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A Simple Transaction I

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Conjured Blade said:
Yeah. We exploited it relentlessly and took a boatload of stupid risks to grow as fast as we did.
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I'm pretty sure considering this, what Rihaku seems to have expected, etc it is impossible to outscale apocryphal to a meaningful degree for more than a couple activations in a row - it's escalation is tied to Hunger's growth. It just has a minimum speed that you must maintain or else.

I mean it threw a fucking armament after us 2 months in! Most cursebearers would have just had to immediately surrender, not having anywhere near the power needed to stand up to one. (We barely did.)
 
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Byzantine said:
I'm pretty sure considering this, what Rihaku seems to have expected, etc it is impossible to outscale apocryphal to a meaningful degree for more than a couple activations in a row - it's escalation is tied to Hunger's growth. It just has a minimum speed that you must maintain or else.
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So the question that follows is how to grow that fast in a sustainable fashion without grievous personal risk.

Magical Wealth generation powers to feed our cloak/signs. (We've got using our essence to mythologize mundane platinum, but other options were and are Daylian, Blood Sorcery, and the Founts of Myth should they be restarted. When we see Haeliel again if we get Ordinalism Tutoring for us, go for Earth/Metal Elementalism to true create mundane plat. Or maybe encourage Gisena to Earth/Metal Elementalism if we can otherwise).

Ludicrous Advancement speed for Grace Creation/Edeldross self improvement loops boosting all stats, taken even further beyond by Aobaru stat buffs and Haeliel's favor(Philosophers Wreath/Edeldross)

The Praxis(Possibly with TSH)

That's what we've got right now as a mix of potential/current options that I'm aware exist.
 
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Conjured Blade said:
Hunger Started out with a 20% Edeldross stats Buff. The 2 pick training session where he got Edeldross Adept gave him an additional 10%. Silver of Evening doubled that to 60% percent and doubled the magnitude of future Edeldross enhancements. How much magnitude training with a 3840% Advancement speed buff do we need to get an additional 48 percent Edeldross enhancement?
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We'd have to get 40000% Edeldross advancement speed for Grace development to reach the same advancement speed that Accretion has from fights, we'd probably also have to invest a large amount of arete by upgrading it to Elixirdross and to unlock the Elixerdross version of True Quintessence for it to be worth improving over Accretion, which is slightly above the level of the Noble Praxis because of TSH.
 
TooSlow said:
We'd have to get 40000% Edeldross advancement speed for Grace development to reach the same advancement speed that Accretion has from fights
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Source? What are you extrapolating from to get that number?

We already know that the Forbear's blade +Hunger is a 15x-27x base XP multiplier depending on thread participation. 15x worst case no participation bonus.

Forbears blade is an Accretion artifact therefore any advancement speed buffs like TSH Accretion should have been factored in to that statement.

Also I'm completely open to cashing out by getting Elixirdross at some point if getting Elixirdross turns up in the training process. It'll upgrade all the Edeldross Graces we got simultaneously after all.

Edit:Also PW's upgrade to Edeldross versatility would let us get a lot more Graces.
Edit: PW also means stronger graces

Edit: @TooSlow I've got more material. Edeldross is an extension of Accretion by virtue of Silver of Evening. And if you really want to Arete pinch. Those PW Graces would also work in Total Eclipse. We've got it for 24 Arete.
 
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Artemisinin doesn't apply to your current A Hunger Sated proc, as Hunger slew the Armament Fish before Gisena defeated Augustine.
 
[X] The Ring of Power: Crimson Flare

Eh the more I think about it the more i think we can creatively use blood casting. Opens up more options for us, also blood casting is just really cool.
 
I do have to argue for King of Winter here since back in the survey I made in what feels like an eternity ago, most were overwhelmingly in favor of leaving the Voyaging Realm and going into the Human Sphere. And while Crimson Flare certainly strengthens Niefel and our companions quite a bit, it does not compare to the convenience of protecting them from the Apocryphal Curse, quelling the Arcanist Shard and completely reverse their decay by restoring the Font of Myth when it comes to having our focus remain in the Human Sphere and not be distracted by a crisis at the worst possible moment; an near inevitability when dealing with the Apocryphal Curse. King of Winter makes this whole Niefel plot basically done, and if you are not voting for it you must accept we will be called to it's at a likely extremely inconvenient time. Just keep that in your minds, okay?
 
[X] The Tears of Winter: King of Winter

If there's anything I've learned from video games, it's that percent based damage reduction is always broken.
 
I mean, on a meta-level I actually wouldn't be surprised if Crimson Flare wins because it's actually fitting with the sort of min-max ambitious playstyle the overall thread is known to go for.

From that perspective, Potential future troubles in Nilfel would just be seen as Pick opportunities or dramatic/moral conflicts that presents a crucible/trial for the story, with all the risks entailed. We chose to fight an fully powered Armament head-on knowing the possibility of dying, after all.

So yeah, while I really like King of Winter for its Aesthetic, Comfiness and the fitting Narrative conclusion, I think either option winning is fair and aligned with the thread's underlying priorities.
 
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Adhoc vote count started by Resonant on Nov 24, 2020 at 7:43 PM, finished with 435 posts and 75 votes.
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Birdsie said:
Rules for Upgrading Spells
Basic Magic: Per upgrade level, +1 SP cost. (1st Upgrade: 1 SP. 2nd Upgrade: 2 SP. 3rd Upgrade: 3 SP. 4th Upgrade: 4 SP.)
Intermediate Magic: Per upgrade level, +1 SP cost. Every two levels, +1 SP cost. (1st Upgrade: 2 SP. 2nd Upgrade: 4 SP. 3rd Upgrade: 5 SP. 4th Upgrade: 7 SP.)
Advanced Magic: Per upgrade level, +2 SP cost. (1st Upgrade: 4 SP. 2nd Upgrade: 6 SP. 3rd Upgrade: 8 SP. 4th Upgrade: 10 SP.)
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Hm... With Advanced Magic unlocked, does Kazuma have access to effects such as Flight or Invisibility? How much would they cost?

Are Advanced Magics practical indoors? It seems like most of them have widely destructive AoEs. Would Kazuma be able to use Lightning Strike or Tornado in a dungeon, for example? If so, it may be worth it to all-in upgrade a single Advanced Magic to lower its cost and improve it versatility. We can upgrade a spell four times, which would result in ~80% cost, ~80% casting speed and ~120% power and versatility.
 
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Discord said:
[6:51 PM] R': No, Taskrabbit is right
[6:51 PM] R': it reduces all incoming damage by 75% unless that damage has the ability to penetrate damage resistance
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So, uh. King of Winter is even better than I previously assumed. Guys, let's not ignore the opportunity to literally cut the majority of incoming damage to a quarter.
 
Conjured Blade said:
If it's King of Winter it's 50 percent health/damage resistance/condition resistance/attack speed. And 83 percent more damage dealt.

They'll be hardier and better at fighting but they won't be smarter.
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That's assuming we don't get any further blood advancements, which seems unlikely. I really do want to pick up Honing and Exalted Spirit at some point, along with Opalescence.
 
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