[Exalted, ?] Most High

[X] Wake the Sleeper
I guess. Given the example of the navy in the previous uodate, that Prophet charm is already enormously powerful in the context of a war. Invasions defeated, losses down by 30%, etc etc.

Wake the Sleeper gives not just biggatons but expert logistics, so between Prophet and Super Math Power I think we're able to cover war charms decently well.
 
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She is a Celestial Exalted. One properly times reveal on her and bam! Her entire empire falls to pieces. We just have to get strong enough to pick up a few of those charms and then pick our moment when she is in the spot light.
Sure, just like we just need to walk into the Sword of Creation and take control. Don't oversimplify.

Paranoid elder Exalt with absurd security is not going to be that easy to expose.
 
[X] Wake the sleeper

While Anys as well as the opposition in Luseng might have a good idea of how powerful Solar Charms are, and can account for them, I seriously doubt that any of them considered dealing with Evocations from a N/A Artifact when they did their planning.
 
But your plan is even more optimistic, as it involves more variables. We owe a big favor to Infernals - surely no negative consequences. We come up to a bunch of Lunars - they happily come under our command. While this is all happening, Anys is certainly not advancing her plan with zero opposition. And of course suggesting that playing against Anys is suicide while advocating moving against a Deathlord.

If the game is rigged against you, you overturn the table. Or you walk away and play another game.

There is nothing we can do to convince Anys Syn to stop trying to get Ulyssian killed and to abandon her plan to make Flame Emperor and restore security to Creation by turning the Dragonblooded Host into an incubator for his super spawn. And if we remain in the Realm we cannot openly oppose her. If she puts Flame on the throne before we act, she wins outright.

If we go try to consolidate the River Province then we have an open field in which to act. Most of the factions are not overtly hostile. Many will be welcoming and more are open to influence because holy Christ is Po17C a huge bargaining chip and instrument. The Confederation of Rivers already exists, so it provides a wonderful instrument to exploit. We are building on something that people will want because it serves their interests. Lookshy, Nexus, Sijan, the Marrukani, Great Forks, etc all want more security and prosperity and to remove the Mask of Winters. The Celestial Exalted want a stretch of Creation that won't try to murder them, where they can pursue their aims without a Wyld Hunt being dropped on them. Since they are not reflexively opposed to the continued existence of Ulyssian then yes, convincing them is far less optimistic than trying to overthrow an entrenched Anys Syn.

And again context is key. Mask of Winters may or may not be a bigger physical threat than Anys Syn, but there's a difference between facing him on the battlefield with a huge army and many Exalted allies, and continuing to take orders from Anys Syn within an institution she has completely subverted and which will not hesitate to destroy Ulyssian if he ever slips up even a little bit.

And then Flame becomes Emperor and we lose, period; have I mentioned that yet?

Fade Away burns that bridge, forever.

Sesus Ulyssian emerging from hidden exile and exposing the false-Hesiesh is, in fact, probably more credible than being able to act within the confines of a Sidereal-ruled Realm to overthrow the Sidereals. Going into exile to plot against an unjust regime is kind of a major thing in courtly tales.
 
Implying we can't just simply dramatically reveal we're alive after bursting in on her and declaring her a fraud in front of the public/immaculate order/Houses with EotUCS
Hell of a lot easier to move within the Realm if we're still Sesus Ulyssian, and don't have to deal with people thinking we're a Lunar impostor. Let's not pretend we can just fake our death and burn those bridges, then turn around and wave a magic wand, and fix everything.
 
Hell of a lot easier to move within the Realm if we're still Sesus Ulyssian, and don't have to deal with people thinking we're a Lunar impostor. Let's not pretend we can just fake our death and burn those bridges, then turn around and wave a magic wand, and fix everything.
No it won't be. Ayns Syn is pretty much ensuring that we have no freedom to move around in the Realm. If we ever succeed, she will simply ship us off to another place in the Theshold, with orders to make us fail, this time.
 
Also Remember what happened the last Anys thought we were dead?

I remember her mortally wounding Zao, Nilul running away with Zao gone and Moon under a very powerful magical sleep spell that took many updates to fix which in turn caused us to go be murderhobos.

If we do a convincing enough job that she legitmately thinks we're dead then she is probably going to go after Moon and Zao like the last time this happened. We might be able to spirit away Moon but Zao is too fucking visible for that to work. She would instantly know we're still alive if we tried to intervene on that front and thus focus on stopping us.
 
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Anys Syn is simultaneously too afraid to move against Ulyssian with overwhelming force despite taking drastic action to address his threat, but willing to break the Navy and the Academy once Ulyssian is no longer a threat because Zao isn't big enough of a threat for her to be afraid of him? Yeah, whatever.
 
Sesus Ulyssian emerging from hidden exile and exposing the false-Hesiesh is, in fact, probably more credible than being able to act within the confines of a Sidereal-ruled Realm to overthrow the Sidereals. Going into exile to plot against an unjust regime is kind of a major thing in courtly tales.
That exile comes with an enormous price tag in the form of an Infernal favor, which I'm just not willing to accept, so long as there are viable alternatives. That's ignoring all the other problems of abandoning our friends and allies within the Realm to Syn's tender mercies; I do actually want Zao to live, to say nothing of the fate awaiting Moon. We will have a degree of latitude as a field commander in Luseng; Syn cannot afford to micromanage us on the periphery of Creation. She will set minders, of course, but it's not as if we lack for ways to simply get them killed against.
 
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Also Remember what happened the last Anys thought we were dead?

I remember her mortally wounding Zao, Nilul running away with Zao gone and Moon under a very powerful magical sleep spell that took many updates to fix which in turn caused us to go be murderhobos.

If we do a convincing enough job that she legitmately thinks we're dead then she is going to go after Moon and Zao like the last time this happened. We might be able to spirit away Moon but Zao is too fucking viable for that to work. She would instantly know we're still alive and thus focus on stopping us.
Nope. You do know how badly beating Zao fucked her up, right? It would cripple her ability to play Hesiah.

Also, it would cripple the Navy if she did it openly, and doing it covertly means she cannot leverage her status as Hesiah.
 
Hell of a lot easier to move within the Realm if we're still Sesus Ulyssian, and don't have to deal with people thinking we're a Lunar impostor. Let's not pretend we can just fake our death and burn those bridges, then turn around and wave a magic wand, and fix everything.

I don't see why we CAN'T with the help of Lea and Nilul, some social charms and good Stunts/Write-ins/Omakes.
Also Remember what happened the last Anys thought we were dead?

I remember her mortally wounding Zao, Nilul running away with Zao gone and Moon under a very powerful magical sleep spell that took many updates to fix which in turn caused us to go be murderhobos.

If we do a convincing enough job that she legitmately thinks we're dead then she is probably going to go after Moon and Zao like the last time this happened. We might be able to spirit away Moon but Zao is too fucking visible for that to work. She would instantly know we're still alive if we tried to intervene on that front and thus focus on stopping us.

:facepalm: That's WHY she's coming WITH US and she'll ALSO have her death faked.
 
Nope. You do know how badly beating Zao fucked her up, right? It would cripple her ability to play Hesiah.

Also, it would cripple the Navy if she did it openly, and doing it covertly means she cannot leverage her status as Hesiah.
Because it's not like she can't just, you know, mobilize the Immaculates or anything against Zao if she thinks we're trying to squirm out from under her thumb. She has options beyond using herself now; that's the whole point of this gambit, to gain the allegiances of more pawns.
 
And the other part:
##### 3.21
[X] Luseng
No. of votes: 29 (including two overwritten votes)
Gaudy Guise, aja318, veekie, Guile, Gerrou, Katreus, Dark Lord Bob, afterthought53, CharlBaal, vali, Ghost, Celestrail, Daniel14541, useofstrike32, LordOfMurder, jamie96969, Vitaris, Yun, trekbook, Alectai, me.me.here, Pipeman, BSRK Aditya, meianmaru, Van Ropen, Serous, Emerald Oracle, TheOtherSandman, aja318

[X]Fade Away
No. of votes: 9
Thomasfoolery, Da Boyz, Savonarola, Valor, Jouaint, Anasurimbor, Vanguard_D, Vanathor, vel10

[X] Cavalier
No. of votes: 1
inawarminister

[X] Pretend to accept the posting to Serentidopolos, fake your death, meet up with your friends and seek out Lealope.
No. of votes: 4
Usernames, Cavalier, VanusDraco, 1986ctcel
-[X] Give Fei Ling and Ayala a Great Favor to secure their aid faking Ulyssian's death.
No. of votes: 4
Usernames, Cavalier, VanusDraco, 1986ctcel
--[X] Attack should obviously point to the Yozis. The Infernals will know ahead of time and shelter or remove their assets.
No. of votes: 4
Usernames, Cavalier, VanusDraco, 1986ctcel
-[X] Pearl, Nilul, and Moon will exfiltrate from the Academy and meet Ulyssian in the River Province.
No. of votes: 4
Usernames, Cavalier, VanusDraco, 1986ctcel
-[X] Head out east to find Lealope.
No. of votes: 4
Usernames, Cavalier, VanusDraco, 1986ctcel
--[X] Buff factions in the River Province standing for Creation and against the Realm with PoSC (Lookshy, Nexus, Great Forks, Marukani Confederation, Sijan, etc) along the way for Resources, influences, support, favors, Artifacts, and etc.
No. of votes: 4
Usernames, Cavalier, VanusDraco, 1986ctcel
--[X] Also debuff Thorns and the Realm if feasible.
No. of votes: 4
Usernames, Cavalier, VanusDraco, 1986ctcel
-[X] bring pearl and nilul with us.
No. of votes: 1
dragon

[X] Serentidopolis
No. of votes: 3
TMIoverload, cyberswordsmen, dragon

________________________________
[X] Keep Ambition
No. of votes: 16
aja318, Mannan, Usernames, Guile, dragon, Gerrou, Katreus, Dark Lord Bob, afterthought53, cyberswordsmen, Ghost, Celestrail, Daniel14541, useofstrike32, LordOfMurder, jamie96969

[X] Don't give Moon Ambition
No. of votes: 1
inawarminister

[X] Lend Moon Ambition
No. of votes: 3
veekie, Savonarola, CharlBaal

[X] Give Ambition to Zao
No. of votes: 1
Da Boyz

[X] Lend Nilul Ambition.
No. of votes: 1
Ridiculously Average Guy
 
Nope. You do know how badly beating Zao fucked her up, right? It would cripple her ability to play Hesiah.

Also, it would cripple the Navy if she did it openly, and doing it covertly means she cannot leverage her status as Hesiah.
But now she can come at Zao with much more. She has already decided she can live with crippling the Navy.
Never fall into your enemies pace. Doing what Ayns wants will be far harder to survive and grow in than anything else. We get Lookshy on our side, we grind till we can survive taking the Sword of Creation over, and then we win.
Ayns pace is set wrong though. Basically, she took the high risk-high reward proposition in gambling we are going to die and expending all her power and influence to take control. Succeeding here isn't playing into her hands, it's upsetting her pace - at a time she can't afford it to be upset, given how tenuous her hold is since every move she makes from here on out strains the houses even more.
 
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Because it's not like she can't just, you know, mobilize the Immaculates or anything against Zao if she thinks we're trying to squirm out from under her thumb. She has options beyond using herself now; that's the whole point of this gambit, to gain the allegiances of more pawns.
Not without crippling the Navy, she cannot.

Plus murdering the strongest DBed alive without a good excuse(a really good one) is going to make the house heads more than a little wary and wondering who may be next.
 
I don't see why we CAN'T with the help of Lea and Nilul, some social charms and good Stunts/Write-ins/Omakes.
Is it possible? Sure. Are we going to run into a whole shitload of other problems that will almost undoubtedly prevent us from doing so? Yes. Really, Fading Away somehow preventing Emperor Flame screams of being a false benefit to me; the option that doesn't engage with the Realm is not the one that'll develop the Realm in a manner favorable to us. That's just common sense.
 
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Not without crippling the Navy, she cannot.

Plus murdering the strongest DBed alive without a good excuse(a really good one) is going to make the house heads more than a little wary and wondering who may be next.
Oh, you mean the Navy that we just spent our Predictionism on shoring up, the one that can suddenly survive without Zao?

And Zao's death is only one of the myriad ways she could fuck with us in our absence. Shall I list the others? Saery, Hero, Nilul, Moon...

The game is rigged. You know that, I know that. But the notion that we have to flip the table or walk away is a false dichotomy. The third option exists: be a fucking Solar, play the rigged game, and win anyway.
 
Now, with regards to Luseng, and the fact I need to argue for it.

A) It's rich, full of natural resources, and likely quite a few ancient artifacts, or there wouldn't be a three way clusterfuck going on there. Don't forget that because it's very important--a single country, no matter how rich, does not get a Deathlord, an Elder Lunar, and a freehold of powerful Raksha to play nice with each other to seize it. What would convince three factions that should hate each other's guts to play nice just to push the person who currently holds the place out? All three of which likely have access to First Age knowledge? Mere mineral and economic wealth isn't enough to move that many big players, and for them to not even consider testing each other. That is suspicious in it's own right. Because these sorts of people generally have better things to do then commit themselves to what will inevitably be a clusterfuck once they push the current holders out.

B) It's high value in prestige, and the greater our prestige, the harder it is for Anys Syn to attack us openly without destroying herself. Which means she can't put the "Lol, I was just kidding all along, he's actually an Anathema" card as "Hesiesh", because that would imply she was either tricked (Which means she's not infallible and full of wisdom, and thus, not Hesiesh), or that she knew all along and didn't kill him outright (Which would actually literally make her a heretic of the Faith that she herself was apparently one of the buddhas for). This forces her to use covert means, such as sending subordinates--or going herself. But if she goes herself, she's attacking us on our own ground, which gives us a massive advantage, and few of her subordinates would be a match for us, which would let us bleed her True Believers dry.

C) It gives us a chance to build a power base that's entirely acceptable, and all the while, Zao and our other allies will be working in the shadows to undermine Anys Syn's gambit--as she is limited in the ways she can act has Hesiesh. Ordering us to a deathtrap is one thing, when it really costs the other Houses and other powers that be nothing--demanding that Flame be made Emperor is another thing entirely. She has neither mind control, nor infinite power--and there is literally no argument she can make that would justify putting Flame on the throne without blowing her cover or causing Mnemon to howl in rage and expose her personally (Because if you're going to destroy the life's work of one of the top ten Dragon Blooded alive who knows that you're bullshit, then you'd best be ready for the consequences).

Strategywise? We don't even know what our assets will be when we go to Luseng, just a vague outline of what's going on. We have several prospects (Use our ridiculous predictionism to start wedging their alliances apart to buy us breathing space, consolidate, and push forward), but we can't actually come up with a fine strategy until we know we're going, and what assets we'll have when we go.
 
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Anys Syn is simultaneously too afraid to move against Ulyssian with overwhelming force despite taking drastic action to address his threat, but willing to break the Navy and the Academy once Ulyssian is no longer a threat because Zao isn't big enough of a threat for her to be afraid of him? Yeah, whatever.
Note how the drastic actions in question were not outright assault, but being called blessed by the Dragons and sent to a suicide posting. No overwhelming force, and at the moment Ulyssian doesn't have much public support.
 
Not without crippling the Navy, she cannot.

Plus murdering the strongest DBed alive without a good excuse(a really good one) is going to make the house heads more than a little wary and wondering who may be next.
But murdering the heir of the strongest DB alive (publicly known to be favored of the Dragons and a savior of the realm) is just fine?
 
That exile comes with an enormous price tag in the form of an Infernal favor, which I'm just not willing to accept, so long as there are viable alternatives. That's ignoring all the other problems of abandoning our friends and allies within the Realm to Syn's tender mercies; I do actually want Zao to live, to say nothing of the fate awaiting Moon. We will have a degree of latitude as a field commander in Luseng; Syn cannot afford to micromanage us on the periphery of Creation. She will set minders, of course, but it's not as if we lack for ways to simply get them killed against.

"Congratulations on your victory, Sesus Ulyssian. Now we're reassigning you to DEATH TRAP #2, with full confidence in your abilities. Your replacement as Satrap, CATHAK IMMACULATE MONK #183 will arrive in three weeks to RESTORE THE OLD METHOD OF GOVERNANCE AND THE SWAY OF IMMACULATE DOGMA. In recognition of the tremendous efforts of your troops, they are being reassigned to THE ASS END OF THE REALM FAR FAR FAR AWAY FROM YOU AND THE BLESSED ISLE. Your well trained lieutenants are being promoted to COMMAND OF A CEREMONIAL LATRINE GUARD. For your efforts we're also sending a bodyguard of TWO SIDEREAL MARTIAL ARTISTS AND THREE SWORN BROTHERHOODS OF IMMACULATE MARTIAL ARTISTS. They are here to MURDER THE HELL OUT OF YOU IF YOU DON'T DIE THIS TIME. Good luck and may the Dragons bless you."
-Tepet TOTALLY NOT A SIDEREAL
 
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