The 45th will turn their retreat from an easy way to pad our KDA into yet more cannon fire from both sides with roughly equal losses. Even if they go into the forest they are still in medium range of the entire enemy artillery park.
Could we shoot them ourselves to make them rout sooner?
Maverick is certainly one of the worst traits on the table.
Eh, we didn't really know how to work around it. There are worse traits and we gained useful information - Mavericks want to attack people if they are in a position to do so, rather than hide. If we put them on the front of a charge, there is very little chance of their trait making the plan go awry.
My main thought on their artillery is that if they're retreating, they have to stop ready firing for the turn - for half a dozen turns for their Dwa Art since they left it more than one space off the road. We might be able to catch those Dwarves, as well as encircling the units in the Foret, if we push forward.
The main issue is with the 61st and 75th, who might retreat a lot later than expected. We can't storm forward with the cavalry until they stop firing, less our poor cavalry gets even more beaten.
Though that doesn't mean that we couldn't try to get the dwarven artillery, I am mainly looking at our cavalry for that here who could try getting to it after charging the jaegers
Ideal target to hit still means a 26% chance of routing them, but this is an option. If you're planning to do this, I would also recommend a charge with the 108th on the hill. We are guaranteed to rout the dwarves, plus the option to move up the hill next turn.
Ideal target to hit still means a 26% chance of routing them, but this is an option. If you're planning to do this, I would also recommend a charge with the 108th on the hill. We are guaranteed to rout the dwarves, plus the option to move up the hill next turn.
Would it be worth it to have the 45th shoot the enemy 90th?
That way we would get a medium range shot off before the 45th inevitably routs. If we target the 90th with the horse artillery as well, we might do some good damage.
Eh, we didn't really know how to work around it. There are worse traits and we gained useful information - Mavericks want to attack people if they are in a position to do so, rather than hide. If we put them on the front of a charge, there is very little chance of their trait making the plan go awry.
What makes you think they will even listen to our orders anymore?
Even if we let him to do what he wants, that pompous commander may not even read his orders anymore.
Besides we going to need to punish him regardless of the outcome, if he fails it going need to be public and if succeeds it needs to be subtly because we can't reward maverick behavior less other units in the future feel they can do the same and that may cost a battle.
The fact they took significant fire due to an ill-conceived charge. Just because a unit ignored an order once doesn't mean they are incapable of following new orders, they aren't malfunctioning robots.
Also, small correction @Photomajig: Your combat log lists the the fire of the 72d Hum as -20, rather than the -50 from long-range fire. With the 177th being 3 tiles away at the start of T9, that is probably an error.
@Photomajig Also, another point: Shouldn't the 200th be hidden, considering any feasible enemy LOS is blocked either by the 45th or the woods tile? This does have some implications for how I would like to move them this turn.
@Photomajig Also, another point: Shouldn't the 200th be hidden, considering any feasible enemy LOS is blocked either by the 45th or the woods tile? This does have some implications for how I would like to move them this turn.
Alright, might as well get on with making a plan. The key question raised is whether to attempt a charge with the cavalry. They are quite mauled, but also have a high chance of recovering casulties due to the elves + cav combo. Charging now might allow us to maul the 14th and use the routing of the 100th dwarves to our advantage, considering that their routing could likely disorganize units as they are currently getting to safety. The key question involved is what the 75th does. Shooting at the 45th does make sense, but so does ready fire against a cavalry charge. A general retreat also makes sense, considering the units can't be pulled back much further and Wachenheim might mistakenly believe in our infantry charge and doesn't want to wait 4 turns for the 20th to safely get in proximity to the street.
If I were in Wachenheim's shoes, I would direct fire at the 45th with the 61st and possibly the 90th. I would probably start moving the the dwarven volunteer artillery out trying to prevent them from being left behind, since I value Jägers less than artillery parity. The 75th goes on ready fire, trying to repulse a cavalry charge.
With this in mind, I have a suggestion to make. I would move the 16th one east first, attempting to trigger enemy ready fire. The cavalry charges, tyring to bring some kind of resolution to the miserable affair and trigger a general enemy rout. The 200th is moved east, allowing them to move into the woods in the likely scenario of the 45th being routed and freeing the way for the 45th to retreat to the small riverside church for a rout, where they disrupt our lines less. 72nd shoots against the 102nd dwarves, reducing their strength further. Our field artillery corps shoots at the 14th, attempting to make the rout for the cavalry easier. If we are lucky, I might trigger a small rout cascade, where the rout of the 14th triggers a rout of the 100th, which hopefully makes the planned retreat into a panicked one by severely damaging the morale of the 14th hum. Horse artillery shoots at the 90th elves, further routing units and undermining the morale of the 177th; plus interfering further by having another routed unit running around. Outside of that, the just some minor reorganization of our formation.
-[] Draft Plan Cunning and Elan
-[] 200th Hobgoblin Fusiliers Regiment: Move E
-[] 72nd Human Regiment of Foot: Fire at 102nd Dwarves [small chance of routing via crits]
-[] 148th Human Regiment of Foot: REST
-[] 42nd Elven Regiment of Foot: [go last] Move east
-[] 45th Elven Regiment of Foot: Move NE [By Ael, get into cover before you're getting your unit killed]
-[] 16th Halfling Light Regiment: [go before cavalry and 42nd] MOVE E, Then NE
-[] 251st Hobgoblin Fusiliers Regiment: Move NE
-[] 19th Halfling Pathfinders Regiment: Rapid Move E, HIDE
-[] 28th Halfling Pathfinders Regiment: REST.
-[] 55th Elven Hussars Regiment: Charge 14th Half Jäg
-[] 108th Elven Hussars Regiment: Charge E, E, E, E
-[] 13th Hobgoblin Lancers Regiment: Move NE, NE
-[] 84th Elven Artillery Battery: Fire at 14th Half. Jäg
-[] 31st Elven Artillery Battery: Fire at 14th Half. Jäg
-[]10th Human Artillery Battery: Fire at 14th Half. Jäg
-[] 5th Hobgoblin Horse Artillery Battery: Fire at 90th Elv
-[] HQ: Resupply 31st
Explanation: See my above post for a general outline of the idea behind it. I'm committing to cavalry charge, plus a feint that attempts to distract the enemy artillery. I'm hoping that with a decisive cavalry charge, the enemy army looses their nerves and devolves into an unorganized retreat, hopefully allowing us to capture the dwarven volunteers and Jäger units.
Damage tables for key scenarios:
Dwa Vol Art vs. 108th: 58% for 2, 47% for 3
61st vs 45th: 57% for 3, 46% for 4.
75th vs either 55 or 16th: 57% for 3, 46% for 4.
Damage to 14th ["softening them for the charge"]: 72% for 5, 52% for 6
Charge against the 14th: 52% for 5, 33% for 6 -> Depending on how the 100th is moved, the unit might only require 10 rather than 11 cohesion damage for a rout, due to adjecency. All in all, we still have a rather decent 65% for routing them, hopefully collapsing the enemy line in the critical moment.
Alright, might as well get on with making a plan. The key question raised is whether to attempt a charge with the cavalry. They are quite mauled, but also have a high chance of recovering casulties due to the elves + cav combo. Charging now might allow us to maul the 14th and use the routing of the 100th dwarves to our advantage, considering that their routing could likely disorganize units as they are currently getting to safety. The key question involved is what the 75th does. Shooting at the 45th does make sense, but so does ready fire against a cavalry charge. A general retreat also makes sense, considering the units can't be pulled back much further and Wachenheim might mistakenly believe in our infantry charge and doesn't want to wait 4 turns for the 20th to safely get in proximity to the street.
If I were in Wachenheim's shoes, I would direct fire at the 45th with the 61st and possibly the 90th. I would probably start moving the the dwarven volunteer artillery out trying to prevent them from being left behind, since I value Jägers less than artillery parity. The 75th goes on ready fire, trying to repulse a cavalry charge.
With this in mind, I have a suggestion to make. I would move the 16th one east first, attempting to trigger enemy ready fire. The cavalry charges, tyring to bring some kind of resolution to the miserable affair and trigger a general enemy rout. The 200th is moved east, allowing them to move into the woods in the likely scenario of the 45th being routed and freeing the way for the 45th to retreat to the small riverside church for a rout, where they disrupt our lines less. 72nd shoots against the 102nd dwarves, reducing their strength further. Our field artillery corps shoots at the 14th, attempting to make the rout for the cavalry easier. If we are lucky, I might trigger a small rout cascade, where the rout of the 14th triggers a rout of the 100th, which hopefully makes the planned retreat into a panicked one by severely damaging the morale of the 14th hum. Horse artillery shoots at the 90th elves, further routing units and undermining the morale of the 177th; plus interfering further by having another routed unit running around. Outside of that, the just some minor reorganization of our formation.
-[] Draft Plan Cunning and Elan
-[] 200th Hobgoblin Fusiliers Regiment: Move E
-[] 72nd Human Regiment of Foot: Fire at 102nd Dwarves [small chance of routing via crits]
-[] 148th Human Regiment of Foot: REST
-[] 42nd Elven Regiment of Foot: [go last] Move east
-[] 45th Elven Regiment of Foot: Move NE [By Ael, get into cover before you're getting your unit killed]
-[] 16th Halfling Light Regiment: [go before cavalry and 42nd] MOVE E, Then NE
-[] 251st Hobgoblin Fusiliers Regiment: Move NE
-[] 19th Halfling Pathfinders Regiment: Rapid Move E, HIDE
-[] 28th Halfling Pathfinders Regiment: REST.
-[] 55th Elven Hussars Regiment: Charge 14th Half Jäg
-[] 108th Elven Hussars Regiment: Charge E, E, E, E
-[] 13th Hobgoblin Lancers Regiment: Move NE, NE
-[] 84th Elven Artillery Battery: Fire at 14th Half. Jäg
-[] 31st Elven Artillery Battery: Fire at 14th Half. Jäg
-[]10th Human Artillery Battery: Fire at 14th Half. Jäg
-[] 5th Hobgoblin Horse Artillery Battery: Fire at 90th Elv
-[] HQ: Resupply 31st
Explanation: See my above post for a general outline of the idea behind it. I'm committing to cavalry charge, plus a feint that attempts to distract the enemy artillery. I'm hoping that with a decisive cavalry charge, the enemy army looses their nerves and devolves into an unorganized retreat, hopefully allowing us to capture the dwarven volunteers and Jäger units.
Since you are messing around with order of attacks anyway, why not move the 55th before the rest of the cavalry? They are a Defensive Genius, and Elves as well.
Since you are messing around with order of attacks anyway, why not live the 55th before the rest of the cavalry? They are a Defensive Genius, and Elves as well.
What do you mean by live? If you mean move them first, than I'm not moving them first in order to avoid ready fire by the 75th on them, who have a non-neglible chance of routing the our charge. Which is something I explained in detail in my reasoning post.
This being said, the light casualties this damage reduction results is in probably not enough to dissuade them. We may well be forced to either follow them or to watch them go out isolated and get cut to pieces far from our lines.
What do you mean by live? If you mean move them first, than I'm not moving them first in order to avoid ready fire by the 75th on them, who have a non-neglible chance of routing the our charge. Which is something I explained in detail in my reasoning post.
Yeah that was a typo. However, I meant that we should move them before the rest of the cavalry, but after the 16th. The plan is to have the 16th absorb fire from the 75th, but in the case that the 16th does not eat all the ready fire actions, it is better that the 55th is the cavalry unit that gets targeted.
Another thing I would personally change is to fire one of our artillery units at the 102nd. They just rested, so they are not likely to rout otherwise. And if I were Wahhenheim, I would order the 102nd to ready fire against our cavalry, to cover the retreat of his halflings. Thus routing them this turn may prevent our cavalry from taking damage. Routing the 102nd will also deal cohesion damage to both halfling units.
Yeah that was a typo. However, I meant that we should move them before the rest of the cavalry, but after the 16th. The plan is to have the 16th absorb fire from the 75th, but in the case that the 16th does not eat all the ready fire actions, it is better that the 55th is the cavalry unit that gets targeted.
I don't think there are other fire actions to be worried about. The 20th Jäg are commited to moving, the 100th is practically dead and the other units can't fire due to restriction to one-directional ready fire. The dwarven vol art couldn't be triggered by the 108th either.
Another thing I would personally change is to fire one of our artillery units at the 102nd. They just rested, so they are not likely to rout otherwise. And if I were Wachenheim, I would order the 102nd to ready fire against our cavalry, to cover the retreat of his halflings. Thus routing them this turn may prevent our cavalry from taking damage. Routing the 102nd will also deal cohesion damage to both halfling units.
Are you confusing the 102nd with the 100th? Because the 102nd can't ready fire against our artillery, they could only ready fire east. Which isn't going to be helping against artillery in the rear. I could switch the horse artillery to target the 102nd, but I need to revisit the expected cohesion there. I will look into it tomorrow.
I'm planning to charge them with our second cavalry unit, so I don't think shooting them adds anything to the equation. If they stay, the incoming charge is guaranteed to route them [-1 cohesion to cav charges, even without casulties]. If they move, we can certainly rout them if they move out of the protective tile. Either way, a lucky roll against the halflings would be more impactful.
If they rout due to shooting, they are unable to Ready Fire on our cavalry, because shooting orders happen before move orders. This is why I would like to shoot them, I expect them to Ready Fire.
Also, if we rout them during the shooting phase they cause Cohesion damage to both halfling units. That may not be the case if they rout due to a cavalry charge, since the units have moved by then.
If they rout due to shooting, they are unable to Ready Fire on our cavalry, because shooting orders happen before move orders. This is why I would like to shoot them, I expect them to Ready Fire.
Returning to this conversation, any artillery shot on the 100th has a really high chance of being wasted and doing zero damage. I have calculated the chances before and they aren't great. A normal shoot has a 51% chance of inflicting no cohesion damage, wasting it. I refuse to put the 10th on it for obvious reasons. By comparison, the ready fire order you are worrying about has only a 48% chance of dealing 3 cohesion damage, which is nowhere near the amount needed to repulse the charge of the 10 cohesion 108th. The 108th can take damage, this shot is better used to increase our odds against the 14th Jäg, where it's less likely to be wasted.
I have calculated the chances before and they aren't great. A normal shoot has a 51% chance of inflicting no cohesion damage, wasting it. I refuse to put the 10th on it for obvious reasons.
Hmm, I am not doubting you, but could you explain how you calculated this? Both the 100th and the 14th are in medium range of our 31st arillery, right? But the 14th are halflings and thus more resistant to artillery shots. So I do not understand how there is a better chance to hurt the 14th than the 100th?
You mean the 100th, right? 102nd is well out of range.
Hmm, I am not doubting you, but could you explain how you calculated this? Both the 100th and the 14th are in medium range of our 31st arillery, right? But the 14th are halflings and thus more resistant to artillery shots. So I do not understand how there is a better chance to hurt the 14th than the 100th?
