RoboRenee
Trans of gender
- Location
- FFXIV, probably
- Pronouns
- She/Her
And how do you get the Fallen to agree to that?
-
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Hell is other angels
- Thread starter Hiver
- Start date
- Location
- Seattle, Washington, USA
You ask them.
If they don't agree, you are no worse off than you are if you skip the idea entirely. If they do agree but are lying, you are no worse off than you are if you skip the idea entirely. If they do agree but are not lying then you are at least safer around them if not completely safe.
There is no downside. Ideally you'd just leave the coin on the ground and never pick it up, but at this point that isn't an option since it has already been picked up.
Except no matter what path you take, you are willingly interacting with a malevolent being vastly more intelligent, patient, and experienced than yourself. It's an AI box scenario. If you are capable of interacting with the AI at all, it will eventually convince you to let it out of the box. If you interact with a Fallen at all, it will eventually corrupt your mind.
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Malbutorius
C'est le bien qui fait mal
Except the AI in a box can't literally read your mind and isn't metaphysically superior to you on a conceptual level.
RoboRenee
Trans of gender
- Location
- FFXIV, probably
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Actually, there is a huge downside. You've engaged the Fallen in conversation.
Say you ask, and it says no. This segues into a story, or a debate on trust, or a flaming row about parasitism, or whatever. This contains some blatant manipulation you ignore, and some far more subtle stuff you feel very clever for catching. And some even more subtle stuff you didn't catch, designed to make you react more negatively when you find out (as it found through looking at your memories) that your boss is a dick or your spouse is a cheater or your best friend has betrayed you. Or maybe it just makes you more inclined to consider those as options when you see your spouse looking harried or hanging out with their friends, or whatever. Or maybe it does something else. The point is, you are now more inclined to think or behave in a way that benefits the Fallen. Maybe not much, maybe just a little bit. But they have time. They can be patient when it suits them.
Or you ask and it says yes (lie). You now have a solid framework for conversation and action that is, in fact, entirely a vessel for manipulation of you.
It won't say yes and mean it. Not without a loophole the size of a skyscraper.
The sun was still high above the horizon when I walked along the sidewalk of Maple Court, one of the smaller shopping districts in Sunnydale, until I reached my destination.
I did my best to look like any other bored teenager and went with just t-shirt and jeans. It was a survival trait in Sunnydale. Blend in with the herd.
Here, humans are not on top of the foodchain and that idea is scary enough on its own. Without pausing I took a right turn and pushed the door open, a soft plinging of a bell ringing as I walked into the magic store.
Definitely not stage magic. But also a lot of what looked like herbs, crystals and books. Dreamcatchers on the wall.
It looked like the definition of New Age bullshit. But maybe there might be something here. I had to try as the only alternative I knew was to risk The Library and hope that Giles actually kept real books in the stacks.
A middle-aged, slightly overweight man with a receding hairline entered through the door behind the counter. "Hello, I'm Bob. Welcome to The Magic Cabinet. What can I do for you today?" he asked with a smile.
Looking around, I nodded and approached the counter. "You can. I'm looking for... magic. Books to be more precise."
"Ah! Magic! I have a lot of that, if you would go to the bookshelf over there, you will find-"
"The real stuff. Not the New Age crap." I sighed, running my hand through my hair.
He frowned at me. "I'm not sure what you mea-"
I frowned right back at him. "Please. If you run a place like this you have to know what's going on in town. I just want to be able to keep myself safe."
Bob was silent for a long moment as he studied me, drumming his fingers on the counter before he nodded shortly. "What exactly is it that you are after?"
"Manuals and general information. Specifically how you keep things out and if they get in, how to lock them down so they can't hurt you. And... as I know nothing about this kind of thing, something that can teach me the basics."
The shopkeep slowly nodded. "I see. Kid... a lot of the things in town can be kept out just by not inviting them in."
"Yeah. The suckers." I agreed. "But just as many things are not. And they tend to be even nastier."
Sighing, he nodded. "Very true. Very well, I'll sell to you. But you need to understand something about magic. Almost everyone can do at least something with enough practice. But not everyone has the power to be a witch or mage. Most people who try it never get further than simple blessings and that's working with covens. Then there is the danger. Magic, even weak spells matter. What you do with magic has a tendency to come back to you in some way. Be it good or bad."
"I understand. I'm not looking to make trouble, I just don't want to wake up dead."
"None of us do." he agreed. "Wait here, I'll be back."
Nodding, I leaned against the counter as he disappeared into the back. Coming here was a risk. For all I knew this guy was some kind of demon-summoning maniac. But I thought it was less of a risk than bringing a Fallen One onto the Hellmouth.
This might get me killed.
Going there might get everyone killed.
Not that that meant I wasn't ready to bolt if he came at me with something. I would have liked to be armed, but for being America it was strangely difficult to get your hands on a weapon. Then again, Sunnydale was a small town and I was a teenager AND I wanted to avoid the kind of people and not-people that would sell weapons to a teen in Sunnydale.
Though I suppose that I could risk taking the bus to Los Angeles if I really wanted to get something. Would need to be something with punch though, a pistol would just piss most things off. Maybe a shotgun.
Hardly something I could hide unless it was sawn off and I walked around in a trench coat or something. And that wouldn't be suspicious at all in the Californian heat. But it might be useful to keep at home. Most things would at least give pause with double barrels of buckshot to the face, maybe even long enough to give me time to run.
But right now, I had more pressing problems. Of the infernal breed and not the kind you could shoot in the face.
"Here we go." Bob said as he returned and put a book and a small box on the counter. "One primer, a copy of what my own teacher had me study when I started. And..." he continued and opened the box, pulling a pair of floppydisks out, "Two books on demonology and four books on protective spells, enchantments and bindings."
"Those are floppydisks."
He nodded. "They are. I assume you know how to use them?"
"...Yes. But with, you know, I kinda expected... thick, leather bound tomes."
"Could you afford thick leather bound tomes?" He asked, raising his eyebrows at me.
"I'm going to go with no?" I answered after a short pause.
"Exactly. I type mine into computer documents anyway, easier to find what you are looking for and way easier to store, especially as the originals are rather too valuable to leave laying about. That will be seventy five dollars."
I tried not to cringe at that. That would mean eating a lot of pasta for the next month. But it wouldn't kill me, I had a max ceiling of a hundred bucks for this. Anything more and I would literally starve.
Instead I nodded and reached for my wallet, counting out the money. "Here you go. And thank you."
"Don't thank me, be careful with this stuff."
I nodded and took the bag he offered me before I flashed him a quick smile and gave him a wave as I left the store. Stopping outside I looked down in the bag for a second before I started down the street. Might as well pick up some milk while I was out.
Magic floppy disks.
Fucking hell.
But... why are the rules for magic different here? Back on Dresden's world, magic fucked with technology. Here there were techno pagans casting spells through them.
"Different parts of Creation, My Host," Taziel whispered into my ear. "Just like magic is almost completely impossible in the part you are from, the rules here are different. Same reason why Demons can walk around freely here while almost not keeping themselves together in what you call Dresden's world. The rules are different depending on where you are."
I did my best to ignore her. Still, that explained it.
After about five minutes I came to a slow halt before looking up at the sign above the store I was standing in front of. The sign was up but the windows were still covered with thick blinds.
Ethan's Costume Shop.
Halloween in a week.
I'm really starting to hate this town.
AN// And a big pile of thanks to Grey Rook for betaing this section.
I did my best to look like any other bored teenager and went with just t-shirt and jeans. It was a survival trait in Sunnydale. Blend in with the herd.
Here, humans are not on top of the foodchain and that idea is scary enough on its own. Without pausing I took a right turn and pushed the door open, a soft plinging of a bell ringing as I walked into the magic store.
Definitely not stage magic. But also a lot of what looked like herbs, crystals and books. Dreamcatchers on the wall.
It looked like the definition of New Age bullshit. But maybe there might be something here. I had to try as the only alternative I knew was to risk The Library and hope that Giles actually kept real books in the stacks.
A middle-aged, slightly overweight man with a receding hairline entered through the door behind the counter. "Hello, I'm Bob. Welcome to The Magic Cabinet. What can I do for you today?" he asked with a smile.
Looking around, I nodded and approached the counter. "You can. I'm looking for... magic. Books to be more precise."
"Ah! Magic! I have a lot of that, if you would go to the bookshelf over there, you will find-"
"The real stuff. Not the New Age crap." I sighed, running my hand through my hair.
He frowned at me. "I'm not sure what you mea-"
I frowned right back at him. "Please. If you run a place like this you have to know what's going on in town. I just want to be able to keep myself safe."
Bob was silent for a long moment as he studied me, drumming his fingers on the counter before he nodded shortly. "What exactly is it that you are after?"
"Manuals and general information. Specifically how you keep things out and if they get in, how to lock them down so they can't hurt you. And... as I know nothing about this kind of thing, something that can teach me the basics."
The shopkeep slowly nodded. "I see. Kid... a lot of the things in town can be kept out just by not inviting them in."
"Yeah. The suckers." I agreed. "But just as many things are not. And they tend to be even nastier."
Sighing, he nodded. "Very true. Very well, I'll sell to you. But you need to understand something about magic. Almost everyone can do at least something with enough practice. But not everyone has the power to be a witch or mage. Most people who try it never get further than simple blessings and that's working with covens. Then there is the danger. Magic, even weak spells matter. What you do with magic has a tendency to come back to you in some way. Be it good or bad."
"I understand. I'm not looking to make trouble, I just don't want to wake up dead."
"None of us do." he agreed. "Wait here, I'll be back."
Nodding, I leaned against the counter as he disappeared into the back. Coming here was a risk. For all I knew this guy was some kind of demon-summoning maniac. But I thought it was less of a risk than bringing a Fallen One onto the Hellmouth.
This might get me killed.
Going there might get everyone killed.
Not that that meant I wasn't ready to bolt if he came at me with something. I would have liked to be armed, but for being America it was strangely difficult to get your hands on a weapon. Then again, Sunnydale was a small town and I was a teenager AND I wanted to avoid the kind of people and not-people that would sell weapons to a teen in Sunnydale.
Though I suppose that I could risk taking the bus to Los Angeles if I really wanted to get something. Would need to be something with punch though, a pistol would just piss most things off. Maybe a shotgun.
Hardly something I could hide unless it was sawn off and I walked around in a trench coat or something. And that wouldn't be suspicious at all in the Californian heat. But it might be useful to keep at home. Most things would at least give pause with double barrels of buckshot to the face, maybe even long enough to give me time to run.
But right now, I had more pressing problems. Of the infernal breed and not the kind you could shoot in the face.
"Here we go." Bob said as he returned and put a book and a small box on the counter. "One primer, a copy of what my own teacher had me study when I started. And..." he continued and opened the box, pulling a pair of floppydisks out, "Two books on demonology and four books on protective spells, enchantments and bindings."
"Those are floppydisks."
He nodded. "They are. I assume you know how to use them?"
"...Yes. But with, you know, I kinda expected... thick, leather bound tomes."
"Could you afford thick leather bound tomes?" He asked, raising his eyebrows at me.
"I'm going to go with no?" I answered after a short pause.
"Exactly. I type mine into computer documents anyway, easier to find what you are looking for and way easier to store, especially as the originals are rather too valuable to leave laying about. That will be seventy five dollars."
I tried not to cringe at that. That would mean eating a lot of pasta for the next month. But it wouldn't kill me, I had a max ceiling of a hundred bucks for this. Anything more and I would literally starve.
Instead I nodded and reached for my wallet, counting out the money. "Here you go. And thank you."
"Don't thank me, be careful with this stuff."
I nodded and took the bag he offered me before I flashed him a quick smile and gave him a wave as I left the store. Stopping outside I looked down in the bag for a second before I started down the street. Might as well pick up some milk while I was out.
Magic floppy disks.
Fucking hell.
But... why are the rules for magic different here? Back on Dresden's world, magic fucked with technology. Here there were techno pagans casting spells through them.
"Different parts of Creation, My Host," Taziel whispered into my ear. "Just like magic is almost completely impossible in the part you are from, the rules here are different. Same reason why Demons can walk around freely here while almost not keeping themselves together in what you call Dresden's world. The rules are different depending on where you are."
I did my best to ignore her. Still, that explained it.
After about five minutes I came to a slow halt before looking up at the sign above the store I was standing in front of. The sign was up but the windows were still covered with thick blinds.
Ethan's Costume Shop.
Halloween in a week.
I'm really starting to hate this town.
AN// And a big pile of thanks to Grey Rook for betaing this section.
Arson?
- Location
- California
God cosplay
Malbutorius
C'est le bien qui fait mal
Dress up as Harry Dresden. There is no way it could possibly go wrong.
Hehehe. Hiver's a better writer than that.
Mechasaurian
Big Bossu
- Location
- Lost among fields of history
- Pronouns
- They/Them
I only vaguely know about either universe in this scenario...But I am a sucker for the "si is fucked" stories. Watched.
RoboRenee
Trans of gender
- Location
- FFXIV, probably
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Oops.
Spell made you the wrong member of the trenchcoat brigade, you now have Constantine's literally supernaturally bad luck and ability to murder anyone by having them be an old friend who's helping him out just this once.
Silverias
Seeing is Believing
- Location
- Squiddy Places
Well, feel free to ask questions in the thread, or if you have specific ones about The Dresden Files, you can PM me. I'm quite the fan (SO YOU BETTER NOT MESS THIS UP HIVER CUZ I AM WATCHING)
Malbutorius
C'est le bien qui fait mal
That's why you make sure to wear a Fedora!
(inb4 "He doesn't wear a Fedora")
Dropbear
Tourists Taste Terrific
- Location
- The next tree you walk under
I'm going to have to go with this as well. Not that something won't go wrong(Lash AND Taz in his head?). Just that gaining something from someone who did in fact resist a Denarian would be a good idea.
Wait, a Hiver-SI who is setting knowledgeable?
RoboRenee
Trans of gender
- Location
- FFXIV, probably
- Pronouns
- She/Her
"He doesn't wear a Fedora"
Though, speaking seriously, I think it would be really stupid to try and game it but you'd probably get more out of Constantine than Dresden. The only thing I'd really bank on you being able to pick up is a mindset or a zen state, and Constantine has solid plutonium balls the size of Jupiter. Dresden isn't quite as willing to do things like flip off Satan.
- Location
- Seattle, Washington, USA
Yeah, but you can shove the AI box in your closet and ignore it. Ignoring something that has a (literally) demonic temper and the power to do almost anything it wants to you at whim? That sounds like an awesome way to wind up damned.
People keep assuming that once you pick up the coin you can just not interact. But that option is completely off the table. You will interact. You have no choice. At absolute best, trying not to interact amuses the Fallen and you wind up corrupted in a year instead of six months. More likely, while you are ignoring the single biggest chance for your short term survival as a human in Sunnydale, you'll become dinner for something a Fallen could have effortlessly saved you from.
Harry Dresden was able to seal away a coin by means of being a totally badass magical powerhouse, with exquisite training in magic. The SI is not Harry Dresden. He is ALREADY screwed. Nothing he can do will unscrew him. He is absolutely at the mercy of a Fallen angel. He can't run, he can't hide and he can't deal his way out. His only hope is to either hand the coin to a being powerful enough to deal with it (and even the Powers that Be probably aren't that strong) or he can hope that this Fallen will make his end merciful. He has literally no other viable options.
Making a good faith deal, with no attempts to weasel the deal, is the only thing he can do that has the tiniest chance of working, wi the resources he has at hand.
The thing about the Buffyverse is that there is no perfect safety. No one is safe. Glorificus was not safe and she was the safest individual seen in the entire series. Looking for safety is a fool's gambit in that universe. Or put another way: If you run you'll just die tired.
I just don't get the SI. He wants to live, but every time he gets handed something that will allow him to not only live but thrive, he reacts with horror and aversion.
I see something similar all the time in this one game I play (Planetside 2). Someone gets so fixated on the 'perfect' spot that they reject anything that is not perfect -- and as a result they die LONG before ever coming near the perfect spot, and usually one of the less perfect options they rejected would have saved them.
At the rate he is going, he will be dead or vamped long before he even catches sight of safety, let alone reaches it. Mostly because while safety does not exist in that universe, traps laid to draw in the unwary are plentiful.
Oh, plenty could go wrong. It's Harry. But on the positive side, when things do go wrong for Harry, it's almost always someone ELSE who winds up on fire.
Quick! Befriend Mayor Wilkins! One stone, half a dozen birds.
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Quick review of them for you then -
Buffy the Vampire Slayer - Teenager destined to fight evil and save the world a lot. Latest in a more than 2000 year old line of such supernatural warriors. Granted many supernatural advantages, senses, and luck to do so. Tries to have a life outside of just being 'The Slayer', including high school and friends. Too bad her high school is right on top of a literal mouth to hell right under the library.
The Dresden Files - Only real Wizard that can be found in the Chicago yellow pages. Does not do parties. Will find anything lost object or person for you. Licensed as a PI. Has a bad history, an example; His first tutor and adopted father only taught Harry so he could sacrifice him and his girlfriend and co-student for more power. Said father did succeed in mentally dominating and brain melting his girlfriend so she would do the ritual. Harry somehow killed him instead of being killed, in doing so he broke one of the seven laws of magic. So the White Council put him on probation, and their executioner helped complete Harry's magical studies, or kill him if he broke any more of the laws of magic.
-The Denarians, or as Dresden call them, the Nickle-heads. Thirty literal fallen angels who are allowed to possess (and usually utterly dominate) anyone who touches their earthly anchor, one of the 30 pieces of silver that Judas was paid to betray Jesus.
Silverias
Seeing is Believing
- Location
- Squiddy Places
I think people are overstating the danger of the coins a -tiny- bit. Not by much, but remember, you DO have to accept them of your own free will. They can coerce, but they can't FORCE you to. If they do, the people upstairs view it as "Cheating" and things get balanced.
I feel it is more likely that Tazi will end up being one of the more reasonable Fallen. (Reasonable meaning she wants a cooperative host to help her rebel against heaven, as opposed to a thrall or a murderous idiot)
I feel it is more likely that Tazi will end up being one of the more reasonable Fallen. (Reasonable meaning she wants a cooperative host to help her rebel against heaven, as opposed to a thrall or a murderous idiot)
Older-than-Time
[Eating My Muse]
- Location
- Somewhere in the Sol System
- Pronouns
- He/Him/ThatIdiot
You assume, based upon other SI stories that Hiver will luck out.
Luck out in the setting where the Power that Be are consumed with maintaining the Status Quo, thus stay in power longer.
And for all we, the readers, know, EVERYTHING is a trap.
And since this is the Internet, it's a fucking trap.
- Location
- California
Actually, what about cosplaying Uriel or a generic angel to balance out the devil on his shoulder.
Older-than-Time
[Eating My Muse]
- Location
- Somewhere in the Sol System
- Pronouns
- He/Him/ThatIdiot
Are we talking biblical angel or fictional angel? Because the actual biblical ones would just annihilate everything that has sinned in some way, because that's what they do.
It's the purely non-religious fictional ones that are all nice and happy.
- Location
- The Void
You know what must be done.
- Pronouns
- she/her
I see nothing wrong with this plan. It's actually... probably a good bet? If anyone can deal with a Coin and a Hellmouth, it's Constantine.
He's also British enough to get on with Giles & Spike.
