Hmmph... this junior is a good seed [Cultivation Management Quest]

[occipitallobe]

Good Seed and Omake Spreadsheet Rules:

Firstly, if you have questions about Good Seeds and the like please read here. If that doesn't answer your question please ping me in thread, or on Discord.

If you write a new Good Seed, or write an omake, please update the spreadsheet if you have access.

If you do not have access, please ping a collaborator (Swordomatic, Alectai, Quest, TehChron, Insane-Not-Crazy, Humbaba, ReaderOfFate, Kaboomatic, no., BungieONI) letting them know what you want and they will update the spreadsheet here. To gain access, you will need a gmail account of some kind. Throwaway emails are fine (I'm using one for the spreadsheet), but to gain access it's as simple as sending me either your email via PM, via DM in Discord, or just in Discord's #spreadsheet-requests channel.

This is mandatory. If a Good Seed does not record their omake by pinging collabs (or just requesting access and editing things themselves - this is the preferred option), I won't give out awards. If a new Good Seed is not recorded here, they won't advance. By doing this it makes the whole thing manageable for me - it's gotten pretty unwieldy!

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Omake Writer Instructions:

There are four fields you need to fill out.

Omake Link, which is just a link to your first omake for the turn. This makes it easier for me to read them as I do the update - without this it's tough to know off the bat which omake were written this turn, and to properly

Requested Bonus, which is your requested bonus for your omake. You can leave it up to me if you like. You can see more info in the Good Seed infopost here.

Cultivation Aims. For those following unorthodox paths - higher than 9th Heavenstage or later than 7th Dao Pillar paths. Please put in what you are aiming for before you break through. I have left it as 'default'. If you do not edit it, I'll go with that.

Turn Notes - Do you want to do something specific? Enter a Secret Realm? Help the Clan out in some way? If you have something specific you want to accomplish on this turn, put it in turn notes so I can adjust your Fate around it.

All other fields are for QM use to record character information to properly run the flow of the game.

 

[TheCount]

"Ai'er, please take a few steps back, I need to deal with this sprightly old lady."

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Oh, he is courting death!!!!

A grim smile grew on her lips.

"Now. Let us see what absolute power is worth against plots and plans."

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And her envoy likes it!!!!!


Joke aside, that was a risky gamble, stalling the princess so AL could bag an early NS for them....
Guess OC wants to chip away at the RP, huh?

Would have been fun to see his reaction at Manuel backstabbing him, alas, this is still in our favor.

Edit: wait.... If OC wrecks the pass, what are the chances he breaks some of our legacy safes?
Or worse, him taking some of said legacies?

 

[occipitallobe]

Edit: wait.... If OC wrecks the pass, what are the chances he breaks some of our legacy safes?
Or worse, him taking some of said legacies?

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Anything an ordinary Nascent Soul could just crack open and take has long been looted, don't worry about that. Everything remaining is essentially impossible to break into.

 

[TheCount]

Anything an ordinary Nascent Soul could just crack open and take has long been looted, don't worry about that. Everything remaining is essentially impossible to break into.

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He is late, so I wasn't sure, but that's a great relief, thank you, Occi!

 

[Shaper47]

Is there any chance we can have Manuel send Diaxing a congratulations letter?

Just some polite correspondence between two peers.

 

[TehChron]

About the only thing truly unexpected here was that OC managed to nab an RP Early Nascent, wow.

I've been concerned about Bloodhammer up and vanishing to fuck off who knows where, while the Abyssal invasion story that Weeping Anvil came up with made sense...We didn't exactly have hard confirmation

It's also really interesting that with Bloodhammer unaccounted for, Dixiang never even considered what happened with Weeping Anvil.

So this couldve been a whole lot worse, and now no ones the wider- but with that being said let's all have a moment for the true loser of the day:

Bloodhammer, completely robbed of his climactic rivalry showdown and with likely no earthly clue as to how or why

 

[weeblypanda]

Is there any chance we can have Manuel send Diaxing a congratulations letter?

Just some polite correspondence between two peers.

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It would really mind fuck Old Cannibal. It would make him paranoid as fuck. Also another crucial detail we learned in the interlude is that Bloodhammer is a rogue cultivator. He operates around the Abyssal Invasion and Devil Bee territories but he is not officially an underling of OC

 

[Crunbum]

About the only thing truly unexpected here was that OC managed to nab an RP Early Nascent, wow.

I've been concerned about Bloodhammer up and vanishing to fuck off who knows where, while the Abyssal invasion story that Weeping Anvil came up with made sense...We didn't exactly have hard confirmation

It's also really interesting that with Bloodhammer unaccounted for, Dixiang never even considered what happened with Weeping Anvil.

So this couldve been a whole lot worse, and now no ones the wider- but with that being said let's all have a moment for the true loser of the day:

Bloodhammer, completely robbed of his climactic rivalry showdown and with likely no earthly clue as to how or why

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Well, Altar Lord did that while OC distracted the Wei Princess and almost died in the process. I don't think that's that unexpected, hunting the weaker Nascents was the whole point of the gambit since its not like he stood any chance in his fight.

 

[Humbaba]

So from what I understand from this update, OC has successfully blocked off the entrance to the mountain pass through via bringing down 7 mountains of rubble via spirit stone bombs and Wei Ning. He now plans to quickly wreck the rest of the pass and then head home.

Checking against the winning plan, we didn't put too many of our assets into the pass, which is a shame. However, OC wrecking it does play well into our longer term ambitions.

I know a few of our cores are intending to go into the pass this turn anyway so it's hardly a total loss.

About the only thing truly unexpected here was that OC managed to nab an RP Early Nascent, wow.

I've been concerned about Bloodhammer up and vanishing to fuck off who knows where, while the Abyssal invasion story that Weeping Anvil came up with made sense...We didn't exactly have hard confirmation

It's also really interesting that with Bloodhammer unaccounted for, Dixiang never even considered what happened with Weeping Anvil.

So this couldve been a whole lot worse, and now no ones the wider- but with that being said let's all have a moment for the true loser of the day:

Bloodhammer, completely robbed of his climactic rivalry showdown and with likely no earthly clue as to how or why

Click to shrink...

I'm not actually sure that Bloodhammer isn't just chilling in the pass itself? OC says he's never met him sure, but OC was also explicitly camping the early parts of the pass (and seeding it with bombs). So it'd make perfect sense if he just hadn't gone in far enough to meet bloodhammer.

Also, OC was flaring Late Nascent energy in a "come and have a go if you think your hard enough" way. If you're a mid-nascent blood path like Bloodhammer meeting a late nascent Blood path like OC is a nightmare because you're a tasty snack. Entirely possible that Bloodhammer felt OC flexing and just went into hiding himself.

 

[Shaper47]

Given our Golden Eye Array we probably know in character how things went down.

Though I'm still looking forward to the day Manuel combines the Golden Eye Array with his Spear to snipe while remaining at the Dawn Fortress.

 

[ConfusedCanuck]

God jeez OC is a mad lad easily my favorite rival we have! It'll be a sad day when we finally defeat him once and for all.

 

[TheGrape]

Eagerly anticipating Bloodhammer chilling with the Blood Oak Sect oblivious to what's going down in the Pass and making everyone paranoid for no reason.

 

[Timewarriors]

Anyway wonder who Altar lord killed?

 

[Crunbum]

I wonder how the "can't fight across Great Realms" thing works. Heraclius mentioned its impossible but if a Hoplite Formation of 100 Cores can fight a Nascent and a good seed at the Great Circle of Core Formation with a ton of Impact to their name can theoretically fight a Hoplite Formation of 100 Cores, then why wouldn't they be able to fight a Nascent?

 

[Swordomatic]

I wonder how the "can't fight across Great Realms" thing works. Heraclius mentioned its impossible but if a Hoplite Formation of 100 Cores can fight a Nascent and a good seed at the Great Circle of Core Formation with a ton of Impact to their name can theoretically fight a Hoplite Formation of 100 Cores, then why wouldn't they be able to fight a Nascent?

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Heraclius mentioned fighting across Impassable Realms is impossible - that is to say, the division between Core Formation/Nascent Soul and the division between Law Creation/Heaven Construction. Great Realm fighting is eminently possible - Heraclius does just that, killing Spirit Severing with Nascent Soul power.

 

[Crunbum]

Heraclius mentioned fighting across Impassable Realms is impossible - that is to say, the division between Core Formation/Nascent Soul and the division between Law Creation/Heaven Construction. Great Realm fighting is eminently possible - Heraclius does just that, killing Spirit Severing with Nascent Soul power.

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Ah, I thought it went Minor Realm (Stage) -> Major Realm (Realm) -> Great Realm (What you said).
Still doesn't answer the question, though. If its so impassable, why can a formation do it but not a single exceptionally powerful Core?

 

[ReaderOfFate]

Yeah, to clarify, what Heraclius means is:

Fighting across an Impassable Realm gap is impossible just with the Qi and base abilities of the stage.

When he's saying Qi Condensation can beat Core Formation or Nascent Soul can beat Law Creation with sheer talent, he's referring to Comprehension Hax.

That's to say, understanding the enemies attacks to the point that you can disassemble them solely with the Qi available to your great realm, and predicting enemy movements with sheer ingenuity and trickery despite them being many times faster and stronger than you physically.

Ah, I thought it went Minor Realm (Stage) -> Major Realm (Realm) -> Great Realm (What you said).
Still doesn't answer the question, though. If its so impassable, why can a formation do it but not a single exceptionally powerful Core?

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Heraclius wasn't referring to bloodlines or special arts that would let a Core have equivalent Qi to a Nascent Soul, because that's what you're essentially saying here. To him, as Occi said on Discord, that defeats the point, as anyone can just lean on an ancestral inheritance or treasure to strike past a realm gap. The indicator of true talent is self sufficiency.

He is simply referring to the Baseline Core parameters.

 

[TehChron]

Which does not explain the Formation thing. Either Cores are helpless before Nascents or they are not. If its so impassable, why can a formation do it but not a single exceptionally powerful Core?

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...Because a Formation can't do that, it can only hit hard enough to be relevant by dint of weight of mass. A Formation doesn't enable massed Soul Attacks to those incapable of them out of nowhere, for example.

 

[ReaderOfFate]

Which does not explain the Formation thing. Either Cores are helpless before Nascents or they are not. If its so impassable, why can a formation do it but not a single exceptionally powerful Core?

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Read my post. I just edited in a response.

TL;DR: Doesn't count because he was referring to a defeat with the average statline of a stage.

Investment of more Qi via whatever method to win is just force, not skill.

 

[Timewarriors]

Had it not been the time for the Golden Devils One-Hundred Year Trials he never would've dared such a thing.

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HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

 

[Crunbum]

...Because a Formation can't do that, it can only hit hard enough to be relevant by dint of weight of mass. A Formation doesn't enable massed Soul Attacks to those incapable of them out of nowhere, for example.

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Except hitting hard enough to be relevant by sheer power is synonymous with "not helpless". If something can swing a Nascent fight, which we have seen a single Hoplite Formation of Cores do, then that clearly indicates an arbitrarily large number of such formations can kill a Nascent = not an impassable barrier. Yet it is precisely because a formation does not enable higher Realm qualities, that an impassable barrier clearly does not exist between it and a lone Core Formation cultivator either. Heck, since a Formation of Cores is not qualitivatively different from one Core, even a Qi Condensation cultivator could in theory best it too. And since Formations can fight Nascents.. you get the idea.

Take Wei Feng for example - with 68 Impact at Foundation Establishment 5-Pillar (Late) he is supposedly the equivalent of someone in the upper middle reaches of Core Formation in power, and that is nowhere close to the limit of what a good seed could reach - one could imagine a Great Circle Core Formation equivalent, with all advantages stacked - that would have no trouble casually destroying a Hoplite Formation of 100 Cores. How and why would such a cultivator be helpless before a Nascent when a Formation they can casually dispatch is not? Basically, either the Impassable Realms are Impassable or they are not, can't have the cake and eat it too so I'm wondering what's up with that.

 

[TehChron]

Except hitting hard enough to be relevant by sheer power is synonymous with "not helpless".

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Do you not know how a mobility disadvantage works? An ability to only lash out, but never catch your opponent?

 

[ReaderOfFate]

If something can swing a Nascent fight, which we have seen a single Hoplite Formation of Cores do, then that clearly indicates an arbitrarily large number of such formations can kill a Nascent = not an impassable barrier

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Please read my previous post.

Heraclius's Impassable Realm comment is under specific circumstances.

Obviously if you somehow had enough Cores to carpet an area with enough 100 Core Hoplite deathballs to the point that the Nascent's vastly, vastly superior speed and maneuverability was somehow not enough to give them space to kite everyone to death and rest between fights, or if they were locked into X area due to natural terrain obstacles and so on, then they'd die.

But that's not what Heraclius even meant when he brought up Impassible Realms.

Young Bhrigu killed Alexios using a fragment of Will from his Spirit Severing grandpa while he was a junior in Foundation. This does not mean he's a talent that exceeds Heraclius in scope.

Occi said that if a Core level Heavenly Star like Aasmi draws on the Light of Heaven using their Star, they can fight Nascents. This still doesn't mean she's a talent that exceeds Heraclius in scope.

Heraclius is purely referring to combat using the baseline parameters of the Great Realm in question, and your Comprehension.

 

[Crunbum]

Do you not know how a mobility disadvantage works?

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A mobility advantage does not exactly matter if the Nascent is utterly unable to kill the absurd Impact Core cultivator who is hypothetically powerful enough to kill them with a figurative glance. The claim Heraclius made was that you can't fight across Impassable Realms and that the most you can do is survive a couple seconds. Even if Nascents has an infinite mobility advantage (they don't), it would still not let them kill the opponent or avoid death at the hands of one if caught. So this clearly does not match up.

Lets look at it this way : you have a Hoplite Formation of 100 Cores, stated to be impactful in Nascent-level combat.
The gap between Core and Nascent (Impassable Realm) is implied to be far wider than the gap between Qi Condensation and Core Formation (2 Great Realms). It thus stands to reason that a Hoplite Formation of 100 Qi Condensation cultivators is far more impactful in Core-level combat than the Hoplite Formation of 100 Cores was in Nascent-level combat.

And yet if that were the case, with there being approximately 10 000 Qi Condensation cultivators for every one in Core Formation, meaning 100 such Formations, wars and everything would be decided solely by lower Realms while the reality as shown in-story is the other way around.

 

[ReaderOfFate]

How and why would such a cultivator be helpless before a Nascent when a Formation they can casually dispatch is not? Basically, either the Impassable Realms are Impassable or they are not, can't have the cake and eat it too so I'm wondering what's up with that.

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I think this is the source of the confusion here.

Point of clarification: A Formation of a hundred Cores would not be able to be dispatched with a Great Circle Core with 68 Impact. In fact, if the other Core didn't run, they would inevitably end up dying given some amount of time.

To be more precise, we currently don't know the Impact threshold required to breach into Nascent relevance, and it's this threshold you would need to beat something with the offense/defense (but not speed) of an Early Nascent Soul.

It should be remembered that the ability of Golden Devil Formations to breach Great Realms is an abnormal property only permitted by the Blood of Bronze harmonizing the components.

For comparison, it takes 30 Impact for QC9 to properly count as FE1, and 50 Impact for FE9 to count as Core 1.

Occi is currently tight lipped on the impact requirements to bridge the first Supreme Realm gap.

 

[TehChron]

A mobility advantage does not exactly matter if the Nascent is utterly unable to kill the absurd Impact Core cultivator who is hypothetically powerful enough to kill them with a figurative glance.

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Said hypothetical will never exist. That was Heraclius' point. And even asserting that such a Formation could exist is such a deliberate misreading of how realm jumping works that I'm kinda taken aback