Burden of the Emerald Empire (A Legend of the Five Rings Tale)

Important or imported?
Imported, my bad.

Theoretically, Hisao owns all the Jade. In practice He takes about half the mined jade to give to the Crab and keeps about half a percent for himself. So gifting Jade is possible, but the Shadowlands isn't really something that most of them will take seriously as its outside their experience. (The Ivory Kingdoms will, but they are probably the foreign power that has the most experience with the Emerald Empire)

Yes balancing things is a bit of a trick. (The Unicorn could have managed it...but well...)
 
If we go with Kyuden Hida is there any counter-measures we could employ to prevent this from happening?
Yes but its hard to keep the inquistors from causing diplomatic incidents with people who know about the taint. We should probably keep the Kuni far, far away from strangers.
Anyway there was a universally strong case for the Doji.
[X] Accept the Ambassadors and hold winter court in Medinaat al Salaam (Potential risk greatly heightened)
[X] Kyuden Doji (Crane)
 
Huh. The three clans with the most experience getting along with outsiders are the Mantis, the Unicorn, and the Scorpion.

...none of which are available.

All right, then.

[X] Accept the Ambassadors in Rokugan proper at your normal winter court (-5 Lion, Crane, Phoenix +5 Mantis, Crab, Unicorn)
[X] Kyuden Doji (Crane)

I like the idea of Medinaat al Salaam being a city set aside for interacting with foreigners, and playing the Hong Kong game with it. In the long run, I think that might work well. In the short run, though.... Well, @keenscythe makes a good point. "Let's receive your foreign dignitaries in this gutted shell of a once-prosperous city" isn't a particularly good image to present, even without the logistical and security issues. Maybe if we had a few more years to build it back up things would be different, but we really don't.

As far as who controls it goes, I'm somewhat inclined to split it up into sections and divvy it out to multiple clans. I'd rather have different clans trying different strategies with little pieces of the place, rather than having one Clan heavily invested in one part. It gives more opportunities to let ideas from the outside word filter back into Rokugan proper. Then we can shuffle around who gets what bits based on who's succeeding and who's failing. Possibly open up another Champion position for external diplomacy, and have that Champion be the one in charge of the city as a whole. Not sure quite what the test should look like, admittedly.
 
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[X] Accept the Ambassadors and hold winter court in Medinaat al Salaam(Potential risk greatly heightened)
[X] Kyuden Doji (Crane)
 
Its kind of funny how basically everyone looks at the Dragon and goes "I dunno lol" except for the Crane, who recommends them(second to the Crane of course)
 
Admittedly, the Dragon are pretty good at playing "inscrutable". They have all sorts of experience being sort of confusing and alien. It's an *amusing" strategy, but I don't know that it's the *best* strategy.
 
As far as who controls it goes, I'm somewhat inclined to split it up into sections and divvy it out to multiple clans. I'd rather have different clans trying different strategies with little pieces of the place, rather than having one Clan heavily invested in one part. It gives more opportunities to let ideas from the outside word filter back into Rokugan proper. Then we can shuffle around who gets what bits based on who's succeeding and who's failing. Possibly open up another Champion position for external diplomacy, and have that Champion be the one in charge of the city as a whole. Not sure quite what the test should look like, admittedly.

I feel this is objectively the absolute worst way of handling the city. This is just going to piss the people off to no end.

You don't want a conquered people to feel like they are being further divided and weakened. Even if the city itself is a festering cesspool of infighting it is a familiar festering cesspool that they're familiar and comfortable with. Making them feel like they have no control like that is just going to make them push back harder.

You also want a unified methodology for handling the natives. Even if the method turns out objectively wrong it is something that the native people can focus on and be changed by us fairly quickly if necessary. Juggling eight (or however many) different methods is just going to create confusion, resentment, eight (or however many) ways the people are going to be angry, and absolute chaos. And honestly are we going to expect any of the Clans to be actually tactful? Except the Unicorn or the Scorpion (and they'll be bitches about it).

We need certainty in administrating conquered territory. Even if that certainty is just a military dictatorship. Change can be made but has to be focused and deliberately paced. Trying to make it a multilateral social experiment will bite us in the ass in so many ways and end with everyone in tears.

...edit...

While the Champion idea is not bad if you experiment first everything will fall apart before s/he gets anywhere near the city.
 
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I'm not sure to what extent I agree with Wang but I do think that dividing a city is a terrible way to govern. Just ask East and West Berlin.
 
I like the idea of Medinaat al Salaam being a city set aside for interacting with foreigners, and playing the Hong Kong game with it. In the long run, I think that might work well. In the short run, though.... Well, @keenscythe makes a good point. "Let's receive your foreign dignitaries in this gutted shell of a once-prosperous city" isn't a particularly good image to present, even without the logistical and security issues. Maybe if we had a few more years to build it back up things would be different, but we really don't.
Can you tell me why you think we should do it host it there anyway? There might be something obvious I am overlooking

With the worry of having people tainted and our Advisors are sure that the Crane could give off the Image we want to present, I'll switch to them.
The Crab have enough on their plate so adding worrying about Gaijin Diplomacy might be a bit much.

Hopefully we can swing a higher than normal Portion of Ide Diplomats at this winter court, cuz yeah, the Unicorn would normally be perfect for this.

[X] Accept the Ambassadors in Rokugan proper at your normal winter court (-5 Lion, Crane, Phoenix +5 Mantis, Crab, Unicorn)
[X] Kyuden Doji (Crane)

Edit: I wonder if can make a jewelled champion position whose sole job is to help manage foreign affairs.
Maybe the Diamond Champion?
 
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I feel this is objectively the absolute worst way of handling the city. This is just going to piss the people off to no end.

You don't want a conquered people to feel like they are being further divided and weakened. Even if the city itself is a festering cesspool of infighting it is a familiar festering cesspool that they're familiar and comfortable with. Making them feel like they have no control like that is just going to make them push back harder.

You also want a unified methodology for handling the natives. Even if the method turns out objectively wrong it is something that the native people can focus on and be changed by us fairly quickly if necessary. Juggling eight (or however many) different methods is just going to create confusion, resentment, eight (or however many) ways the people are going to be angry, and absolute chaos. And honestly are we going to expect any of the Clans to be actually tactful? Except the Unicorn or the Scorpion (and they'll be bitches about it).

We need certainty in administrating conquered territory. Even if that certainty is just a military dictatorship. Change can be made but has to be focused and deliberately paced. Trying to make it a multilateral social experiment will bite us in the ass in so many ways and end with everyone in tears.

...edit...

While the Champion idea is not bad if you experiment first everything will fall apart before s/he gets anywhere near the city.

I think that depends on how many people are left there of the original populace. I was under the impression that everyone was basically already dead. The Shadow Dragon isn't the gentlest of conquerors. If the place has been basically emptied out, then setting it up with different clans in charge of different quarters could work out fine. If the place still has most of its populace and a decent chunk of its original power groups, then yeah, I'll agree that a single leader is the way to go.

...and the point of it wasn't to try to make Medinaat al Salaam itself work well. The point was to use it as a testbed for generating ideas on governance that we can bring back to Rokugan proper.

Can you tell me why you think we should do it host it there anyway? There might be something obvious I am overlooking
That was me messing up and copy/pasting without fully reading the vote that I copy/pasted. Fixed now.
 
Another tally then, a tally for the masses.
Adhoc vote count started by gman391 on Feb 26, 2018 at 7:41 PM, finished with 33 posts and 8 votes.
 
Fun fact, if you discount the votes of people who want to meet at Medinaat al Salaam we've still got a four way tie for where in Rokugan we meet.
Who are you going to handle this?
Near as I can tell even if I did discount Deadly Snark, that would still leave Kyuden Doji with two?
Which isn't really the vote margin I want, but momentum is a thing.
 
Fun fact, if you discount the votes of people who want to meet at Medinaat al Salaam we've still got a four way tie for where in Rokugan we meet.
Who are you going to handle this?
You are incorrect. I hadn't meant to vote for Medinaat al Salaam, and changed my vote when it was pointed out. I too support the Crane.

Ironically, if I hadn't realized that and edited vote, we'd be tied *two* ways.
 
Year 5: Winter Court I
-Receive the Ambassadors within the Emerald Empire.
--Kyuden Doji.

Month of the Rat

There were a lot of words used for Kyuden Doji, not one of them was 'unimpressive'. Though the Crane had grumbled somewhat about you letting the foreigners onto Rokugani soul, they had gone all out in preparing for you and for them. The stately walls of the palace rose out of the famed Gardens of the Crane as if it belonged there, the entire landscape shaped so that the idea of the castle not being there was as laughable as the idea of man flying on his own. The castle proper had no defences but the immense walls that surrounded it and the port city a few miles away had made it so that the castle had no need to. (Not that Daidoji didn't have plans to turn the Gardens into death traps you were sure.)

There had been some questions of protocol, but the Doji had partnered with a few of the Ide to come to a...solution. The Pelmyrian, Yodotai and Senpet Ambassadors had said that they would not kowtow to a foreign Emperor who did not rule them. The Pelmyrian had rather rudely said that she wouldn't even kneel to her own Tsar, by what right did you command her to?

By the right that they were in your Empire, had been the response from most people. It had seem a stand off until Doji Domotai had stepped in, and offered a challenge to the three reticent ambassadors. If they could beat a Rokugani who did serve you, they would not have to kow-tow. It was a dangerous game, but the arrogance of the Yodotai and Senpet had worked against them, and the Pelmyrian...
You don't know who exactly someone fused a Matsu, Utaku and a Yoritomo into one person but you wish to beat them violently. The Pelymrian (with the unpronounceable name of Bogadana) had simply laughed and agreed on the spot, challenging Domotai to a wrestling match.

Domotai had thrown Bogadana out of the ring a half dozen times before the Pelmyrian had declared that she liked the Crane women and that a deal was a deal, although this didn't mean she was your servant no sir. Frankly, you're rather happy she's not your vassal. Barbarian he might be, you can only wish Vladimir the best if all of his vassals are like her. The worrying thought is that Bogadana might have been the most diplomatic person he could send... Poor dumb bastard.

The Senpet (Also with an unpronounceable name of Ahmes of Lurant) had instead challenged the Crane to a contest of art particularly painting. The small darker skinned, hairless man, had been perhaps a touch arrogant, but he had nearly won, nearly. Until Kakita Sayaka had unleashed her full skill and made a painting that may well be going into the Imperial museum...if you can convince Domotai to part with it. Although clearly deeply unhappy, Ahmes had also agreed in the end.

Suetonious Lasakinid (You have decided that gaijin names are mostly created by drunken bets) had bluntly refused the contests. Stating in no uncertain terms that the only contest he would consider valid was one of battle which would be impossible as he had no army with him. As such you weren't going to see him at all, let him feel left out of the loop until he learned his place. Or until one of your Crab relatives beat his ass while drunk, one of the two.

You would in time have to pick whether to speak to the Senpet or the Pelmyrian first. However, to show that following protocol got results, you had opted to speak to the ambassador from the Ivory Kingdoms. An admittedly beautiful woman (if you liked them on the darker side) who was maybe a few years older than you. She named herself Kavita of House Zaman. A part of you suspects that they are operating on old rumours of you having a preference for beautiful women. Which okay you do, but Kaname was all you needed or wanted.

Having kowtowed to you like a proper civilized person. Kavita had been invited to watch the setting sun with you and a couple of your guards. The Ivinidi had graciously drank tea and waited for you to make it clear that it was time to talk about important matters. She had even offered some poetry on the setting sun from her homeland, the beat and meter had been all wrong or Rokugani but you appreciated the attempt.

As you finish off a cake, you decide it is time to get to the point.

"Ambassador, it is not often that I receive those with such titles. I must commend the Padishah for sending such a refined representative for him. However, I find myself hoping that Padishah is only acting in friendship." You say.

"Emperor, my Padishah wishes friendship, as we have shown each other in the past. However, he is concerned by your actions, a war of aggression against the Jewel of the Desert is not something that can pass unnoticed. While no doubt you have your reasons, we do not know them." Kavita says.

"The Jewel of the Desert was taken in a coup some time ago, you know this yes?" You ask.

She nods, looking at you with curious eyes.

"The coup was performed by an old enemy of the Toturi, one that my father fought, and my grandfather. We believed that war was coming to us and prepared our armies for such an event. It was in our opinion better to stain the sands of the desert with blood than our own lands." You say.

"So you say, but until your war, Medinaat al Salaam welcomed all, but now it welcomes none. However, the Jewel is not the only concern we have." She says.

You bristle a little but ask.
"And the other?"

"Your...Bayushi Paneki now sits atop the path between the Ivory Kingdoms and the city. He has fortified it as such that we would risk war to dig him out. The Toturi have been friends the Padishah in the past, we wish not to end that friendship, but having an army camped on our borders is not something the Padishah will abide." Kavita answers.

What was Paneki up to, you certainly hadn't ordered that, only that he destroy the golem factory, so why then was he doing that? More worrying was why hadn't your uncle sent this in his dispatches? For now though you had to downplay it.

"I believe that Bayushi-san is simply being overzealous in his duty of defending the south from reprisal attacks from the former rulers of Medinaat al Salaam. However, we understand the Padishah's concern and will see about allaying those ones. However the question of the Jewel is much more open, after all my Shogun captured it, should we not then be permitted to keep it?"

Kavita shakes her head.
"Emperor, Medinaat al Salaam is too valuable as a neutral city for my nation, or indeed any others to easily let you have it, in spite of your sacrifice. I say that as someone who wishes friendship between our peoples."

You don't frown, but you can feel it inside your boiling up.
"Many of my Samurai have died, I cannot in good conscience just give away the fruits of victory like that."

Kavita nods.
"I understand that Emperor, but the Jewel of the Desert has doomed many empires, the Padishah has no desire to see it doom you."

"Your advice is taken in the spirit of friendship." You say calmly.

"Thank you for understanding. While there is more to discuss, the hour grows late, and I am not used to this cold, if the Emperor will forgive me for asking to retire for now?" Kavita asks.

You nod, you had a lot to think about. The ambassador rises, kowtows, and makes her way back to her own quarters. The warning Kavita gave was absolutely given in friendship, you believe that, which makes the threat all the more telling. Without something major, Padishah Purugupta, whose family yours had helped install, was prepared to go to war over Medinaat al Salaam.
The damning thing was, that you didn't know if you could give them anything to let them relent on that...or stop them if they did go to war.

You sit looking at the now starry winter sky for a long time thinking about that.

The next ambassador you were to meet was...
[] Ahmes of Lurant
[] Bogodana the Golden
 
[X] Bogodana the Golden

She may be... uncivilized, but she will be straightforward, which means that she may offer us information that will be useful when speaking with the Senpet.
 
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