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Command: Modern Air & Naval Operations: Let's Play and Expansions

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Next scenario needs to be a Mediterranean one, why break the streak.

I suggest either some variant of "Spain takes Gibraltar" (UK vs Spain), "Suez Crisis 2.0" (Egypt vs the World), or "Bosporous (sic) Bottlenecking" (Russia vs EU/NATO).
 
Jonen - but when will poaw get his chance to wreck the Swedish and German Navies?
 
Do a sequel to this one, Greece vs. Turkey, playing as the Turks.

Name it "Operation Insert Kebab".
 
Lailoken said:
There is something very characteristic in one of this forum's members expressing lesser lament over the strategic consequences of the loss of planes and pilots than the munitions that they were carrying.
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Only because I'm running out of missiles faster than I'm running out of planes.
 
poaw said:
No, because my nearest airfield is completely out of AMRAAMs* so I had to transfer my fighters to airfields further away. Operating from the further airbases reduces my response time significantly. My tanker situation doesn't allow me to run strikes into Greece and maintain a fighter cap so this is a problem.
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From what you've said in this thread, I believe it's safe to say that unfired missiles and unused fuel landed at an airbase go back into inventory, correct? Can you transfer missiles and fuel from further airbases to nearer ones on fighters? Or with tankers? I recognize that it probably won't let you use trucks, but if this is half as simulationist as it seems to be there ought to be at least a bad solution. If you've thought of this and it's too much micromanagement, I apologize for wasting your time.

EDIT: If this is possible, could you do it with carriers, too?
 
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Fission Mailed
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    • Wakka said:
    From what you've said in this thread, I believe it's safe to say that unfired missiles and unused fuel landed at an airbase go back into inventory, correct? Can you transfer missiles and fuel from further airbases to nearer ones on fighters? Or with tankers? I recognize that it probably won't let you use trucks, but if this is half as simulationist as it seems to be there ought to be at least a bad solution. If you've thought of this and it's too much micromanagement, I apologize for wasting your time.

    EDIT: If this is possible, could you do it with carriers, too?
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    There is *roundabout* way of doing this, but it's not cool in the slightest. (Fuel is universally stored and unlimited BTW)

    Basically I can ready an aircraft at a base further away then have it take off and re-assign it to a different airfield. When it lands it will have to be re-readied, but it's stores will transfer. It works with carriers as well. The only problem is I can't load stores on cargo planes (nor did I have cargo planes). So I can fly exactly one load down at a time, not such a big deal with the fighters (A2A loadouts ready in 30 minutes), but for strike loadouts it's 6 hours.

    It's not preferable because I can fly from the further airbase in about 22 minutes, although I would have more fuel once I got there.
    ----------------------------------------------
    Anyway, I called this one a Fission Mailed.

    My southern most carrier group lost 2 frigates and a destroyer, to AShM attacks, with the CV itself being completely trashed and most of it's airwing destroyed (heavily damaged once they stopped the flooding and put out the fires, able to make 7 kts). My northern group got plugged by Mirage-2000s while attempting to shell one of my objectives. The CV there was lost along with another destroyer.

    I decided to make a last push at the newly opened channel through their IADS to take out at least ONE airfield for my trouble. At the same time though my sole AWACs had to go off station along with several of my tankers. I set up the back up tankers, but didn't have any AEW Helos to put up (sunk or burned up in their hanger) and my AAW ships were resting in the locker of one Davy Jones as well. As soon as my mob of strikers came down and started tanking, Greek F-16s flipped on their radars and lobbed a veritable wall of AMRAAMs at me. Most of the strikers avoided the missiles, but the tankers did not. This wouldn't be a complete disaster except the F-16s pushed in to use their Sidewinders as well. My strike aircraft had their own IR missiles for self defense, but those kinds of fights tend to be a bit of MAD. We both bleed but they're losing 5 pints from an elephant, I'm losing 5 pints from a human.

    Once all the F-16s are down, I have one tanker left airborne to refuel 20+ Tornados who have just spent 5+ minutes at afterburner while at the literal edge of their strike range...

    Pictured: How much fuel I had as I turned everyone around to fly back ~450nmi to base.

    The ones who were lowest I attempted to divert to nearby airfield when I look a bit to the southeast and see this:


    Well shit...

    7 Tornados with less than a Range Rover's worth of gas between them have to now afterburn to dodge missiles. I lost 5 to fuel starvation and 2 to missiles. The remaining Tornados made it to the other divert field, only to run out of fuel during pre-landing.

    The strike aircraft I had left were 3 Tornado ECRs, 4 IDS, 4 AMX-11 and 4 Predators.

    I dun goofed on that one.
     
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    • poaw said:
    Anyway, I called this one a Fission Mailed.

    My southern most carrier group lost 2 frigates and a destroyer, to AShM attacks, with the CV itself being completely trashed and most of it's airwing destroyed (heavily damaged once they stopped the flooding and put out the fires, able to make 7 kts). My northern group got plugged by Mirage-2000s while attempting to shell one of my objectives. The CV there was lost along with another destroyer.
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    So, how much of the Marina Militare has survived this?

    I dun goofed on that one.
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    Man, it almost seems like this "war" thing is hard.
     
    Give the man some credit here, this sounds like a bitch of a mission. The Greeks have a buttload of ground radar with a meaningful SAM force to back it up, not to mention their very own airborne Not Fucking Around Crew. Facing that kind of opposition, Lord High Admiral Custer poaw has aircraft with approximately equal weapons and flight characteristics, (AMRAAMs vs. AMRAAMs) not to mention a lack of game-changers like VLO aircraft or massive numbers of cruise missiles.

    Not to mention, goddamned Harriers. :mad:
     
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    You know, it's time to make a call to Madrid and Paris and ask them for help. Nicely.

    But seriously, couldn't the Typhoon fly under the radar horizon of the long range search systems and lob stealth cruise missiles?
     
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    I thought that with your (destructive) leadership whould bring italy to victory, instead now the greek beat us again, you just spawned a new generation of jokes about italian military "capabilities":rage::anger::rage:
     
    Rufus Shinra said:
    You know, it's time to make a call to Madrid and Paris and ask them for help. Nicely.

    But seriously, couldn't the Typhoon fly under the radar horizon of the long range search systems and lob stealth cruise missiles?
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    The fighters shot down my Storm Shadows when I tried. Even if they weren't they were shooting down my HARMs when I attacked the radars.

    There are various things I'd do differently on a second playthrough. Not out of any specific insight, but because I have the gift of 20/20 hindsight at this point. For example I probably would have gone in hard and heavy early and eaten the losses to fighters and strike aircraft in order to shut down even one or two airfields.

    I'd do more to avoid the saturation attacks on my CVBGs because those are what bled my missile magazines dry, which had massive knock on effects (the lack of protective umbrella for my harriers is why they all got shot down). I'd also lean much more heavily on fighters based further away, to burn through my stockpiles of AMRAAMs more evenly, along with being more aggressive with my usage of their missiles (going for 4 on each target to bring my Pk​ up while reducing the "wastage" inherent when a fighter dies with 6 missiles on it's rails.

    Quite an illustrative experience all in all.
     
    Nuts! said:
    Give the man some credit here, this sounds like a bitch of a mission. The Greeks have a buttload of ground radar with a meaningful SAM force to back it up, not to mention their very own airborne Not Fucking Around Crew. Facing that kind of opposition, Lord High Admiral Custer poaw has aircraft with approximately equal weapons and flight characteristics, (AMRAAMs vs. AMRAAMs) not to mention a lack of game-changers like VLO aircraft or massive numbers of cruise missiles.

    Not to mention, goddamned Harriers. :mad:
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    He had a game-changer: his Storm Shadow stealth missiles that could have been used to take out the enemy's long-range detection capabilities.
    Alt!Chri said:
    I thought that with your (destructive) leadership whould bring italy to victory, instead now the greek beat us again, you just spawned a new generation of jokes about italian military "capabilities":rage::anger::rage:
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    Yeah, the facepalms in the various militaries must have been registered by seismic sensors all around the world.
    Grin_Reaper said:
    Yeah, the CdG survived the last two scenarios, we need to fix that. And the Spanish haven't even been touched at all yet.
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    Are you kidding? In the poaw-verse, the CdG is now a ship of legend, its airwing having owned the Russian ships in Syria so hard Putin backed down from World War III, all the while the carrier got itself ready to give a spanking to an airforce equipped with modern air superiority fighters the next year.

    poaw said:
    The fighters shot down my Storm Shadows when I tried. Even if they weren't they were shooting down my HARMs when I attacked the radars.
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    What the hell? Those are supposed to be stealth missiles, and you should launch them at a low altitude where the radars are physically deprived of any LoS. How do they shot down stealth targets that are particularly tiny and flying just above the ground?!
     
    Rufus Shinra said:
    What the hell? Those are supposed to be stealth missiles, and you should launch them at a low altitude where the radars are physically deprived of any LoS. How do they shot down stealth targets that are particularly tiny and flying just above the ground?!
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    The F-16s were what shot them down, as soon as they got near the radar they swung around with their radars on and started firing AMRAAMs. The Greek AEW aircraft could have had something to do with that.
     
    poaw said:
    The F-16s were what shot them down, as soon as they got near the radar they swung around with their radars on and started firing AMRAAMs. The Greek AEW aircraft could have had something to do with that.
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    If their AEW aircraft saw such missiles coming, I doubt that stealth planes could have gone in undetected, then. Yeah, saturation strikes on the radars and the airfield seems to have been needed.
     
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