Should the world be a Low Fantasy setting?

  • Yes

    Votes: 63 70.0%
  • No

    Votes: 27 30.0%

  • Total voters
    90
  • Poll closed .
[X] [React] Thank Arthryn and her Daughters for the victory. ([MAIN] Venerate the Goddesses)
[X] [Policy] Infrastructure = Focuses on building infrastructure.
[X] [Policy] Study = Takes study actions.

I kinda want study actions as well. We only researched magic once and having technological edge is great.
 
Wouldn't this be playing into Urth's hands?
We go down south we are in a diplo battle against Urth's daughters, who mind you were able to wring away our own vassal from us. Furthermore if we do this then the Maradysh who are loyal and had their belief in southern corruption with given us a huge backlash. They saw half their people just fall to a curruption and killed them for it and now you want to say there is no such thing?
The internal friction is probably what Urth wants. The enemy came north, and they went south, I suggest we stabilize in the mean time bh venerating.
 
Wouldn't this be playing into Urth's hands?
We go down south we are in a diplo battle against Urth's daughters, who mind you were able to wring away our own vassal from us. Furthermore if we do this then the Maradysh who are loyal and had their belief in southern corruption with given us a huge backlash. They saw half their people just fall to a curruption and killed them for it and now you want to say there is no such thing?
The internal friction is probably what Urth wants. The enemy came north, and they went south, I suggest we stabilize in the mean time bh venerating.
There's only been four pages of discussion, it wouldn't be too hard to read it all before commentating.

Here is what Oshha said about the Maradysh:
They wouldn't be happy with it, but they would accept it. They got what they wanted out of the civil war with the rebels being crushed and the lowlanders driven back south with heavy losses. They also need to expand and rebuild their pre-war strength as the civil war has cost them about half of their population.

They will grumble but ultimately accept it.

@10ebbor10 said the point I was going to make quite well (possibly better than I could).

You are making a lot of assumptions here; I will try and go through them but by bit.

1) Peace will not last; Urth will turn them against us.
This is a self defeating prophecy. If you believe peace will not last and thus never attempt to achieve it, then of course it will be true.

2) The Caradysh have the ability to consistently poison the lowlands against us.
Even if they do, it would mean that they have to tangle up some of their actions consistently poisoning the well instead of being able to use our existing shitty reputation (Rich Mountain Demons) in order to get people to easily attack us.

Here is also a nice quote from @Hallesworth49 :
I'd like to add to this that the diplo action could also serve as an early warning, on whether our relations with other civs take a turn for the worse and thus we can be prepared for either war or to avert it.

Another quote from @Kiba
Diplomacy also keep us abreast of technological innovations happening in other areas, and let us get useful animals and goods.

3) Attemtpting to gain peace while the Caradysh exist is pointless and thus we should not do it.
This is demonstrably false. Peace means that we don't have to worry about getting sneak attacked, it means that we can finally have an information source in the lowlands, it means that the Caradysh have less people to throw st us in combat, and so on.

4) The Lowlanders are a monolithic block that have already become under the sway of the Caradysh.
This is also false, as we've just seen with the Maradysh. No civ is a monolith (including our own highly collectivist civ); we will be able to find someone who support us/doesn't think we're terrible if we work hard enough at it.

Overall, the vibe I'm getting from you (and the anti-peace people in general) is that diplomacy is not worth the effort.
Diplomacy is always worth the effort.

I've listed the main reasons I can think of for peace here.
 
There's only been four pages of discussion, it wouldn't be too hard to read it all before commentating.

Here is what Oshha said about the Maradysh:
They wouldn't be happy with it, but they would accept it. They got what they wanted out of the civil war with the rebels being crushed and the lowlanders driven back south with heavy losses. They also need to expand and rebuild their pre-war strength as the civil war has cost them about half of their population.

They will grumble but ultimately accept it.



I've listed the main reasons I can think of for peace here.
But there is still urth's daughters and among them is the heroic diplo who have been going to and fro to do their work.
 
But there is still urth's daughters and among them is the heroic diplo who have been going to and fro to do their work.

Urth made a gamble to get his war to work. Specifically, he lied to the Lowlands people in order to maneuver their traders into a position where they would be slaughtered. He then utilized that slaughtering to send the Lowlands against us. That duplicity leaves a diplomatic weakness from which we can take advantage.

In addition, if we don't act now, we let Urth set the narrative on the atrocities, which could result in us being hated for a long time , which would be bad.
 
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Urth made a gamble to get his war to work. Specifically, he lied to the Lowlands people in order to maneuver their traders into a position where they would be slaughtered. He then utilized that slaughtering to send the Lowlands against us. That duplicity leaves a diplomatic weakness from which we can take advantage.

In addition, if we don't act now, we let Urth set the narrative on the atrocities, which could result in us being hated for a long, which would be bad.
To add to this, said hero is only excellent unless against another hero (as that is how immortals work).
So it's not as though this is some sort of impossible battle and we should never even bother with diplomacy.
 
[x][React] Seek peace with the Lowlander Tribes. ([MAIN] Trade Expedition = Lowlander Tribes)
[X][Policy] Diplomacy Focuses on engaging in diplomacy.
Changing vote to this because it's unexpected, doubles as limited scouting and stops Urth from having a completely free hand at shaping the narrative.

So wanna hit the venerate button to stabilise our nation but we should be okay till next update.

Edit: Corrected vote
 
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[x][React] Seek peace with the Lowlander Tribes. ([MAIN] Trade Expedition = Lowlander Tribes)

Changing vote to this because it's unexpected, doubles as limited scouting and stops Urth from having a completely free hand at shaping the narrative.

So wanna hit the venerate button to stabilise our nation but we should be okay till next update.
just to let you know, whenever you make a new vote it overrides everything in your old vote.
So you are currently only voting for peace with no vote on the policy at the moment.
 
[x][React] Seek peace with the Lowlander Tribes. ([MAIN] Trade Expedition = Lowlander Tribes)
[x][Policy] Diplomacy = Focuses on engaging in diplomacy.
 
[x][React] Seek peace with the Lowlander Tribes. ([MAIN] Trade Expedition = Lowlander Tribes)
[x][Policy] Diplomacy = Focuses on engaging in diplomacy.
 
Inserted tally
Adhoc vote count started by nat_401 on Mar 16, 2019 at 12:33 PM, finished with 100 posts and 35 votes.
 
How are the Maradysh feeling about their taboo.
- Do they still retain their death penalty on everyone who goes to the lowlands?
--- For warfare?
--- For peace?
--- For Trade?
- How do they feel about the escaped remnants?
--- To be exterminated?
--- Driven out?
--- Left alone?
- How did the barbarian Maradysh treat loyalists who happened to be in their settlements when the secession occured?
How do the boar people feel about the atrocities?
Did we see any children of Urth among any of the enemy forces?

The Maradysh currently retain their taboo, but many are doubting it. Right now, they feel that the lowlanders and rebels have used the evil magics of the Caradysh to protect themselves from the plague and they have faith that the divine magics of Arthryn and her Daughters can do the same for the Arthwyd so they don't mind you trading with them. They will kill anyone who tries to go too far south or anyone else who comes up from too far south, but you, the Arthwyd, can go to the south and back just fine in their eyes thanks to the goddesses.

As for the surviving rebels, they would like to see them dead, but they don't mind you making peace so long as they stay in the south and don't come back north.

With how the rebels treated the loyalists, it was poorly. While some managed to escaped and others died fighting back, many were murdered or sold into slavery and some of the men had their way with a fair few of the women when they come before killing or enslaving them.

Boarfolk are okay with them because they deserved it and it needed to be done. They were actually responsible for most of the killing.

Every now and again in large concentration of barbarians or rebel settlements and only by Catclaws who had sneaked past the front lines. None were seen by the frontlines and none took part in any fighting.
 
Vote is still open.
Vote Tally : Chronicles of Nations - Civ Quest - Original | Page 368 | Sufficient Velocity [Posts: 9182-9281]
##### NetTally 1.9.7
Task: React
[x][React] Seek peace with the Lowlander Tribes. ([MAIN] Trade Expedition = Lowlander Tribes)
No. of Votes: 17
[X][React] Thank Arthryn and her Daughters for the victory. ([MAIN] Venerate the Goddesses)
No. of Votes: 8
[X][React] Scout your enemies. ([SEC] Explore Lands = Lowlands, [SEC] Explore Lands = Cursed Forest,)
No. of Votes: 7
[X][React] Develop Infrastructure ([SEC] Develop Mine = Sunrise Mountains – Copper, [SEC] Build Palisade = Sunrise Bay)
No. of Votes: 6
[x][React] Invade the Cursed Forest. ([MAIN] War Party = Caradysh)
No. of Votes: 2

——————————————————————————————————————————————Task: Policy
[x][Policy] Diplomacy = Focuses on engaging in diplomacy.
No. of Votes: 19
[X][Policy] Infrastructure = Focuses on building infrastructure.
No. of Votes: 12
[X][Policy] Defensive = Takes defensive martial actions.
No. of Votes: 4
[X][Policy] Exploration = Focuses on exploring areas.
No. of Votes: 2
[X][Policy] Balanced = Does whatever seems reasonable.
No. of Votes: 1
[X][Policy] Study = Takes study actions.
No. of Votes: 1
Total No. of Voters: 35
 
The Maradysh currently retain their taboo, but many are doubting it. Right now, they feel that the lowlanders and rebels have used the evil magics of the Caradysh to protect themselves from the plague and they have faith that the divine magics of Arthryn and her Daughters can do the same for the Arthwyd so they don't mind you trading with them. They will kill anyone who tries to go too far south or anyone else who comes up from too far south, but you, the Arthwyd, can go to the south and back just fine in their eyes thanks to the goddesses.

As for the surviving rebels, they would like to see them dead, but they don't mind you making peace so long as they stay in the south and don't come back north.

With how the rebels treated the loyalists, it was poorly. While some managed to escaped and others died fighting back, many were murdered or sold into slavery and some of the men had their way with a fair few of the women when they come before killing or enslaving them.

Boarfolk are okay with them because they deserved it and it needed to be done. They were actually responsible for most of the killing.

Every now and again in large concentration of barbarians or rebel settlements and only by Catclaws who had sneaked past the front lines. None were seen by the frontlines and none took part in any fighting.
Speaking of the Merntir Boarfolk, do we in general know what their values are?

I'm assuming they're different from the other loyalists since they're still highly religious in worshiping the All Boar.
 
Oh wow. OK. If they think we can handle going south, then that does make Diplomacy much more viable. Though, that large of a focus on it doesn't seem like a great plan. I'd much rather have the policy being infrastructure. This is stuff that we'll be doing long term, and it takes an action to change it.
 
Oh wow. OK. If they think we can handle going south, then that does make Diplomacy much more viable. Though, that large of a focus on it doesn't seem like a great plan. I'd much rather have the policy being infrastructure. This is stuff that we'll be doing long term, and it takes an action to change it.

Ideally we'd also be doing Diplo long Term, so it depends. In addition, we get a free switch at the end and start of a war, so we should get the option to switch soon-ish.

Boarfolk are okay with them because they deserved it and it needed to be done. They were actually responsible for most of the killing.

That could be an issue if we ever overthrow the monarchy.

Anyway, how do the Maradysh currently elect their leaders? We're in a personal Union, but that can break fast if succession mechanisms differ.
 
Speaking of the Merntir Boarfolk, do we in general know what their values are?

They value martial prowess and riding ability. They place a lot of importance on being loyal to your family/tribe (for them, it is the same thing) and your leaders. They also look down upon non-Boarfolk and foreign deities as they stick to their own enclaves and communities whilst sticking to worshipping the All-Boar.

Anyway, how do the Maradysh currently elect their leaders? We're in a personal Union, but that can break fast if succession mechanisms differ.

They generally go for the same heir as the Arthwyd except they will go for someone else if they think they are significantly better or they feel that the Arthwyd's choice is unsuitable to be Cadlon.
 
They value martial prowess and riding ability. They place a lot of importance on being loyal to your family/tribe (for them, it is the same thing) and your leaders. They also look down upon non-Boarfolk and foreign deities as they stick to their own enclaves and communities whilst sticking to worshipping the All-Boar.
Could we do a trade-mission with the Boarfolk, with the intent to figure out some kind of religious alliance between the Goddesses and the All-Boar?
 
Got some cool information about the Birdfolk on the discord, so I thought it would be nice to share:

Birdfolk are humanoid with feathered bodies that have wings in addition to legs and arms. They also have beaks for mouths & noses alongside talons for toes.
They can fly, but are limited in height and speed
Halfbreeds look somewhere between a Birdfolk and a human.
Halfbreeds with Arthrynites also have the Blessing

On the Maradysh:
They currently have 12500 people, and used to be 25000 before half of them were killed/fled in the civil war
Of those 12500, 2000 are Boarfolk and 1200 are Birdfolk

On us:
We currently have 125000 people
We have some immigration into the Maradysh, but because we still consider them to be pretty barbaric it is only the adventurous who move there.
The Arthwyd generally prefer to stay in the communities of their birth.
We get far more immigration into the Arthwyd from the Maradysh than the other way around
 
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Vote is closed.
Vote Tally : Chronicles of Nations - Civ Quest - Original | Page 368 | Sufficient Velocity [Posts: 9182-9281]
##### NetTally 1.9.7
Task: React
[x][React] Seek peace with the Lowlander Tribes. ([MAIN] Trade Expedition = Lowlander Tribes)
No. of Votes: 18
[X][React] Thank Arthryn and her Daughters for the victory. ([MAIN] Venerate the Goddesses)
No. of Votes: 8
[X][React] Scout your enemies. ([SEC] Explore Lands = Lowlands, [SEC] Explore Lands = Cursed Forest,)
No. of Votes: 7
[X][React] Develop Infrastructure ([SEC] Develop Mine = Sunrise Mountains – Copper, [SEC] Build Palisade = Sunrise Bay)
No. of Votes: 6
[x][React] Invade the Cursed Forest. ([MAIN] War Party = Caradysh)
No. of Votes: 2

——————————————————————————————————————————————Task: Policy
[x][Policy] Diplomacy = Focuses on engaging in diplomacy.
No. of Votes: 19
[X][Policy] Infrastructure = Focuses on building infrastructure.
No. of Votes: 12
[X][Policy] Defensive = Takes defensive martial actions.
No. of Votes: 4
[X][Policy] Exploration = Focuses on exploring areas.
No. of Votes: 2
[X][Policy] Balanced = Does whatever seems reasonable.
No. of Votes: 1
[X][Policy] Study = Takes study actions.
No. of Votes: 1
Total No. of Voters: 35
 
Got some cool information about the Birdfolk on the discord, so I thought it would be nice to share:

Birdfolk are humanoid with feathered bodies that have wings in addition to legs and arms. They also have beaks for mouths & noses alongside talons for toes.
They can fly, but are limited in height and speed
Halfbreeds look somewhere between a Birdfolk and a human.
Halfbreeds with Arthrynites also have the Blessing

On the Maradysh:
They currently have 12500 people, and used to be 25000 before half of them were killed/fled in the civil war
Of those 12500, 2000 are Boarfolk and 1200 are Birdfolk

On us:
We currently have 125000 people
We have some immigration into the Maradysh, but because we still consider them to be pretty barbaric it is only the adventurous who move there.
The Arthwyd generally prefer to stay in the communities of their birth.
We get far more immigration into the Arthwyd from the Maradysh than the other way around

Is 125,000 people a lot for a civ in this time period?
 
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