Any details on that and the general handling of the three eyes, maybe with a comment on there connection to the Bali?
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White Wolf's World of Darkness
AkatsukiL13
An Enlightened Mind
- Location
- New Copernicus Station
Well to being with the Baali have always been enigmatic and contradictory. DAV20 does nothing to change that. It describes their origins in the vague story of the nameless tribe who made sacrifices to demons and other depraved acts until one night a mysterious figure tore into the village, killing them all and tossing their bodies down the sacrificial pit and three crawled out the next night. But it doesn't say who the figure was. In fact it points out that the Tremere will in one breath blame [Tzimisce] and its Clan because of their association with Kupala. In the next they'll blame Saulot, claiming the Salubri's pogrom against the Baali is born out of hidden guilt.
As for the Salubri themselves, all three Castes have their own pages, the Healers, the Warriors and the Watchers*. And they've changed them a bit. It kind of implies that all three Castes got their start in Enoch and further evolved after its fall. But aside from that they largely remain the same. Healers are the faithful humanists, Warriors are the crusaders against evil and the Watchers are one part scholar and one part thief.
*The part of the Clan from the Far East, better known as Wu Zao.
The part in the Appendix I mentioned presents a different scenario following [Tremere]'s devouring of Saulot. Instead of the Castes further dividing, with the Watchers retreating further into the Far East, the Warriors becoming a twisted mockery that we know them as in the modern day and the Healers being virtually wiped out by the Tremere, the Castes come together. They still suffer at the hands of the Tremere and their pogrom but by standing together they endure it. The Warriors even put aside their old hatreds with the Tzimisce in the face of the Tremere.
Fast-forward to the Anarch Revolt and the Convention of Thorns, the Salubri reject the Camarilla because of the Tremere backing it, joining instead with the Tzimisce and Lasombra, creating a different Sabbat. The Black Hand is dominated by the Salubri Warriors, the infernalism that periodically rears its head in the Sabbat finds far less purchase, and the Tal'Mahe'Ra never gets the power influence it had over this Sabbat. Through their influence the Sect is a less monstrous, more philosophical group. Though that is not to say that it isn't the Sword of Caine. They are still hellbent on fighting the Antes, its just that Salubri balance out the excesses of the Tzimisce and Lasombra.
In the end it is this Sabbat, not the Camarilla that becomes the dominant Sect in the world.
Oh and I forgot to mention the surprise Bloodline for those who weren't following the DAV20 development is the Niktuku, what the Nosferatu fear. It is a different albeit interesting take on the Bloodline than what we had previously seen. Certainly it does blur what we knew about them from before but at the same time what it adds does actually add to it, namely their weakness. They don't have the hideousness of the Nosferatu but they have two rather unique flaws. First they only gain for blood point for every three they drain from kine. Second every hundred years they lose one dot in Appearance, transferring it to any Physical Attribute that can handle it, which is especially important because they go out of their way to Embrace young, beautiful people.
As for the Salubri themselves, all three Castes have their own pages, the Healers, the Warriors and the Watchers*. And they've changed them a bit. It kind of implies that all three Castes got their start in Enoch and further evolved after its fall. But aside from that they largely remain the same. Healers are the faithful humanists, Warriors are the crusaders against evil and the Watchers are one part scholar and one part thief.
*The part of the Clan from the Far East, better known as Wu Zao.
The part in the Appendix I mentioned presents a different scenario following [Tremere]'s devouring of Saulot. Instead of the Castes further dividing, with the Watchers retreating further into the Far East, the Warriors becoming a twisted mockery that we know them as in the modern day and the Healers being virtually wiped out by the Tremere, the Castes come together. They still suffer at the hands of the Tremere and their pogrom but by standing together they endure it. The Warriors even put aside their old hatreds with the Tzimisce in the face of the Tremere.
Fast-forward to the Anarch Revolt and the Convention of Thorns, the Salubri reject the Camarilla because of the Tremere backing it, joining instead with the Tzimisce and Lasombra, creating a different Sabbat. The Black Hand is dominated by the Salubri Warriors, the infernalism that periodically rears its head in the Sabbat finds far less purchase, and the Tal'Mahe'Ra never gets the power influence it had over this Sabbat. Through their influence the Sect is a less monstrous, more philosophical group. Though that is not to say that it isn't the Sword of Caine. They are still hellbent on fighting the Antes, its just that Salubri balance out the excesses of the Tzimisce and Lasombra.
In the end it is this Sabbat, not the Camarilla that becomes the dominant Sect in the world.
Oh and I forgot to mention the surprise Bloodline for those who weren't following the DAV20 development is the Niktuku, what the Nosferatu fear. It is a different albeit interesting take on the Bloodline than what we had previously seen. Certainly it does blur what we knew about them from before but at the same time what it adds does actually add to it, namely their weakness. They don't have the hideousness of the Nosferatu but they have two rather unique flaws. First they only gain for blood point for every three they drain from kine. Second every hundred years they lose one dot in Appearance, transferring it to any Physical Attribute that can handle it, which is especially important because they go out of their way to Embrace young, beautiful people.
I'm going to actually respond to this several months late because I missed it the first time. I think it's easier to understand Panopticon if you understand the genre and the internal conflicts behind all the characters involved than really going in-depth on the stuff for Mage, especially because a lot of things are hacked, retconned, or hidden.
If you just want to know oMage, I think the best sources are probably Mage Revised, the Guide to the Traditions, and the five Revised Convention books. If you're interested in a Tradition, try to read the Revised version of their Tradition books.
TheLastOne
Person of impeccable tastes (for destruction)
@Chloe Sullivan I would add on to that list The Book of Worlds. It's for second edition, not third, but The Infinite Tapestry... is somewhat more contentious. You don't really understand all the boarders of the Ascension War without going into the Umbra, and it's one of the most plot-filled books you could possible pick up.
Both The Digital Web and The Digital Web 2.0 are great books if you're going to use them, but while everyone has a presence, only the technocrats and technomancers have a strong one. You can find digital shamans calling upon spirits of information and organization, or seers reading peoples Karma through their inbox, but it's a specialty rather then the default for seven of the nine Traditions.
Both The Digital Web and The Digital Web 2.0 are great books if you're going to use them, but while everyone has a presence, only the technocrats and technomancers have a strong one. You can find digital shamans calling upon spirits of information and organization, or seers reading peoples Karma through their inbox, but it's a specialty rather then the default for seven of the nine Traditions.
AkatsukiL13
An Enlightened Mind
- Location
- New Copernicus Station
I'd second Book of Worlds but I'd add this, read the Rev Ed Void Engineers Convention Book first as it presents the Umbra through the eyes of the Technocracy which is easier to absorb than either Book of Worlds or Infinite Tapestry.
NonSequtur
a body
It totally is. The relatively asexual protagonist (Jamelia) can't decide between any of her suitors (KeepAwake, Job, Disruptive Phone Calls, and then you have the crack pairings like Donald, Serafina, and The General). Also she is pursued by a tsundere who totally hates her, really! (Ms. Clock) who is also totally her sister but it's ok.
Speaking of which, are you ever going to reveal the hacked Ab. 2.0 Psion/Mage Revised rules you use for Panopticon? Or the numerous pieces of equipment, mook character sheets, and other stuff that you presumably have mechanics for, but nobody really gets to see?
I don't really care if it's in slapdash GM-notes format, either. I'm capable of sorting through it on my own, but it's both interesting and relevant to my interests/future gaming experience(s).
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You have essentially seen all of it, because the only thing I'm doing is adding on some random stuff to the Aberrant 2.0 psion rules.
- Pronouns
- They/Them
I was wondering: did someone write something to integrate Scions in the WoD (Scion: The Heroing or Scion: The godding)? Or to integrate the WoD in Scion?
It might be hard due to the fact that while WoD works with the Abrahamic myths, it's explicitly one of the few that doesn't exist in Scion, but it would probably be cool.
Or is it a stupid idea?
It might be hard due to the fact that while WoD works with the Abrahamic myths, it's explicitly one of the few that doesn't exist in Scion, but it would probably be cool.
Or is it a stupid idea?
AkatsukiL13
An Enlightened Mind
- Location
- New Copernicus Station
Yes and no, at least with the Old World of Darkness. New World of Darkness is pretty vague and modular in design so you could do something like that with the NWoD without worrying too much about it.
I'm not as well versed in WoD as I am in some other games, but from what I can remember?
I would hesitate before tossing in Scions.
They're kinda beefy.
Lealope
Not yet invincible
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Scions OP, pls nerf. But yeah, the only reason you'd want Scion in the World of Darkness is wanting them to interact with other splats, and Scions would go through most gamelines like buzzsaws. Their Knacks are really OP, as is the scaling of Epic Attributes.
- Pronouns
- They/Them
Ah, that's too bad. Putting Scions in the WoD would have been an awesome end to the Ragnarok campaign since, while the world is fucked, it can be some metaphoric end of the world (like if suddenly everything turned dark and edgy and depressing, like... say, WoD).
- Location
- Italy
Carrnage
Human
- Location
- New Zealand
how many things are their fault?
- Location
- Italy
Haven't checked it our yet, can't say.
Vindictus
XENO
- Location
- Texas
IIRC, the Ragnarok campaign would actually be a way to de-fuck a lot of the WoD, since Ragnarok was as much a renewal as an ending.
*has flashbacks* Make it stoooooop! *starts sobbing*
(so yeah, Epic Attributes having an expotential rate of growth in terms of relationship between rating and bonuses given is, hands-down, the biggest problem in Scion once you get past Hero. Even Heroes get major advantages over almost anything in the WoD mind, but it moves from 'the most powerful thing on the block but still beatable' to 'OMGwtf' with frightening speed once they hit Demigod)
Yep.
Seven* free auto-successes for every role with the appropriate Attribute is pretty scary, even leaving aside that they've got good sized dice pools.
To say nothing of what some of the Knacks can let you do.
*And then 11. Then 16, 22, etc.
Yeah.
Honestly, I love Scion. I love the idea, I love the fact that you can have all these different children of the Gods rubbing shoulders with each other, I do rather like the fact that they (if by taking some liberties) managed to give all these different pantheons common cause with each other...
And I can see why Epic Attributes are the way they are...
But dear god the mechanics are awful. (Even if they actually gave a solid 'this is what Appearance is for, it's not just a booster of other social actions)
Honestly, I love Scion. I love the idea, I love the fact that you can have all these different children of the Gods rubbing shoulders with each other, I do rather like the fact that they (if by taking some liberties) managed to give all these different pantheons common cause with each other...
And I can see why Epic Attributes are the way they are...
But dear god the mechanics are awful. (Even if they actually gave a solid 'this is what Appearance is for, it's not just a booster of other social actions)
Well, look at this way.
At least Scion 2.0 is in the works and is going to hit open development eventually.
NonSequtur
a body
In the meantime, there's MJs Aberrant 2.0 for your 'pick up a plane as a melee weapon' needs.
I think I actually cap out at a tank.
And I think I'm going to have to revise those rules pretty significantly at some point in time.
Eh, on a good day I can lift a Cessna so I don't think it's too big a deal