Ideally Cochise would be the capital world of a rapidly expanding multi planet interstellar power by the time the Emperor reaches the region.

That would give cover for Fan's significant oddities. It's a shame that it's so late, and that the Great Crusade has been going for thirty years already, so the Emperor has a big headstart.
The Crusade lasted for hundreds of years. So no worries, you are not missing much.

I mean the Rangdam genocide starts at 840M30 and the actual war starts at 862.M30.

This happened roughly in Segmentum Pacificus where you currently are. Get into space quick enough and you might find yourself involved in the first war, though that was mostly a skirmish.
 
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Thd Crusade lasted for hundreds of years. So no worries, you are not missing much.

I mean the Rangdam genocide starts at 840M30 and the actual war starts at 862.M30.

This happened roughly in Segmentum Pacificus where you currently are. Get into space quick enough and you might find yourself involved in the first war, though that was mostly a skirmish.

It's mainly about the relative size of our domains compared to the Emperor's when we encounter him.
 
It's mainly about the relative size of our domains compared to the Emperor's when we encounter him.
Size does not matter as much as productive worlds would.

Though admittedly, an iron ring would trump even that. Having one and controlling only one planet would give you a lot of power over the negotiations despite the weaker position.
 
In the 4X parlance, it is a matter of deciding whether to build tall or wide. Ideally, in this instance, one would want both, but given the narrow time frame, it may not be possible to achieve both on this timetable. Therefore, the question is which one to take first.
 
And since hopefully we won't have xenophobic, supermacist and all that facist bull we would have faster time in making an interstellar government since we won't be exclusive and only add "pure humans".
 
Size does not matter as much as productive worlds would.

Though admittedly, an iron ring would trump even that. Having one and controlling only one planet would give you a lot of power over the negotiations despite the weaker position.

A good negotiating position, yes, but not the scale required to disguise's Fan's nature, I think.

In the 4X parlance, it is a matter of deciding whether to build tall or wide. Ideally, in this instance, one would want both, but given the narrow time frame, it may not be possible to achieve both on this timetable. Therefore, the question is which one to take first.

The thing is, the choice isn't between building tall or building wide, it's between building tall and conquering wide, because we're not talking about settling virgin worlds that need to be built up from scratch, but assimilating existing civilisations that already have their own infrastructure that we don't have to pay for.

In this scenario, we'd need to build tall enough to support our own version of the Great Crusade. We're potentially in a good place to be able to do it if we ramp up fast enough. We're assembling the pieces to be able to create our own legions of bio-engineered super-soldiers, and we know the pieces required to build superhumanly powerful generals to lead them.
 
I thought loyalty was at max, this seems really suspicious.

Ed: Okay, perhaps no. After all turns take a years each.
 
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I thought loyalty was at max, this seems really suspicious.

Ed: Okay, perhaps no. After all turns take a years each.
Loyalty yes but not zelotry. They trust you and would die for you. Hence why no assassination attempt or why no one was killed.

Think Alpharious's infamous quote "What I do now, I do for the Emperor."

Their issue was that things are changing at break neck speeds.

Essentially things in uplifting went "Horribly well" and you succeeded too fast, resulting in all the problems, like water, power etc.

Socially, the tribe changed so much and with the wound irritating their fears more, they lashed out.

The people who blew up the caravan were not bad people per say but acted out of a position of fear.

So now you have to decide what to do with them.
 
Even thus, one's position remains unsoftened. They should be executed. Fear is understandable but allowing it to control them to the extent that they would do such a thing is not acceptable. An example must be made. Sometime a gentle touch is need. In other cases, it is the firm hand. In this situation, one very much believes that it is the firm hand that is necessary.

On a different note, going back to the Celestial Martial Arts, alas, Lorgar is not suitable for the Violet Bier of Sorrows style. For that matter, one suspects that Lorgar is also regrettably not suited for the Dreaming Pearl Courtesan Style. Hm, Silver-Voiced Nightingale Style is also probably not an option, unfortunately.

As noted, Crystal Chameleon Style may be suitable, given its interactions with light. Crane Style was also noted as a possibility that could mesh well with the Holy Archetype of Lorgar's Mythos.

As to the Four Arguments of Virtue styles, one would hope that Lorgar is also suitable for them. If so, one would prefer that Lorgar master the Art of Meditative Discussion Style and the Art of Victorious Concession Style. Valor and Conviction are not problems for any Primarch. If anything, one might argue that they have too much of those traits. What is needed is for Lorgar to be moderated by Temperance and Compassion.

Regarding the Sidereal Martial Arts, apologies, but one hopes that Lorgar never finds a sifu for the Sidereal Martial Arts. With a great fondness for the Sidereal Exalted, one firmly adheres to the position that the Sidereal Martial Arts should be for the Fivescore Fellowship alone. The roots and bulb of the Perfected Lotus are the Terrestrial Martial Arts. The stem of the Perfected Lotus would be the Celestial Martial Arts. However, the Blossoming of the Perfected Lotus should be reserved for the Chosen of the Five Maidens.

Hm, speaking of the other Primarchs, @Yzarc, is Lorgar the only one who does not have Physical as a focus, primary or secondary? If so, what would be the focuses of Sanguinius and Fulgrim? Some combination of Social and Physical?

Fulgrim would probably be perfect for the Dreaming Pearl Courtesan Style and the Silver-Voiced Nightingale Style. After his corruption by Slaanesh, hm, the most appropriate styles would probably be Laughing Wounds Style and Orgiastic Fugitive Style.
 
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[X] Kill them.
–They have hurt water production and the traditional punishment is death.

they did this in the name of tradition so they get the traditional punishment seems fair and they can't complain
 
[X] Spare them. Have Lorgar…..convince them.
-[X] In normal circumstances they'd be executed, but they're not fully responsible for their actions because of the influence of the Wound. Have Lorgar teach them to better master themselves and rehabilitate them. Mind control is best avoided, but therapy for warp influenced criminals is a different matter, and use this reasoning to help persuade them to cooperate with the process.
-[X] Cultural Divide: Emphasise that you're remaining true for the core values and virtues of your culture, respect for the spirits and people of the living world. In the face of that, the logistics of how we love, which technologies we use don't matter. The superficial will change, but that
core of who we are will be preserved.
-[X] Heightened tempers: We are each vast, containing multitudes. Each person is the sum of a great many parts; habits, drives and experiences. Those parts of ourselves we want to emphasised can be cultivated both by meditation and action so we can each become more of the person we want to be while those aspects we disfavoured can be controlled or channelled to be productive. Those parts of the mind/soul resonate with the Warp.
-[X] Redistribution of water: Just as we allow our herd animals to drink water, we need to spend water on technology to make more water in future. If we don't invest resources now, we won't have better lives in future.
 
[X] Kill them.
-[X] make is so that their deaths are dignified and honorable, as their actions come from place of misunderstandings, fear and ultimately love of fellow tribe members, choosing to avoid assassination & murder
-[X] have their items & possessions redisposed back to there families if they have any, and to be spread throughtout the tribe if they don't have any relatives




[X] Plan: 3 different ways to say "I Love You" & we have a blessed fount of infinite water
-[X] Cultural Divide: Have Lorgar work on the Cultural divide. He would need to unify the beliefs of the people, old and new so that people do not fear change.
--[X] Humans are created with a womb, built from the air we breathe, food consumed and water drank, all of which are from; therefore self-belief in human potential is faith in nature and the spirits that helped you be you, the old ways of spirits and nature is belief in humans.
--[X] furthermore, Lorgar's awakening as shed light on how existence is comprised of "Yin & Yang"; "Yin" is the warp, the realm of chaos and potential, the Empyrean, the Aether, the Sea of Souls, etc. "Yang" the physical energies of real space, structured and tangible matter.
--[X] Human souls, made of the air, water, food, of the milk and the love of another humans
--[X] the spirits of the desert swimming through the sand, the maelstrom spirits that call down rain, soaring through the skies and clouds, and the world soul residing within the planet of Colchis
--[X] the Motive Force, the flow of existence is to say what makes up souls and what causes change; look at the tools you wield, from spears made of bone containing animals, do you say they don't have souls? and the metal that comes from the earth, will you deny the existence of spirits that gave the materials that make up the guns and machines we now possess?
--[X] the soul and the body made up many parts, the spirits of the land and nature that make up the world, the machine spirits that come from the metal and bones provided by those of nature; do not fall under that spell where you fail your body touching existence as if you were a separate things, that the spirits of nature and machine are separate things, that humans are separate things.
--[X] ancestor spirits, animal spirits, nature spirits, machine spirits, the words change but the universe doesn't change
--[X] many different words meaning the same thing, the universe having 3 different ways to express information, data, knowledge, to observe itself and be observed, and we come to the conclusion that the tribe has 3 different ways of saying "I Love You"
-[X] Heightened tempers : You are going out and talking to people. The Talismans work but not as well as expected. You are going to have to make some meditation techniques to help people.
--[X] understand that you can do it, that you are capable of more you can know; to retain our culture look to the tools we craft, inscribe on the surface of weapons of personal prayers to the spirits (both nature and machine), knowledge of who forged said tools and who has owned/used it, of the songs & dance and other facets of our traditions.
--[X] our tradition of hunting and gathering, you think it would disappear? where would the bones that make up charms and weapons? when one goes out looking for metals and resources, isn't that a hunt, a trek and journey into the desert to find what the tribe needs?
--[X] self prayer, self-belief, they come in different forms; for one it is to be on the hunt, to trek harsh and desolate deserts seeking mighty prey, for others its to craft unique art, personal tools or well thought out gifts to others, others it is in the traditional dances and songs they sing originating from our culture, or the observation and admiration found in the beauty of nature, even the action of talking to another and learning bout their likes and dislikes.
--[X] when one thinks of self-belief what do they think it is? it is to do what you love, it is to love yourself, this tribe has been doing it for so long what is their to contemplate about?
-[X] Redistribution of water : Thalassa works on the Resource redistribution. She will reduce the resources used for machines and redirect them to the people. But she will also explain how the use of water and other precious resources will not negatively impact the tribes, with their abilities.
--[X] we were blessed with an infinite source of water, one that everyone has been to the oasis and drank from the fount, one that has quenches our thirst to such a level that one sip has granted us little need of water , our bodies will last throughout long droughts for several generations.
--[X] the Fount is protected by a holy barrier so none can take it from us and we can always go back to restock on water, water is now more used to wet a dry throat then to sate thirst, it is a luxury of indulgence instead of survival of that past, to hoard it for self indulgence is an act of greed when it can be used to uplift the tribe.
 
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Votes as they stand.
Adhoc vote count started by Yzarc on May 19, 2024 at 12:05 AM, finished with 33 posts and 5 votes.

  • [X] Kill them.
    [X] Spare them. Have Lorgar…..convince them.
    -[X] In normal circumstances they'd be executed, but they're not fully responsible for their actions because of the influence of the Wound. Have Lorgar teach them to better master themselves and rehabilitate them. Mind control is best avoided, but therapy for warp influenced criminals is a different matter, and use this reasoning to help persuade them to cooperate with the process.
    -[X] Cultural Divide: Emphasise that you're remaining true for the core values and virtues of your culture, respect for the spirits and people of the living world. In the face of that, the logistics of how we love, which technologies we use don't matter. The superficial will change, but that
    -[X] Heightened tempers: We are each vast, containing multitudes. Each person is the sum of a great many parts; habits, drives and experiences. Those parts of ourselves we want to emphasised can be cultivated both by meditation and action so we can each become more of the person we want to be while those aspects we disfavoured can be controlled or channelled to be productive. Those parts of the mind/soul resonate with the Warp.
    -[X] Redistribution of water: Just as we allow our herd animals to drink water, we need to spend water on technology to make more water in future. If we don't invest resources now, we won't have better lives in future.
    [X] Kill them.
    -[X] make is so that their deaths are dignified and honorable, as their actions come from place of misunderstandings, fear and ultimately love of fellow tribe members, choosing to avoid assassination & murder
    -[X] have their items & possessions redisposed back to there families if they have any, and to be spread throughtout the tribe if they don't have any relatives
    [X] Plan: 3 different ways to say "I Love You" & we have a blessed fount of infinite water
    -[X] Cultural Divide: Have Lorgar work on the Cultural divide. He would need to unify the beliefs of the people, old and new so that people do not fear change.
    --[X] Humans are created with a womb, built from the air we breathe, food consumed and water drank, all of which are from; therefore self-belief in human potential is faith in nature and the spirits that helped you be you, the old ways of spirits and nature is belief in humans.
    --[X] furthermore, Lorgar's awakening as shed light on how existence is comprised of "Yin & Yang"; "Yin" is the warp, the realm of chaos and potential, the Empyrean, the Aether, the Sea of Souls, etc. "Yang" the physical energies of real space, structured and tangible matter.
    --[X] Human souls, made of the air, water, food, of the milk and love of another humans
    --[X] the spirits of the desert swimming through the sand, the maelstrom spirits that call down rain, soaring through the skies and clouds, and the world soul residing within the planet of Colchis
    --[X] the Motive Force, the flow of existence is to say what makes up souls and what causes change; look at the tools you wield, from spears made of bone containing animals, do you say they don't have souls? and the metal that comes from the earth, will you deny the extistance of spirits that gave the materials that make up the guns and machines we now possess?
    --[X] the soul and the body made up many parts, the spirits of the land and nature that make up the world, the machine spirits that come from the metal and bones provided by those of nature; do not fall under that spell where you fail your body touching existence as if you were a sperate things, that the spirits of nature and machine are separate things, that humans are separate things.
    --[X] ancestor spirits, animal spirits, nature spirits, machine spirits, the words change but the universe doesn't change
    --[X] many different words meaning the same thing, the universe having 3 different ways to express information, data, knowledge, to observe itself and be observed, and we come to the conclusion that the tribe has 3 different ways of saying "I Love You"
    -[X] Heightened tempers : You are going out and talking to people. The Talismans work but not as well as expected. You are going to have to make some meditation techniques to help people.
    --[X] understand that you can do it, that you are capable of more you can know; to retain our culture look to the tools we craft, inscribe on the surface of weapons of personal prayers to the spirits (both nature and machine), knowledge of who forged said tools and who has owned/used it, of the songs & dance and other facets of our traditions.
    --[X] our tradition of hunting and gathering, you think it would disappear? where would the bones that make up charms and weapons? when one goes out looking for metals and resources, isn't that a hunt, a trek and journey into the desert to find what the tribe needs?
    --[X] self prayer, self-belief, they come in different forms; for one it is to be on the hunt, to trek harsh and desolate deserts seeking mighty prey, for others its to craft unique art, personal tools or well thought out gifts to others, others it is in the traditional dances and songs they sing, or the observation and admiration found in the beauty of nature, even the action of talking to another and learning bout their likes and dislikes.
    --[X] when one thinks of self-belief what do they think it is? it is to do what you love, it is to love yourself, this tribe has been doing it for so long what is their to contemplate about?
    -[X] Redistribution of water : Thalassa works on the Resource redistribution. She will reduce the resources used for machines and redirect them to the people. But she will also explain how the use of water and other precious resources will not negatively impact the tribes, with their abilities.
    --[X] Write in some ideas on how to convince a desert tribe that using precious water for machines is not a bad thing and what compromises can be made.
    --[X] we were blessed with an infinite source of water, one that everyone has been to the oasis and drank from the fount, one that has quenches our thirst to such a level that one sip has granted us little need of water , our bodies will last throughout long droughts for several generations.
    --[X] the Fount is protected by a holy barrier so none can take it from us and we can always go back to restock on water, water is now more used to wet a dry throat then to sate thirst, it is a luxury of indulgence instead of survival of that past, to hoard it for self indulgence is an act of greed when it can be used to uplift the tribe.
 
Well, it is as good a plan as any for solving the problem.

[X] Plan: 3 different ways to say "I Love You" & we have a blessed fount of infinite water
 
@Yzarc is it possible to impose a particular Yozi theme or Imprint upon new Worldspirit during reconstruction of its Core? For Example Mentalities of SWLIHN or Principles of Gaia or others?
 
@Yzarc is it possible to impose a particular Yozi theme or Imprint upon new Worldspirit during reconstruction of its Core? For Example Mentalities of SWLIHN or Principles of Gaia or others?
A world soul is the literal reflection of the life you want on the planet.

Ask yourself if you really REALLY want that to be Yozi themed?

Also, you only have access to 3 Yozi, SHLiHN, Cecelyne and the Ebon Dragon.
 
Personally I think SHLiHN is best option if he consider her Hate Against Chaos and focus social cohesion. I mean she dislikes randomness and free will. It does not mean she supports tyranny or oppression rather she like system that are orderly, efficient and well maintained. Those are clearly good qualities in warhammer.
 
Here is a story for you.
forums.spacebattles.com

Warhammer 40K : What if the Emperor became a Chaos God ?

This was suggested to me by one my readers on ffnet as an idea for a short story, and I thought...

Here is the relevant part.

Then, all humans – not just those who lived under the Imperium's aegis, but also the descendants of long-lost colonists and the heretics who make up the Lost and the Damned – heard the same word, a same compulsion booming through their very souls :

SUBMIT

Most of those who heard the word of the Eternal Tyrant died, their brains failing to comprehend the enormity of what had just happened, their souls torn from their flesh and fed to the New God. Of those who survived, many were reduced to hollow shells of the people they had been – barely sentient, repeating the same actions day after day, without end. They are still there, on those silent worlds, trapped in an eternal cycle entirely devoid of meaning, denied even the cold release of death as long as their actions serve the Tyrant through their repetition. The Lost and the Damned fared better, though even they were crippled unto their very souls by the rise of the Lord of Light.
In short, you are using the Essence of a broken Primordial, one who has......issues with freewill. And are using it to make a Worldsoul, a soul that is the reflection of all the life on the planet.

If you go ahead with this, do not blame me for what happens.
 
Here is a story for you.
forums.spacebattles.com

Warhammer 40K : What if the Emperor became a Chaos God ?

This was suggested to me by one my readers on ffnet as an idea for a short story, and I thought...

Here is the relevant part.


In short, you are using the Essence of a broken Primordial, one who has......issues with freewill. And are using it to make a Worldsoul, a soul that is the reflection of all the life on the planet.

If you go ahead with this, do not blame me for what happens.
Can we able to use Lorgar's Mythos as Foundation of Worldspirit rather than the exalted?
 
we could have the world spirit heal naturally?

also would it be funny if we gave the planet true faith and started preaching to it?
 
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