Remove ads

Tower of Babel: A Bronze Age Space Civ Quest

Reader mode
eoparatiratis would likely be rather eager to be the captain of a spaceship, to travel to other stars and investigate their affects on fate
 
The biggest worry with the Astroid, is that it's suppose to cost between 2 to 6 scale. We currently only got 4 scale, and if it's a two turn project like i'm guessing, Reordering is gonna make us go down to 3 scale. Even if the mundanes can reduce the cost like they did with ice-chapter, that might be out of our price range.

It's also gonna make our mundane population go down by one, which isn't that big of a crisis, but it does mean we won't be getting another MAP point at the end of this cycle. Though, i wonder if "Food of soul" might increase our mundane population growth, since it means less people would be dying. Since it's noted as having included medicinal herbs and drugs.

Honestly, this is mostly guess work, we'd need to see the astroid before chosing between it and the Ice-Chapter. Ice Monistary seems like a decent mid-choice between a Chapter and Fortress option though.
 
an important thing about that scale, if we use an map on the asteroid it'll use one less scale. and if we can't do an asteroid the comet is still an option, though
 
On that note. Assuming we do fuse the ice-coments into a Monastery, that's gonna cost us 4 scale(And honestly, it's a free action, so i don't see why we wouldn't, except for the question i'm asking now), and Reordering is gonna cost us 1 scale. How would that work out, since we're currently at

16 Scale - 12 used
4 Scale used for Monastery
1 scale consumed for Reordering.
Would that work or is that using above our scale limit @OldShadow ? Is there a difference between used scale and then consuming it, like this in a turn

Edit: never mind, i'm stupid, the mundanes bring it down to 3 scale cost, so it's not an issue(I was even looking at it(commented on it recently??), so i don't know how i forgot). But i still think it's valid question to ask for the future. In case we do have something similar to this.
 
Last edited:
Sa'kage said:
Would that work or is that using above our scale limit @OldShadow ? Is there a difference between used scale and then consuming it, like this in a turn
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
You cannot use a point of Scale and then consume it, if you do no want to face...consequences.
Scale represent the mystical "space" used up by the Workings of the Order.
Think of Cradle as a gigantic black board, and the Workings of the Order as either drawings (Using Scale) or engravings (Consuming Scale) upon it.
Now, what would happen if you engraved a part of the board and drawned upon it at the same time ?
 
Last edited:
OldShadow said:
You cannot use a point of Scale and then consume it, if you do no want to face...consequences.
Scale represent the mystical "space" used up by the Workings of the Order.
Think of Cradle as a gigantic black board, and the Workings of the Order as either drawings (Using Scale) or engravings (Consuming Scale) upon it.
Now, what would happen if you engraved a part of the board and drawned upon it at the same time ?
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...

Right! That's what i assumed would happen, but still nice to know for future cases just to be sure

Though....Drawing and engraving on the board at the same time. I'm wondering if there are cases where engraving upon a "drawn" board might actually be good. Sometimes, like flaws consequences are benefical if employed in the correct manner.

Though, i imagine trying the same with the nigh myhtical energy sustaining our civilization, is the kind of thing that ends up making us a historical fallen story empire.
 
Last edited:
presumably the consequences would depend on what's being "drawn over." strangely if we're drawing over the righteous reordering it might imbue the chapter with space-shortening properties... or it could make the reordered roads cold like the void of space. it really depends on the severity and direction of the bleed through
 
Looks at the comments

Well, didn't get much discussion because people sidetracked to the action I specified I wouldn't be choosing, so I guess I'm going to go with Reordering. In the unlikely chance it shakes loose a few votes.

[X] Plan: Turning to the Past in Strength with Travel
-[X] Sowing the Fields of Tomorrow [Mundane]
--[X] Restore Past Gardens [0/1] [Gardeners] - 1 Mundane AP
-[X] Carve the World-Spine [0/1] [Mundane] [White Tower] - 1 Mundane AP
-[X] Explore Times Forgotten [Ruins] [0/1] - 1 AP
--[X] Explore in Force [0/1] [Ruins] [Mundane] [Guilds] - FREE MAP SPENT
-[X] The Godly Womb [0/1] [Consume 1 Scale] [Tower that Think] - 1 AP
-[X] Build the Heavenly Cities [Mundane] Updated
--[X] Halls of Battles [0/1] [Sundial Tower] [Doomed] - 1 AP
-[X] Righteous Reordering of Travels [0/2] [Consume 1 Scale] [Sundial Tower]
 
Pyro Hawk said:
Looks at the comments

Well, didn't get much discussion because people sidetracked to the action I specified I wouldn't be choosing, so I guess I'm going to go with Reordering. In the unlikely chance it shakes loose a few votes.

[X] Plan: Turning to the Past in Strength with Travel
-[X] Sowing the Fields of Tomorrow [Mundane]
--[X] Restore Past Gardens [0/1] [Gardeners] - 1 Mundane AP
-[X] Carve the World-Spine [0/1] [Mundane] [White Tower] - 1 Mundane AP
-[X] Explore Times Forgotten [Ruins] [0/1] - 1 AP
--[X] Explore in Force [0/1] [Ruins] [Mundane] [Guilds] - FREE MAP SPENT
-[X] The Godly Womb [0/1] [Consume 1 Scale] [Tower that Think] - 1 AP
-[X] Build the Heavenly Cities [Mundane] Updated
--[X] Halls of Battles [0/1] [Sundial Tower] [Doomed] - 1 AP
-[X] Righteous Reordering of Travels [0/2] [Consume 1 Scale] [Sundial Tower]
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
yeah, sorry for derailing your replanning. i get what you're going for and appreciate it, but the prospect of achieving another tower in four turns is too tantalizing to pass up. your plan is good, it buffs our cities and units, starts the righteous reordering and the comet-ships, and finishes us cradle's restoration, i just think that the long-term possibility of getting another ap is too important for us to go for your plan
 
Just an extremely minor note on Path of the Elements, but I would like to note that Straightening of the World have a Mundanes tag, so we have a little bit of flexibility to not just spend all AP on that part. In fact, I would say that using MAP for (some of) it might be important. We know the result change depend on what kind of point we use and having the Mundanes take part in such a complex project would be a rather great demonstration of their growth.
 
When i did originally propose it, the idea was that by having Philosophers constantly on the Straightening action so they could accumulat to the mindset of elemental magic, since that is one of thr biggest difficulty we currently do have.

While that might change, since we'd be doing a lot more actual Path of Elements action, I'm still leaning towards majority being AP. Not like we don't got a bereft of Mundane projects regardless.

One important thing to note, is that i absolutely do not think we spend mundane point on Straightening on the last turn. The taming fire is noted as dangerous, and if we got mundanes close to any actions that might endanger them by proximation, we risk the Sundial Tower flaw activating. Which might invalidate the action and potential a lot more
 
i have to admit a problem. i called dibs for the forum posts, but without any context for how the civilization knows about the order i just can't get my muse to work, if anyone else can write it before me feel free. i'll come back to it later if it hasn't been written by then
 
Lord_Abaddon said:
i have to admit a problem. i called dibs for the forum posts, but without any context for how the civilization knows about the order i just can't get my muse to work, if anyone else can write it before me feel free. i'll come back to it later if it hasn't been written by then
Click to expand...
Click to shrink...
You can invent it.
Either they meet one of the Order's God-Fortress in the future, or one of their explorer stumbled upon Cradle.

EDIT
Also some Lore : The Order include gatherings of Philosophers with names like Order of the Star-born Wisdom or Order of the Rightful Betterment of Flesh, but the Order as a whole is only ever called the Order.
This has two goals : make it impossible to target the entire Order with an hostile Working by using its name and mystical allow one of the subOrder to recreate the Order in case of a catastrophe.
Of course, such naming convention is hell for other species trying to understand the Order.
 
Last edited:
A civilization that had people able to talk like that on an online forum, is not of thr Black King and most likely not the Green King.

So one of the lights escaping away. I'd go with something from either mass effect or star trek in theory. Where it's an advanced society with a focus on technological progress but still dedicated to the ideas of democracy and equality.

Which means it's far enough away to go "Wait, what are these crazy guys doing? Is that a meticracy or a hereditary guild based goverment structure" but not so much that they would try to crush us on principle like the Star King-Tyrants.

(On another note, am taking at the sorcery-tyrant omake)
 
Remove ads
Vote closed
  • Voting
    • Scheduled vote count started by OldShadow on Jan 20, 2024 at 6:51 PM, finished with 62 posts and 13 votes.
    • [X][Collaboration] [White Tower] : Create a meeting ground to facilitate collaborations and ensure every affected party is aware of it. Collaboration is Harmony, excessive secrecy and undisclosed division of focus is not.
      [X][Travel][Sundial Tower] : The Mundanes should be taught how to solve their problems. Let us summon a Conclave of important Mundanes to create rules for travelers and merchants all over Cradle.
      [X] Plan: To Plan for the morrow.
      -[X] Sowing the Fields of Tomorrow [Mundane]
      --[X] Restore Past Gardens [0/1] [Gardeners] -1 MAP
      -[X] Carve the World-Spine [0/1] [Mundane] [White Tower] -1 MAP
      -[X] Explore Times Forgotten [Ruins] [0/1] - 1 AP
      -[X] The Godly Womb [0/1] [Consume 1 Scale] [Tower that Think] - 1 AP
      -[X] Righteous Reordering of Travels [0/2] -1 AP
      -[X] Straightening of the World [0/4] [Mundane] [Sundial Tower] [Precises] [Path of the Elements] [Gardeners] -1 AP
      [X][Tyrants]: The Guilds hold in their hand a Sword of Power, and to prevent its misuse its Hilt must be made of those they might wield it against. This Blade must be used for as many as possible by as many as possible, create a Council of Guiding Hands selected from the Mundanes and overseen by a Philosophical (apprentice) appointee that may point this Sword justly. Place the Guilds under their power and have them hold court for offenses the Guilds may take against the Mundanes to ensure fair action. Thus, as the Blade's Power grows it will be properly Guided.
      [X] Memories [Eye] : What is left of the Eye's memories, to be extracted and translated. How was it born ? How was it raised and shaped ? Toward which goals ?
      [X] Plan: Turning to the Past in Strength
      -[X] Sowing the Fields of Tomorrow [Mundane]
      --[X] Restore Past Gardens [0/1] [Gardeners] - 1 AP
      -[X] Carve the World-Spine [0/1] [Mundane] [White Tower] - 1 Mundane AP
      -[X] Explore Times Forgotten [Ruins] [0/1] - 1 AP
      --[X] Explore in Force [0/1] [Ruins] [Mundane] [Guilds] - 1 Mundane AP
      -[X] The Godly Womb [0/1] [Consume 1 Scale] [Tower that Think] - 1 AP
      -[X] Build the Heavenly Cities [Mundane] Updated
      --[X] Halls of Battles [0/1] [Sundial Tower] [Doomed] - 1 AP
      [X][Tyrants][White Tower] : By trying to crush potential Tyrants, the Order may begin to become such Tyrants.
      [X][Travel][Tower that Think] : Demand that each new arrivant swore to be honest and have good conduct before an altar of the local God-City, and allow the Gods to punish those that break this oath as criminals. Make it known that abusing sworn strangers is an insult against the God-Cities.
      [X] Gates of Violence [Eye] : How do the Eye fight ? What imprinted instincts command its strike, and how do it differentiate between friends and foes ?
      [X] Plan: Restoration Of Ancient Power
      -[X] Sowing the Fields of Tomorrow [Mundane]
      --[X] Restore Past Gardens [0/1] [Gardeners] -1 MAP
      -[X] Explore Times Forgotten [Ruins] [0/1] - 1 AP
      --[X] Explore in Force [0/1] [Ruins] [Mundane] [Guilds] -1 MAP
      -[X] Purify the Storm [0/3] [Path of the Elements] [White Tower; Living Tower] -3 AP
      [X][Collaboration] [Tower that Think] : The collaboration is not the issue, but the fact that it was hidden from the Order's structures and the other Towers. Implement a procedure to officially create a collaboration, with each Towers informed and the duties and ressources attributed to the collaborators adjusted.
      [X][Tyrants][Living Tower][Teacher] : We shall let the Guilds grow in power, but urge them to invest their resources and power in more schools of their arts and more teaching. This way, the Mundanes will be pushed toward learning knowledge that will elevate them, and the Guilds may find the Wisdom that comes from being a teacher for the willing, and not a tyrant ruling over slaves.
      [X] Introspection [Eye] : The mind is trapped in a cage of circular thoughts, never to be free. Can such a soulless mind learn from this ? Could it reach wisdom ? Or has the Order found a perfect weapon against the Engines of Extinction ?
      [X] Plan: Turning to the Past in Strength with Travel
      -[X] Sowing the Fields of Tomorrow [Mundane]
      --[X] Restore Past Gardens [0/1] [Gardeners] - 1 Mundane AP
      -[X] Carve the World-Spine [0/1] [Mundane] [White Tower] - 1 Mundane AP
      -[X] Explore Times Forgotten [Ruins] [0/1] - 1 AP
      --[X] Explore in Force [0/1] [Ruins] [Mundane] [Guilds] - FREE MAP SPENT
      -[X] The Godly Womb [0/1] [Consume 1 Scale] [Tower that Think] - 1 AP
      -[X] Build the Heavenly Cities [Mundane] Updated
      --[X] Halls of Battles [0/1] [Sundial Tower] [Doomed] - 1 AP
      -[X] Righteous Reordering of Travels [0/2] [Consume 1 Scale] [Sundial Tower]
    Click to expand...
     
  • Voting
    • So the Path of Elements cycle plan has at very least started. I'm extremely curious how the Tyrant write in is going to turn out, as well as the collaboration results.
     
    i'm looking forward to it as well. it isn't meant to be a full on hop to democracy, but more of a introduction into the theory of power and accountability for the philosophers and mundanes. combined with the conclave where they're creating laws it should be the seed for a proto-legislature at the very least, an experiment in governance
     
    Due to nature on how Philosophers works and by nature of the White Towe, i don't think we're ever going to have a democracy. But we can make one that is actually acting in good faith and stuff
     
    no, we're certainly unlikely to ever have a democratic state. the very fact that our country is ruled by a literal order of secretive wizards who's power derives not from wealth and popular mandate, but from their ability to perform magic precludes any sort of true democracy, however we can include... let's say accountable power structures. the intent of the council of guiding hands is meant to give the mundanes an ability to coordinate and decide amongst themselves instead of being adjudicated upon by the order. the main advantage of our political system, i think, is that the philosopher's power, unlike in our society, is strangely unpolitical. philosophers gain power through living their philosophy, and a large component of that is treating the mundanes not necessarily well, but goodly.

    there is a very heavily engrained culture in the order that's... not anti-authoritarian, more anti-tyrannical. due to the fact that their philosophy is likely literally corrupted by trying to seize mundane power they are actually encouraged to not interfere in mundane affairs.

    however, this is where the guilds come in. as mundanes there power derives slightly from the philosopher's teachings, but they aren't as unerringly dedicated to the path, so their power, despite being philosophical, is still mundane. mundane power is accrued politically, and unaccountable political power is very prone to corruption, because to center more power into yourself is to take it away from someone else. mundane power is prone to tyranny if unchecked.

    we do have an excellent checking mechanism, the white tower, but the more time they spend making sure tyrants don't arise is less time they have for philosophy and more chance to get a taste of mundane power. what's needed is a system for the mundanes to accrue their power without the system actively encouraging a descent to tyranny. that way, even though tyrants will pop up, they'll arise less often, and will therefore trigger the checking mechanism less, and society can continue on its merry way

    so democracy as a political structure is likely to arise not out of some principle of freedom, but because it's easier to passively influence and control. cause, i mean, when you control literal fate it's easy to make sure the right guy wins elections
     
    Last edited:
    Is that a miss for asteroid hit for comet if I've understood it correctly?
     
    Well then, I guess we'll get to see the options for the astroids then, and if we want to invest in that over the comet. I think it's going to mainly depend on the Cost in actions terms, but exciting stuff!
     
    Reader mode
    You must login or register to reply here.
    Remove ads
    Back
    Top