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Knight of Dandriss: Stone and Steel

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Academia Nut said:
You're pretty impressive for being able to do that, you know? Still... does this place make your soul itch?

Kind of. There's... well, there's a lot wrong out there, but there is certainly something odd. [Mirande's Thought response]

Be wary. There are things in motion in this place that are liable to strike from unwary angles.
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Delcer said:
Our Eldar friend actually hinted at it very blatantly in an exchange we had with him prior to this. So yes we did know.
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Yeah, it's so blatantly obvious that we knew the veil was weak. If that was your only issue, it's a pretty weak counter-argument. All you did was prove that, yes, we knew something was hinky in psyker land, but we had no clue what it was.

Are you going to counter the rest of that point (and the two following points), which is where the meat of my argument is, or can I take that as you surrendering your position?
 
Powerofmind said:
Yeah, it's so blatantly obvious that we knew the veil was weak. If that was your only issue, it's a pretty weak counter-argument. All you did was prove that, yes, we knew something was hinky in psyker land, but we had no clue what it was.

Are you going to counter the rest of that point (and the two following points), which is where the meat of my argument is, or can I take that as you surrendering your position?
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I don't know where you're coming from, but in my mind a weak veil means that daemons will appear, especially since this guy was abusing his psychic power regularly.

If you're trying to say that we wouldn't have fought daemons, then I have no words for you.
 
Arbit said:
We had more solid evidence for Blackthorn then for Indigo Leaf. The basic premise of your risk assessment was based on at best scant and shaky evidence. So no that choice wasn't all that resonable and there was enough argueing about that enough then. But like I said taking that decision and thus having to go for the assassination did not lead to the escalation. And yeah hitting him with the rifle was uncertain and hitting him with the sword was almost guranted. So that was reasonable.

Also I would thank you if wouldn't falsely accuse me of being disingeneous.
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I'm not accusing you of being disingenuous, I'm accusing @Delcer of being disingenuous.

My risk assessment was based on the fact that ANY potential target was less than 50% and that while Blackthorn had better odds, we had a great deal more to lose if we abandoned Indigo Leaf and wound up being wrong. Especially since Blackthorn's two treasures were mathematically and narratively unlikely to be sequential with one another (meaning that there were overwhelming chances he'd come to Indigo next with only one of the two in hand if Blackthorn was, indeed, the next in line). Also keep in mind the fact that Indigo Leaf came before one of the Blackthorn Treasures in order (which we know now was BT#2) made Blackthorn a lot less likely from a statistical standpoint. That's important information.

That was my thinking at the time, anyway. But yeah, I'm not taking issue with your standpoint so much. Just Delcer's and others who've made the same argument as him. I agree with your assessment for the most part.
 
Delcer said:
I don't know where you're coming from, but in my mind a weak veil means that daemons will appear, especially since this guy was abusing his psychic power regularly.

If you're trying to say that we wouldn't have fought daemons, then I have no words for you.
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We wouldn't have fought Daemons if the veil didn't break, and it wouldn't have broken if he hadn't gotten an exploding crit to resist our heavily-buffed soul-killing roll despite his shit willpower. It was actually a highly unlikely outcome, as it turns out. That's in hindsight. Based on the information we had available at the time? I'd hardly have called it a guarantee. Even if they did come though, there was an army of fanatics and mutants that probably would've wound up fighting the majority of them anyway.

EDIT: And PoM is in fact correct. By the time we found out WHAT the weird environmental effect was, the sword vote was locked in. We just knew something strange was going on. That's half of why we went for the most reliable option (sword) in the first place.
 
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Delcer said:
I don't know where you're coming from, but in my mind a weak veil means that daemons will appear, especially since this guy was abusing his psychic power regularly.

If you're trying to say that we wouldn't have fought daemons, then I have no words for you.
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That's the thing, we wouldn't have fought any daemons if not for several specific rolls having several specific values. The odds of what had happened were so unbelievably low as to be impossible to replicate after a hundred repeats and then some.

To put things in perspective. If we had taken the AR rifle option to the head, roll for roll, we'd have missed, he'd have escaped, and we'd have had to go army-to-army at him, on the offensive, out of a maglev tunnel, and probably lost the vast majority of the polity's army.
 
Powerofmind said:
That's the thing, we wouldn't have fought any daemons if not for several specific rolls having several specific values. The odds of what had happened were so unbelievably low as to be impossible to replicate after a hundred repeats and then some.

To put things in perspective. If we had taken the AR rifle option to the head, roll for roll, we'd have missed, he'd have escaped, and we'd have had to go army-to-army at him, on the offensive, out of a maglev tunnel, and probably lost the vast majority of the polity's army.
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Ekans Ekans Ekans said:
We wouldn't have fought Daemons if the veil didn't break, and it wouldn't have broken if he hadn't gotten an exploding crit to resist our heavily-buffed soul-killing roll despite his shit willpower. It was actually a highly unlikely outcome, as it turns out. That's in hindsight. Based on the information we had available at the time? I'd hardly have called it a guarantee. Even if they did come though, there was an army of fanatics and mutants that probably would've wound up fighting the majority of them anyway.

EDIT: And PoM is in fact correct. By the time we found out WHAT the weird environmental effect was, the sword vote was locked in. We just knew something strange was going on. That's half of why we went for the most reliable option (sword) in the first place.
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A thin veil, many psykers about, and a fight that's going to drag on? Daemons will happen.

I suppose I just expected it to happen the moment I read that line, whereas you two desperately hoped otherwise.

Ekans, look at the bottom of the page, it was not locked in.
 
This argument is literally an year old and fully in the past, IC and OOC.
We cannot do anything about what happened.
Let's just stop, please, before we annoy AN.
 
Can we take the 40K arguments to a 40K thread?
This is an original thread that drew inspiration from a previous thread, which was a 40K thread.
If you want to Argue about Age of strife, could you take it to PM's? It is cluttering the thread and not really fun to read.
Votes were made, decisions and consequences happened, and shit went down. We all had a good time. (don't want to backseat mod, but there was an update, and most comments are an argument about the prequel-quest)


I would rather talk about the Dragon Variations and the cool thing that is the Dragon Woods!!!

Does anyone think the Emperor skeleton is still there? Like, a certain Dragon society living inside of it, going about their lives inside the Dragon Skyscraper?

Also, now I know what a Linnorm is generally shaped like, cool.
I know it's unlikely, but does anyone think that if we rank up our fighting skills, and keep killing dragons, that we could start painting a rep. symbol on our mech, like a Dragon kill-list?
 
I'm curious about our gear/tech situation; what we have and what we can get.

Could we get cortex bombs to nullify Reaver and Dragon abductions without forced activations?
Can we enhance Muses with IFF routines so that it can mirror our mech's neutralization of some Reaver psych-tricks?
Anti-Reaver weapon specialization such as air-bursts and fragmentation rounds so as to minimize aim-dodge and take advantage of their lack of armour?
Perhaps increase ability to fire on enemy danger-close, and/or foot troops with defensive flechette-packs on armour?
etc
 
The good news is Messer's Dandriss augs will keep him from having any really weird mutations since he's got his psychic potential heavily suppressed. The bad news is, the dragon that grows around him is probably gonna be fuckbig.
 
Ekans Ekans Ekans said:
The good news is Messer's Dandriss augs will keep him from having any really weird mutations since he's got his psychic potential heavily suppressed. The bad news is, the dragon that grows around him is probably gonna be fuckbig.
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Now that'd be a skull worth displaying.

Alpha you think? I mean if the core was 3m, then the dragon's gotta be at least a greater right?
 
I would just like to note, how freaking terrifying these things are.

That and it's realy weird and also cute that there's apparently 50cm or less dragons.

I want that as a pet, or a weapon, or both...eventually. I hope. Maybe? Pretty Please plan makers?
 
Academia Nut said:
Do note that even the small ones still want to cocoon you, and human derived dragons tend to be at least prime sized.
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AA, you may or may not have meant for that to deter me, but you have only strengthened my love of tiny dragons as pets/weapons/untaimed-pets-for-our-enemies.

Point taken though, not going to happen anytime in the foreseeable future.
 
Or a Psyker to make a familiar of one for themselves. Hopefully they'd have some biomancy as well to help create a domesticatble strain.
 
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Ekans Ekans Ekans said:
You mentioned the belters in that codex entry. How long has it been since they made contact, anyway? (Oh hey, no excuse to shoot our shit out of orbit if the Mantis aren't here yet :D)
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They've had some degree of contact since about 30 years after Starfall, and have basically taken the attitude that they control the orbitals. There has been more than one conflict among the various Great Powers (going to do a codex entry on who is who, and another one on culture, in the near future, possibly at least one tonight in conjunction with the update proper) over that, and the general consensus is that sub-orbital flights will be tolerated, but actually getting permanent assets into space results in your shit getting shot up. The majority of their assets are elsewhere, and from the sounds of things getting assigned to the military outposts in orbit is considered something of an exile.
 
Ok, I also really want Dragon Riders or at least dragon familiars...
But I guess we will need psykers before this, and probably more Warp tech, I very much doubt we will be successful without creating warp taps and psykers with biomancy and/or telepathy to change/communicate with the dragons.
 
Well, if we can domesticate Dragons to any degree, at least it will be a good method of getting rid of rogue psykers.

Although we could do that to farm psycho-active bone anyway, so long as we tracked the cocoon and took it out as it was born.
 
I think if anybody other than Mirande could tame dragons, it'd be the augmented of Indigo Hammer.

We'd have to get them to tame the dragons, and then trade.

But tamed is different from domestic. I'm Not sure whether we'd be able to domesticate dragons without vastly superior tech and knowledge.
 
Delcer said:
Or a Psyker to make a familiar of one for themselves. Hopefully they'd have some biomancy as well to help create a domesticatble strain.
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Psionics can't tame dragons without extensive, and frankly well beyond our ability (at least half a century even if it was an empire-level research focus), designer biological modification. Even Mirande can't modify them significantly enough to make them domestic. Hell, she barely had input in their conception as a species other than pumping them full of energy to mutate from.
 
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