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MCV Luv Alternative: Muv Luv only with 100% more C&C

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[X] I need more information before I can commit to any decision: You can't just waltz through half a country of aliens and Tiberium just because someone ask nicely

Better understanding of what's going on will allow us to employ our forces better, particularly the house-sized masses of Fuck You.

Also the Hammerheads and Orcas. But especially the Hammerheads. The Zone Trooper Hammerheads.
 
[X] I need more information before I can commit to any decision: You can't just waltz through half a country of aliens and Tiberium just because someone ask nicely
 
If you're going to be spam rating my posts funny @ckk185 , at least realize I'm a comedy writer and all it does is make the funny vote counter raise even higher on my profile rather than antagonize me.

Whiskey Golf said:
Also the Hammerheads and Orcas. But especially the Hammerheads. The Zone Trooper Hammerheads.
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Oh yes.

Though, imagine if you will BETA tunnels and hives count as garrisoned in C&C game mechanics. Can you say Hammerhead's equipped with Grenadiers. :V
 
[X] I need more information before I can commit to any decision: You can't just waltz through half a country of aliens and Tiberium just because someone ask nicely.

Need to be cynical here. Caution might be needed here.
 
ckk185 said:
On grounds of what? Their non existant ABM networks? Their currently non existant army? If any of the other parties decide that they want to fire off some firecrackers, you can't exactly stop them barring interception.

Oh and trust me. They got way more boom than you have Ion cannon satellites
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Well for one our WMDs aren't currently denied by laser fire; not denying they'll be able to overwhelm us but we've got enough to turn the tide in any ground battle.
ckk185 said:
Signal flares and runners. The oldest trick in the book. There is more to military communication than just radio. Not to mention that you guys are the ones choosing to fire the cannon anyway.
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If there is an Ion storm that communication will be shot to hell; signal flares suck when visibility is shit and anyone exposed runs the risk of Tib exposure.

Also again it's to slow for the speeds GDI operates at.
ckk185 said:
Oh yes and by the time everything goes wrong like that, everybody and their mum's would have popped all their red flares and started running backwards.

You know. Like not retarded soldiers.
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Ion storms have a tendency to appear without warning and the second tiberium war was filled with non-stop battles during those storms (Nod loved ambushes during those storms) so fighting during one is just gonna be another day at the office for GDI.

If an Ion storm appears GDI won't be hindered in the slightest (beyond no aircraft but that's not a worry) due to advancements in technology but our allies don't have anyway to deal with the interference an Ion storm produces; ensuing communication and coordination remains viable at all times or at least preparing for breakdown of communication is vital for the success of this mission.
Whiskey Golf said:
Better understanding of what's going on will allow us to employ our forces better, particularly the house-sized masses of Fuck You.

Also the Hammerheads and Orcas. But especially the Hammerheads. The Zone Trooper Hammerheads.
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Technically we can have them fly at TSF head height or something which would solve the laser issue; otherwise we can still spam Guardians filled with zone raiders and zone troopers though.

Speaking of guardians the steel talons mobile repair version filled with zone raiders should be part of every TSF squad to ensure rapid repair and rearmament.
 
Night_stalker said:
I was talking about having runners deliver messages. It could work, if we have some Nod bike schematics in our databases.
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Ooooooh okay, I'm really sorry I misunderstood. We do have the Pitbull though. Mind, might as well have Pitbull's with everyone due to their bullshit detection abilities.

For burrowing BETA.
Bag of Bones said:
Speaking of guardians the steel talons mobile repair version filled with zone raiders should be part of every TSF squad to ensure rapid repair and rearmament.
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Oh yeeaaah. We have that. That's... really broken.

Being able to repair in seconds, in field, would be such an amazing advantage for the MuvLuv guys.
 
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[X] I need more information before I can commit to any decision: You can't just waltz through half a country of aliens and Tiberium just because someone ask nicely.

We got leverage, let's pump the the info while we can.
 
[x] Sure let's do this: Blowing up aliens in a hostile Tiberium infested environment? That's basically Tuesday for you.

with the added caveat that we should use GDI's classical 'Armored fist' doctrine as much as possible- they can deny us Orcas and Firehawks all they want, but a mile-long wall of Mammoth Tanks backed by Juggernauts and fast-reaction groups of APCs will ruin anyone's day. and if we happen to spot developing hardpoints, well, that's what the Ion Cannon is for.

also, considering the ion cannon is perfectly capable of wrecking a Threshold tower (which, given the size of the things, must be made of Bullshitium) I'd lay even-odds on us being able to zap Hives- or at least blow the surface structure open.
 
Mechanis said:
with the added caveat that we should use GDI's classical 'Armored fist' doctrine as much as possible- they can deny us Orcas and Firehawks all they want, but a mile-long wall of Mammoth Tanks backed by Juggernauts and fast-reaction groups of APCs will ruin anyone's day. and if we happen to spot developing hardpoints, well, that's what the Ion Cannon is for.

also, considering the ion cannon is perfectly capable of wrecking a Threshold tower (which, given the size of the things, must be made of Bullshitium) I'd lay even-odds on us being able to zap Hives- or at least blow the surface structure open.
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There is a hole in the top; we can probably explode the main reactor doing that (or at least deliver a 300 to 500 KT nuke equivalent right into the center of the thing which would likely collapse most of the tunnels and vaporize most of the BETA in them).

Question is do we want to do that or do we want to shove an engineer into the hive?
 
Mechanis said:
[x] Sure let's do this: Blowing up aliens in a hostile Tiberium infested environment? That's basically Tuesday for you.

with the added caveat that we should use GDI's classical 'Armored fist' doctrine as much as possible- they can deny us Orcas and Firehawks all they want, but a mile-long wall of Mammoth Tanks backed by Juggernauts and fast-reaction groups of APCs will ruin anyone's day. and if we happen to spot developing hardpoints, well, that's what the Ion Cannon is for.

also, considering the ion cannon is perfectly capable of wrecking a Threshold tower (which, given the size of the things, must be made of Bullshitium) I'd lay even-odds on us being able to zap Hives- or at least blow the surface structure open.
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let's dig in a little more before we play that card.


i'm thinking Mammoth tanks with Wolverne escorts for the front line, groups Titans and APCs at loaded with Zone troopers and Raiders following close behind and everything fully upgraded.
Juggernauts stay in the back and should be firing non-stop both to soak up laser fire and try and thin the heard if we can get enough shells in the air.
as for the mix: 1:4 Mammoth to wolverne and 1:1:2 titans and Guardian-APCs and Repair-APCs (ratio is in that order, Guardians have Zone Troopers, Repairs have raiders)
 
sound good to me. though, speaking as a die-hard Turtle, I'd further suggest we send some MCVs and Surveyors trundling along behind our front, in order to construct security for our rear lines (Sonic emitter nets, mainly, but also strongpoints of lesser defenses) and maintain the short supply train that makes C&C-style warfare so brutally effective. if nothing else, securing any Tiberium fields along the way- both to fund our war effort and for IC containment reasons- should be something we do during this advance.

really we absolutely must establish forward bases once our battle line gets too far from our main base, in order to fully exploit our hilariously short reinforcement cycle. having fortified positions to fall back too and regroup if things go south is a big deal.
edit: it also occurs to me that we should mix some Zone Trooper/Raider Behemoths in with our Juggernauts just in case the BETA try something sneaky. Nod-induced paranoia, HO!
 
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Mechanis said:
with the added caveat that we should use GDI's classical 'Armored fist' doctrine as much as possible- they can deny us Orcas and Firehawks all they want, but a mile-long wall of Mammoth Tanks backed by Juggernauts and fast-reaction groups of APCs will ruin anyone's day. and if we happen to spot developing hardpoints, well, that's what the Ion Cannon is for.
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I should point out yet again that Laser-classes can win a battle of Artillery spam vs laserspam; Schwarzesmarken establishes that a standard size Warsaw Pact artillery battalion (fifty seven guns) will run dry before it's put a dent in the Lasers, who'll have happily shot down all the shells. It's very cold and calculating of me to say this, but I'd rather drop Firehawks on the Lasers from suborbit. They might all die, but they should take the Lasers with them.
 
Whiskey Golf said:
I should point out yet again that Laser-classes can win a battle of Artillery spam vs laserspam; Schwarzesmarken establishes that a standard size Warsaw Pact artillery battalion (fifty seven guns) will run dry before it's put a dent in the Lasers, who'll have happily shot down all the shells. It's very cold and calculating of me to say this, but I'd rather drop Firehawks on the Lasers from suborbit. They might all die, but they should take the Lasers with them.
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we don't have to worry about our guns running dry and each of our guns puts out three shells per salvo with a salvo every 3 seconds. 57 Juggernauths means 3420 shells put into the air every minute.
 
Whiskey Golf said:
I should point out yet again that Laser-classes can win a battle of Artillery spam vs laserspam; Schwarzesmarken establishes that a standard size Warsaw Pact artillery battalion (fifty seven guns) will run dry before it's put a dent in the Lasers, who'll have happily shot down all the shells. It's very cold and calculating of me to say this, but I'd rather drop Firehawks on the Lasers from suborbit. They might all die, but they should take the Lasers with them.
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Oh! We should ask the UN or US forces for data on their anti-laser shells. That would help a lot with saturating the shit out of the area around Laser strains.
 
Whiskey Golf said:
I should point out yet again that Laser-classes can win a battle of Artillery spam vs laserspam; Schwarzesmarken establishes that a standard size Warsaw Pact artillery battalion (fifty seven guns) will run dry before it's put a dent in the Lasers, who'll have happily shot down all the shells. It's very cold and calculating of me to say this, but I'd rather drop Firehawks on the Lasers from suborbit. They might all die, but they should take the Lasers with them.
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My method is to use this much firepower as a distraction to send an engineer spam. Expensive as hell but worth it.
 
Juggernoughts fire three shells every three seconds. Juggernoughts are basically an Iowa turret on legs, get enough of them and we can saturate Laser class, at least enough that they can't do anything but shoot down our shelling.

edit: also, those fifty-seven guns have an issue called endurance. yeah, maybe they can't saturate a laser class, but that may simply be a function of not being able to sustain a bombardment. they'll run out of shells eventually, after all.

we, on the other hand, could keep a maximum-intensity bombardment going for literally years with no breaks, no rest, no pauses to keep gun barrels from melting, nada.
there isn't a force in the world capable of doing that. and...
we can build two more every minute per War Factory.

exponential growth's a right bitch for the other guys.

our strategy, basically, is pretty much going to end up being what works in the base game: that is, pick a force mix, and spam like you're in a Monty Python skit.
 
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Whiskey Golf said:
I should point out yet again that Laser-classes can win a battle of Artillery spam vs laserspam; Schwarzesmarken establishes that a standard size Warsaw Pact artillery battalion (fifty seven guns) will run dry before it's put a dent in the Lasers, who'll have happily shot down all the shells. It's very cold and calculating of me to say this, but I'd rather drop Firehawks on the Lasers from suborbit. They might all die, but they should take the Lasers with them.
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Juggernauts are armed with 200mm cannons, near unlimited ammo thanks to tiberium and we can spam hundreds of them.

Lasers can be overwhelmed as operation 21st shows and unlike them we won't have to worry about ammo concerns.
 
Mechanis said:
Juggernoughts fire three shells every three seconds. Juggernoughts are basically an Iowa turret on legs, get enough of them and we can saturate Laser class, at least enough that they can't do anything but shoot down our shelling.
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like i said: 57 Juggernauts means 3420 shots per minute. individually each juggernaut puts out 60 shots/min which is double modern ROFs according to a quick google search.
 
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