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Alchemical Solutions [Worm/Exalted] Thread 18: Ravaging Rapscallions Rapidly Regret Regular Rampages

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uju32 said:
Slate is not needed for Shatterbird, and can't stop Shatterbird from attacking from outside his range.
Send Bladedancer; the woman who controls clouds of blades and can sense through them should have a ball against the villain who shatters glass into lots of blades, and Weaver almost certainly built her some new spidersilk underarmor in the last week.

Also, Jack is armed with a knife.
So if he enters her range, she disarms or cripples him into retreating.
Ditto any drone with a bladed weapon.
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The reason why I decided to use Narwhal instead of Bladedancer is because I'm concerned about Jack's ability to slash us from beyond Kali's range. Narwhal protects against that, and she also circumvents the issue of reaction time if Jack goes for a teleport backstab.

The other issue, which I've mentioned before, is that we don't want to counter them too hard or else he'll cut his loses and run. We don't want that - we want to give him the illusion of a chance, keep him occupied while we eliminate his most dangerous teammates. This is also the best opportunity we have for stumbling onto his Thinker power; Taylor is perceptive enough (and has the bullshit magic) to notice that Jack isn't reacting to the sniper teams like he is to MM despite the similarity of their actions. The longer we keep him there the better the chance we have of Taylor figuring that out.

If people think it's absolutely vital that Kali be there we can swap her with Narwhal; Narwhal doesn't softcounter Mannequin like Kali does, but she does give them a bigger margin of error for dealing with Bakuda.
 
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Possible concern that may or may not have been brought up already: IIRC, Mannequin can and does change his loadout to suit the situation. There's at least a decent chance he's done that here and isn't as vulnerable to Bladedancer.
 
Scify said:
Possible concern that may or may not have been brought up already: IIRC, Mannequin can and does change his loadout to suit the situation. There's at least a decent chance he's done that here and isn't as vulnerable to Bladedancer.
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That's a good point. Hmm. Of course, that begs the question of what he's replaced them with. Probably not blunt weapons as that'd take up too much space. Needles and other puncturing weapons then. Not sure if that qualifies as being edged, as the points are obviously quite sharp.

Still, not something I'd want to bet on. I'll make the adjustments to the list.
 
I still like Narwhal backing up the Wyld Hunt - authority, able to defend the team, able to kill quick enough to take out a teleporter like Burnscar. Also, she is not PRT so she'll use her own judgement about saving Uzu rather than toeing the "treat her as dead" line.

Bladedancer vs Shatterbird is a good match. Only thing is Marrow needs a partner who can keep up with her to have her perfect defense available - does anyone else fit the bill like Kali? The main value of Kali at the Castle is taking away the bad guy's offence which is great for keeping the Kings and our PRT guys in play. How about if we pair a Dragon suit with FPoP? Bladedancer can back up Chevalier at the Castle and with an adamant blade she can get a kill on Shatterbird (I don't hold out much hope of turning her armour against her) and she's better armoured than Hannah so she can use volume of fire directly rather than mortar rounds. That frees up Miss Militia for one of the other fights.

Kali and Robert are both Protectorate but they do know Tatsu personally so they'll avoid killing the girl if they can.

We could send MM to the Hospital because she's probably better vs hordes than she would be vs Mannequin and Bakuda.
 
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So, thought on how best to ensure that we rescue both Uzu and Tatsu - it's actually kind of obvious, if you think of it.

1. As seems to be the current plan, have all of Wyld Hunt + Kid Win + whoever dealing w/ Bonesaw and Burnscar.
2. Capture Bonesaw. Kid Win can prevent her from teleporting away. Have Maestro hijack her if possible.
3. Have him use Bonesaw's control of her altered victims prevent Jack from teleporting away. (also rescue the other controlled victims and stop the zombies, I guess) In fact, we could forcibly teleport him into a PRT cell, if the twins have ever been to the cells in PRT headquarters.

A stunt for this wouldn't be amiss.
 
FunkyEntropy said:
The reason why I decided to use Narwhal instead of Bladedancer is because I'm concerned about Jack's ability to slash us from beyond Kali's range. Narwhal protects against that, and she also circumvents the issue of reaction time if Jack goes for a teleport backstab.
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Send Narwhal and Bladedancer to the Street King place; defence and offense.
Send Miss Militia to the PRT HQ; her ability to change her loadout instantly makes her a very good match against Mannequin.
A little squishy against drones, but without a teleporter, the drones have to come from the front, and she can EMP them.

FunkyEntropy said:
The other issue, which I've mentioned before, is that we don't want to counter them too hard or else he'll cut his loses and run. We don't want that - we want to give him the illusion of a chance, keep him occupied while we eliminate his most dangerous teammates. This is also the best opportunity we have for stumbling onto his Thinker power; Taylor is perceptive enough (and has the bullshit magic) to notice that Jack isn't reacting to the sniper teams like he is to MM despite the similarity of their actions. The longer we keep him there the better the chance we have of Taylor figuring that out.
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This is a concern, but remember: this is Jack in all his hubristic glory.

He has spent a week prepping, he still has captives in the base, one Mastered-AI Bezalel as a tool, a captive teleporter, two healers, drones and possibly stockpiles of Bakuda bombs.
And he's never had problems recruiting back up.
Dude didn't cut and run after losing Crawler and Mannequin in canon, after all; he just considers it a new challenge.
 
landcollector said:
Are you sure? Didn't he leave BB shortly after that in canon?
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He left when he was bored/out of things to do, not because he was scared.

Note that even if we manage a clean sweep on his deployed capes?
Dude will still have at least one Dragon-lite Tinker(Bezalel), multiple controlled capes(most of those young people on TV were probably parahuman), multiple drones, and as much firepower as he had when he hit canon BB.
He isn't likely to think of himself as losing.

The Slaughterhouse Nine has been a thing for almost thirty years, and the membership has changed pretty regularly.
Even the most powerful members (Gray Boy, Harbinger) have died or left.
Only Jack is constant.
I do not expect losing a bunch of people to trouble him too much.

Hell, he EXPECTS to lose people, having come to a major American capehub with major capes, and having the Triumvirate take the field against him.
 
Enjou said:
So, thought on how best to ensure that we rescue both Uzu and Tatsu - it's actually kind of obvious, if you think of it.

1. As seems to be the current plan, have all of Wyld Hunt + Kid Win + whoever dealing w/ Bonesaw and Burnscar.
2. Capture Bonesaw. Kid Win can prevent her from teleporting away. Have Maestro hijack her if possible.
3. Have him use Bonesaw's control of her altered victims prevent Jack from teleporting away. (also rescue the other controlled victims and stop the zombies, I guess) In fact, we could forcibly teleport him into a PRT cell, if the twins have ever been to the cells in PRT headquarters.

A stunt for this wouldn't be amiss.
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I'm not sure if we can use Bonesaw to alter one teen's power usage to mess with the other, so I doubt we could hijack Jack's teleporter.

However, securing one of the teens does make things a lot easier because we can trap the hidey hole dimension with, say, a bunch of PRT containment foam troopers/turrets. At that point it's just a matter of knocking out the other teen to force the automatic unconscious teleport. If the teens can also teleport to each other's location (which I think they can do but I don't recall for sure) we can get the drop on him at any point...although this means Jack has access to the same trick - something to be on guard for.

uju32 said:
Send Narwhal and Bladedancer to the Street King place; defence and offense.
Send Miss Militia to the PRT HQ; her ability to change her loadout instantly makes her a very good match against Mannequin.
A little squishy against drones, but without a teleporter, the drones have to come from the front, and she can EMP them.
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The reason I want MM at Street King is because of her ability to help keep the area of drone-free. The faster the area gets cleared the sooner we can deploy Who for recon/spotting. I also want her there because of her skills in diplomacy. She's got a well-deserved reputation, which will help us keep the two gangs in line.

It's just not a good trade IMO. The increase in defense isn't worth the loss of a faster drone clear and better diplomacy.

uju32 said:
This is a concern, but remember: this is Jack in all his hubristic glory.

He has spent a week prepping, he still has captives in the base, one Mastered-AI Bezalel as a tool, a captive teleporter, two healers, drones and possibly stockpiles of Bakuda bombs.
And he's never had problems recruiting back up.
Dude didn't cut and run after losing Crawler and Mannequin in canon, after all; he just considers it a new challenge.
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In canon Jack didn't have access to a teleporter and a healbot station; his options are much more open this time around. Teleport Hit and Run is a viable tactic and we don't want to encourage its use.
 
uju32 said:
Nope.
Leet regularly picks on people as part of his webshow.
There is a distinct difference between the threat levels in beating up a prostitute in a GTA re-enactment, and Armsmaster picking fights with Hookwolf and Lung.
His threat rating was very low for a reason; Squealer got in more consequential fights.

As for other Tinkers?
They regularly build and adapt new gear and give it out for use, fulfilling the "new data" part of their shard contract.
Leet did not.
Add to that the fact that it was explicitly stated that his shard was faulty, and you can see why his shard was trying to get him ganked.
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Considering that he was totally willing to get into a brawl with the undersiders? (unless Bakuda had him bombed?) then I think he has more cape fights under his belt than just that.


How do you expect his little "beat up hookers" game ended, anyway?

someone stopped him, and I doubt it was the police.

Didn't he have several arrests under his belt? He's not a non-combatant.

And the thing about production tinkers (people who don't fight at all) gaining data by building and selling stuff doesn't make a lot of sense when you consider that Leet builds something completely new every time he does anything.
 
FunkyEntropy said:
I'm not sure if we can use Bonesaw to alter one teen's power usage to mess with the other, so I doubt we could hijack Jack's teleporter.
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No, I mean that Bonesaw put in the control implants, so she might have remote control over the twins and all the other people she's made into puppets. Control of Bonesaw = control of her puppets, at least hypothetically. At the very least, she could be forced to relay a voice command over speakers that we conveniently placed in the other battlegrounds to get the other puppets there to stop.

Once Maestro has Bonesaw under control, he just has her send whatever orders he wants to the puppets. It's actually narratively ironic, a puppetmaster taking control of another puppetmaster, so it makes for a great stunt. It's puppetception!
 
FunkyEntropy said:
I'm not sure if we can use Bonesaw to alter one teen's power usage to mess with the other, so I doubt we could hijack Jack's teleporter.

However, securing one of the teens does make things a lot easier because we can trap the hidey hole dimension with, say, a bunch of PRT containment foam troopers/turrets. At that point it's just a matter of knocking out the other teen to force the automatic unconscious teleport. If the teens can also teleport to each other's location (which I think they can do but I don't recall for sure) we can get the drop on him at any point...although this means Jack has access to the same trick - something to be on guard for.
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If we can capture Bonesaw/Uzu and PRT forces snipe Jack (without aiming for Tatsu, include that in stunt) then we're golden.

The reason I want MM at Street King is because of her ability to help keep the area of drone-free. The faster the area gets cleared the sooner we can deploy Who for recon/spotting. I also want her there because of her skills in diplomacy. She's got a well-deserved reputation, which will help us keep the two gangs in line.

It's just not a good trade IMO. The increase in defense isn't worth the loss of a faster drone clear and better diplomacy.
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Isn't Narwhal the head of the Guild? She'd have to be a good leader in and out of the field, and have quite the reputation.

Bladedancer increases defense and the need for Jack to dodge (he's still going to dodge) and keeps Shatterbird on her toes. And shields, blades, and PRT forces (not the snipers) can take out the drones.

Bladedancer is also less squishy than MM. But you could keep MM as well and swap out Weld to somewhere else. MM could stick with troops/gangs to take out drones. Or Weld could do so. The one (or both) that isn't fighting Jack can be put elsewhere.

I'll post my own revision of a roster later. But I think we should have Alexandria AND Legend against Siberian and Crawler.

I'm not sure about splitting up any of the Wyld Hunt. But Clockblocker and Skein would have some great synergy (not sure where to put them, though).
 
I'm gonna get started on stunts as unless something truly remarkable comes up I think what we've got is good enough.

Enjou said:
No, I mean that Bonesaw put in the control implants, so she might have remote control over the twins and all the other people she's made into puppets. Control of Bonesaw = control of her puppets, at least hypothetically. At the very least, she could be forced to relay a voice command over speakers that we conveniently placed in the other battlegrounds to get the other puppets there to stop.

Once Maestro has Bonesaw under control, he just has her send whatever orders he wants to the puppets. It's actually narratively ironic, a puppetmaster taking control of another puppetmaster, so it makes for a great stunt. It's puppetception!
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Hmm. Good idea. I'm not going to count on it because Bonesaw might have altered her nervous system enough that Maestro would be unable to hijack her, but if he can that's something we should follow up on.

spudman said:
Isn't Narwhal the head of the Guild? She'd have to be a good leader in and out of the field, and have quite the reputation.

Bladedancer increases defense and the need for Jack to dodge (he's still going to dodge) and keeps Shatterbird on her toes. And shields, blades, and PRT forces (not the snipers) can take out the drones.

Bladedancer is also less squishy than MM. But you could keep MM as well and swap out Weld to somewhere else. MM could stick with troops/gangs to take out drones. Or Weld could do so. The one (or both) that isn't fighting Jack can be put elsewhere.

I'll post my own revision of a roster later. But I think we should have Alexandria AND Legend against Siberian and Crawler.

I'm not sure about splitting up any of the Wyld Hunt. But Clockblocker and Skein would have some great synergy (not sure where to put them, though).
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Good point about Narwhal probably having a good reputation and leadership skills.

Meh. I think what I've got is good enough and fussing over this loadout further takes away time that could be better used crafting stunts and free actions.
 
Weld is optimal for Boulder Builders. He's completely immune to all of Bonesaw and Burnscar's bullshit, so he can basically do a Terminator and retrieve Bonesaw regardless of all opposition, IF she can't teleport.
 
Enjou said:
Possible, but so long as the alterations aren't on the brain Wyld can change them.
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Good point. This is an option we should definitely exploit once she's in our custody.

veekie said:
Weld is optimal for Boulder Builders. He's completely immune to all of Bonesaw and Burnscar's bullshit, so he can basically do a Terminator and retrieve Bonesaw regardless of all opposition, IF she can't teleport.
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I like this a lot (this was my original plan but I traded him out because I felt I needed to buff up other areas), and this gives us significantly more margin of error. But who do we replace him with at the JS&SB party? I'm open to suggestions.
 
FunkyEntropy said:
The reason I want MM at Street King is because of her ability to help keep the area of drone-free. The faster the area gets cleared the sooner we can deploy Who for recon/spotting. I also want her there because of her skills in diplomacy. She's got a well-deserved reputation, which will help us keep the two gangs in line.
It's just not a good trade IMO. The increase in defense isn't worth the loss of a faster drone clear and better diplomacy.
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Narhwal has at least as good a reputation.
And Bladedancer is actually a Philly cape to boot, and thus knows who to talk to.

As for wrecking drones, Narwhal is explicitly not-Manton limited.
Wrecking drones should be a breeze when you can introduce delicate electronic internals to forcefields.
FunkyEntropy said:
In canon Jack didn't have access to a teleporter and a healbot station; his options are much more open this time around. Teleport Hit and Run is a viable tactic and we don't want to encourage its use.
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Teleport Hit and Run is already on the table; that's what Bonesaw tried to pull on Wyld.
Mass destruction is not his style anyway.

Besides, Kid Win built us a Dimensional Anchor.
Give us an evening, and we can duplicate it, at which point we can deny more than one point to him.
And remember,once we can secure one of the Twins, he has to worry about going through the dimension and running into an ambush.
It becomes a stand-off.
 
uju32 said:
Narhwal has at least as good a reputation.
And Bladedancer is actually a Philly cape to boot, and thus knows who to talk to.

As for wrecking drones, Narwhal is explicitly not-Manton limited.
Wrecking drones should be a breeze when you can introduce delicate electronic internals to forcefields.
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Don't forget her original use of her power before her second trigger, super sharp forcefields flying at iirc 60 miles an hour do a LOT of damage.
 
Possible stunt for sniping Jack:

PRT Officer Sasha Freeman couldn't believe her luck. Eight years she'd waited for this chance. Weaver had ordered sniper teams into position to take out Jack Slash without killing the mutilated Ward, and now she had a clear shot. She took the tinkertech round she'd smuggled out of evidence and loaded it into her rifle. "This is for my brother."


If we want to make a PRT officer snipe Jack, then we increase the narrative by naming her and giving her motive beyond the job. Vengeance is suitable for that, given how long Jack's been killing people.
 
Rearranged character spread:
[ ] Docks Shelter: Marrow, Weaver, Legend, Chevalier
-[ ] Stunt: Bolts of light leaving odd afterimages rain down upon Crawler as Vajra battles the giant parahuman, swinging around a pillar to pierce deeply into a joint with an earthshaking crunch. Crawler's mobility gradually eroded by his very own defense. The swarm reforms even as Siberian rips through yet another decoy, pointing the way to more stragglers for Chevalier to 'rescue'.

While Alexandria would LIKE to be here, with Siberian on site her main ability isn't useful, and if she's pinned down with wrestling Crawler(who's going to ignore any damage she does), she can't deal with Siberian. She's better elsewhere.
Legend is here to both take out Manton and maim Crawler systematically. With IEU he can handle the action easily.
Chevalier meanwhile will be combing through the civilians find the parahuman hiding in them, as well as suppressing the drones.


[ ] Street King Castle: Bladedancer, Bulldozer,
-[ ] Stunt: <includes PRT snipers>

The main thing here is Bladedancer taking down Shatterbird and PRT snipers backing her up. Bulldozer is the only one available who's tough enough to handle Jack and Shatterbird who's not Alexandria(who'd kill our Twin backpack) or Weld(who's WAY better used against Bonesaw)

[ ] Boulder Builder Mountain: Wyld, Slate, Maestro, Feral, Skein, Inquisition, Weld, Kid Win, Who/Suzy
-[ ] Stunt:

The full Wyld Hunt will be in action here, and needs little command or support as a complete team. Weld adds melee power that ignores disease and fires, making him ideal for bringing Bonesaw in, as she's basically just a little girl where he's concerned. Kid Win would be shutting down the teleport.
Who is on site to take advantage of Slate's darkness and to provide a liason between Wyld Hunt and the on site Wards. She's also one of the better options for taking out Burnscar by surprise as she's in a fire resistant spidersilk suit, and there aren't many ways to pin down a teleporter.

[ ] PRT Downtown Headquarters: Narwhal, Clockblocker, Alexandria, Willow
-[ ] Stunt: <stunt Surprise Grass Willow on Bakuda>

There is already a lot of firepower on site, so what is needed is defense(Narwhal and Alexandria), and nonlethal stopping power on Bakuda. Someone pointed out that this area is quite heavy in greenery, so Willow can get in close by surprise, and Clockblocker meanwhile is both an absolute defense and a takedown method.

[X] Philadelphia General Hospital: Miss Militia, Gallant, Gully
-[ ] Stunt: <stunt in preconstructed barricades>

Gallant to do IFF on zombies,
Gully, as a Shaker, is well suited to countering large numbers of drones and raising terrain barriers as well to contain any breach.
Miss Militia is civilian liason, experience, and a whole lot of dakka. Not to mention she's just as good at close combat as ranged when it's just drones and zombies.

Reserve: Gust(w/ IEU)
He'd act as high altitude artillery, and oversight(remember he has senses capable of picking up everything in the city when up in the sky, but lacks the mental capacity to process more than one location at a time. Add IEU and send him skywards with a stunt and he can locate Hatchet Face and blast the bastard immediately..
 
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I think I've found room for Weld for the BBM team. Swapping MM with Narwhal frees up Weld since Bladedancer and Narwhal are a really tough nut to crack. They might have some difficulty if Hatchet Face shows up, but because neither of them is a Brute he's unlikely to show up there because his entire MO is to stalk and ambush Brutes; having both Legend and Gust available to respond to emergencies means this is less of a concern than it might seem because LEGEND INTERRUPT.

I'm open to trading Bulldozer for Clockblocker if people are too concerned about Crawler getting lucky, but I'd like to point out that I have extreme reservations about this because it means the Hospital team is going to have a much more difficult time taking out drones because all three of its members would be relatively squishy and they wouldn't have an easy means of taking out drones (timestopped threads are a static defense).

On the Second Day of Slaughter: (Effectively 5 write-in votes, with ONE Stunt allowed for each!)
[ ] Docks Shelter: Alexandria, Clockblocker, Marrow, Weaver
[ ] Street King Castle: Bladedancer, Narwhal, Who
[ ] Boulder Builder Mountain: Feral, Inquisition, Kid Win, Maestro, Slate, Weld, Willow, Wyld
[ ] PRT Downtown Headquarters: Chevalier, Gully, Miss Militia
[ ] Philadelphia General Hospital: Bulldozer, Gallant, Skein
veekie said:
[ ] Street King Castle: Bladedancer, Bulldozer,
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Terrible idea because, as I've mentioned many times, Bulldozer is vulnerable to Broadcast shard diplomacy due to his current doubts RE: Marrow and I don't want to count on Bladedancer being able to convince him otherwise.
 
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