My musings were not about a huge issue or anything, I just felt like grumbling about something. Still, I have some ideas since Dark as Silver asked.

Basically, the problem with the dice is that they were originally meant to introduce variability and uncertainty to combatting, and now that the dice are reduced to unimportance, those goals are left unfulfilled. Pre-determined and totally predictable combat is a bit boring. Pre-combat advantages are a huge part of MMORPG's, and I'm not saying to get rid of those. I just feel that skill should matter as well, and that the need for quick thinking mid combat is a perfect way to implement that skill coming to play. Dice introducing variability is certainly a way to do this, but not the only one. In fact, adding more dice is probably bad, since that inconveniences Terran.

Actually implementing strategic and tactical elements to combatting is the way I would rather go. I'm talking about abilities like:
-Combat stances, that can be changed mid combat.
-Bonuses and penalties from positionIng, maybe with allies, like flanking or retreating or a formation or backstabs.
-Maybe skill based dodging and hitting and damaging to some abilities, instead of auto-hitting/missing in everything. Timing, accuracy, there are many ways to do this. My idea is to introduce tactics to hinder the enemy's performance, not to start requiring overly much finger dexterity or rhythm sense from players.
-Possibilities to react on enemy choices. Things like counters or shields, on a tactical temporary basis.

These are just some ideas, and not all fit to Yggdrasil necessarily, but you see the trend here. More active and temporary abilities is the key, and I don't mean just attacks with different keywords. I'm sure mages have things like that in spells, but warrior gameplay seems a little overly focused on passive abilities and number raising, or "press this button" type of active abilities to just ignore some numbers when the numbers seem bad (looking at you "unblockable damage"). Case in point: StormDoom has like <5 active abilities she uses. Most of those are used once per battle, at the start of battle. No thinking involved whatsoever.

Raising the HP pools could be a part of a fix as well, allowing for more time for tactical maneuvers and mid-battle strategy choices.


Again, I don't feel strongly about this subject. These are just ideas for future abilities or patches.
 
Yeah I can see where you're coming from I feel like the predetermined aspects of combat only really come into play between players with very different levels as the difference between two levels has never been more that significant.
I broadly agree with the suggestions that you've offered as game design criticism, however I think its actually missing part of the point. Are you approaching the system as a game that can be played independently of the quest, rather than a device to fuel the narrative?
Terran has shown a preference to roll battles out in whole even when they'd be extremely long and then condense that rather than stopping for more input and drawing a fight into two updates. If you want mid battle choices then perhaps the best thing to do is to actually say that as otherwise stance changes would probably get lumped into the micro management that we never see. Also the only way I could see Skill based gameplay being represented would be allowing rerolls of some dice.
 
Yeah I can see where you're coming from I feel like the predetermined aspects of combat only really come into play between players with very different levels as the difference between two levels has never been more that significant.
I broadly agree with the suggestions that you've offered as game design criticism, however I think its actually missing part of the point. Are you approaching the system as a game that can be played independently of the quest, rather than a device to fuel the narrative?
Terran has shown a preference to roll battles out in whole even when they'd be extremely long and then condense that rather than stopping for more input and drawing a fight into two updates. If you want mid battle choices then perhaps the best thing to do is to actually say that as otherwise stance changes would probably get lumped into the micro management that we never see. Also the only way I could see Skill based gameplay being represented would be allowing rerolls of some dice.
Well, I don't want Terran to pause the narration mid combat, you are right in that. All my suggestions, like stance changes, would have to be simulated in the background by Terran during combat.

I disagree about never seeing it though. Terran can perfectly well write out the crucial mid-battle choices for us to read, as a part of the battle description. Karen can eventually learn to make good decisions, and triumph. Karen can be fooled to make bad decisions and lose. The opponent can make decisions that have an effect. Bluffing during combat, information gathering during combat, and many other currently nonexistent tactics would emerge and we could read about those in the story.

When it comes to direct gameplay, we voters can still participate in the battles by making the battle plans. PvE offers a lot of variety naturally, with group tactics, target selection, and the environment, but I would imagine PvP duels to be really boring to plan for Karen right now.


Example: Momonga says in the source that he always lost the first round in duels, but won the following ones. Currently, there is no chance in the system for Karen to do the same. She only has active abilities which she always uses; there is zero adjusting based on the opponent. No movement patterns, varying hit areas, combat stances, or timing based abilities. No learning about the opponent and improving mid battle. Even if Terran only simulated those behind the screen, as they should, more tactical and varied combat would be nice to read about.


Again, this isn't currently a problem or anything. Just some ideas for future abilities and narratives.
 
Inserted tally
Adhoc vote count started by Monk Penguin on Jan 16, 2019 at 1:09 AM, finished with 39 posts and 28 votes.
 
Hahaha, thats a pretty old Tally.
Adhoc vote count started by Dark as Silver on Jan 16, 2019 at 1:33 AM, finished with 84 posts and 13 votes.

  • [X] Insist on going down to loot the Spider. It's a level 60 monster, it must have some good loot for you.
    [X] Go down the Tree. You can come back later when you're stronger.
    -[X] Go back to Arresalt, you're nearing level 50.
    [X] Plan Slaggedfire
    -[X] PHY DEF 10
    -[X] MAG. DEF. 14
    -[X] Unlock 'Collector'
    -[X] Unlock 'Blessing of Wind'
    -[X] Unlock 'Battle Continuation'
    -[X] Unlock 'Way of Wuxia'
    -[X] Unlock 'Divine Defiance'
    -[X] Improve...
    --[X] Flexible Body
    [X] Plan Slaggedfire
    -[X] PHY DEF 10
    -[X] MAG. DEF. 14
    -[X] Unlock 'Collector'
    -[X] Unlock 'Blessing of Wind'
    -[X] Unlock 'Battle Continuation'
    -[X] Unlock 'Way of Wuxia'
    -[X] Unlock 'Divine Defiance'
    -[X] Improve...
    --[X]The Way of the Asura's Defensive Form
    [X] Plan Time for more Actions
    -[X] PHY DEF 10
    -[X] MAG. DEF. 14
    -[X] Unlock 'Blessing of Wind'
    -[X] Unlock 'Battle Continuation'
    -[X] Unlock 'Way of Wuxia'
    -[X] Improve...
    --[X]The Way of the Asura's Defensive Form
    --[X]Heightened Combat Reflexes x2
    [X] Plan Balance
    -[X] HP 10
    -[X] MP 14
    -[X] Unlock 'Blessing of Wind'
    -[X] Unlock 'Battle Continuation'
    -[X] Unlock 'Way of Wuxia'
    -[X] Improve...
    --[X]The Way of the Asura's Defensive Form*2
    --[X]Heightened Combat Reflexes
    [X] Plan Maximized Attack Power
    -[X] PHY ATK 20
    -[X] AGILITY 4
    -[X] Unlock 'Collector'
    -[X] Unlock 'Blessing of Wind'
    -[X] Unlock 'Battle Continuation'
    -[X] Unlock 'Way of Wuxia'
    -[X] Unlock 'Divine Defiance'
    -[X] Improve...
    --[X]The Way of the Asura's Defensive Form
    [X] Buy a cash shop reset after allocating these points.
    [X] Plan Time for more Actions
    -[X] PHY DEF 10
    -[X] MAG. DEF. 14
    -[X] Unlock 'Blessing of Wind'
    -[X] Unlock 'Battle Continuation'
    -[X] Unlock 'Way of Wuxia'
    -[X] Improve...
    --[X]Heightened Combat Reflexes x3
    [X] Keep going up. You're not going to log-out here.

Adhoc vote count started by Dark as Silver on Jan 16, 2019 at 1:33 AM, finished with 84 posts and 13 votes.

  • [X] Insist on going down to loot the Spider. It's a level 60 monster, it must have some good loot for you.
    [X] Go down the Tree. You can come back later when you're stronger.
    -[X] Go back to Arresalt, you're nearing level 50.
    [X] Plan Slaggedfire
    -[X] PHY DEF 10
    -[X] MAG. DEF. 14
    -[X] Unlock 'Collector'
    -[X] Unlock 'Blessing of Wind'
    -[X] Unlock 'Battle Continuation'
    -[X] Unlock 'Way of Wuxia'
    -[X] Unlock 'Divine Defiance'
    -[X] Improve...
    --[X] Flexible Body
    [X] Plan Slaggedfire
    -[X] PHY DEF 10
    -[X] MAG. DEF. 14
    -[X] Unlock 'Collector'
    -[X] Unlock 'Blessing of Wind'
    -[X] Unlock 'Battle Continuation'
    -[X] Unlock 'Way of Wuxia'
    -[X] Unlock 'Divine Defiance'
    -[X] Improve...
    --[X]The Way of the Asura's Defensive Form
    [X] Plan Time for more Actions
    -[X] PHY DEF 10
    -[X] MAG. DEF. 14
    -[X] Unlock 'Blessing of Wind'
    -[X] Unlock 'Battle Continuation'
    -[X] Unlock 'Way of Wuxia'
    -[X] Improve...
    --[X]The Way of the Asura's Defensive Form
    --[X]Heightened Combat Reflexes x2
    [X] Plan Balance
    -[X] HP 10
    -[X] MP 14
    -[X] Unlock 'Blessing of Wind'
    -[X] Unlock 'Battle Continuation'
    -[X] Unlock 'Way of Wuxia'
    -[X] Improve...
    --[X]The Way of the Asura's Defensive Form*2
    --[X]Heightened Combat Reflexes
    [X] Plan Maximized Attack Power
    -[X] PHY ATK 20
    -[X] AGILITY 4
    -[X] Unlock 'Collector'
    -[X] Unlock 'Blessing of Wind'
    -[X] Unlock 'Battle Continuation'
    -[X] Unlock 'Way of Wuxia'
    -[X] Unlock 'Divine Defiance'
    -[X] Improve...
    --[X]The Way of the Asura's Defensive Form
    [X] Buy a cash shop reset after allocating these points.
    [X] Plan Time for more Actions
    -[X] PHY DEF 10
    -[X] MAG. DEF. 14
    -[X] Unlock 'Blessing of Wind'
    -[X] Unlock 'Battle Continuation'
    -[X] Unlock 'Way of Wuxia'
    -[X] Improve...
    --[X]Heightened Combat Reflexes x3
    [X] Keep going up. You're not going to log-out here.
 
Inserted tally
Adhoc vote count started by Dark as Silver on Jan 16, 2019 at 1:33 AM, finished with 84 posts and 13 votes.

  • [X] Insist on going down to loot the Spider. It's a level 60 monster, it must have some good loot for you.
    [X] Go down the Tree. You can come back later when you're stronger.
    -[X] Go back to Arresalt, you're nearing level 50.
    [X] Plan Slaggedfire
    -[X] PHY DEF 10
    -[X] MAG. DEF. 14
    -[X] Unlock 'Collector'
    -[X] Unlock 'Blessing of Wind'
    -[X] Unlock 'Battle Continuation'
    -[X] Unlock 'Way of Wuxia'
    -[X] Unlock 'Divine Defiance'
    -[X] Improve...
    --[X] Flexible Body
    [X] Plan Slaggedfire
    -[X] PHY DEF 10
    -[X] MAG. DEF. 14
    -[X] Unlock 'Collector'
    -[X] Unlock 'Blessing of Wind'
    -[X] Unlock 'Battle Continuation'
    -[X] Unlock 'Way of Wuxia'
    -[X] Unlock 'Divine Defiance'
    -[X] Improve...
    --[X]The Way of the Asura's Defensive Form
    [X] Plan Time for more Actions
    -[X] PHY DEF 10
    -[X] MAG. DEF. 14
    -[X] Unlock 'Blessing of Wind'
    -[X] Unlock 'Battle Continuation'
    -[X] Unlock 'Way of Wuxia'
    -[X] Improve...
    --[X]The Way of the Asura's Defensive Form
    --[X]Heightened Combat Reflexes x2
    [X] Plan Balance
    -[X] HP 10
    -[X] MP 14
    -[X] Unlock 'Blessing of Wind'
    -[X] Unlock 'Battle Continuation'
    -[X] Unlock 'Way of Wuxia'
    -[X] Improve...
    --[X]The Way of the Asura's Defensive Form*2
    --[X]Heightened Combat Reflexes
    [X] Plan Maximized Attack Power
    -[X] PHY ATK 20
    -[X] AGILITY 4
    -[X] Unlock 'Collector'
    -[X] Unlock 'Blessing of Wind'
    -[X] Unlock 'Battle Continuation'
    -[X] Unlock 'Way of Wuxia'
    -[X] Unlock 'Divine Defiance'
    -[X] Improve...
    --[X]The Way of the Asura's Defensive Form
    [X] Buy a cash shop reset after allocating these points.
    [X] Plan Time for more Actions
    -[X] PHY DEF 10
    -[X] MAG. DEF. 14
    -[X] Unlock 'Blessing of Wind'
    -[X] Unlock 'Battle Continuation'
    -[X] Unlock 'Way of Wuxia'
    -[X] Improve...
    --[X]Heightened Combat Reflexes x3
    [X] Keep going up. You're not going to log-out here.
 
*Magic:
In YGGDRASIL, Magic fall under four main categories:

  • Arcane: Western Fantasy-like Magic
  • Divine: Restoration, healing, self-buff and allies buff Magic.
  • Spiritual: Eastern Fantasy-like Magic
  • Alternative: Spells that fall outside of the other types of spells.
I checked back the thread, and saw that divine magic isn't really offense based. Also, the ability reset doesn't seem to get votes at this time, though I still think it's the best use for dollars, and very time-sensitive.

Thus, I'm changing to Dark as Silver's plan.

[X] Plan Time for more Actions



And still putting this in with hope.

[X] Buy a cash shop reset after allocating these points.
 
If we reset, would "The Way of the Asura" (Rank 6) not be possible to get back?
 
Any skill we currently have?
Yes but not all skills or abilities are great enough to warrant an improvement to rank 6. For example, if you used it on Light Feet... It'll be wasted.
And if you don't use it for The Way of the Asura, you'll likely lose the extra rank 6 ability you recently gained. The Wu Xing elements.
By the way, can we level up Edith or is she stuck at level 10?
She can level up naturally albeit at a much slower pace than player characters.
In fact, she reached level 30 recently due to how much fighting and grinding you got into. I'll give you the option to choose Edith's next class.
Course we can level her, but I don't remember how it's done. Probably Data Crystals if the QM kept that from canon.
Yes, that too if you don't want to bother going the traditional way and wait till' she levels up.
As a rule, however, Edith can't exceed your own level so even if you got a fuck-ton of Data Crystals, you can't go wild and level her up to 100. :tongue:
 
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Yes but not all skills or abilities are great enough to warrant an improvement to rank 6. For example, if you used it on Light Feet... It'll be wasted.
And if you don't use it for The Way of the Asura, you'll likely use the extra rank 6 ability you recently gained. The Wu Xing elements.

I was honestly thinking of these abilities to hit Rank 6.

"Enlightened Soul" (Rank 1): You have reached a new stage of enlightenment and existence. The energies inside of you swirl around as they exit the confines of your body and coat it in a protective warm shell. You are completely immune to the magic(Arcane and Spiritual)of the 7th tier and lower. Physical damage needs to reach a certain threshold(50) before it can even register.

"Unyielding Mountain" (Rank 1): There will be no half-measures or compromises when you make your decisions. Your will is dominating and unyielding. You go all the way, or not at all. Once you take a decision, you will stand by it even if the Gods themselves disagree. Such is a Will to defy Heaven. Your place amongst the Gods is assured and irrefutable, none can deny it. Once per battle you may completely ignore a magical attack that would throw you or otherwise overwhelm you by your sheer strength of will.

"Ambition to Reach Heaven" (Rank 2): Primal terror accompanied the first tentative steps into the dark, away from your home and the safe city that nurtured us. Only by conquering and stomping out this fear can you continue to grow. Millions will die so that you may reach your ambition. Your name will one day be on the lips of the Gods themselves. Use a specific ability in a way that lets you ignore multiple laws of physics completely and offer massive bonuses when used on attacks of +10 to Damage, Attack, and Dodge rolls. This ability also offers complete immunity to mental interference unless it is of a 6th tier and higher.

Mostly Enlightened Soul. Rank 6 on a skill that at base level gives us immunity to physical and magical attacks below Tier 7? It should make us outright immune to damn near everything.
 
Yeah, that sucks but we've got some elemental skills to fall back on just in case. I suppose as a dodge tank you don't really need invulnerability, plus there would be high level skills that would ignore defences that we'd have to rely on our agility for as well.

QM confirmed when we were discussing Wu Xing elements that it can be used for defensive purposes as well. Though correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't our current elemental abilities from our Wu Xing Elements?

I wonder how Asura Defensive Stance will be affected by the merge.
 
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QM confirmed when we were discussing Wu Xing elements that it can be used for defensive purposes as well. Though correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't our current elemental abilities from our Wu Xing Elements?

I wonder how Asura Defensive Stance will be affected by the merge.

Nah, we've got a couple of skills that are entirely separate.

"Mystical Holy Strikes"(Rank 2): Your instincts guiding your movements are flawless, graceful and elegant while still being brutally efficient with minimal movements. This ability is an AoE attack that can be used three times per fight.+8 to Melee Attacks and Damage. Your fists are coated in Golden Divine Light. Holy Attribute.

"Fiery Thunder Sword" (Rank 1): A brutal technique. Your hands become as sharp as swords, they become coated in the element of Fire. After further improvements, your hands would crackle with high-powered charges of electricity. +5 to Melee Attacks and Damage

"Splendid Water Fist" (Rank 1): An elegant attack using the element of Water, the movement flow like pure tranquil water as your fist extends and projects jets of high-pressure water. This allows you to attack both at range, far and close since it has melee advantages as well. +5 to Melee Attacks and Damage

Not sure if we unlocked them because of way of the asura, but we've got 3/7 elements or something covered without way of the asura.

Plus in a complete respec we would have a chance to buy the other skills to unlock the remaining elements.
 
QM confirmed when we were discussing Wu Xing elements that it can be used for defensive purposes as well. Though correct me if I'm wrong, but aren't our current elemental abilities from our Wu Xing Elements?

I wonder how Asura Defensive Stance will be affected by the merge.
We get to choice on how defensive merges so if you've got an idea now would be a good time to start trying to subtly influence our QM.
 
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