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Shepard Quest Mk VI, Technological Revolution

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Yog said:
The appeal of radiation pressure deflection mechanism is that it would take a far lower K (100s, maybe even 10s instead of 10^10 or such) to deflect something - after all, the pressure scales with K^5.5.
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While true, it seems to me that the obvious response to this being the primary method of deflecting incoming fire would be for people to start cooling their bullets before firing them.

Yes, gravity doesn't create a repulsive force, but if an object were to pass through a non-uniform PME field, do you suppose there'd be tidal forces?
 
Alanek2002 said:
Though, IIRC, Hoyr did say that we could research past techs that we outright bought with bonus points.
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That doesn't sound like something I'd say. On the other hand I'd have no issue with you treating a tech you don't have the prerequisite for as an overflow as long as a) the plan had the prerequisites and b) they finished. If you do that you may want another overflow.

I also recall saying that if overflow exceeded the techs listed for it I'd pool the extra points

Prerequisites are kinda "required before".

Carrnage said:
WHat was the raid at the start of the quest called in the news?
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Depends on who you ask. In general discussion I believe its just called the slaver raid/attack/assault on Mindoir. News head lines would be things link "Slavers attack/raid/assault Mindoir!" "Local teen repulses slaver raid with prototype battlesuit". Depending on various factors a date may be tacked on the slavers might be called Terminus Slavers or other minor clarifying details added/changed. If you wanted to be... politically inflammatory* you could call it the Batarian (Hegemony) Slaver raid on Mindoir.

*Some people might argue that that's only like lighting a match in the middle of a nuclear detonation, not going to do much. Others would say it more like lighting a match next to a powder keg. Depends on how active you think the Hegemony-Alliance conflict really is.

TheEyes said:
Ugh, hate hate hate those.

Um, hate to bum on your idea here @Yog, which I don't think is mentioned here often enough but that is some amazing work, but if the idea is that shots are deflected due to the incoming shot emitting black body radiation, wouldn't cryo ammo then bypass kinetic barriers entirely? What ever happened to that idea of using PME fields to lower the speed of light to the point that incoming fire exceeds the speed limit?
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Ditto on the hate. I think it may be a simple case of treating a lot of that as a constant for the evaluation, F(x)d2​x/dt2​=k but I can recall how to solve F(x)d2​x. Second one is easy though, dW/dt=[stuff] is W=[stuff]*t+C if [stuff] is not dependent on t or W. If it is like I think it is then its a lot harder. So yeah fun.

On the other hand the problem of the reduced speed of light is probably the radiation that the codex claims* it would emit. Your shields converting a not insignificant amount of the shots power into lethal radiation doesn't help much. Barring space magic.

*Which makes no sense unless something weird is going on.
 
Hoyr said:
Depends on who you ask. In general discussion I believe its just called the slaver raid/attack/assault on Mindoir. News head lines would be things link "Slavers attack/raid/assault Mindoir!" "Local teen repulses slaver raid with prototype battlesuit". Depending on various factors a date may be tacked on the slavers might be called Terminus Slavers or other minor clarifying details added/changed. If you wanted to be... politically inflammatory* you could call it the Batarian (Hegemony) Slaver raid on Mindoir.

*Some people might argue that that's only like lighting a match in the middle of a nuclear detonation, not going to do much. Others would say it more like lighting a match next to a powder keg. Depends on how active you think the Hegemony-Alliance conflict really is.
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damn was hoping for something that could be used as a ship name. hmm how about "Consequences of Mindoir"
 
Carrnage said:
damn was hoping for something that could be used as a ship name. hmm how about "Consequences of Mindoir"
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If you wanted to be kinda ironic and rather insensitive you could call the ship the Mindoir Massacre. Referencing what happened to the slavers (Nearly 100% dead!). Though colonists did die so that maybe a little... not good?
 
Hoyr said:
On the other hand the problem of the reduced speed of light is probably the radiation that the codex claims* it would emit. Your shields converting a not insignificant amount of the shots power into lethal radiation doesn't help much. Barring space magic.

*Which makes no sense unless something weird is going on.
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Which is why black body radiation pressure is such an attractive notion - the spectrum would be the same as normal, meaning that what will be released will be heat, not hard radiation.
 
[x] Peak Human - 30d10+55 + Overflow 1
[x] Frigates - 50d10+70 + Overflow 2
[x] CASIE Implant - 60d10+35 + 50 Bonus RP + Overflow 3
[x] Improved Warhead - Overflow 4
[x] Advanced Neural Interface - 0d10+0 + 400 Bonus RP
[x] Advanced ME Theory - 0d10+0 + 400 Bonus RP

I might be a little lost, but considering that people seem to be voting for a revote and delaying the update, this one does seem to be the best option available at the moment.

Unless someone wishes to correct me.
 
meianmaru said:
Hmm. @Hoyr, should we also include new personal action -votes to the plan, as revote seems to have most of the support?
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Nope! I'm not hitting the undo button, Just letting you adjust for things possibly becoming invalid, also the old vote had errors. The choices you made back then you made with the limited knowledge you had.

I've got a majority it of people (clearly) saying they'd like to revisit the old vote. It not a huge majority, but it is one.

This is the old vote for reference:

[ ] Peak Human (212/400)(30d10+55) (98.08%)
[ ] Frigates (400) (70d10+55) (95.40%)
[ ] Improved Warhead (150) - 0d10 +50 (Tiger Reward) +50 (Lagrange Omake) +50 (Reference Recognition) (100%)
[ ] Mk II Suit (500) - 40d10+20 + (Overflow)
[ ] Legionary Re-Entry Shroud (50) 0d10 +50 (UberJJK Omake) (100%)


You have 140d10+160 points to spend.
4 x 10d10 (Revy)
3 x 10d10 + 10 (Labs)
6 x 10d10 + 15 (Research Teams)
1 x 10d10 + 15 (Conrad)
3 x +10 (Theoretical research, must be applied to a 10d10 set, one application per set)

You have according to my math 950 points banked, for 19 x 50 point lots.

You may spend on any Yellow or Cyan tech in the tree. For this vote only Frigate + 200m MAC may be treated as the same 500 point tech.

Hopefully we can have this done by Saturday ish. Also you don't have to do this but if I know where the points for a tech come from it helps with the fluff. I'd also prefer it is you kept with the general techs of the old plan, but you don't have to.

Edit: Derp you can have the bonuses back too I guess :p
 
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Mkay. In that case:

[X] Peak Human - 30d10+55 + Overflow 1
[X] Frigates - 50d10+70 + Overflow 2
[X] CASIE Implant - 60d10+35 + 50 Bonus RP + Overflow 3
[X] Improved Warhead - Overflow 4
[X] Advanced Neural Interface - 0d10+0 + 400 Bonus RP
[X] Advanced ME Theory - 0d10+0 + 400 Bonus RP

I'm going with Van Ropen's plan. It has some changes, but those changes are for more transhumanism and faster access to Optical Computing (and the other Advanced ME -techs), so yeah.
 
[X] Peak Human - 30d10+55 + Overflow 1
[X] Frigates - 50d10+70 + Overflow 2
[X] CASIE Implant - 60d10+35 + 50 Bonus RP + Overflow 3
[X] Improved Warhead - Overflow 4
[X] Advanced Neural Interface - 0d10+0 + 400 Bonus RP
[X] Advanced ME Theory - 0d10+0 + 400 Bonus RP
 
Hoyr said:
Also you don't have to do this but if I know where the points for a tech come from it helps with the fluff.
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And about this: it would be kind of hard and complex to do, because fluff-wise nearly every single one of our projects needs Revy's touch in some amount for them to be workable at all. Gameplay and story seggration seem to be quite hard, as for example we could put all the lab bonuses on one project, and research teams on completely different one. Better that you decide by yourself what projects get most attention from who. But as a general very soft outline I could see them somewhat like this:

Peak Human - Revy focuses mostly on nanotech part, while quite a lot of research teams and some theorycrafters work on the biological side of things.
Frigates - Some focus from Revy on the revolutionary parts and research teams work on the more mundane details.
Advanced Neural Interface - Revy focuses on the implant itself and its miniaturization mostly, research teams on the biological side.
CASIE Implant - Same as the ANI.
Improved Warhead - Conrad, Revy and research teams.
Advanced ME Theory - This would likely take quite a lot of Revy's time, as well as the time of theorycrafters who can keep up with her. Maybe some help from Conrad.

Speaking of Conrad, he is one of the main reasons why I want CASIE now. With it, and a personal action in the turn after that for getting Conrad to lower his hero worship, I could see us managing to make him somewhat more tolerable, especially now that he has worked with us for quite some time. Maybe even get rid of that malus at some point.
 
meianmaru said:
Speaking of Conrad, he is one of the main reasons why I want CASIE now. With it, and a personal action in the turn after that for getting Conrad to lower his hero worship, I could see us managing to make him somewhat more tolerable, especially now that he has worked with us for quite some time. Maybe even get rid of that malus at some point.
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*imagines Conrad with CASIE implant - is terrified*
 
tyaty1 said:
[ ] Peak Human - 30d10+55 + Overflow 1
[ ] Frigates - 50d10+70 + Overflow 2
[ ] CASIE Implant - 60d10+35 + 50 Bonus RP + Overflow 3
[ ] Improved Warhead - Overflow 4
[ ] Advanced Neural Interface - 0d10+0 + 400 Bonus RP
[ ] Advanced ME Theory - 0d10+0 + 400 Bonus RP
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Quick note: to @Van Ropen and @meianmaru as well: this vote is 100 points short.

I think we should go with something more like:

[X] Peak Human - 30d10+55 + Overflow 1
[X] CASIE Implant - 70d10+65 + Overflow 2
[X] Frigates - 40d10+40 + Overflow 3
[X] Improved Warhead - 0d10+0 + 150 Bonus RP
[X] Advanced Neural Interface - 0d10+0 + 400 Bonus RP
[X] Advanced ME Theory - 0d10+0 + 400 Bonus RP
[X] Optical Computing 0d10 + Overflow 4

That essentially guarantees Peak Human and CASIE, and gets us started on frigates. I'll break this down by die when I'm at a real computer: poking that all out on a phone sucked enough as is.
 
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I think I will go with this as well. Seems reasonable.

[X] Peak Human - 30d10+55 + Overflow 1
[X] CASIE Implant - 70d10+65 + Overflow 2
[X] Frigates - 40d10+40 + Overflow 3
[X] Improved Warhead - 0d10+0 + 150 Bonus RP
[X] Advanced Neural Interface - 0d10+0 + 400 Bonus RP
[X] Advanced ME Theory - 0d10+0 + 400 Bonus RP
[X] Optical Computing 0d10 + Overflow 4
 
[X] Peak Human - 30d10+55 + Overflow 1
[X] CASIE Implant - 70d10+65 + Overflow 2
[X] Frigates - 40d10+40 + Overflow 3
[X] Improved Warhead - 0d10+0 + 150 Bonus RP
[X] Advanced Neural Interface - 0d10+0 + 400 Bonus RP
[X] Advanced ME Theory - 0d10+0 + 400 Bonus RP
[X] Optical Computing 0d10 + Overflow 4
 
Okay. Changing my vote.

[X] Peak Human - 30d10+55 + Overflow 1
[X] CASIE Implant - 70d10+65 + Overflow 2
[X] Frigates - 40d10+40 + Overflow 3
[X] Improved Warhead - 0d10+0 + 150 Bonus RP
[X] Advanced Neural Interface - 0d10+0 + 400 Bonus RP
[X] Advanced ME Theory - 0d10+0 + 400 Bonus RP
[X] Optical Computing 0d10 + Overflow 4
 
Oh, and in the future I'm going to advocate that we just always purchase the MAC series of techs, rather than spend research die on them. We should still get any bonuses from customization from our weapon mod tech, which we will get around to purchasing; everything else about MACs that we would need should be centuries out of patent by now.

BTW @Hoyr, what is the difference between the weapon mod and ammo mod tech, in terms of capabilities?
 
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[] Improved Warhead - 0d10+0 + 150 Bonus RP (100%)
[] Advanced Neural Interface - 0d10+0 + 400 Bonus RP (100%)
[] Advanced ME Theory - 0d10+0 + 400 Bonus RP (100%)
[] Peak Human - 30d10+55 (98.08%)
[] CASIE Implant - 70d10+65 (98.23%)
[] Frigates - 40d10+40 + Overflow 1 (1.46%) (95% chance of 230)
[] Optical Computing 0d10 + Overflow 2 (Basically 0%)

Here are the percentages for those wondering. Also doesn't overflow halve with each flow? So for example with 1,000RP Overflow:

Overflow 1 = 500RP. 100RP spent, 400RP remaining
Overflow 2 = 200RP. 100RP spent, 100RP remaining
Overflow 3 = 50RP. 50RP spent, 0 remaining

If so I think just changing the Overflow to be on the Frigates and Optical Computing (like above) would be far more efficient.
 
@UberJJK: I think it only halves if it's actually needed, so if Peak Human and CASIE are already complete it doesn't cost us anything. I'd just rather be really, really certain that those two techs complete this turn; we don't really need Frigates this quarter, or even this year frankly.
 
TheEyes said:
@UberJJK: I think it only halves if it's actually needed, so if Peak Human and CASIE are already complete it doesn't cost us anything. I'd just rather be really, really certain that those two techs complete this turn; we don't really need Frigates this quarter, or even this year frankly.
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Considering that Revy has come under assault from those who thought that attacking us in-between Relay jumps was a good idea, me personally I would like some anti-ship capability.
 
TheEyes said:
BTW @Hoyr, what is the difference between the weapon mod and ammo mod tech, in terms of capabilities?
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Ammo mod are (generally) for things like changing damage "type"/effect.

Weapon Mod are for changing weapon performance.

With the right ammo mods you can have the right round for the right time The jack of all trades favorite tool. (Inferno v Krogan/Vocha, warp v boitics etc) and even go so far as to make a sniper rifle into a pseudo-rocket launcher if the mods are high enough quality, mind you'd want some weapon mods so the gun doesn't break from that ;).

Weapon mods are kinda the weapon min-maxer's favorite tool. Your infantry variable weapons tech makes this less useful on the infantry scale however you can still optimize even at that level. Used right a vehicular main gun could be rapidly switched from "high powered long ranged anti vehicle shots" to "shorter ranged/lower power shots that you could spray at infantry". Combine it with Transformation Systems and you'd probably get shape shifting guns that go from ~Shotgun to ~Assault Rifle and then to ~Anti-Material Rifle all in the same turret*. Weapon mods may also apply to non-MAC weapons.

*Edit: Ohh siege tanks. Mind the actual design was kinda silly but...

Also weapon mods are a potential source of revenue and allow tech updates to be shared without replacing the entire gun. Frictionless materials become cheap to produce? Sell it as mods and even people that can't don't want to buy a new gun will have an upgrade. This does apply to some degree to ammo mods too, but its a lot more noticeable with the weapon mods. As well as becoming more and more of an issue with large guns as they almost literally cost a mint to replace.

I hope that answers the question.

UberJJK said:
Here are the percentages for those wondering. Also doesn't overflow halve with each flow?
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IIRC I said that I'd be willing to take the extra points of a given tech halve them and "pool" those. Then I'd apply the pool in the minimum amount need for each tech in the order listed. Any left over after that would roll over as points to spend. Not particularly complicated and a tad more generous to you guys then the other option.

Just try to keep the overflow list under control... actually I might just ask you guys to put the techs in the order you want overflow to happen... Eh not changing it now, but that might help... I'll have to think about it.
 
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