Remove ads

Dungeon Crawler You!

Reader mode
GenericName said:
The thing is that eventually we might be attacked by someone with a skull. Moose doesn't need to hunt them down, eventually it's an actual risk, if not an inevitability, that we'll be attacked by people who want to kill us. This allows us to work in self defense without getting marked as a killer ourselves. The narrative that bounty hunter will turn moose into a hardened killer out for blood is inaccurate, it will basically give us a warning if dangerous people are nearby and allow us to defend ourselves if they try anything.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
If they attack us, we can kill them with or without Bounty Hunter. That's fine, but we're already very casually talking about killing enough people to stay alive ourselves. That doesn't instill in me much faith that we're going to carefully judge each person we let Moose kill.

I'd prefer to have the enhanced ability to find things and people, instead of focusing it all on criminals. Each person we can save with Seeing Eye Dog's Spot/Pathfinder combo is a future asset, not just to us, but to the rest of us Earthlings. Each of them will get to continue leveling.

@Skippy (Were you discharged?) If you want to go around bullying bosses, consider Pirate Captain's doubled boss box actionable. Would go well together.

Edit: We need someone with Escape Plan or Pathfinder for this floor. We don't have Sysop online yet, so we can't pull off a teleport or roll up a crawler chat snowball, so we need to find a stairwell within a week's travel.

Edit: Seeing Eye Dog has half the votes of the leaders, that's a surmountable gap. Only need twelve more votes or BOF and BH each taking a couple steps back.
 
Last edited:
[x] Class: Seeing Eye Dog
[X] Class: Bomb Sniffer Dog

Not a lot of hope of Seeing Eye Dog suddenly getting ten votes and catching upto the level of BoL and BHD..

Also please don't let this be another drawn out tie..
 
Last edited:
_brightwing said:
Not a lot of hope of Seeing Eye Dog suddenly getting ten votes and catching upto the level of BoL and BHD..

Also please don't let this be another drawn out tie..
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
It can, Hard Cash went up from next to nothing to double the leading vote, so I'm pretty hopeful. If anyone's voting for BOF so BH won't win or vice versa, people can pair up to remove those votes. For instance, you're voting for Bounty Hunter. If you remove that vote, I'll remove mine for Boring Old Fighter. It'll be like an extra vote to Bomb Sniffer and Seeing Eye Dog.
 
GenericName said:
The thing is that eventually we might be attacked by someone with a skull. Moose doesn't need to hunt them down, eventually it's an actual risk, if not an inevitability, that we'll be attacked by people who want to kill us. This allows us to work in self defense without getting marked as a killer ourselves. The narrative that bounty hunter will turn moose into a hardened killer out for blood is inaccurate, it will basically give us a warning if dangerous people are nearby and allow us to defend ourselves if they try anything.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
The narrative is going to be "Team Trick Shot picked a class optimised to kill other crawlers over all their other (unknown) class choices". This is brute fact. The other crawlers can't read our minds. They don't know our motivations for taking Bounty Hunter. They only know that, out of what is typically a few hundred options, we chose a crawler-killer class to give to our biggest, most intimidating party member.

Can we dig our way out of that hole with stellar diplomacy and a record of good behaviour? Maybe. Will it be a metaphorical skull constantly hanging over Team Trick Shot's name? Definitely.
 
Olivebirdy said:
If they attack us, we can kill them with or without Bounty Hunter. That's fine, but we're already very casually talking about killing enough people to stay alive ourselves. That doesn't instill in me much faith that we're going to carefully judge each person we let Moose kill.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I'm very casually talking about the fact that I expect people to attack us and therefore we will need to kill them to stay alive ourselves. Out of the 200 some crawlers we've met so far at least one of them will need to die (Eugene is converting the Astronomy Army into platinum boxes) and at least some of Team Treason seem likely to cross the line at some point. Even if only 1 in 200 crawlers is homicidal, the fact that the AI rewards them makes them more likely to survive. I expect way more than 3500 problem crawlers to have made it to this floor.

Every crawler we save is additional power. This includes preventing other crawlers from killing them.

Velorien said:
The narrative is going to be "Team Trick Shot picked a class optimised to kill other crawlers over all their other (unknown) class choices". This is brute fact. The other crawlers can't read our minds. They don't know our motivations for taking Bounty Hunter. They only know that, out of what is typically a few hundred options, we chose a crawler-killer class to give to our biggest, most intimidating party member.

Can we dig our way out of that hole with stellar diplomacy and a record of good behaviour? Maybe. Will it be a metaphorical skull constantly hanging over Team Trick Shot's name? Definitely.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I think Moose can win people over if they get a chance to talk to him.
 
Removing my BOF vote and reinstating the tie (sorry) because I'd actually really like to see Seeing Eye Dog get more traction -- with the amount that Moose and Calliope team up, and her taking a class that won't actively support her much in combat and her typical kamikaze plays... I'd like to see her with more scouting support (even beyond her getting Danger Sense as a racial ability.)

Yeah, him being a tank would protect her too, but he's already strong and anyway, imo it might be better to know what's coming than hope that strength is a catch-all solution.

Plus imagine the plays they'd be able to accomplish, Seeing-Eye!Moose able to know where enemies are before they even have an inkling we exist, the two of them sneaking up, Calliope able to use her puppydog eyes You Never Fed Me, Honest! skill to catch enemies off guard/stall, then the two of them ambushing with a surprise double whammy from the skies (or a speedy getaway!). Some good shit.
 
Last edited:
nickelesque said:
Removing my BOF vote and reinstating the tie (sorry) because I'd actually really like to see Seeing Eye Dog get more traction -- with the amount that Moose and Calliope team up, and her taking a class that won't actively support her much in combat and her typical kamikaze plays... I'd like to see her with more scouting support (even beyond her getting Danger Sense as a racial ability.)

Yeah, him being a tank would protect her too, but he's already strong and anyway, imo it might be better to know what's coming than hope that strength is a catch-all solution.

Plus imagine the plays they'd be able to accomplish, Seeing-Eye!Moose able to know where enemies are before they even have an inkling we exist, the two of them sneaking up, Calliope able to use her puppydog kittycat eyes to catch enemies off guard/stall, then the two of them ambushing with a surprise double whammy from the skies (or a speedy getaway!). Some good shit.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
If we get BoF dog then Leo will always have a defender.
And with that class Drew can go for more out there classes on the next floor seeing as he doesn't need to be fully among the main fighters.
Also a stronger dog can pick up some fun objects.
Also a beatstick has more than one function such as being a one dog demolition company.
It's a better option than the bountyhunter dog because he can train regenerate.
Joining us in breaking the tie versus bountyhunter is a partywide increase in survivabillity
.
 
Last edited:
If we are talking good television, I'm pretty sure squishing bosses like they were mobs is going to be more interesting than hunting other crawlers.

Later levels also definitely have bosses that a flying super dog could help with.

Being able to be the calvary is also useful for making friends.
 
Last edited:
schlega said:
Every crawler we save is additional power. This includes preventing other crawlers from killing them.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Yeah, point. Still, not to knock extra lives, but Bounty Hunter doesn't help kill other crawlers much more than the other classes. What it mostly does is give better incentives. If it comes down to a serial killer, Seeing Eye Dog can track them down and we can bring in the rest of the party. (And it's not limited to only tracking criminals.) If they can find them, BOF can just mulch them and Bomb Sniffer could set up traps.
charlesrwest said:
If we are talking good television, I'm pretty sure squishing bosses like they were mobs is going to be more interesting than hunting other crawlers.

Later levels also definitely have bosses that a flying super dog could help with.

Being able to be the calvary is also useful for making friends.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Most of the choices have obvious benefits for views. The audience at home loves crawlers killing each other. They'd love a dog wrecking bosses as long as it's cool, and they'd love a dog finding and saving crawlers in trouble. Getting views from collaborations is classic YouTube.
 
Last edited:
Olivebirdy said:
Yeah, point. Still, not to knock extra lives, but Bounty Hunter doesn't help kill other crawlers that much more than the other classes. What it mostly does is give better incentives. If it comes down to a serial killer, Seeing Eye Dog can track them down and we can bring in the rest of the party. (And it's not limited to only tracking criminals.) If they can find them, BOF can just mulch them and Bomb Sniffer could set up traps.
Most of the choices have obvious benefits for views. The audience at home loves crawlers killing each other. They'd love a dog wrecking bosses as long as it's cool, and they'd love a dog finding and saving crawlers in trouble.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I really want the extra lives for Leo. The show runners are going to be specifically targeting her to avoid having to pay for celestial boxes.

Another long term potential is Plus One combined with Mystic Scholar's access to all training guilds. I'm not sure what type of skills will be trainable, but being able to convert money into power sounds really good.
 
schlega said:
I think Moose can win people over if they get a chance to talk to him.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I think that's quite likely, assuming they're prepared to take his behaviour at face value. I doubt there are many sapient animal crawlers around the dungeon, and the first thing people are going to see when they look at him is a particularly intimidating dungeon monster, only with a blue dot on the map. Moose's innate friendliness needs to overcome that first impression, and also the fact that he naturally has no social skills and could accidentally say all sorts of inconvenient or misinterpretable things. Notably, we don't know much about his moral outlook yet, or even if he has one beyond pack predator instincts, and I have images of him casually saying things like "I want to be friends with everyone, unless they threaten my people, in which case I'll kill them", all while towering over you with a body that is no longer shaped like a familiar friendly pet's.

And of course, that's a big if. If I had a skull for any reason, or just felt vulnerable, I would probably give Trick Shot a wide berth the way a canon crawler would Lucia Mar and her dogs.
 
Adhoc vote count started by RandomOTP on Sep 29, 2022 at 1:39 PM, finished with 421 posts and 44 votes.
Click to expand...


Current status of votes, including Moose Class, Drew's Choices, and the Party's Path.
 
schlega said:
Out of the 200 some crawlers we've met so far at least one of them will need to die (Eugene is converting the Astronomy Army into platinum boxes)
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Speaking of, we have met him in person. If he's managed to escape from a vengeful Astronomy Army, we could track him down with Seeing Eye Dog if we decide he needs to die by our hands. Though as SysOp depends on people trusting us, I'd rather be skullless. ....Wouldn't say no to extorting him out of all his boxes and gear, though.
schlega said:
I really want the extra lives for Leo. The show runners are going to be specifically targeting her to avoid having to pay for celestial boxes.

Another long term potential is Plus One combined with Mystic Scholar's access to all training guilds. I'm not sure what type of skills will be trainable, but being able to convert money into power sounds really good.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
If the showrunners want her dead, she's dead. Period. No matter what. Carl only survives because his destruction is entertaining enough to make a net profit. If someone shit-talks Borant, they die to an unending swarm of monsters. 'Acceleration' was a threat for if we did something as harmless as missing three payments on Med Student's debt. If Borant thinks she'll cost them bankrupting amounts of money, they'll support us while the anticipation earns them money, then she'll die. They have no interest in nor rules for playing fair. An extra life or ten won't save her.

eaglejarl said:
  • Access to all training guilds and an unlock for each skill trainable at that guild
"Training guilds give you experience in a skill as though you had actually used it in the field," Levi said. "Normally you can't use a training guild unless you have at least level 7 in the skill, but it looks like this class can use them to get level 1 in a skill and then you can train it up from there. That's huge. Without it, getting level 1 in a skill or spell is super difficult or impossible if you don't have a boost from the dungeon. In this particular case, you'll lose the unlock if you leave the guild without paying to train the skill."
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

eaglejarl said:
Skill: Plus One
You may bring up to (Skill Level) party members with you into areas that they would otherwise not be welcome. You may accompany party members into areas where you would not otherwise be welcome.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Only the Mystic Scholar gets the unlocks for all skills at Level 1*. Everyone else has to train from skills they already have at level 7. We don't know how hard it is to get access to a training hall for a skill we already have, but I think it's as easy as a V/D pass-- which we can pass around with SysOp.

We don't know that Plus One works that way, that Moose can enter an area he's not allowed in that a party member is allowed in, while also bringing in (Skill Level) people. @eaglejarl?

Edit: *....unless unlocks come in the form of permission slips Drew could share. And it could be that Drew won't get that actionable anyway.
 
Last edited:
Anyway, in more lighthearted terms can we all agree that Moose is Best DOG and definitely much better than the dogs in canon?

Because thinking back on it the last chapter right before he got his intellect he was flipping adorable just wanting to be with his human. or at least not stuck in a blue wall.
 
Velorien said:
The narrative is going to be "Team Trick Shot picked a class optimised to kill other crawlers over all their other (unknown) class choices". This is brute fact. The other crawlers can't read our minds. They don't know our motivations for taking Bounty Hunter. They only know that, out of what is typically a few hundred options, we chose a crawler-killer class to give to our biggest, most intimidating party member.

Can we dig our way out of that hole with stellar diplomacy and a record of good behaviour? Maybe. Will it be a metaphorical skull constantly hanging over Team Trick Shot's name? Definitely.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...


I'm so confused by this line of reasoning. The class is more than just angelic approval for one, and even if it wasn't, it's only a crawler killer class for other crawler killers. This whole idea of pure pacifism under any circumstances is not something that survives contact with the enemy. If by the end of quest we have not killed a single crawler I will be actually shocked.

Fact is that this option essentially gives us proof of self defense. If we're every in a situation where we NEED to kill someone because they're actively attempting to murder us for power, we can kill them without getting marked negatively. If anyone looks at this class and goes "see now they're gonna hunt down crawlers," then they haven't leveled INT once, and even if they do say that, no one here is going to vote for that so we simply prove them wrong by not doing that.

That's not even going into the benefits of dual club membership and the ability to bring people with him. That's honestly the strongest part of the class short term, and we can easily justify the class pick with that alone.
 
Bond674 said:
Anyway, in more lighthearted terms can we all agree that Moose is Best DOG and definitely much better than the dogs in canon?

Because thinking back on it the last chapter right before he got his intellect he was flipping adorable just wanting to be with his human. or at least not stuck in a blue wall.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Absolutely, Moose is great. His meme speak is gonna get real old real fast, though, so I hope he matures, or at least stops yelling in Doge.
GenericName said:
If by the end of quest we have not killed a single crawler I will be actually shocked.

Fact is that this option essentially gives us proof of self defense.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
These two statements contradict each other. If you think that most people will get skulls because it's going to be kill or be killed, the angel wings are in no way proof of self-defensea.

Many otherwise innocent crawlers will have skulls, and will be potential targets. They will know they're potential targets.

GenericName said:
That's not even going into the benefits of dual club membership and the ability to bring people with him. That's honestly the strongest part of the class short term, and we can easily justify the class pick with that alone.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
We already have the ability to share, transfer, pass around club tattoos. It's not going to be hard to pick them up normally, or trade another crawler for them. We can not easily justify the class pick off of the ability to bring people into either club at the same time when it's easy to acquire the ability to allow people into either club separately. It's just not that big an upgrade.
 
Last edited:
Olivebirdy said:
We already have the ability to share, transfer, pass around club tattoos. It's not going to be hard to pick them up normally, or trade another crawler for them. We can not easily justify the class pick off of the ability to bring people into either club at the same time when it's easy to acquire the ability to allow people into either club separately. It's just not that big an upgrade.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
Transferring a tattoo disables SysOp for 30h.
Without +1 we can forget feasibly taking people into restricted areas for money/favours (Well, unless what they have to offer is so awesome it is worth 30h no SysOp class)
Oh and we can forget doing it this floor at all. SysOp is deactivated because we had to transfer Drews +20 int to Moose.

And where do you get the idea from that it certainly is done via transferring tattoos? How are you certain that those two clubs are the only relevant areas?
 
Olivebirdy said:
If you want to go around bullying bosses, consider Pirate Captain's doubled boss box actionable. Would go well together.
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

That would be great actually, yeah. Perhaps we might get it on another floor with Character Actor from Drew, or if we meet someone with the class and use Sysop - although there's an opportunity cost to both. Still, organising BOSS RUSH PIRATE LOOT CRUISE 2022 does seem like to good of an idea to pass up on.

We could make little pirate hats for everyone! 🏴‍☠️🏴‍☠️🏴‍☠️

_brightwing said:
Also please don't let this be another drawn out tie..
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

The one downside of Character Actor is that we may have this to look forward to on every floor when it's time to pick a new class for Drew. Doubly so if we use Sysop to clone Character Actor onto multiple people. There's something about choosing between abilities/shinies which makes for very compelling quest arguments.

...Maybe let's not give Character actor to other party members. 😅
 
Skippy said:
That would be great actually, yeah. Perhaps we might get it on another floor with Character Actor from Drew, or if we meet someone with the class and use Sysop - although there's an opportunity cost to both. Still, organising BOSS RUSH PIRATE LOOT CRUISE 2022 does seem like to good of an idea to pass up on.

We could make little pirate hats for everyone! 🏴‍☠️🏴‍☠️🏴‍☠️



The one downside of Character Actor is that we may have this to look forward to on every floor when it's time to pick a new class for Drew. Doubly so if we use Sysop to clone Character Actor onto multiple people. There's something about choosing between abilities/shinies which makes for very compelling quest arguments.

...Maybe let's not give Character actor to other party members. 😅
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
I expect the vote ties to be slightly less horrible after this hell is over.
Not that it's actually a good idea to use the full-strength sysop power on every floor. (unless of course, it's to get a super actionable onto someone right away. Like cloning the dog on the end of the next floor.)
 
Reader mode
You must login or register to reply here.
Remove ads
Back
Top