Halkegenia Online Thread 22 - Kill Sheffield Vol. 2

[Skychan]

I know, but the differences unfortunately are a bit too extreme for such a blanket statement to really work in this case.

(And you have to admit, it's a rather surprising weakness, all things considered: Octavia can handle extreme heat, but not extreme cold.)

...Maybe if Klein were to try to "block" the blizzard with a fire spell, with the resulting flecks of water spraying onto Octavia, or something. Not much of a power-up, granted, but it's something.

Click to shrink...

Why can she nto handle extreme cold? When has that been established? Why is the state of water, Gas, solid, or liquid an issue with her ability to be empowered by it if she is empowered by H20?

There is no reason to make the asumption you have that it requires liquid state water to empower her, nor that she is particularly vulnerable to cold.

 

[Triggerhappy]

Why can she nto handle extreme cold? When has that been established? Why is the state of water, Gas, solid, or liquid an issue with her ability to be empowered by it if she is empowered by H20?

There is no reason to make the asumption you have that it requires liquid state water to empower her, nor that she is particularly vulnerable to cold.

Click to shrink...

I just thought it would be fricking hilarious if Prim tried to seal her in a block of ice and it didn't work.

 

[Dacl73]

Thankfully Hegent already is more then well aware of how to work with corned powder, plus knows all about making sure each shot has the same amount of powder, all the time, every time (paper cartridges and/or bags make ALL the difference, depending on if we're talking small arms, or cannons).

Click to shrink...

Already mentioned Corned Powder, way back in the prologue. And that they were going to be making it for their cannons and shot.

 

[GeshronTyler]

How about this as a possible concept for TauTona?
(link)

Associated pics: 1, 2, 3, 4.

Click to shrink...

That does look pretty cool. Trying to imagine the geology that could produce a formation like that though... I guess a volcano might do, with the central column consisting of hard igneous plug, and the surroundin former cone softer material... How to remove the surrounding material to creat the "pillar" escapes me though- it doesn't look it was mined, I could see it as chemical weathering I suppose, water (or acid rain) leaching away the material off through cracks in the earth (creating some spectacular cavern systems), with the central column more resitant.

Tau Tona is a mining city though, and I find it hard to picture a mine where the center of the mined area doesn't have worth while concehtrations of ores/minerals.

 

[GeshronTyler]

Going by the Alfheim map it was in a Cove with three rivers

Click to shrink...

The terraces still wouldn't fit.

 

[Sakuya's Butler]

Already mentioned Corned Powder, way back in the prologue. And that they were going to be making it for their cannons and shot.

Click to shrink...

I'm well aware of this. Its more me repeating things so that people remember that fact.

 

[jwolfe_beta]

I'm well aware of this. Its more me repeating things so that people remember that fact.

Click to shrink...

Of course that was some time ago. Cardinal only knows what Hyuuga is planning now.

 

[GeshronTyler]

I feel that Tristian will have enough time to get a significant number of cannons fielded. In the last TRIST snippet it was around late spring and they already almost had everything in place(Forges, iron, cannon design) to quickly produce the required cannons for their ships. A full scale invasion isn't likely going to happen until early next spring giving both sides enough time to fully build up their arsenals for the coming conflict. As it stands Tristian isn't going to be able to fully upgrade everything, but they should be able to upgrade all of their best ships and key fortifications.

Click to shrink...

Actually, since Reconquista was already preparing for an invasion, Dunkirk simply delayed the preparations. From what I understand TH's plans to be, Reconquista will be launching their assault within a few months, probably in fall. The losses in the fleet hurt, and caused a delay, but the infrastructure and naval supplies stockpiles were for the most part untouched.

 

[jwolfe_beta]

The losses in the fleet hurt, and caused a delay, but the infrastructure and naval supplies stockpiles were for the most part untouched.

Click to shrink...

That can change of course if Tristain/the Fae manage to get some saboteurs into Albion. Fortunately I don't think Albion is going to be trying any invasions during winter so after the coming attack everyone is hunkering down until spring/summer.

 

[Vaermina]

That can change of course if Tristain/the Fae manage to get some saboteurs into Albion. Fortunately I don't think Albion is going to be trying any invasions during winter so after the coming attack everyone is hunkering down until spring/summer.

Click to shrink...

I don't think Albion is actually effected by Winter.

If it was the weight from the massive ice buildup from all that mist surrounding it. Would probably drop the whole island into the ocean.

It's probably due to the the same effect that keeps the island a nice temperate climate 3 miles above sea level.

 

[Tython82]

I don't think Albion is actually effected by Winter.

If it was the weight from the massive ice buildup from all that mist surrounding it. Would probably drop the whole island into the ocean.

It's probably due to the the same effect that keeps the island a nice temperate climate 3 miles above sea level.

Click to shrink...

Is it ever stated in the light novel how the whole temperatures and air pressure etc works for Albion?

 

[Vaermina]

Is it ever stated in the light novel how the whole temperatures and air pressure etc works for Albion?

Click to shrink...

It's never mentioned as being in any way abnormal.

My bet however is that it's all due to the Windstones. They probably create some sort of bubble of air around whatever they are holding up. That traps in heat and keeps the pressure steady. Kind of like a greenhouse.

 

[Nicholai]

It's never mentioned as being in any way abnormal.

My bet however is that it's all due to the Windstones. They probably create some sort of bubble of air around whatever they are holding up. That traps in heat and keeps the pressure steady. Kind of like a greenhouse.

Click to shrink...

Before we get too far into something that would require intelligent action on behalf of the Windstones..

.. do we know how high Albion is? There are significant portions of our world at very high elevations where people do live. ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_highest_cities_in_the_world ) It is entirely possible that Albion is "higher than sea level" but lower than "requires specialized breathing equipment to not die."

 

[Vaermina]

Before we get too far into something that would require intelligent action on behalf of the Windstones..

.. do we know how high Albion is? There are significant portions of our world at very high elevations where people do live. ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_highest_cities_in_the_world ) It is entirely possible that Albion is "higher than sea level" but lower than "requires specialized breathing equipment to not die."

Click to shrink...

Albion is 3 miles above sea level at it's lowest point when the island is at it's lowest.

Also that wouldn't really matter, remember Dunkirk where Tristain ships came down from like a mile above Albion itself. They didn't need specialized breathing apparatus either. So it has to be a function of the windstones that keep normal pressure and temperature when they are actively moving things.

 

[Tython82]

Well either that or some sort of environmental enchantments all over the island which are now a forgotten art.

Since no one comments on it and it just works.

 

[The17thImmortal]

Why can she nto handle extreme cold? When has that been established? Why is the state of water, Gas, solid, or liquid an issue with her ability to be empowered by it if she is empowered by H20?

There is no reason to make the asumption you have that it requires liquid state water to empower her, nor that she is particularly vulnerable to cold.

Click to shrink...

I'm talking about the physical conditions at the bottom of Earth's oceans, and the kinds of evolutionary adaptations needed to survive down there. And in this case, what those adaptations don't account for.

I am not claiming that Octavia is vulnerable to cold, I'm saying that she's not invulnerable to it. There's a difference. (Like Superman and magic – he's no more vulnerable to it than any other mortal, it just simply happens to be one area that his invulnerability doesn't cover for.)

Even if ice can qualify for Octavia's power-up (which I'm still unconvinced of), the kinds of temperatures present in a blizzard could very well suck out her body heat to lethal levels, long before her power-up can kick in enough that she might be able to protect herself from the cold.

 

[Triggerhappy]

I'm thinking that Reconquista will try a few major thrusts all at once with the objective of knocking out a few of the Faeries 'strongholds' before thy can be fully fortified.

So Freelia Cadenza and Sylvain are in the crosshairs to try and assault before winter with ambitions of pinning Tau To and Gaddan (no I can't stop laughing at those last two either)

I figure they'll be repelled at Freelia and Sylvain but be permitted to mostly take Cadenza as the city is very poorly defensible and securing the area as far afield as Tarbes. (This will become their main foothold and will likely be the sight of a counter attack with possible help from Germania to drive them off)

The culmination of this will be the begining of winter possibly starting with a counter attack to grab a foothold on Albion before bunkering down for winter.

Then I can do the jotunhim arc like the present beach arc.

 

[Tsuzurao]

Catching up on posts...

Then they're screwed. As the whole point of TH's concept is that the Border Bosses are immensely powerful but that power is limited by their environment (or draws most of their power from it as the case seems to be). Though I thought that particular scene it was Asuna in Beast Transformation and is only for a limited time as established.
*snip*

Click to shrink...

I think the 'draws power from the environment' detail is probably unique to Octavia, but just to make sure...
@Triggerhappy, do any/all of the other Border Bosses receive buffs based on their environment, or is that an Octavia-unique trait?

Forgiveness does more to garner long term friendly relations then imprisonment and blackmail.

It also doesn't run the risk of the Aquatic Mobs going out of control without Octavia around to keep them in check. Or the Naiads getting hunted by slavers without Octavia around to protect them. Or the Mobs and Naiads deciding they need to rescue Octavia by going on the offensive against Tristian to get her back.

Click to shrink...

You've repeated this error a couple of times. The mermaid mobs are "Nyriads", not "Naiads". I'm not sure why TH went with that rather than "Naiad" or "Nereid", but that's what he's going with. Honestly, if I had to justify it, I'd excuse it as an error on the design team's part (not the first time a name got corrupted in transition from myth to computer game, especially when transitioning between languages).

*Snip*
I think you got hit with auto-correct because IIRC it was called the Dragon's Rainment.

Click to shrink...

"Dragon's Raiment" in the LN's ("Raiment" is an archaic word for clothing. "Rainment" is not a word, as far as I know). If I recall correctly, HalkO uses "Dragonfly's Raiment", since in this story, the vehicle is a Huey helicopter, not a Zero fighter plane.

 

[Vaermina]

Well either that or some sort of environmental enchantments all over the island which are now a forgotten art.

Since no one comments on it and it just works.

Click to shrink...

Doesn't explain why the fleet that attacked Dunkirk didn't freeze/asphyxiate. Since said fleet dropped down to attack from miles above Albion. Which itself is somewhere above 3 miles above sea level.

Actually now that I think of it is sort of a shown effect of Windstones. The elves use them combined with water stones in the opposite manner to cool down area's of the desert so they can live normally in them. So it's not outside reason to believe they create a bubble of air around themselves when active that effects temperature/air pressure.

 

[revanninja]

Albion is 3 miles above sea level at it's lowest point when the island is at it's lowest.

Also that wouldn't really matter, remember Dunkirk where Tristain ships came down from like a mile above Albion itself. They didn't need specialized breathing apparatus either. So it has to be a function of the windstones that keep normal pressure and temperature when they are actively moving things.

Click to shrink...

on 3 miles above sea level and that it is the lowest
And again on coming down a mile above dunkirk

As far as I am aware they didnt come high at all they came in normally just high for the docks which since it was early dawn is not surprising to avoid accidents.

But the Highest city in the world is in peru and it is 3.1 miles high and has 30,000 people.
Humans can survive at 3.6 miles for 2 years.
Once you get into 4 miles you cant survive and need O2.

 

[iemand]

I'm thinking that Reconquista will try a few major thrusts all at once with the objective of knocking out a few of the Faeries 'strongholds' before thy can be fully fortified.

Click to shrink...

If Albion goes for a split offensive, won't the concentrated Tristain fleet be able to crush any individual part? Position the fleet at Freelia, crush the 1/3rd fleet there while giving up Cadenza and holding them off with the fort at Silvain, then rest and wheel around to crush the 1/3rd Albion fleet at Cadenza or force them to flee and capture/destroy the landed ground forces.

 

[jwolfe_beta]

So Freelia Cadenza and Sylvain are in the crosshairs to try and assault before winter with ambitions of pinning Tau To and Gaddan (no I can't stop laughing at those last two either)

Click to shrink...

They have little to no information, tactical or otherwise on those two last cities don't they?

I figure they'll be repelled at Freelia and Sylvain but be permitted to mostly take Cadenza as the city is very poorly defensible and securing the area as far afield as Tarbes. (This will become their main foothold and will likely be the sight of a counter attack with possible help from Germania to drive them off)

Click to shrink...

On one had I'm sad that the Puca don't manage to drive off the initial attack but as you said the place isn't a great location defensively. Hopefully they make Reconquista bleed for every step and manage to get their civilians out.

After all we've seen the Salamanders, Sylphs, Spriggans and the Caits shine in battle. It'll be interesting to see what sort of hell an entire race of spellsingers can unleash.

 

[revanninja]

They have little to no information, tactical or otherwise on those two last cities don't they?

On one had I'm sad that the Puca don't manage to drive off the initial attack but as you said the place isn't a great location defensively. Hopefully they make Reconquista bleed for every step and manage to get their civilians out.

After all we've seen the Salamanders, Sylphs, Spriggans and the Caits shine in battle. It'll be interesting to see what sort of hell an entire race of spellsingers can unleash.

Click to shrink...

Also arent the Puca like the lowest population of the fae? Because you need Musical talent to really get them going?

 

[Vaermina]

If Albion goes for a split offensive, won't the concentrated Tristain fleet be able to crush any individual part? Position the fleet at Freelia, crush the 1/3rd fleet there while giving up Cadenza and holding them off with the fort at Silvain, then rest and wheel around to crush the 1/3rd Albion fleet at Cadenza or force them to flee and capture/destroy the landed ground forces.

Click to shrink...

Remember the higher quality training and windstones means Albion ships have a large mobility advantage compared to Tristians ships.

In addition they have something like 3 times the number of ships that Tristian does. And Tristian can't ever concentrate all it's fleet at a single point. They have to keep scouts and pickets up on their border. On top of standing fleets to defend the various ports and military bases.

So even at most Tristian might be able to meet the number of the First Attack. After which if they win they will probably only have 2/3ds of their fleet left to engage the second fleet.

 

[Tython82]

Albion is 3 miles above sea level at it's lowest point when the island is at it's lowest.

Also that wouldn't really matter, remember Dunkirk where Tristain ships came down from like a mile above Albion itself. They didn't need specialized breathing apparatus either. So it has to be a function of the windstones that keep normal pressure and temperature when they are actively moving things.

Click to shrink...

Where in the LN is it stated about Albion being 3 miles above sea level at lowest? Is it one of those blink and you miss it passages cause I don't recall that.