S͈͈͟y͈͈͋s̴͈͈͈͈ͧ͑t͈͈̋e͈̝͈m͈͈̓ ͈͈᷾E͈͈͟r͈̹͈r͈᷿͈o͈͈᷆r͈͈͜(Raildex Quest Redux)
- Thread starter Lunaryon
- Start date
[X] Inertia sense - ??? Stunt - Upon interacting with an object, you passively are able to tell the exact amount of force required to move the object.
The professor seems alright enough, if rather intense, and lacking in social graces, he's got me interested to know what kind of crazy plan, or goal he's trying to achieve
The professor seems alright enough, if rather intense, and lacking in social graces, he's got me interested to know what kind of crazy plan, or goal he's trying to achieve
Feng Lengshun
Z-Program Researcher
- Location
- Indonesia
[x] Envisioned Structure - Clairvoyance Stunt - You may choose to increase the cost of activating Clairvoyance by 1. Doing so allows you to see the entirety of whatever you are examining with Clairvoyance as if you were looking at a wire-frame model.
As Emiya Shirou has proven, both in canon and in fanfictions, Structural Analysis is a pretty useful power. Like, for example, we could find out about where exactly is the weak point of any object. Someone's hiding in a structure, like, say... a golem? Just analyze them and you can know where they at, after which you can snipe them (provided you have the resources to do so).
As Emiya Shirou has proven, both in canon and in fanfictions, Structural Analysis is a pretty useful power. Like, for example, we could find out about where exactly is the weak point of any object. Someone's hiding in a structure, like, say... a golem? Just analyze them and you can know where they at, after which you can snipe them (provided you have the resources to do so).
Feng Lengshun
Z-Program Researcher
- Location
- Indonesia
Also, double post but vote tally so far:
Vote tally:
##### 3.18
[X] Clairsentience - ??? Stunt - By expending a number of power points equal to the number of minutes divided by five, you can see into the past of any object you touch as if you were in the room with the object
No. of votes: 3
silentspirals, lethe, Vilegrave
[X] Inertia sense - ??? Stunt - Upon interacting with an object, you passively are able to tell the exact amount of force required to move the object.
No. of votes: 2
Bondo, Shura12305
[x] Envisioned Structure - Clairvoyance Stunt
No. of votes: 1
marids
[x] Envisioned Structure - Clairvoyance Stunt - You may choose to increase the cost of activating Clairvoyance by 1. Doing so allows you to see the entirety of whatever you are examining with Clairvoyance as if you were looking at a wire-frame model.
No. of votes: 1
Feng Lengshun
Clairsentience in the lead, with both inertia sense and envisioned structure at the second place lagging one vote.
Vote tally:
##### 3.18
[X] Clairsentience - ??? Stunt - By expending a number of power points equal to the number of minutes divided by five, you can see into the past of any object you touch as if you were in the room with the object
No. of votes: 3
silentspirals, lethe, Vilegrave
[X] Inertia sense - ??? Stunt - Upon interacting with an object, you passively are able to tell the exact amount of force required to move the object.
No. of votes: 2
Bondo, Shura12305
[x] Envisioned Structure - Clairvoyance Stunt
No. of votes: 1
marids
[x] Envisioned Structure - Clairvoyance Stunt - You may choose to increase the cost of activating Clairvoyance by 1. Doing so allows you to see the entirety of whatever you are examining with Clairvoyance as if you were looking at a wire-frame model.
No. of votes: 1
Feng Lengshun
Clairsentience in the lead, with both inertia sense and envisioned structure at the second place lagging one vote.
Something goofy about that tally.
there are only three clairsentience votes on this page, but I know for a fact that there are more on the previous page. same for the other votes, really.
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Feng Lengshun
Z-Program Researcher
- Location
- Indonesia
Alright... not sure what went wrong. Let me try that again.
Vote tally:
##### 3.18
[X] Clairsentience - ??? Stunt - By expending a number of power points equal to the number of minutes divided by five, you can see into the past of any object you touch as if you were in the room with the object
No. of votes: 8
veekie, Nervos Belli, LightMage, Koden, Asael, silentspirals, lethe, Vilegrave
[X] Inertia sense - ??? Stunt - Upon interacting with an object, you passively are able to tell the exact amount of force required to move the object.
No. of votes: 6
Bass11, Carrnage, Mizu, Z000, Bondo, Shura12305
[x] Envisioned Structure - Clairvoyance Stunt
No. of votes: 1
marids
[x] Envisioned Structure - Clairvoyance Stunt - You may choose to increase the cost of activating Clairvoyance by 1. Doing so allows you to see the entirety of whatever you are examining with Clairvoyance as if you were looking at a wire-frame model.
No. of votes: 1
Feng Lengshun
Huh, Envisioned Structure is on a huge loss... aw, come on guys. It's basically Scan! You can use it to find out a lot of details. Heck, analyze a house or a room, and you might find some hidden passages. Analyze and electrical object, and it can help you fix them. Analyze the structure of a tank, and you can find which of its spots are the weakest. Come on, it's a nifty ability that is very versatile!
I mean, I can see the appeal of being able to see the past of an object, but while it could be useful for investigating something, its usage is still somewhat narrow. Especially since you need a lot of points to see far to the past. It wouldn't let you know if someone, say, happens to have a weak leg with them.
Also, Envisioned Structure is way cooler especially because you can use it to look at the cat in the box without opening them, thus saying a Fuck You to Schrodinger's Cat theory (well, its literal part anyways).
OctarineShrike
Avatar of Mandos
[x] Envisioned Structure - Clairvoyance Stunt - You may choose to increase the cost of activating Clairvoyance by 1. Doing so allows you to see the entirety of whatever you are examining with Clairvoyance as if you were looking at a wire-frame model.
You can use Clairsentience to track people too, depending on how it function.Just touch the ground and follow the after image.
If you can hear past events it is good for spying as well. just touch an area were a secret meeting happened and BAM!.
Passcode on the door?, doesnt matter to us!.
Password on the computer?, all your secrets belong to us.
Also, kinda hoping we can develop it into parachronal cognition. although that might be a stretch.
Feng Lengshun
Z-Program Researcher
- Location
- Indonesia
Yeah, I imagined that as well, and I really want it too, but then I thought about the cost to use it, as well as...
Depends on how long it has been since it was entered. If it has been half an hour? Yeah, that's going to eat a LOT of points. On the other hand though, with Envisioned Structure you can just analyze them to know how to disassemble them. Then you can try to break it in the first one to bait and distract guard or maybe re-wire it if we have learned enough about electronics. For the second one, you can just then disassemble the computer and bring the hard disk home.
Now, I get the charm of that ability. Being able to see the past and be 'present' in that past is a nifty trick. But the problem is that it is also very circumstantial. Heck, how do you even determine if you needed an info from 5 minutes ago or 6 minutes ago? Unless you are already near the object at that time or we have a friend who knows exactly of what time do we need, it's going to be quite hard to determine at which time you need to see. Envisioned Structure on the other is useful at all time, and is guaranteed to give you information any time you use it, even if its usefulness might vary depending our skills and resources.
That a lot of guesswork there. we have no idea what any of this will cost.
Also, good luck doing any of this without the proper tools.
Understanding of the structure of an object in no way gives you understanding of electronic programming.
Ahem:
[ ] Envisioned Structure - Clairvoyance Stunt - You may choose to increase the cost of activating Clairvoyance by 1. Doing so allows you to see the entirety of whatever you are examining with Clairvoyance as if you were looking at a wire-frame model.
having a wire-frame image of a structure doesn't help with you half the thing you mentioned.
meanwhile we can, RIGHT NOW, examine 250 min of past. personally, I imagine we can review things in reverse order if necassary.
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- Location
- South Africa
[X] Inertia sense - ??? Stunt - Upon interacting with an object, you passively are able to tell the exact amount of force required to move the object.
Feng Lengshun
Z-Program Researcher
- Location
- Indonesia
It helped with Emiya Shirou, though admittedly he has been doing this stuff for years. Though it also helped with Gyro Zeppelli. Hm... I suppose it depends on the level of detail we get on the wire-frame. If it's only just the outer structure, then yeah, it wouldn't be worth it. But if it works like an x-ray, of at least Shirou Emiya's Structural Grasp level, allowing us to see the wire-frame of a person's bone structure and their organs, then it would be a really strong one.
Well, in any case, I'm more partial towards Envisioned Structure because of how useful and versatile I've seen a Structural Grasp/Scan-like ability is, compared to something that is practically a Moody Blues.
Shiro's powers were different. he could alter (somewhat) and reinforce an object. The power we would get is just seeing the wireframe of a thing.
The two are only related superficially.
Being able to see someones organs is only really useful if your trying to be a doctor. in general, if you stab someone in the gut they will most likely die.
Seeing the bone structure of a target won't help you break them. Only really useful if your trying to play medic.
Even if we did develop Shirou like abilities in terms of scanning... well, to use your earlier example, if we were fighting a tank and used scanning to find it's weakpoint, it would not matter at all because even the weakest spot on a tank is impervious to our fists.
Meanwhile, if we manage to develop parachronal cognition we could literally Rube Goldberg our way through problems.
- Location
- canada
[] Envisioned Structure - Clairvoyance Stunt - You may choose to increase the cost of activating Clairvoyance by 1. Doing so allows you to see the entirety of whatever you are examining with Clairvoyance as if you were looking at a wire-frame model.
My thoughts on this power was that it would give us even more perception on top of our AIM field perception. By being able to to see through the ENTIRETY of anything that we're examining, we should then be able to find the best way to move around in a building or any single structure, and be able to perceive any type of hidden paths behind walls or floors and such.
Also, by knowing how things are on the inside, even if they're merely wire-frame models, we should have an easier time to either break through locks or see if anything is hiding something, such as hidden compartments of a container or objects in other objects or even people.
Lastly, I do agree that by simply looking at the structure of either a person or object doesn't tell us where we should hit it to exploit any weakness it has, as that would probably require an understanding of physics, engineering, and perhaps even biology and architecture. BUT, just because the power require the most amount of studying doesn't make it any less valuable. Just look at Misaka Mikoto, she certainly wasn't a level 5 when her power was discovered as a kid. It was by increasing her understanding of electricity, physics, and probably even more in-depth knowledge of electromagnetism in general, that let her finally become a competent and powerful level 5. Basically, this is a power which will probably require more education at everything else for it to truly shine.
Thus, in my understanding, this power is the most useful for total generalized purposes for both combat and practical uses due to it's versatility and how it enhances what the user can perceive and aid in many more things that we can do, which can even include building or dismantling things, and understanding something better in essence, as opposed to simply giving an answer directly in giving either memories of what happened in the past or how much force it takes to move it in a specific direction.
I guess in the end it depends on the players on what kind of game they want after all, the long time needed to be spent on training to truly maximize the use of a skill might not even be available if more deadly stuff starts to happen at a quick enough pace.
My thoughts on this power was that it would give us even more perception on top of our AIM field perception. By being able to to see through the ENTIRETY of anything that we're examining, we should then be able to find the best way to move around in a building or any single structure, and be able to perceive any type of hidden paths behind walls or floors and such.
Also, by knowing how things are on the inside, even if they're merely wire-frame models, we should have an easier time to either break through locks or see if anything is hiding something, such as hidden compartments of a container or objects in other objects or even people.
Lastly, I do agree that by simply looking at the structure of either a person or object doesn't tell us where we should hit it to exploit any weakness it has, as that would probably require an understanding of physics, engineering, and perhaps even biology and architecture. BUT, just because the power require the most amount of studying doesn't make it any less valuable. Just look at Misaka Mikoto, she certainly wasn't a level 5 when her power was discovered as a kid. It was by increasing her understanding of electricity, physics, and probably even more in-depth knowledge of electromagnetism in general, that let her finally become a competent and powerful level 5. Basically, this is a power which will probably require more education at everything else for it to truly shine.
Thus, in my understanding, this power is the most useful for total generalized purposes for both combat and practical uses due to it's versatility and how it enhances what the user can perceive and aid in many more things that we can do, which can even include building or dismantling things, and understanding something better in essence, as opposed to simply giving an answer directly in giving either memories of what happened in the past or how much force it takes to move it in a specific direction.
I guess in the end it depends on the players on what kind of game they want after all, the long time needed to be spent on training to truly maximize the use of a skill might not even be available if more deadly stuff starts to happen at a quick enough pace.
I disagree. Even with a better understanding of physics, this power is inherently a kind of clairvoyance. Matter manipulation does not figure in at all.
To that end, combat applications are limited. investigation application relies on the presence of hidden compartments (which is unlikely.)
Likewise, it does not help you analyze what the components are made from, or their properties.
it helps you understand the structure, that is to say, the physical dimensions of an object. Applications are actually quite limited.
Clairsentience is basically the best information gathering tool on this list. In academy city, knowledge is power.
@marids
One of the examples you use for an application is
This is incorrect.
Assuming you have no knowledge of motor vehicle maintenance, would showing you a diagram of it help you build one?.
I doubt it.
Would showing you a diagram with no labels help you understand how it works?.
No way in hell.
Now assume you gained all the knowledge you needed to build a car from scratch. Would being able to 'see' the internal dimensions of it help you build it?.
Only very slightly.
One of the examples you use for an application is
This is incorrect.
Assuming you have no knowledge of motor vehicle maintenance, would showing you a diagram of it help you build one?.
I doubt it.
Would showing you a diagram with no labels help you understand how it works?.
No way in hell.
Now assume you gained all the knowledge you needed to build a car from scratch. Would being able to 'see' the internal dimensions of it help you build it?.
Only very slightly.
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- Location
- canada
It is NOT incorrect. Say if you were trying to build some kind of machine or object, yet a specific component needs to be attached or added on but there was plenty of obstructions in the way to let you see clearly, then this would let you do that action with much more confidence since you can literally see through the entire construct. Also, if more moving parts have to be tested for their functionality while encased in something else, then this perception would allow you to see just how are every piece moving at a time and thus help you spot just exactly where an error is occurring and fix it quicker than otherwise.
As for your example for the car diagram thing, why did you assume that I meant that as soon as you looked at the chart you would be able to know just how to put it together? I DID SAY that it would require education to know how to apply it better. This is NOT a substitute for actual knowledge, it is POTENTIALLY capable of letting you do thing EVEN BETTER than normal people can when at similar skill levels, but only if the perception is useful for that type of construction in the first place. As for knowledge in engineering, that should help the person understand in general how common machines work and where to better open up or crack apart the pieces, but would probably do little or nothing for the super-high levels of tech that academy city have for their main forces.
ALL of these types of application requires more learning and training to begin with, which is something I kept emphasizing, that it enhances, not replaces a skill. There's a reason why I thought this would be a more generalist type of skill rather than just a directly useful type of power.
As for the matter manipulation thing, just exactly where did I ever wrote that? It's clearly a perception-based power, no physical manipulation at all anywhere.
In response to the limited in combat thing, that's strictly based the type of fight and on the already existent level of skill and knowledge that the person has to begin with. An uneducated person with no understanding or knowledge of what he is seeing or has no way to actually use the information due to a lack of means and power would obviously not have much use for it. But all the ways to navigate and spot hidden locations is still all useful even at the beginning.
@Lunaryon
Can we get some more details for the Envisioned Structure - Clairvoyance Stunt? As in, just how much resolution for details would he get? and would there be any sort of recognition of differences in different types of alloys or materials and such? better yet, would any of this improve with more training or is there even more to it?
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Information: Powers - Stunts
Lunaryon
Dual Aurora Wave
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Information: Powers - Stunts
Esper abilities are varied in both number and what they are capable of doing, which each person capable of doing different and unique things. A number of the more interesting power uses that are unique to the various users of these abilities are nicknamed 'Stunts'.
A simple description of a Stunt is a particular power usage that goes above and beyond what is considered ordinary for that power.
But going by that description would not be wholly correct due to the fact that not all stunts are as simple a matter as that.
While far from being treated with any actual level of scientific study, there has been a variety of different people who have looked into these stunts and how they seem to work more out of their own curiosity than anything else.
Many of them came up with very similar deductions about the nature of stunts, and after a short time working together have created a primer on the nature of stunts.
Their definition of a stunt is as follows:
Stunts are tricks and skills that Espers begin to pick up over the time that they have their ability. This particular power usage is an adaptation of their true esper power, and has the possibility of functioning on a level higher than the actual esper ability.
These Stunts are separated into three different categories -
Active Stunts - These stunts are the easiest to develop, and can actually develop and function at a level higher than the ability under normal circumstances.
The Ur-Example of this kind of Stunt is the famous 'Railgun' Stunt that Level 5 Electromaster Misaka Mikoto has developed. She actually first developed the ability at level 3, when she went through a class shift, and during the first time it was being measured, it was assumed that Misaka went through a level shift because the railgun itself was functioning at a level 4 state.
Passive Stunts - Passive stunts are abilities that once they are developed they are always functioning. They do not require EP to use, but they can only work at the same level as your ability and should you go through a Level Shift you will need to redevelop the ability for the new level.
The Ur-Example of this kind of Stunt is Accelerator's 'Reflection Aura' Stunt which runs passively in the background and reflects incoming attacks.
Evolutionary Stunts - Evolutionary starts are the most difficult type of stunt to develop, but are some of the most powerful. These stunts alter how your powers function in a very fundamental way.
The Ur-Example of this kind of Stunt is Shirai Kuroko's 'Matter Displacement' Stunt that allows her to teleport an object into another with only the second object taking damage, where without this stunt when someone teleports something into something else both objects are damaged, but the more durable object takes the lesser amount of damage.