Esquestria: The House of the Sun - A pony cultist experience

Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
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Dear reader! Whether you are new here, archive-reading and whatnot, or you are already someone who has been with us for quite a while, I would like to say a few words that I believe are best kept close to mind.

-This is an MLP quest. And more importantly, none of us are gratuitously cruel. So good things will happen on this quest, and I hope that enough good things have already happened to prove that.
-This is also a horror quest, so bad things will happen. Bad things might happen to good characters if you are not able to protect them, and you most certainly will not be able to intervene if you lack the tools to do so.
-And finally, this is a quest in which you jostle with powers greater than yourself, with all that it entails.

Please, do keep those things in mind as you go forward. But ultimately, this is also a quest in which it is hoped we all have fun! So if any of the above points is not exactly your cup of tea, or somehow make the experience as a whole "not worth it", then this quest might not be for you. Which is fine! Individual tastes are a thing, so don't think any more about it if you don't want to read anymore. And regardless, I hope you have a lovely day!

Kaelor said:
PSA for whoever needs to hear it:

Readers should take their own mental health into consideration when voting and not subject themselves to triggering narrative elements like rape or constant mental torture of a friend just for the Greatest Good of a world that doesn't exist.

If those are fine for you or Regrettable is even more triggering, then GREAT! More power to you. But you aren't a bad or selfish person for picking the option that keeps the characters you've emotionally connected with safe. [REDACTED for spoiler warning]

This is a high intensity quest that doesn't hold back when it comes to horror and negative consequences. Take care of yourself.
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(Quote slightly edited to avoid spoilers)
 
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Glau said:
I will absolutely get it. But then my motive is spite, and as you mention later, that gets satisfied regardless of anything else.

The master has done quite enough to be worth spiting even at an overall loss.

With luck and a very brutal, public death it will cause some of the other occultists to re-evalute whether they really want to fuck with us.
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I hope you will. I won't, I am not motivated by spite, really, but I genuinely hope you will.

It's just I don't believe it.

...Well, I am quite certain the last part won't be right, about "re-evalute". Velvet does not share stories of her RAs, we know that. Maybe people will learn that the Master is dead, but I doubt even that. For most, he is simply gone, and he will stay gone.

Maybe Comet is going to suspect something, but "seed never bloomed" or "we simply don't notice" are far more likely explanations.
 
Starlit Horizon said:
...Beside, let us be real: if people thought that Offer was that simple, and then Bird suddenly showed us how it actually is - that would be far more scummy.

And I do believe Offer was this shitty originally, it's not it has reason not to suck. It is just an option that is fun to write for Bird (enough to write it), even if it sucks.
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Yeah, Offer ended being only a little bit worse than even I expected, as I never thought she would keep us in a dark box until it was time to run our actions, just play with us like a cat with a mouse. But taking all our resources, giving us orders, threatening our family, it was pretty spot on. I was even going to write another vignette based on how I thought it would turn out.
 
Starlit Horizon said:
If you have any expectation of satisfaction, pride, or anything else, I believe you won't get it. The Master death will feel sad - somehow - character reactions will feel sad, Cadance's reaction specifically will feel sad. The event will haunt Velvet together, and in another month (judging by how we felt after the Door vote), we feel regretful and won't consider it "worth it" anymore.
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Oh, I fully expect Bird to make it a sad affair. But frankly, everything we've learned about the Master both IC and OOC has pretty much convinced me that there can be no other way (other than her death via a drawn out conflict in the Banish route imo). She/He needs to die. If this update proves anything its that His/Her lust for power, be it the temporal or eldritch, regardless of the broken remains left in His/Her tracks knows no bounds. An acceptable compromise is impossible because we are too weak to enforce one. And by the time we might be strong enough to do so the Master will have set himself/herself up to be unassailable.

Part of me is sad that it has to be this way and wonders what He/She would have been like if we hadn't picked Him/Her as our starting master.

Just like how part of me had some hopes that 'Accept' could maybe lead to a Master changed by either Cadance, Harmony or both. But giving everything we know and Bird has emphasised, that's pretty much wishfull thinking. Earning time in return for even more collateral damage when we do have to deal with the new Prince.

In the end, there can be no finality but battle.
 
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[X] Accept her offer.

I think Accept is the better option, as horrible as it is, but I'm willing to accept Regrettable Things. I'll see if Accept gets any higher and might consider dropping Kill if it's close, but the one thing I absolutely would loathe is Offer Yourself.

e: Checked the vote count and switched to Accept.
 
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zxzx24 said:
Maybe. But no.

Velvet has also striven tirelessly to do what is "right" and to make the world a better place.

Not always. But plenty of times.

Look at how desperately we have tried to aid Twilight.
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oh, but what makes Twilight worth of our extra effort and sacrifices to try and help, compared to all the other thousands upon thousands of suffering ponies in Equestria?

It's the fact she was our friend, and that she was hurt as an indirect consequence of our choices.

It's a good action our part... but we're NOT helping a lot more people...

aspirant said:
I'm definitely leaving if Accept wins. The fact that it's currently winning kind of makes me question if this is the community for me.
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eh, if that's how you feel about it.

I hate the "Offer Yourself" vote, but I'll still be around if that one wins, because I like how Bird writes the story.

OH, I'M FINALLY AT THE THREADMARK! LET'S SEE...

BirdBodhisattva said:
Finally, think of the other factors you know.
You know from the options that Shining (ergo, a possession host) can "wake up" at some point, and become a prisoner of their own flesh.
You know from his words, speaking of the "Accept" ritual, that he can "keep the target asleep" if he wants.
Why wouldn't he be able to do that to YOU? What makes you special?

The correct answer is that you are not special. Plain and simple.
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how most people who voted for Offer Yourself are likely reacting to this:



BirdBodhisattva said:
There is every possibility that, if Velvet is possessed, her life will become a constant repetition of blackouts, followed by short periods of conscience where Velvet will scramble to perform her 3 APs worth of actions.
Because the Master, based on all the evidence we have, will be able to do whatever he wants. The Master can turn you into a homeless beggar inside the city of your own mind.
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wow.

I definitely do NOT want to play that. and I was already against this action above all others!

BirdBodhisattva said:
Some of you are thinking that "Bird would never give us an option where Velvet's family is hurt, consequently the Master will never have the opportunity to hurt Velvet's family".

But that is wrong. The way I see it is:

"VELVET will never allowed her family to be hurt. So she will do whatever she can, in her power, to protect them".

And the possession option is the intentional stripping away of your power.

So think it this way. You come back to conscience after god knows how long. You realize you cannot control your body, and that the Master is making you look at a mirror. You realize it is night, and that you are in your room, and that your husband who you have not hugged in oh so long is right there out of reach peacefully sleeping on your bed.

The Master then tells you he just woke you up to ask for something real quick.

"Baldomare annoys me. Give me her bindings so I can pass them on to Windy."

What happens if you answer no? Easy.

"Oh, that wasn't a request. Do that, or I break one of your daughter's legs. In fact, I will break her right hindleg just so she looks a bit more like you."

You think that wouldn't happen because "QM will keep Velvet's family sake". But you are wrong. That won't happen because VELVET will keep her family safe.

And Velvet will do it by obeying the Master, no questions asked. She will give up those bindings faster than you could think, and I wouldn't even open a vote for that.
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...

@BirdBodhisattva how is this even an option? What possible advantage can Velvet IC see to picking this course of action?!

I thought the WORST of this option, and this is even worse than my worst estimates!

Glau said:
Copper. She was a friend, he pushed her into trying to kill us.
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to be fair she already hated us. I think there might have been an implication of wolf nudging her to hate us too? Or am I misremembering?






aaand I'll stop here and catch up on the rest tomorrow
 
Fireiy said:
Predictable. Three way neck and neck tie, two of them for avoiding accepting and Bird comes out with a post elaborating on all the horrible possible consequences of the non-regrettable action. Whoops, there it goes tumbling down to a firm third place and the regrettable action jumps up to a clear lead.
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Do the horrors of accept or Regret need elaborated on?

And he did elaborate on the horrors of accept. Describing the rape very succinctly. As people were not aware of that.
 
Dutch said:
Just like how part of me had some hopes that 'Accept' could maybe lead to a Master changed by either Cadance, Harmony or both. But giving everything we know and Bird has emphasised, that's pretty much wishfull thinking. Earning time in return for even more collateral damage when we do have to deal with the new Prince.
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Well, I would say that enforcing a compromise/an acceptable status quo in a position of an Hour is not just wishful thinking, and I don't think Son born out this RA is going to be much better - that is, I think it will be worse - for the majority of Equestria.

Honestly, if we can just get the alicorns together they might be strong enough already. Yes, Cadance is going to love her firstborn, more than her life, but this does not translate to "I will support him into turning Equestria into a hell/taking all light of Harmony for himself/whatever".

Compromise doesn't have to unbreakable to be followed; it just needs to be easier to follow than to break.
 
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I wonder if the Master has some kind of contingency plan in place.

It would make sense if he's planning to leave equestria for years.
 
Against the Wolf

I had been (approval) voting for the Wolf option. I no longer am, for two main reasons:

1) I went back and re-read the Regrettable Action when we destroyed the Tribal Door. I'd really encourage you all to do the same. In my head it's something terrifying but admittedly pretty cool. But reading the update... man, it's just very sad. There is the rage, and the Wolf-word. But there's so much of the Wolf's vileness, and rot, and awfulness. There's so much of Velvet's pain, and suffering. There is "You are going to die", repeated again and again, until we expel a vile creature from our soul. And the conversation with Baldomare afterwards isn't much better.

I can see why I didn't remember it like that. It's a lot more pleasant to remember the badass Mansus-remodeling than to remember the awfulness that suffuses the actual text. But when I re-read it, it was the latter that the update truly focused on.

2) Windy. Something like 6 months ago, he was already hearing the Wolf on the wind (well, on his Gramaphone). He's spent months now exploring that further. He has been working some certainly awful projects, which are undoubtedly nearing completion. I think if we're to give the Wolf another foothold in the Wake, he'll notice, and act.

In my head, the Wolf is likely to be murder. And I think Windy would do just that. The Wedding is tomorrow. I worry if we take the Regrettable Action, we'll wake up to news that Phillydelphia has been buried under a snowstorm and its inhabitants murdered. (Maybe that'd happen on the first day of the Honeymoon. Either way, absolutely awful timing for the Lunar Bureau's Director to have been ignoring her job all month!)

[X] Accept her offer.

Iustus Vitae said:
I do believe you're inflating it in a way. Bird has stated that he fixed the consequences of the Third Son a while back and if he somehow predicted this situation a while back then it's an entirely different thing. But he hasn't and so while the RA will be regrettable saying it's definitely the worst of the bunch is a bit much.
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Did he? Did I miss something?

I know he said he has the Third Son, caused from this action, fully set, yes. But Sons, by their nature, reflect the circumstances of their creation. If we had made Softy an Apostle, after all, that wouldn't have birthed Paranoia!
Fireiy said:
Predictable. Three way neck and neck tie, two of them for avoiding accepting and Bird comes out with a post elaborating on all the horrible possible consequences of the non-regrettable action. Whoops, there it goes tumbling down to a firm third place and the regrettable action jumps up to a clear lead.
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Bird explicitly described why he made the post. Because people had assumptions about how the possession would go, which Velvet knew were unjustified. Like really, he made that very clear. And I think it's very good that he did, because that Character/Voter cohesion is an important thing to maintain. I think reading into it to say that he has a preferred action is an unfair level of mistrust.
 
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zxzx24 said:
I wonder if the Master has some kind of contingency plan in place.

It would make sense if he's planning to leave equestria for years.
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I wouldn't be surprised if the answer is no.

Moth is certainly impulsive enough for that, and I do believe he leaves it (as he believes it) in capable enough hands.

Worst case scenario, if the cult gets cleansed, he can probably fake his death, and then Dim Equestria all by himself, or restart the cult in some other country.

We do know dragons are valid protagonists, and therefore they should be - at least occasionally - be able to climb the Mansus.

If Equestria goes to war to them somehow, then it should dim the world just fine as well.

It just takes a little time, but he is not in rush yet.
 
spiderhellian said:
In my head, the Wolf is likely to be murder. And I think Windy would do just that. The Wedding is tomorrow. I worry if we take the Regrettable Action, we'll wake up to news that Phillydelphia has been buried under a snowstorm and its inhabitants murdered. (Maybe that'd happen on the first day of the Honeymoon. Either way, absolutely awful timing for the Lunar Bureau's Director to have been ignoring her job all month!)
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No.

Our other enemies are going to carry out their plans. Regrettable action or no regrettable action.

If you wished to stop windy Flakes from doing whatever it was he was going to do- you should have pushed for looking into him.
 
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zxzx24 said:
I wonder if the Master has some kind of contingency plan in place.

It would make sense if he's planning to leave equestria for years.
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He does, yes, he explained that. His contingency plan is us, and Copper, and Windy.

We are all playing our own parts, with ample encouragement having been provided and enough momentum behind us that She expects us to keep it going without his presence.

rafuki22 said:
Now who is making assumptions?

Not saying it couldn't happen, but if Windy wants to follow the wolf he is going to do it, regrettable action or not.
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zxzx24 said:
Our other enemies are going to carry out their plans. Regrettable action or no regrettable action.
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Oh I totally agree that Windy is going to be a problem sooner rather than later. I've been warning about that for a while. (Don't forget, he also has the last remnant of the Sun-in-Rags/something similar at the center of the Garden of Lights in/almost in hand!) But for the reasons I explained, I think the Regrettable Action will make him a problem immediately. At a time we'd really rather he wasn't.
 
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spiderhellian said:
I think reading into it to say that he has a preferred action is an unfair level of mistrust.
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No, Bird has made it very clear that he favors the Wolf. He will not hide the fact that the Wolf is always worse, but loves to dangle the option in front of us and is delighted when we take the bait despite having been flat out told that it is the worse option.

Removing all element of choice would ruin that delicious story. The road to hell is paved with good intentions, but there must be a choice as otherwise those intentions never matter. Soft Sweeps was a special exception both in that Bird wanted to have more Wolf influence but thought we had learned the lesson well enough to know never to pick it again, and in that he just wanted to have some extra motivation to start the quest up again.

Bird will not lie, will not pretend that the Wolf is the better option. But he still would prefer us to take it, because he really likes the thematics of the Wolf.
 
To be honest, if I had to guess the name of the Third Son, it would be either Lie or Betrayal.

After all, we did and would be doing in the great act of lying and betrayal.

Likely betrayal, more visceral. Maybe a permanent malus to loyalty to all non-alicorn ponies, with benefit of the Mother that it won't affect any organization or pony we are in change of, or something.

Would suck more than you think at first, because even if the Lunar Bureau won't be affected, Solar Court and Eclipse would be.

Eclipse splinter cells that go occult for the "win", I guess?
 
Glau said:
There is not and never will be enough AP to protect ourselves from all the threats that have been hinted at. We didn't catch this because there were things we needed to do, and there's at least three current things that could bite us I've seen called out in the last few pages. So I'm not too fussed that we made an error in not dealing with the master earlier- there are too many lurking potential problems and nowhere near enough AP for us to deal with anything that isn't an immediate threat.
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I really don't think that's the right lesson to draw. I agree there were clues we missed. I agree that it's not clear what we should have sacrificed on scrying the Master. But:

1) Did we expect the consequence to be this bad? I was expecting a punch in the face, but not to this level. Were you? That's worth taking into account if we plan the same "let them be and tough it out" strategy in the future.

2) If we want to ignore our foes, then we should expect them to punch us in the face. And they don't pull their punches. So we should emphasize actions that make us more resilient, over actions that are good in other ways but leave us vulnerable. I think I know what that looked like for the Wedding. I'm not sure what it looks like for say, next turn's plan. But we should take it into account. (Skipping Fleetings for summons, maybe? Though I don't think we have the cash...)
Greymere said:
We really gotta scry Copper, Starry, and Windy. Or at least Windy. I can't help but get the feeling he's the next ticking time-bomb, considering what his last task was and what the Master said.

(edit: AND WE STILL HAVE TO FIND OUR MANUSCRIPTS GODDAMNIT, that's ALSO a huge problem just waiting to happen to do inaction
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Hey, what did Starry ever do! Even the Master didn't mention her!

Or we can get her as our reward, and that'll be taken care of.
Pittauro said:
It's not THAT much worse than 500 bits mechanically (it just takes more time to give us that many bits).
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I don't really want to relitigate, but ahahahaha I think it's so much worse than 500 bits mechanically. So much worse to not have the capacity and flexibility now.

I mean that seriously. I'm thinking how the "Go to war" plan would look, or a plan to put effort into finding our foes, or a plan to summon defenses... and it's so different to not be bit-bound for the next turn or two. Benefits compound, and so does danger.
 
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There is, I think, nothing I will regret quite as much as rolling over and giving the master what he wants.

I wonder if Windy can unleash another wolf on the world without us taking a regrettable action?

spiderhellian said:
I really don't think that's the right lesson to draw. I agree there were clues we missed. I agree that it's not clear what we should have sacrificed on scrying the Master. But:
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To put it another way, what AP would you sacrifice next turn to deal with Windy, who has been hinted to be being up something nasty, and Discord, who is conspicuously missing and presumably also being up something nasty?

Do we really have any choice except to take the hits as they come?

There's also Starry who might bite us, our father's agenda, Marinette possibly/eventually going rogue, etc.

And picking the wrong one to look into will just be waste.

Personally I'm going to vote to try and befriend Baldomare and DoA and hope that we can deal with punches as they happen.
 
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