I can't say I see how any of that is particularly relevant to the current situation. Unless you're saying that Ulyssian does not perceive any meaningful difference between Orasmus scenarios and any other day? While you did try to claim something else early in the thread, I'm not sure you've distinguished between this and some form of super PTSD. I expect you will say that these are more the formative experiences that shaped Odyssial. My concern is that Odyssial is fundamentally unhealthy and a poor judge of consequences and circumstances due to this.
I think the elaboration in the extensive post you quoted is already quite revealing, but to clarify further -
1) If you have two terminal values, it is possible for a sufficiently powerful and determined enemy to make them conflict.
2) When this occurs, you will have to choose between them or face action paralysis / break like Kiritsugu. Case in point, The Unconquered Sun in 2.5E. His absolute dedication to each virtue caused action paralysis.
3) Odyssial routinely went up against beings capable of engineering #1, just look what happened to UCS
4) Until the Lathe of Heaven is completed, it is an extremely huge weakness to have more than one terminal value. The world is more than capable of punishing that.
Odyssial may or may not be classed as "unhealthy" - that is a matter of opinion for the player base as a whole to decide. You are dramatically underestimating him if you believe him to be a "poor judge of consequences," though. You have not seen Odyssial's actions except during the Primordial War. You have seen Ulyssian's actions while under Odyssial's Limit Break.
So you say. I can't say I can detect much if any examples of him doing so. Perhaps it is not incapacity, but rather disinclation to bother trying? I don't feel these two states are sufficiently distinct.
Literally the only Odyssial actions you have seen are from the Primordial War. I can't imagine anyone reading those segments and coming to the conclusions you did. I think you are very much attacking a strawman.
In any case, there is a very huge distinction between a being that is capable of modeling human beings, and a being that is both capable of modeling human beings and has an exact human value system. The first is far more to dangerous to humans than the second, but it would be foolhardy to claim that the first "can't model humans." To think otherwise is to make the crucial mistake that "someone who's never experienced an emotion cannot understand that emotion," or "something that lacks an internal experience similar to mine can't understand me."
Consider a Culture Mind that is hostile to the existence of humans. With its technological nigh-omniscience, it capable of perfectly modeling a human mind. That does not mean it cares about humans as anything other than a means to an end. But it does mean it is very capable of manipulating humans. That is a very large difference from, say, a Khornate Berserker that also desires the end of humanity, but is not capable of manipulating humans. You would not expect the Berserker to perform Simurgh-level circumstance manipulation, but you would be foolish not to expect it of the Mind.
Presuming that one uses the same definition of improve as the ant or mice would. Given the differences in a mouse's perspective and a human's, we would naturally be inclined to believe that the human's is superior. Is it strange to be suspicious of a being that claims to know better than humanly possible? Particularly when its actions have had little net positive effect so far?
It is not strange to be suspicious of a being that claims to know better than humans can, but neither is it impossible for such a being to exist (as far as judging consequences goes, of course; we're not getting into morality here). But I don't think that is what people are reacting to. I think people are reacting to the perceived arrogance in your own tone, more than anything.
It is not unwise to be suspicious of Odyssial, or even hostile to him; that is one of several entirely valid conclusions given my hints so far. But it would be very, very foolish to underestimate him.
I suppose you are correct. I question his motives more than his ability. Despite the lack of evidence, I can speculate that Odyssial is capable of comprehending humans. It then seems more likely that he choses not too, then.
The obvious conclusion, if you are suspicious of Odyssial, is neither of the above.
Odyssial can model humans, but his values have diverged from what is conventionally human. He understands them for purposes of manipulating them; he just doesn't care about them except as means to an end.
But this is very different from "choosing not to understand humans" - that would impair his ability to manipulate them.
Understanding is not prioritization. It is not empathy. It is not valuation. It is only understanding.
Of course, you have not seen any of Odyssial aside from generalities past the Primordial War, so it is hard to say whether this is actually what occurred. His Limit Break does give some pointers, though.
Given we spent 400,000 solar XP on Sables we've gained 217,500 normal XP and 65,000 solar XP in 3 days Jair from all the fanworks.
Actually that was just a math error on my part. It has been fixed.
