Magical Girl Phantom Ascension

@SpoopyGhost

Would pulling the fire alarm be a valid write-in vote or sub vote of intervening?

Broken Base said:

(Though I think "we're going to be late" is maddeningly superficial)

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I recognize the rest of your arguments to at least be valid, and in fact would agree with you if it weren't for the point I am about to bring up.

It's not "we're going to be late".

It's "we're almost certainly going to completely miss the meeting that let's us prove we are who we say we are to our only current ally, who is very angry at us because they believe we are lying about who we are". That's an exceedingly important drawback, rather than just "lost time".

Part of the reason I like the idea of pulling the fire alarm is that it does break up the fight, and if delays up it'll also delay her as well rather than her thinking we're toying with her. Which is a bad thing when she's our only teammate.

Broken Base said:

I think maybe we should... chill a bit? Like, I also honestly don't think this character is going to die if we don't intervene. This isn't a situation where it can be be logically assumed anybody would kill anybody else, she hasn't shown herself to be a cold-blooded murderer willing to kill people on a whim. Literally the only real reason we have to think that it's going to escalate that far as that it's in the choice text



Like this reads a lot more like an IC colloquialism to me rather than "holy shit she's going to actually commit murder." So, like, having "you people are condoning murder" as a point in the dialogue isn't going to really help or convince anyone.

Now that having been said, this thus doesn't necessarily come down to "do will allow somebody to be murdered" but the more broad "how high of a bar do we need to have before we intervene, and what sacrifices are we willing to make to do so."

And honestly I think this is a debatable point. This is somebody that we actually don't know, we're going to probably end up sacrificing something, and there's a good chance we're not going to win a direct confrontation anyway. Like the main reason that I think this isn't a good precedent to be setting isn't even that those are inherently bad reason to not intervene (Though I think "we're going to be late" is maddeningly superficial), but the fact that this is our fault, if not intentionally. Helping people in itself is important, but it's especially important when on some level this is our responsibility. To just walk away from this is setting the precedent that our character is not only willing to back off from situations where people are in danger, but cases where it was basically our fault to begin with. I don't think that's a good look or a good direction to go.

I'd be happy with a non-interventionalist fire alarm write-in though if it can gain momentum.

[X] Intervene. (You're terrified, but this is indirectly your fault. You may be a little late to the meeting with Midori, but maybe if you can use your ghostly invisibility to throw Hotaru off, you can stop her from killing this other kid. Plus, didn't you face so much worse than her last night…?)

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Only one person out of all the voters actually took it literally. Honestly random NPC-kun probably won't even suffer a bruise, it sounds like this is just venting.

Regardless messing around and playing poltergeist here is most likely only going to escalate the situation. Right now the situation is pretty much ordinary school life, the delinquent is blustering and being a pain in the ass but that's normal. If we start throwing shit around and being a spooky ghost then people get scared and they start doing really stupid things.

This isn't just a situation of intervene or not-intervene, it's also a situation of should we intervene. Even if we didn't have a very important meeting to get to it still probably wouldn't be a good idea to play poltergeist since it wouldn't actually help anyone.

beowolf said:

It's not "we're going to be late".

It's "we're almost certainly going to completely miss the meeting that let's us prove we are who we say we are to our only current ally, who is very angry at us because they believe we are lying about who we are". That's an exceedingly important drawback, rather than just "lost time".

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That's fair, I was being reductionist, kind of because it felt like other people were but that's no excuse, and it is a legitimate concern. Though I'm not sure that "almost certainly" going to miss the meeting entirely is fair. We certainly don't believe that in the update, and we don't even frame it as "miss entirely" but "be late", which is somewhat different even in our context. And the only firm justification for believing there's going to be THAT huge a drawback was OOC reasoning, which I'm "eh" on. Partially because I don't like basing votes on it, partially because I typically don't like trying to read the mind of the QM.

Like in the world of the quest I feel like the argument is slightly wobblier than you're making it, it isn't "almost certainly" so much as "We may be late and given the overall context, it's quite plausible that she won't be patient." I agree that it's a point of concern though? i'm hoping the fire alarm option is fine because it's pretty quick and expedient and ideally we can all win, to an extent. If not, then I'll probably reframe things and think it over.

WorldSlayer said:

The only person out of all the voters who actually took it literally is Jeboboid.

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I didn't think singling a seemingly upset user in particular would be particularly productive in trying to keep things from further escalating? Like if the comment doesn't apply to you, it you know, doesn't apply to you.

WorldSlayer said:

Regardless messing around and playing poltergeist here is most likely only going to escalate the situation. Right now the situation is pretty much ordinary school life, the delinquent is blustering and being a pain in the ass but that's normal. If we start throwing shit around and being a spooky ghost then people get scared and they start doing really stupid things.

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It depends on how you do it. Do you directly intervene physically? In some way indirectly? In some form like the fire alarm option that has no backlash at all? Like an inventive person can come up with an endless amount of ways to utilize our skillset, some of them probably detrimental in this situation, but some of them not. I don't think that honestly the fact that the most direct approach would, indeed, escalate the situation is a good argument that we should just let things be because the direct, obvious approach isn't the only approach that exists.

Like "should we intervene" is a valid point, but it's typically a more powerful argument when the exact nature of our intervention is specified and we know exactly what it is we're going to do. The question here wasn't "Do we go intervene through X method" it was "do we intervene at all", which requires a different calculus and minimizes "Well the intervention that we'd take would be inherently detrimental" because we don't know what form of intervention we'd take.

[} Intervene. (You're terrified, but this is indirectly your fault. You may be a little late to the meeting with Midori, but maybe if you can use your ghostly invisibility to throw Hotaru off, you can stop her from killing this other kid. Plus, didn't you face so much worse than her last night…?)

WorldSlayer said:

Only one person out of all the voters actually took it literally. Honestly random NPC-kun probably won't even suffer a bruise, it sounds like this is just venting.

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SpoopyGhost said:

His attempts to placate the situation backfire, as Hotaru grabs him by the throat and pulls him close, hissing in his face. "Oh, I'm suuure it was just an accident. You've always been tryin' to git me kicked out of there, haven't you? I'm sure this was 'yer doing, Daido! Well, now you've gone TOO FAR!" She raises a fist, he whimpers, and you feel your stomach drop.

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Highlighted the last line. Looks like she's about to slug the kid, I think it's a bit too optimistic to say she's going to stick to words, or even just one punch.

On another topic, I must have missed something earlier, 'cause I recall Midori being a magical girl, which would mean she's dead, which would make attending school difficult. I'm forgetting something right?

I am not seeing us trying to reign in Hotaru's temper all the time unless she is a MG with whom we'll be interacting on a regular basis... which, come to think of it, actually seems pretty likely. But if she is not, I don't see the reason to intervene in this particular case because if she flies off the handle like that at the slightest provocation - and even without one, - she'll just find another victim to take her frustrations out on, so we'd be achieving precisely nothing.

Sorry, random NPC-kun. Your miserable on-screen life shall become an indictment of the inefficiency of the school's social workers, which I am sure is a topic someone would care about. Preferably someone else with a lot of free time on their hands.

Now, to the actually important things!

[X] Ignore it. (You did nothing wrong, and you don't want to get on her bad side even now that you're dead. You have a meeting to get to, anyway, and this makes for a good distraction...)

Dark Lord Potato said:

On another topic, I must have missed something earlier, 'cause I recall Midori being a magical girl, which would mean she's dead, which would make attending school difficult. I'm forgetting something right?

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Midori's still alive; we are the only ghost MG.

ColdGoldLazarus said:

Midori's still alive; we are the only ghost MG.

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Oh. Thought you had to be a ghost to become a MG. Guess I was wrong. Explains why Midori thought we were lying.

[X] Indirectly Intervene (Pull the fire alarm; it should be a good distraction to Hotaru without making you late.)

Altered my earlier post so I'm not voting for two things at the same time.

wagonwagonwagon

[X] Indirectly Intervene (Pull the fire alarm; it should be a good distraction to Hotaru without making you late.)

Are you sure you guys really want to pull that fire alarm?

For a start it's absolutely a crime to pull a fire alarm when there isn't a fire.

Second it can cause a panic which can cause people to be injured (unlikely but possible).

Third it will cause firetrucks to be called in, not only is that an expense to the school it will also potentially pull away vital resources if there's an actual fire elsewhere.

It's kind of pain in the ass for everyone, seriously no one wants to lose a shitload of time because of a fake fire alarm.

Also do we even know where the alarm is? It seems unlikely we'll be able to actual find and pull it before anything happens here in the room (although I don't think anything major is going to happen except for NPC-kun crying like a baby at being threatened). However even if something were to happen like NPC-kun being hit we're probably not going to be able to find and pull a fire alarm before that happens.

Pulling the fire alarm may cause Hotaru to change her plans and not meet us in the original spot.

Basically you should truly think about the consequences before you decide it's the right course of action.

WorldSlayer said:

For a start it's absolutely a crime to pull a fire alarm when there isn't a fire.

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You can't sue a ghost!

But yeah, that could be its own can of worms. If they don't notice it's a false alarm, we are looking at disrupting the school day.

On the other hand, our QM introduced the option as a middle of the road one, supposedly (?) with the intention of not being passive and not being late. If it really causes a scare, it will make Midori (and whoever else is there) come down from the roof, thus ruining the meeting... and running contrary to the stated goals of the option that led to its addition in the first place.

If the lack of the option weren't regarded as an 'issue', I'd probably be more wary of it.

well, whatever happens, this'll be a learning experience.

SpoopyGhost said:

It appears the thread blew up while I was asleep...

Ah, I see the issue. I really should have given this update another pass before posting. So in light of that...


Sure. I'll make the template here:

> Indirectly Intervene (Pull the fire alarm; it should be a good distraction to Hotaru without making you late.)

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Actually if we have write ins can we intervene by manifesting and telling them it was actually an evil ghost that did it and we're sorry for the inconvenience. Then quickly leaving because we have places to be and things to do.

Nevill said:

You can't sue a ghost!

But yeah, that could be its own can of worms. If they don't notice it's a false alarm, we are looking at disrupting the school day.

On the other hand, the QM intoduced the option as a middle road, suposedly (?) with the intention of not being passive and not being late. If it really causes a scare, it will make Midori (and whoever else is there) come down from the roof, thus ruining the meeting... and running contrary to the stated goals of the option that led to its addition in the first place.

If the lack of the option wasn't regarded as an 'issue', I'd probably be more wary of it.

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Yeah I get the feeling that this middle of the road plan is going to end up as a failure in all counts, we'll fail to intervene before NPC-kun pisses his pants and we won't be able to have the meeting because Hotaru can't go to the original meeting place due to the fire alert.

[X] Ignore it. (You did nothing wrong, and you don't want to get on her bad side even now that you're dead. You have a meeting to get to, anyway, and this makes for a good distraction...)

[X] Ignore it. (You did nothing wrong, and you don't want to get on her bad side even now that you're dead. You have a meeting to get to, anyway, and this makes for a good distraction...)

Well, you did actually something wrong, but I don't see how ghost involvement can make this situation better.

[X] Ignore it. (You did nothing wrong, and you don't want to get on her bad side even now that you're dead. You have a meeting to get to, anyway, and this makes for a good distraction...)