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sdwood said:
Lung is a thug. You can't negotiate with a thug, and in the case of a sex trafficker like Lung, I literally can't imagine why anyone would want to unless there is a worry about collateral damage.
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He may be ... but he's not a DUMB one. Remember that when he fought off the entire Protectorate at once? He did NOT kill any of them (or Wildbow would have gleefully pointed out that he did, and used it to Make Things Worse at least twice). He understands strategy/tactics, along with intimidation & threats, use of power, and enough management to keep the gang and its operations going. And, probably, how to keep people thinking of him as a stereotyped Asian who doesn't understand English well...

Sandy River DL said:
People like Lung only understand violence. Demonstrate willingness to do violence to them, and you may sometimes get them to actually listen to reason.
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Lung has to deal with sundry people of that type. And he keeps them in line with, yes, threats of violence. Don't mistake that for that being the only thing HE understands or responds to.

Dave, underestimating your enemy is a good way to get defeated repeatedly
 
David DeLaney said:
Lung has to deal with sundry people of that type. And he keeps them in line with, yes, threats of violence. Don't mistake that for that being the only thing HE understands or responds to.
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His canon response to being humiliated by four teens was to go try and murder them. He's also the guy who thought that recruiting a known terrorist with a superiority-inferiority complex was a good idea. So yeah, I'm pretty confident in saying violence is his standard solution.
 
january1may said:
The problem is that PTV is also canonically supposed to be incapable of dealing with triggers, which (if true) makes it highly unlikely that "making Kenta trigger" (and/or any consequences thereof) was the intended result of the operation in question. Which is weird, because it certainly seemed geared for that otherwise.
(It also suggests that whatever was the actual intended result was almost certainly ruined by Kenta's trigger. Poor Contessa.)
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Point of order: Contessa can't predict triggers, but PtV handles them just fine. She stumbled in that scene, but impossibly fluidly and it seemed to serve her purposes.

And since someone else mentioned it, Contessa was there because Doctor Mother was there. It's not clear why Doctor Mother was there, of course. (Something something selling drugs for money, is my best recollection.)
 
mp3.1415player said:
My approach is much the same as I've used before, that Tinkertech is real tech that's been deliberately and subtly nerfed by having critical bits of it tweaked via powers so simply duplicating what it looks like doesn't give you something that's identical in how it works. Much like you can't plant seeds from an apple and end up with a tree that grows the same apples, since the bit that makes the fruit is grafted onto the actual root stock.

Taylor is smart enough, and has enough background knowledge, to be able to look at what something is allegedly doing and work out the parts that are missing in what's there to achieve the desired effect. Because she understands the underlying principles of the tech in question, unlike the Tinkers who generally don't. And the more she learns about doing this sort of thing the better she gets at it... :)
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I'm curious about what will happen once Tinkers that try to understand what their power is giving them (Arms and Dragon) start getting access to Gravtech for their work.
 
Anti-No said:
Is the whole 'kidnapping girls off the street to throw them in the ABB run bordello' (the farm) thing fanon or canon?
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It's canon in that one of the ABB goons who attacked Emma in the alley threatened in vague terms to send her there. It's never mentioned otherwise so the reality could be anything to 'Yes, it exists, and all the horrible implications are true' to 'He's pulling it out of his ass to sound intimidating'. (If there's a WoG that clarifies, I've not seen it.)
 
It would be an interesting scene if the woman who threatened Max decided they needed the PRT to back down and tried the same to the chief director. I can visualize the scene, RCB instead of Max in the same situation and can predict how it would go.

People seem to be overestimating the power of a somewhat neutered US military in Earth Bet. If Contessa gets interested she could thwart pretty much any military action that could be taken by getting to the decision makers and convincing them to change their minds. Everyone knows that sniper bullet can take out most capes, yet somehow that never seems to work when it is tried.

Taylor is protected because government at a high enough level has told PRT to cooperate and likely become involved in her protection. Parahuman level assistance will be required to protect against parahuman threats. PRT itself, at least at the operative level, is elite to the level of anything the other agencies have and knows more about parahumans and how to handle them, and they need to be involved.
 
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mp3.1415player said:
A gravitational reference frame regenerator does what it says on the box. It makes a completely independent reference frame for local gravity.

This is not dependent on any other reference frame for gravity. At all.
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Interesting. Normally, when Gravity causes an object to accelerate towards another, Momentum is conserved through mutual attraction; when you fall to the ground, the ground also falls to you.

So, where the hell is the Momentum coming from? Conservation of Momentum is perhaps the most ironclad Law in Physics, and not something one even bends lightly.

zzfanz said:
It would be an interesting scene if the woman who threatened Max decided they needed the PRT to back down and tried the same to the chief director. I can visualize the scene, RCB instead of Max in the same situation and can predict how it would go.
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That's not how it would go. The President would call her up, and tell her to stop pushing or he would slash her budget and halve her pay, if not replace her entirely with someone that can avoid stepping on DARPA's toes.

Much as she may wish it otherwise, there are people RCB has to answer to, and who can reign her in. If for no other reason then due to how important having her in that position is for their plans. Plus, the path for her keeping that job would be to convince her to say "Yes, sir" and follow orders...
 
Please do. My guess is that Subspace contains a permanent energy differential with the "normal" universe. However, said energy differential has a massive(relative to any attempts to naturally(eg astrophysicaly) overcome) energy barrier. A specific set of circumstances (eg. like those found in Taylor's gravitic drive) can create a reduction in said energy barrier allowing for things to happen.
 
About Contessa:

I don't think she has the absolute power you're attributing to her, same as the military, you're overestimating PtV. I believe that PtV can do some pretty improbable things, but things that absolutely cannot be changed, or are beyond Contessa's ability to change cannot be affected by the path.

All in all, it really depends on the author about how the story will go, and whether Cauldron is involved or not, is all up to the author. After all, Contessa is less of a character and more of a duex ex machina that can be pulled out to handwave impossibily large plot holes.
 
Bobot-Man said:
Yes, I can see that happening. However, I can also see Contessa-related shenanigans occurring to counteract that. Such an action would undoubtably begin the process of making DARPA aware of Cauldron. Resulting in Cauldron and DARPA engaging in a Cold War-like game of car-and-mouse. Cauldron would ultimately be 'fixed' and made/'absorbed' into something under both DARPA and Gravtech.
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DARPA and US government have no power at all over Cauldron. If Cauldron is keeping hands off, it is because they believe it is the best course of action needed to meet their own goals, not because they folded in some power play. Assume Cauldron knows exactly what is going on, who the players are, including Taylor, and support what she is doing for their own reasons. Nobody has enough power to stop them from acting as they so choose to.

Memory Gem said:
About Contessa:

I don't think she has the absolute power you're attributing to her, same as the military, you're overestimating PtV. I believe that PtV can do some pretty improbable things, but things that absolutely cannot be changed, or are beyond Contessa's ability to change cannot be affected by the path.

All in all, it really depends on the author about how the story will go, and whether Cauldron is involved or not, is all up to the author. After all, Contessa is less of a character and more of a duex ex machina that can be pulled out to handwave impossibily large plot holes.
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Assume for the purposes of the story Contessa's path supports what is happening and may be working to prevent anything from happening to Taylor. Otherwise they could easily stop it through many different ways. They can't be forced to do anything but they can be convinced that their own goals are met by helping instead of interfering.
 
Bobot-Man said:
I am still wondering how DARPA will handle Lung?
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MTB said:
With prejudice. Extreme prejudice.
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mp3.1415player said:
No reason to assume that an RPG to the chest wouldn't work when he's coming out of his house...
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Sandy River DL said:
No, anti-materiel rifle/AT-4 to drop Rage Dragon before he gets going. Maybe an SDB (small diameter bomb).
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I was thinking the solution to the Lung problem would be brought to you by the letters A, G and M, as well as either the number 65 or 114.
Bobot-Man said:
I would recommend reading Constellations for inspiration on dealing with Lung through non-violent means.
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Sandy River DL said:
And it took Taylor being backed up by Ammy-chan for Lung to care about etiquette.
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FaerieKnight79 said:
Bolt from the blue suggests there were violent means.
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Yeah, Lung only started caring about etiquette after taking a lightning bolt to the face. Immediately before that, he was telling Oni Lee to kill Taylor to send a message not to disrespect him, after having backhanded her into unconsciousness.
 
zzfanz said:
DARPA and US government have no power at all over Cauldron. If Cauldron is keeping hands off, it is because they believe it is the best course of action needed to meet their own goals, not because they folded in some power play. Assume Cauldron knows exactly what is going on, who the players are, including Taylor, and support what she is doing for their own reasons. Nobody has enough power to stop them from acting as they so choose to.
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Except in the story it's mentioned that Brockton Bay has become unpathable, indicating that Cauldron and it's best asset have no idea what's going on in that town. Anything involving Taylor will be classified as "Need To Know", and as far as DARPA is concerned the PRT has no need to know.

I don't doubt Cauldron can figure things out, but they may well burn a LOT of assets in the process.

On the subject of Lung, I would suggest looking over some of this author's other works. Often, if approached properly, he can be quite reasonable in these stories...
 
Bobot-Man said:
I truly regret posing that. I get it, Lung just such a horrible criminal that he deserves nothing less than the world's supply of biggatons to the face. While Max Anders, an actual Nazi, should simply get a slap to the wrist.
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First, Max isn't an actual ideological Nazi; he's just mouthing the words to maintain his power. Second, Max is smart enough that when someone comes up to him and tells him, "You or your people look funny at the DWU and you'll be meeting your father and sister again," he'll actually take that advice on board and stay away. Lung would feel insulted that someone thought they could tell him what he could do, and he'd immediately try to start shit.
 
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Bobot-Man said:
I guess I will never be able to have Lung become a source of beneficial change for BB if people like the suggestion. Seriously, everyone seems to hate Lung to the point where redemption is impossible. People prefer giving him a high-speed bullet to the head rather than Teatime.
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I can only think of one version of Lung at the moment that didn't need some applied violence before he was fit for teatime, and that's the one from @CmptrWz's Mauling Snarks. Although that one did need a lot of alcohol.
 
Bobot-Man said:
I guess I will never be able to have Lung become a source of beneficial change for BB if people like the suggestion. Seriously, everyone seems to hate Lung to the point where redemption is impossible. People prefer giving him a high-speed bullet to the head rather than Teatime.
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Maybe looking to 'Cultural Appropriation: The Fanfic ft. Weirdly Racist Stereotypes' isn't the best choice to be making? Teatime doesn't solve the fact that he's looking at multiple lifetimes of jail time for his crimes.
 
Bobot-Man said:
I guess I will never be able to have Lung become a source of beneficial change for BB if people like the suggestion. Seriously, everyone seems to hate Lung to the point where redemption is impossible. People prefer giving him a high-speed bullet to the head rather than Teatime.
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Okay. I'm going to spell it out for you, because you just don't seem to get it: canon Lung makes money off of girls getting raped. Some as young as thirteen.

No, Lung will never be a source of beneficial change, and no, he's not redeemable. Some things you don't come back from.
 
There are a few stories where Lung isn't a complete monster. Mauling Snarks is one of them. So are Taylor Varga and Scaling Up. The thing to remember about Lung is that unless the author is specifically changing it for the story, Lung is the sort of monster who deals in slavery, drugs, and anything else he thinks he can make money on. The sort of person who is not only fine with burning down half the city in order to kill someone, but will chose that option by preference. He is an arrogant thug who defaults to "kill anyone who insults me". And he views most things as a personal insult.

If this isn't the case, that's a major AU. If you go into a story based on Worm expecting to find Lung causing good things to happen out of the kindness of his heart, you're likely barking up the wrong tree. There's a reason why even in stories where he's not a complete monster Lung is violent. His arrogance and willingness to cause extreme property damage (not to mention death and destruction) are kind of his defining character traits.

EDIT:
@Bobot-Man Unlike most forums, this forum defines "double posting" as "more then one post without letting others post first" rather then "exact same post twice in a row". And double posting is against the site's rules. If you are responding to multiple people, multi-quote so you can reply to everyone in the same post. If you want to add something more but nobody else has posted yet, edit the additional comment into your already existing post.

I'd rather you not get in trouble with the mods due to your habit of multiple posts in a row.
 
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Bobot-Man said:
I guess I will never be able to have Lung become a source of beneficial change for BB if people like the suggestion. Seriously, everyone seems to hate Lung to the point where redemption is impossible. People prefer giving him a high-speed bullet to the head rather than Teatime.
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Dude, the one turning this into a question of whether Lung can be redeemed is you. Everyone else is arguing that, where Max was told 'back down or be shot' and chose to back down, Lung will probably refuse and thus need to actually be shot. It's not about which of them is worse, it's not about what either of them deserve, it's purely a question of what solutions will actually work and which will not.
 
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