and confidantes - We've moved beyond Ponyville. We should be focusing on our counterparts in Celestia's government. If we do that we have potentially 2 free actions to work on them, one social and one Bureau. We should be also picking up targeted other people as needed.

While I would like to collect all the bearers it's not needed, our counterparts are.

Bits - We could use one more revenue stream. People seem to think we could monetize the Apple farm in a deal so get Apple jack. Otherwise come up with a business. We are going to be starting expeditions maybe we will find stuff to sell.

Expeditions - Our Servants are good for looking for mundane expeditions safely. Which might get stuff to sell or maybe we can start our own book series like Daring Do. Which would get us bits. Otherwise we have a bunch of stuff we're currently looking for and once that is done we should regularly go on expeditions.

Where we are headed - Full steam for Glory. We took a huge turn when we decided to raise Luna ourselves and we've made many sacrifices in other areas to do so safely. But in doing so we concentrated on our own lores and that is our strength now more than ever.
We should double down on that. Get scraps from our summons, get sacraments, surround ourselves with the most badass ponys of yore who survived the death of the gods and gain their loyalty so we don't have to keep resummoning them (or they refuse to be summoned by anyone not us).
Become the final boss.

Aranfan · Jan 14, 2024

Toboe said:
Yes, Bird changed that. Originally we couldn't, but now we can.

See the social part of the free action in turn 18 options:

Goddamnit.

Pittauro · Jan 14, 2024

Void_510 said:
Bits - We could use one more revenue stream. People seem to think we could monetize the Apple farm in a deal so get Apple jack. Otherwise come up with a business. We are going to be starting expeditions maybe we will find stuff to sell.

and of course between Rarity 4/2 and the dressmaking option apparently going to win, we're already raising our income some.

Void_510 said:
Expeditions - Our Servants are good for looking for mundane expeditions safely. Which might get stuff to sell or maybe we can start our own book series like Daring Do. Which would get us bits. Otherwise we have a bunch of stuff we're currently looking for and once that is done we should regularly go on expeditions.

and both Mareinette and Axe are good enough to do expeditions on their own.

I don't think writing books is really an option though. too time-consuming.

Void_510 said:
Where we are headed - Full steam for Glory. We took a huge turn when we decided to raise Luna ourselves and we've made many sacrifices in other areas to do so safely. But in doing so we concentrated on our own lores and that is our strength now more than ever.
We should double down on that. Get scraps from our summons, get sacraments, surround ourselves with the most badass ponys of yore who survived the death of the gods and gain their loyalty so we don't have to keep resummoning them (or they refuse to be summoned by anyone not us).
Become the final boss.

there's also the other two "endings" we can and SHOULD pursue.

Jade/Baldomare will take care of Memory of Light, and we'll see what comes up after it. Having Luna on our side (hopefully), as well as Cadance, will hopefully help there.

and with 2 more actions we'll get our SH sacrament, which means we'll be able to go up the Tower that reaches the moon, and then we'll see what comes up next there as well.

Talon TigerDino · Jan 14, 2024

I mean, the current timescale of the game is, LUNA followed by a metric ton of question marks. In terms of Glory we have run headfirst into the universe's strongest lock. Since the rush has failed it's time to develop the board state, so to speak. And besides, I just want enough friends to kick-start our own ponyville cult while in Canterlot we run the anti-not-us-occult-police. The idea amuses me far more than something like the one-off being the Maid of Honor. It's not like we don't hammer the Cadence button every time it comes up already.

Void_510 · Jan 14, 2024

Pittauro said:
and both Mareinette and Axe are good enough to do expeditions on their own.

I don't think writing books is really an option though. too time-consuming.

I'm not saying we write them ourselves. Get a good writer, take them on some low level expeditions with us maybe befriend them and take them with us on any expedition, or narrate an expedition trip for them to write. People are probably very interested in us right now.

there's also the other two "endings" we can and SHOULD pursue.

Jade/Baldomare will take care of Memory of Light, and we'll see what comes up after it. Having Luna on our side (hopefully), as well as Cadance, will hopefully help there.

and with 2 more actions we'll get our SH sacrament, which means we'll be able to go up the Tower that reaches the moon, and then we'll see what comes up next there as well.

I think we should investigate them but I don't think we should pursue them. Blood of the Outsider and then Glory should be our main focus.

TheWave · Jan 14, 2024

[X] "I would be honored to be the maid of honor." (Become closer to Cadance)
[X] "Your dress is good. But it could be better. I know a mare..." (Involve Rarity in dressmaking. Applies Rarity's Lore levels)
[X] "But none of them are nobles. Are you sure I can invite them?" (Increase all non-locked ponies in your Contacts list to Good Friends)

Void_510 · Jan 14, 2024

Talon TigerDino said:
I mean, the current timescale of the game is, LUNA followed by a metric ton of question marks. In terms of Glory we have run headfirst into the universe's strongest lock. Since the rush has failed it's time to develop the board state, so to speak. And besides, I just want enough friends to kick-start our own ponyville cult while in Canterlot we run the anti-not-us-occult-police. The idea amuses me far more than something like the one-off being the Maid of Honor. It's not like we don't hammer the Cadence button every time it comes up already.

I would rather make the Bureau our own Lore fueled anti-not-us-cult cult. Without splitting our AP on making a new cult. In Dresden terms we will be the White Council and we will be setting the Laws.

Greymere · Jan 14, 2024

Void_510 said:
I'm not saying we write them ourselves. Get a good writer, take them on some low level expeditions with us maybe befriend them and take them with us on any expedition, or narrate an expedition trip for them to write. People are probably very interested in us right now.

I think we should investigate them but I don't think we should pursue them. Blood of the Outsider and then Glory should be our main focus.

So what you're saying is that we should make friends with Daring Do?

Anyway. I feel like at this point distinguishing between investigating the other endings and pursuing them is a matter of splitting hairs. The only way to learn more about them right now is to follow the paths we have found and see where they lead.

Esquestria: The House of the Sun - A pony cultist experience

A bodhisattva, by definition, must die to move on.

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