If we had taken Sorceror, would we have finished it?
[Exalted, ?] Most High
- Thread starter Rihaku
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Rihaku
The Internet
You can't just PICK SAIL without an argument!
Yeah, I find the conflicting agendas compelling; it's not interesting if Odyssial just picks up right where he left off. Besides, even if we don't remember more than a fraction of our life as Odyssial... remember that a fraction of that can still wind up being much greater than Ulyssian's lifespan up until that moment. Recall what Odyssial himself said in the most recent update, that his mortal life had been reduced to the barest sliver of his existence.
It explicitly says that a high-fidelity reincarnation considers himself to be Odyssial. To me, that is the most damning evidence against the option.
It explicitly says that a high-fidelity reincarnation considers himself to be Odyssial. To me, that is the most damning evidence against the option.
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[X] Thrown - A long-ranged engagement option focused on dealing colossal burst damage early on. Likely will synergize extremely well with Stealth. Carries on Odyssial's legacy of slings and throwing knives, the weapons of a more brutal and primeval time.
[X]Lore
Lore seems best to me. Know your enemies. Know their weaknesses, their goals, their strengths.
[X]Lore
Lore seems best to me. Know your enemies. Know their weaknesses, their goals, their strengths.
Likely not, because if we'd finished it, we'd have won. At everything.
Da Boyz
The Cutest Apocalypse.
[X] Pick an additional option from any epoch after the one you achieved Greatness 10, for free.
[X] The Lathe of Heaven
[X] The Fairest
[X] Reincarnation Planning
When did we reach the point where Odyssial in another world would look upon or works and despair, have we gone too far? No if anything we have not gone nearly far enough, The Infinite Singularity Husk will grant absolution in the world to come!
[X] The Lathe of Heaven
[X] The Fairest
[X] Reincarnation Planning
When did we reach the point where Odyssial in another world would look upon or works and despair, have we gone too far? No if anything we have not gone nearly far enough, The Infinite Singularity Husk will grant absolution in the world to come!
Rihaku
The Internet
If he'd finished it he likely would have won, so no. He found a way... just not in time.
He would only remember the snippets you've seen, at the outset. Maybe a couple more.
Hm, you may want something that allows you to socially analyze your enemy's intimacies, which probably doesn't fall under Lore until very late on.
Guile
Having a really great time right now
[X] Double XP for the entire game
This is the best option for Ulyssian. Remember Ulyssian? We'll be playing as him very soon.
[X] The Peerless City
So not only is this an immense pimped-out fortress that would have given Ody enough power to withstand the usurpation, but it also: cements Ody's reputation among scholars, may arm any remaining Dragon Blooded cells of his with First Age tech, is potentially an awesome redoubt/secret base for Ulyssian, AND ensures that no abuses of authority took place within the reach of Ody's might? Sign me up.
Well, I like the idea of Ody reincarnating into the Second Age, but I don't know that I like it enough to pick it over the other options. I also like the idea of not hitting 10 Heartlessness.
This is the best option for Ulyssian. Remember Ulyssian? We'll be playing as him very soon.
[X] The Peerless City
So not only is this an immense pimped-out fortress that would have given Ody enough power to withstand the usurpation, but it also: cements Ody's reputation among scholars, may arm any remaining Dragon Blooded cells of his with First Age tech, is potentially an awesome redoubt/secret base for Ulyssian, AND ensures that no abuses of authority took place within the reach of Ody's might? Sign me up.
Well, I like the idea of Ody reincarnating into the Second Age, but I don't know that I like it enough to pick it over the other options. I also like the idea of not hitting 10 Heartlessness.
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Conflicting agendas due to the different perspectives from his time as Ody and Uly can still happen, but it would be someone in conflict with himself as opposed to Uly combating essentially an outside influence, which doesn't seem nearly as novel or interesting.
Not to mention that the result of any Uly experience driven decision would essentially be Ody changing his mind, which while not necessarily guaranteeing that they go along with it, would at least lead to a more intersting reaction by Ody's surviving associates than the reincarnation lacking in fidelity.
Not to mention that the result of any Uly experience driven decision would essentially be Ody changing his mind, which while not necessarily guaranteeing that they go along with it, would at least lead to a more intersting reaction by Ody's surviving associates than the reincarnation lacking in fidelity.
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- Location
- N36°3.38472, W112°8.1894
Well there's a lot of cool stuff so I'll just look at each...
[X] Double the reward of fanwork XP for the entire game.
[X] The Lathe of Heaven
[X] The Fairest
[X] Dodge
[X] Lore
Taking two despite the additional Heartlessness (Puts us at 10 I think, though mitigated a bit through circumstance and choices).
Peerless City -This is pretty cool and falls in line with the whole obtaining resources, and housing soldiers thing, but I don't really like it compared to some of the others. The final (unfinished) effect is cool as all hell though. It does cement his legacy, but only the catch of "among scholars of the esoteric" is a pretty niche group. Everyone else apparently thinks he's at least a little crazy (they're probably right!). I like it for the "have a base of operations plan," but I'm not sold on it compared to the others.
Lathe - Infinite Singularity Husk heebie-jeebies aside, this definitely does seem like the culmination of his personal growth, and gives us the championship belt on scaring the shit out of everybody (with The Fairest) . I am, obviously, not entirely sure exactly the completed version is, it could be anything from the Primordial "Malfeas lives in Malfeas, bordered by Cecylene" thing as applied to Odyssial (Inner-soul planet?), to the kind of weapon that makes the Sword of Creation look like a dagger, hell, it might be, as speculated, his answer to the Great Curse. The important part to me, at least, is "Effects will be world-shaking. Monumental." This is exactly the sort of thing I see him doing.
The Fairest - This seems like a wonky ride. I can't see him not fighting in this tourment, were it to be held, and the prior warning of the Usurpation is an incredibly interesting side effect. The sword is also pretty sweet, as is completing the Crown of Fear. This one seems like a bit of a grab bag of cool effects, even though as stated its unlikely to come to any real fruition. I like Odyssial having the additional human connection, and the idea that his last days weren't completely terrible and locked in limit break. Even if it reinforces reincarnation I think the other pieces swing me towards liking it.
I've not been a fan of reincarnation as I wanted them to be separate people, but it looks like that's going to the wayside by degrees anyway... I can definitely see the appeal of, having played the prologue, wanting the accumulated experience/knowledge/shinies from it to carry over. It's not for me but I can definitely see why a lot of people are on board with this one.
And oh god another option comes up while I'm typing this. Keeping that part shorter.
Dodge - Defense wins in Exalted (immovable object trumps unstoppable force), and doubling Seven Shadow Evasion with Heavenly Guardian Defense is just wtf overboard on perfects, but should cover us from most circumstances. Even if we don't mechanically follow things core (who knows what 3e core is, even), I think doubling down on defense and sticking with melee (especially with the ubersword) is probably the play here.
Lore - Just absolutely bonkers. Between Lore and War you can take vanilla mortals and make them into godly anythings, which is perfect for the role that it looks like we're shaping up to take. I am slightly biased by game mechanics here, though. This also gives us easier access to the ability to tame the Wyld. From a story perspective I could definitely be swayed into taking survival or performance.
Edit - my god this thread moves faaast. And simplified for future polls. whoops.
[X] Double the reward of fanwork XP for the entire game.
[X] The Lathe of Heaven
[X] The Fairest
[X] Dodge
[X] Lore
Taking two despite the additional Heartlessness (Puts us at 10 I think, though mitigated a bit through circumstance and choices).
Peerless City -This is pretty cool and falls in line with the whole obtaining resources, and housing soldiers thing, but I don't really like it compared to some of the others. The final (unfinished) effect is cool as all hell though. It does cement his legacy, but only the catch of "among scholars of the esoteric" is a pretty niche group. Everyone else apparently thinks he's at least a little crazy (they're probably right!). I like it for the "have a base of operations plan," but I'm not sold on it compared to the others.
Lathe - Infinite Singularity Husk heebie-jeebies aside, this definitely does seem like the culmination of his personal growth, and gives us the championship belt on scaring the shit out of everybody (with The Fairest) . I am, obviously, not entirely sure exactly the completed version is, it could be anything from the Primordial "Malfeas lives in Malfeas, bordered by Cecylene" thing as applied to Odyssial (Inner-soul planet?), to the kind of weapon that makes the Sword of Creation look like a dagger, hell, it might be, as speculated, his answer to the Great Curse. The important part to me, at least, is "Effects will be world-shaking. Monumental." This is exactly the sort of thing I see him doing.
The Fairest - This seems like a wonky ride. I can't see him not fighting in this tourment, were it to be held, and the prior warning of the Usurpation is an incredibly interesting side effect. The sword is also pretty sweet, as is completing the Crown of Fear. This one seems like a bit of a grab bag of cool effects, even though as stated its unlikely to come to any real fruition. I like Odyssial having the additional human connection, and the idea that his last days weren't completely terrible and locked in limit break. Even if it reinforces reincarnation I think the other pieces swing me towards liking it.
I've not been a fan of reincarnation as I wanted them to be separate people, but it looks like that's going to the wayside by degrees anyway... I can definitely see the appeal of, having played the prologue, wanting the accumulated experience/knowledge/shinies from it to carry over. It's not for me but I can definitely see why a lot of people are on board with this one.
And oh god another option comes up while I'm typing this. Keeping that part shorter.
Dodge - Defense wins in Exalted (immovable object trumps unstoppable force), and doubling Seven Shadow Evasion with Heavenly Guardian Defense is just wtf overboard on perfects, but should cover us from most circumstances. Even if we don't mechanically follow things core (who knows what 3e core is, even), I think doubling down on defense and sticking with melee (especially with the ubersword) is probably the play here.
Lore - Just absolutely bonkers. Between Lore and War you can take vanilla mortals and make them into godly anythings, which is perfect for the role that it looks like we're shaping up to take. I am slightly biased by game mechanics here, though. This also gives us easier access to the ability to tame the Wyld. From a story perspective I could definitely be swayed into taking survival or performance.
Edit - my god this thread moves faaast. And simplified for future polls. whoops.
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[X] The Fairest
[X] Reincarnation Planning
Either "The Fairest" or "The Peerless City"; Reincarnation Planning is one I definitely want though.
I actually want to see how Odyssial would come out. I don't really have a specific hangup against beating death in Exalted; nothing about that narrative hits my "do not want" button, so I'm fine with it.
At the least, it might be interesting to see a story about a perfect reincarnation that was actually pulled off. That doesn't happen too often. Really the only time I can think of is in Keychain of Creation... Actually, hm. Ah, nostalgia.
What I'm not fine with, though, is Heartlessness 10. Really guys? We're already at 9!
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This was the only mention of Infinite Singularity Husk I could find.
http://forums.spacebattles.com/threads/the-odyssey-part-3-exalted.260857/page-38#post-10998093
Really? Arguments opposing "more power!" are dust in the wind -- unless we're talking about immortality and continuation of course, then it's totally different.
That seems inconsistent to me.
[X] Reincarnation Planning
Either "The Fairest" or "The Peerless City"; Reincarnation Planning is one I definitely want though.
I actually want to see how Odyssial would come out. I don't really have a specific hangup against beating death in Exalted; nothing about that narrative hits my "do not want" button, so I'm fine with it.
At the least, it might be interesting to see a story about a perfect reincarnation that was actually pulled off. That doesn't happen too often. Really the only time I can think of is in Keychain of Creation... Actually, hm. Ah, nostalgia.
What I'm not fine with, though, is Heartlessness 10. Really guys? We're already at 9!
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This was the only mention of Infinite Singularity Husk I could find.
http://forums.spacebattles.com/threads/the-odyssey-part-3-exalted.260857/page-38#post-10998093
TheProffessor said:
Rihaku said:
I find it quietly hilarious that you kept on pressing and pressing for "maximum power, maximum heartlessness!" Odyssial, and glared at anyone who looked like they might object on the basis of morality... but now, you are going against the greatest possible amount of power just because of sentimentality.
Really? Arguments opposing "more power!" are dust in the wind -- unless we're talking about immortality and continuation of course, then it's totally different.
That seems inconsistent to me.
[X] Dodge
[X] Bureaucracy
Why bother throwing things when you can dodge the distance between your weapon and your opponent. Thats right, Oddysial has been dodging wrenches so long that he can now dodge distance.
[X] Bureaucracy
Why bother throwing things when you can dodge the distance between your weapon and your opponent. Thats right, Oddysial has been dodging wrenches so long that he can now dodge distance.
Fancy Face
Tactically Superior
- Pronouns
- She/Her
[X] Pick an additional option from any epoch after the one you achieved Greatness 10, for free.
[X] The Peerless City
[X] The Lathe Of Heaven
[X] The Fairest
At first, Odyssial looked to mundane concerns. He tested his skill in a contest of arms against his "peers" and found himself superior, and in so doing gained a great weapon and future ally. And it was good.
Yet he was not satisfied. He constructed a grand fortress, one that was to all other fortresses what he was to all other Exalted. In the center he created a grand spire, one that reached beyond the great mountain. Yet it was not vanity that drove this excess, but rather prudence; for he who resided within this tower could stand against all of creation without faltering. And it was magnificient.
Yet he still found the world wanting. But that could be fixed. And so he began his last construction; the Infinite Singularity Husk. No longer would the ideal be shaped by the world. Now the world would be shaped by the ideal. Odyssial was not the clay, but now the sculptor, and all of existence would become his materials. And it was terror.
Yet of these works, only the first was ever truly completed. An unfinished legacy, yet one that still resonates, in terror and awe alike, to this very day, long after Odyssial himself had fallen.
[X] The Peerless City
[X] The Lathe Of Heaven
[X] The Fairest
At first, Odyssial looked to mundane concerns. He tested his skill in a contest of arms against his "peers" and found himself superior, and in so doing gained a great weapon and future ally. And it was good.
Yet he was not satisfied. He constructed a grand fortress, one that was to all other fortresses what he was to all other Exalted. In the center he created a grand spire, one that reached beyond the great mountain. Yet it was not vanity that drove this excess, but rather prudence; for he who resided within this tower could stand against all of creation without faltering. And it was magnificient.
Yet he still found the world wanting. But that could be fixed. And so he began his last construction; the Infinite Singularity Husk. No longer would the ideal be shaped by the world. Now the world would be shaped by the ideal. Odyssial was not the clay, but now the sculptor, and all of existence would become his materials. And it was terror.
Yet of these works, only the first was ever truly completed. An unfinished legacy, yet one that still resonates, in terror and awe alike, to this very day, long after Odyssial himself had fallen.
Planning for reincarnation explicitly takes a toll on Odyssial's efforts in the First Age. I wanted to craft the greatest and most terrible version of Odyssial that I could; in that regard, I have succeeded. Greatness is at 10. Heartlessness seems likely to follow in its footsteps; I'm satisfied with that. What I do not want is for that legacy to overshadow and destroy the tales that can be told of the Age of Sorrows.That seems inconsistent to me.
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Ridiculously Average Guy
I'm you, but stronger
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I'm thinking Dodge and Lore.
Gotta take that lore! Besides, even if he isn't the machine Ody was Ulyssian was still Batman. Gotta have the knowledge to get shit done.
Gotta take that lore! Besides, even if he isn't the machine Ody was Ulyssian was still Batman. Gotta have the knowledge to get shit done.
But this isn't the greatest and most terrible version of Odyssial. Not yet.
You've just picked a different arbitrary line that you don't want Odyssial to cross; for others it was morality or excess, for you it's incarnation.
If anything, you've basically balked at the finish line.
You're too late, I already did that when the Dodge/Thrown discussion was first raised...
[X] Dodge
[X] Lore
Planning for reincarnation explicitly takes a toll on Odyssial's efforts in the First Age.
Alectai
Speaks Words of Wisdom... On occasion
Guess what? There's a whole spectrum between "MAXIMUM MONSTER" and "The Greatest and most Terrible of the Solars". I may not generally agree with Orm's priorities, but on this point, we're largely in agreement--Odyssial's story is done, and for all his glory, and all his horror, the Old must give way to the New. It's a law of myth and nearly a law of Creation as well.
And again, I am Deeply uncomfortable with the idea that a dead man's dreams and desires will be carried on to another. It's fine to accept someone's dying wish, it's another thing entirely for that man to rearrange matters so that you are born to simply be his respawn button. Even if "Raising the Dead" is a hard and fast law of Creation, a Heartlessness 10 Odyssial will not really consider his "Successor" as a being in their own right, so much as he would consider it to be an extension of himself.
I want Ulyssian to make Odyssial's works his own and take them in a new direction, learning the lessons of the past without simply being an extension of it. A "Perfect Reincarnation" kind of screws that over, because it ensures that Odyssial basically gets another toss at the dice. Rather then an exceptional man, but still one of the Second Age, needing to take up that legacy and do what he will with it.
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- Location
- The savanna.
And he won't be, if you take time away from training to plan to die.
[X] Pick an additional option from any epoch after the one you achieved Greatness 10, for free.
[X] The Peerless City
[X] The Lathe Of Heaven
[X] The Fairest
[X] Dodge
[X] Lore
[X] The Peerless City
[X] The Lathe Of Heaven
[X] The Fairest
[X] Dodge
[X] Lore
Rihaku
The Internet
It's the same consciousness, so they're not different people in that regard. He has the same Exaltation find the same hun soul; that's already been arranged. If you had an epic life and then died, had all your memories wiped, and then reincarnated, wouldn't you at least be curious what your previous, extremely epic life was like?
It's prudent not to put all your eggs in one basket. The virtue of caution, the greatness of being prepared, even for the most uncomfortable of situations... that, too, is a type of greatness, and a very important kind indeed.
Alectai
Speaks Words of Wisdom... On occasion
Additionally, since the Infinite Singularity Husk still exists, we must assume other small factors from the Odyssey exist.
Namely, this statement right here.
In other words, yes, a "Perfect Reincarnation" will mean we're not playing as Sesus Ulyssian anymore, but Odyssial Reborn.
Namely, this statement right here.
Rihaku said:
In other words, yes, a "Perfect Reincarnation" will mean we're not playing as Sesus Ulyssian anymore, but Odyssial Reborn.