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Lighting the Candles (RWBY Criminal Empire Quest)

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Zam said:
I feel we should at least try to be threatening, at least a little.
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Threaten her too much and she'll agree to join us and escape the moment we lower our guard.

Making her trust us is going to be hard enough even without us explicitly saying that we are willing to use her as an example if she screws up.

If things will be bad for her, she'll leave (and we can't keep watch over her 24/7), and she knows that. Making the offer just good enough that she will at least consider giving it a shot has a higher chance of her not escaping the moment we turn our eyes away from her.
 
Itaywex said:
Threaten her too much and she'll agree to join us and escape the moment we lower our guard.

Making her trust us is going to be hard enough even without us explicitly saying that we are willing to use her as an example if she screws up.

If things will be bad for her, she'll leave (and we can't keep watch over her 24/7), and she knows that. Making the offer just good enough that she will at least consider giving it a shot has a higher chance of her not escaping the moment we turn our eyes away from her.
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Good points, maybe hint at her being under 'observation' implying she has free reign might still be a bit far.
 
[X] "That was sloppy... But not bad. You've got
the makings of a two bit pickpocket. If you're
lucky, you might even be a three bit pick pocket.
You can look forward to only starving twice a
month... Or... You can come work for me. Turn
this little hobby... Into a profession, make some
real money."
 
[X] "That was sloppy... But not bad. You've got the makings of a two bit pickpocket. If you're lucky, you might even be a three bit pick pocket. You can look forward to only starving twice a month... Or... You can come work for me. Turn this little hobby... Into a profession, make some real money."
 
[X] "That was sloppy... But not bad. You've got the makings of a two bit pickpocket. If you're lucky, you might even be a three bit pick pocket. You can look forward to only starving twice a month... Or... You can come work for me. Turn this little hobby... Into a profession, make some real money."
 
Hyp3rB14d3 said:
Actually, I'm pretty sure she's not in another gang. Or at least isn't actively trying to con her way into being a double agent. She's shown herself far too stupid and incompetent for a reasonable person to want to recruit, and has made no effort to get us to recruit her now that our attention is on her.

If she were an unnamed pickpocket whose description did not match one of the characters in RWBY, we would not even be having this argument.
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Which is exactly what she'd won't you (us/Roman) to believe if she WAS all the things I offered she could be.

But you did raise a good point, I doubt we'd be here right now if she'd said "My name is Jill", but then my vote would STILL be to invest in her. It's like xcom, gotta take shit and turn it into gold. When opportunity tries to steal your wallet, give opportunity an opportunity.
Zam said:
[X]Try to recruit her
-[X] Explain to her what you would normally do to people who would try to steal from you.
-[X] But luckily for her, you hate seeing wasted talent more than you hate seeing people trying to steal from you.
-[X] So instead of making an example of her, you are willing to recruit her (how generous of you). That way she can pay you back for trying to steal from you, and in the end it will be much more beneficial for her to work with an organization than to be hospital patient. Does pickpocketing come with good health care?
--[X] And of course if she screws up or proves herself less than, how shall we say, loyal, well... We'll just have to let the results serve as a warning to anyone else in the future.

I feel we should at least try to be threatening, at least a little.
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I can get on board with this. Cuz if she does for some reason say no, and we don't seem at least a little threatening, she's gonna run off with the impression that we don't take people who steal from us very seriously. Which should never be the case.

But again, in all fairness if we recruit Emerald, the laws of balance dictate her role in cinder's crew needs to be filled by someone else...

Someone who may or not have shown up in volume 2 outta nowhere and aced Yang with her sass alone...

Plus, this gives us somebody to talk to about our grandiose schemes...

Still, @Hyp3rB14d3 has a point, we've got some pretty cool dudes on our payroll already...

But then, as is ever the question with quests... Why not both?

[X] Introduce her to Bill the Beowolf slayer.

Also, out of curiosity because I may have missed it. HAS anyone tried to steal from us before now? If so, how did we deal with them? Cuz if we have evidence as to how we dealt with this situation in the past, then there's no real debate here. If the last pickpocket got a beating, then this one does too.

Can't play favorites unless she looks like ice cream.
 
OMG A SHEEP said:
I can get on board with this. Cuz if she does for some reason say no, and we don't seem at least a little threatening, she's gonna run off with the impression that we don't take people who steal from us very seriously. Which should never be the case.

But again, in all fairness if we recruit Emerald, the laws of balance dictate her role in cinder's crew needs to be filled by someone else...

Someone who may or not have shown up in volume 2 outta nowhere and aced Yang with her sass alone...

Plus, this gives us somebody to talk to about our grandiose schemes...

Still, @Hyp3rB14d3 has a point, we've got some pretty cool dudes on our payroll already...
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I agree with much of what you say.

Honestly, when my mind goes to recruit its mostly, shove her in with some of our other mooks and tell her not to screw up and have them keep an eye on her. If she doesn't mess up and proves she has potential and is willing to try we may be able to justify pushing her beyond mook work, but I don't think we should start favouring an outsider too fairly right off the bat after she tried to rob us, good pickpocketing does not a loyal minion (or skilled criminal in other areas) make.
 
I agree she has potential but I feel I should point out a few problems with recruiting Emerald.
1) We do not have the same resources as Cinder I.E. knowledge and skill with both aura and semblance, weapons, dust, etc. as such there is no guarantee that she will be even close to as good as she is in cannon.
2) We do not have any means of insuring her loyalty, she can back stab us at any time for a multitude of reasons such as money or simply not liking us. Correcting this would probably take quite a few personal actions and turns, even then it's not a guarantee.
3) We simple do not have the time it would take to cultivate her potential, we have barley even started our criminal empire and as such are in a very precarious position. I assume training Emerald would take quite a few personal actions that could be better spent training ourselves or overseeing operations to insure success.
 
nolston said:
I agree she has potential but I feel I should point out a few problems with recruiting Emerald.
1) We do not have the same resources as Cinder I.E. knowledge and skill with both aura and semblance, weapons, dust, etc. as such there is no guarantee that she will be even close to as good as she is in cannon.
2) We do not have any means of insuring her loyalty, she can back stab us at any time for a multitude of reasons such as money or simply not liking us. Correcting this would probably take quite a few personal actions and turns, even then it's not a guarantee.
3) We simple do not have the time it would take to cultivate her potential, we have barley even started our criminal empire and as such are in a very precarious position. I assume training Emerald would take quite a few personal actions that could be better spent training ourselves or overseeing operations to insure success.
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I don't think that 1 and 3 are crucial (or can be improved right now). There isn't much to do about us not having time or resources, but it doesn't mean that we shouldn't recruit somebody with potential when we see one.

2, however, is a very good point. This is the main reason why my vote doesn't threaten her a lot, and instead states that we are benevolent enough to offer her a job which would be better than what she has now (I.E. nothing).

We can't insure her loyalty, but it doesn't mean we shouldn't try to recruit her. If she sticks with us now (when we have nothing) she will probably stay with us once we grow more. In fact, recruiting her now would be easier than in the future (when she might already be a part of another gang and might be an infiltrator instead of someone really willing to join).

OMG A SHEEP said:
Still, @Hyp3rB14d3 has a point, we've got some pretty cool dudes on our payroll already...
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We need a named character in the gang besides Roman, Sir Nameless doesn't count!
:V
 
Hyp3rB14d3 said:
I know she introduced herself as Emerald. It's why everyone is trying to recruit her. What I am saying is that if she hadn't introduced herself, then nobody would be trying to get her to join us. Nobody is interested in her for any reason other than the merits of her canon counterpart.
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This isn't true. We even had that omake where we coerced a faunus burglar into working for us. I like the idea of Roman pretty much claiming anything that is brought to his attention. He finds a secret network of tunnels? That's his secret network of tunnels now. Petty thief tries to steal from him? That's his petty thief now. Link shows off his fancy gun-cane? That'll be Roman's fancy gun-cane soon enough.
 
Itaywex said:
I don't think that 1 and 3 are crucial (or can be improved right now). There isn't much to do about us not having time or resources, but it doesn't mean that we shouldn't recruit somebody with potential when we see one.
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I disagree, I think they are very crucial. Emerald is an investment, an investment that we have neither the time nor resources to bring to its potential. we are a novice at both combat and aura, there is not much we can teach her and we don't know anyone who can or would, ergo at best she would be a mook with a name. As I said we are a new and relatively weak power in this city, at this time we need to be building a power base and improving our abilities, if we recruit Emerald we will have to devote time and resources that we don't have to her in order for her to be worth the effort. In the end potential is only power that has yet to come, and needs time and resources to bring out.


Itaywex said:
2, however, is a very good point. This is the main reason why my vote doesn't threaten her a lot, and instead states that we are benevolent enough to offer her a job which would be better than what she has now (I.E. nothing).

We can't insure her loyalty, but it doesn't mean we shouldn't try to recruit her. If she sticks with us now (when we have nothing) she will probably stay with us once we grow more. In fact, recruiting her now would be easier than in the future (when she might already be a part of another gang and might be an infiltrator instead of someone really willing to join).
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The problem is being benevolent can easily be mistaken for weakness or foolishness. At this point Emerald is a street rat that looks out for herself she has no reason NOT to try and screw us, anything we can offer her (money and a place to sleep) she can get mostly on her own.

The key word there is IF she sticks with us, in order to insure she doesn't just run or screw us we would need to devote manpower to having her watched, and lets face it our goons are not the sharpest tools in the shed. Right now she has no reason to stick with us except the threat of violence or death, and any job we offer her will not have enough benefits to not look for a better offer from someone else or just screw us for revenge, especially as she gets stronger and more experienced.
 
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OMG A SHEEP said:
Snip
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Bill who?

*Looks at gang stat sheet*
I don't see any named character other than Roman.

Diomedon said:
This isn't true. We even had that omake where we coerced a faunus burglar into working for us.
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I wrote this one :V

Diomedon said:
Link shows off his fancy gun-cane? That'll be Roman's fancy gun-cane soon enough.
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GJ on reminding this to everyone. Guys, remember our real long term goal!

nolston said:
I disagree, I think they are very crucial. Emerald is an investment, an investment that we have neither the time nor resources to bring to its potential. we are a novice at both combat and aura, there is not much we can teach her and we don't know anyone who can or would, ergo at best she would be a mook with a name. As I said we are a new and relatively weak power in this city, at this time we need to be building a power base and improving our abilities, if we recruit Emerald we will have to devote time and resources that we don't have to her in order for her to be worth the effort. In the end potential is only power that has yet to come, and needs time and resources to bring out.
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I can see your point, but I still think that even if we won't benefit from her at the start and instead will have to invest in order for her to become effective it will still be worth to recruit her.

She has the potential to become a huntress (or at least a beacon student). It might be hard to support her now, but I think that later on having a loyal Emerald on our side will be very beneficial. The alternative is to let her go and recruit her later once it will be easier on us to handle her, but at that point she might be lost forever to Cinder/another gang (Note to self: recruit Cinder, this will solve some of our issues).

nolston said:
, and any job we offer her will not have enough benefits to not look for a better offer from someone else or just screw us for renege, especially as she gets stronger and more experienced.
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I think that you are assuming things here. Just because we (/Roman) can see her potential doesn't mean that everybody else does. It's entirely possible that she isn't in touch with another gang that can offer her the kind of job we do, and she might not be aware that in few years she'll be able to get along with stronger gangs than ours.

It's entirely possible that right now is our only chance of recruiting her, and I believe that if we do it while making her not want to screw us over (I.E. less death threats) it will pay off in the long one.


Edit:
Also, if we go with my plan I'll be willing to use my fate point to help recruit her.
 
Itaywex said:
She has the potential to become a huntress (or at least a beacon student). It might be hard to support her now, but I think that later on having a loyal Emerald on our side will be very beneficial. The alternative is to let her go and recruit her later once it will be easier on us to handle her, but at that point she might be lost forever to Cinder/another gang (Note to self: recruit Cinder, this will solve some of our issues).
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But that is my point, it would be to hard to support her now and if we don't invest our time with her then she has time to think of a way out as well as even less reason to stick around as she is not gaining anything. As I said kindness is easily mistaken for weakness or foolishness on the streets, especially by the inexperienced and young.

Itaywex said:
I think that you are assuming things here. Just because we (/Roman) can see her potential doesn't mean that everybody else does. It's entirely possible that she isn't in touch with another gang that can offer her the kind of job we do, and she might not be aware that in few years she'll be able to get along with stronger gangs than ours.
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Nobody has to see her potential for her to approach somebody else to screw us, for example let's say when we start moving against link she goes to him and sells us out. Just because we are kind dose not mean she will not take advantage of us, you are assuming that she will repay our kindness with loyalty when in fact she may simple be greedy.

There are all kinds of reasons to screw us from greed, to revenge, to simple being pragmatic. Also just because we are the only ones who see her potential now does not mean that others wont in the future and make her a better deal, especially if we do invest our time into her since people like link have far more resources to offer than us. Or perhaps somebody else will see that we have an unhappy "employee" and simply us her as a mole in our gang, after all despite using nice words we are still forcing her to join us or die.
 
Itaywex said:
Bill who?

*Looks at gang stat sheet*
I don't see any named character other than Roman.
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I'm sorry, I'm used to quests that allow the accomplished no-names to be named, if we got a guy that can kill a grim, maybe we get to know him better, make him more of a leg breaker than a nameless goon who might someday walk up to a little girl in red and dumbly clarify he's robbing her, rather than doing what they actually WENT there to do.

Just sayin...

Diomedon said:
This isn't true. We even had that omake where we coerced a faunus burglar into working for us. I like the idea of Roman pretty much claiming anything that is brought to his attention. He finds a secret network of tunnels? That's his secret network of tunnels now. Petty thief tries to steal from him? That's his petty thief now. Link shows off his fancy gun-cane? That'll be Roman's fancy gun-cane soon enough.
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This is EXACTLY how one builds a criminal empire. They don't call us Roman "Mr. Steal your shit" Torchwick for nothing.
 
OMG A SHEEP said:
I'm sorry, I'm used to quests that allow the accomplished no-names to be named, if we got a guy that can kill a grim, maybe we get to know him better, make him more of a leg breaker than a nameless goon who might someday walk up to a little girl in red and dumbly clarify he's robbing her, rather than doing what they actually WENT there to do.

Just sayin...
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The thing is that killing a single Grimm isn't that much of an achievement...

OMG A SHEEP said:
This is EXACTLY how one builds a criminal empire. They don't call us Roman "Mr. Steal your shit" Torchwick for nothing.
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They don't call us that at all...

:V

EDIT:
Besides, we aren't stealing, we just take what's rightfully ours.
Our enemies need to realize that...
 
Itaywex said:
The thing is that killing a single Grimm isn't that much of an achievement...
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Maybe not, but if we get him to teach more dudes how to it, our workforce competence could improve a bit. Maybe there are better ways to do this, but that's neither here nor there right now.

Itaywex said:
They don't call us that at all...

:V
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Roman "The Ice cream man" Torchwick!

Itaywex said:
EDIT:
Besides, we aren't stealing, we just take what's rightfully ours.
Our enemies need to realize that...
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Roman "Get your dirty mitts off my stuff" Torchwick!
 
Currently looking at a tie right now. We're going to need to get that resolved before this can go on.
 
Azecreth said:
The current tie is between NSMS's plan, and Aegir's plan, each with six votes. The next highest is Itaywex's plan with 3 votes
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Actually, I think that there's actually a winner (which isn't actually "my" plan, but whatever). BBBence1111's vote is actually part of the winning set, but he put several newlines in there which made it get read as something different...

Vote Tally : Lighting the Candles (RWBY Criminal Empire Quest) | Page 28 | Sufficient Velocity
##### NetTally 1.1.17

[X] "That was sloppy... But not bad. You've got the makings of a two bit pickpocket. If you're lucky, you might even be a three bit pick pocket. You can look forward to only starving twice a month... Or... You can come work for me. Turn this little hobby... Into a profession, make some real money."
No. of Votes: 7
Aegir
BBBence1111
Cjdavis103
Iandude0
RandomLurker
SlugSLinger
Zoxabels

[X] "Whatever I want. As for what I want though... well, I haven't quite made up my mind yet, and a professional doesn't rush into these things, so how about this? I'm going to let you help me decide."
-[X] "This is your chance to persuade me not to kick you out into the alley with your arms and legs broken. Do it, and we'll go from there. Fail, and... I'm sure a 'smart' young girl like you can guess the rest."
No. of Votes: 6
NSMS
Algalon
Avalon Du Lac
hcvquizibo
Khepri14
The LD Man

[X]Try to recruit her
-[X] Explain to her what you would normally do to people who would try to steal from you.
-[X] But luckily for her, you hate seeing wasted talent more than you hate seeing people trying to steal from you.
-[X] So instead of making an example of her, you are willing to recruit her (how generous of you). That way she can pay you back for trying to steal from you, and in the end it will be much more beneficial for her to work with an organization than to act on her own.
No. of Votes: 3
Itaywex
Bondo
Krain

[X] Try to recruit her
-[X]"You got guts kid, but now you're mine. Shouldn't have done that."
No. of Votes: 2
Frakir's brother
Erehwon

[X] Try to recruit her.
-[X] Make it sound like you're doing her a favor. Point out that you could very well have taken everything she had that was of value, instead of just your wallet, and that if she was stupid enough to piss off a freaking gang leader in the first place then it's a wonder she's survived as long as she has in the first place. Frankly, she needs protection. You're offering protection, plus an actual job. What more could she ask for?
-[X] You've been in her shoes. It sucks. You could care less about the poor, poor orphans in the streets, but she... well, you can't just ignore somebody who dared to pick your pocket.
No. of Votes: 1
devo342

[x] Teach her a lesson.
-[x] Break one of her legs.
--[x] Lock her in the freezer.
No. of Votes: 1
Hyp3rB14d3

[x] Teach her a lesson.
-[x] Break one of her arms.
-[x] and a hair cut while we are at it.
No. of Votes: 1
theflyingbiscuit

-[X] "This is your chance to persuade me not to kick you out into the alley with your arms and legs broken. Do it, and we'll go from there. Fail, and... I'm sure a 'smart' young girl like you can guess the rest."
No. of Votes: 1
lockdownspartan

[X] Introduce her to Bill the Beowolf slayer.
No. of Votes: 1
OMG A SHEEP

[X]Try to recruit her
-[X] Explain to her what you would normally do to people who would try to steal from you.
-[X] But luckily for her, you hate seeing wasted talent more than you hate seeing people trying to steal from you.
-[X] So instead of making an example of her, you are willing to recruit her (how generous of you). That way she can pay you back for trying to steal from you, and in the end it will be much more beneficial for her to work with an organization than to act on her own.
--[X] And of course if she screws up or proves herself less than, how shall we say, loyal, well... We'll just have to let the results serve as a warning to anyone else in the future.
No. of Votes: 1
Zam

Total No. of Voters: 24

Edit: Removed Bugs inappropriate vote.
 
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