Probably the guy who takes over the legions, I believe Telamon mentioned him.

I don't see spending our XP on logistics as useful currently. I'd prefer military due to the coming battles and sieges for this war and we can easily just hand off logistics to Pompulussa or Caracalla, who have been in the Legion longer than us and have better stats in logistics. I feel like logistics is a stat we should slowly build up because we have other officers with better stats, we can't be amazing in everything so we hand off the things we're bad at to others.
We are the guy who takes over the legion if Marius dies. It goes us than Marius.

When Marius dies not much will be holding the 6 legions and mercenaries together other than fear if Sulla or Mithridites. We need to be prepared to lead the legion over to Sulla when Marius dies.
 
We are the guy who takes over the legion if Marius dies. It goes us than Marius.

When Marius dies not much will be holding the 6 legions and mercenaries together other than fear if Sulla or Mithridites. We need to be prepared to lead the legion over to Sulla when Marius dies.
Oh that's what you meant by. Well, even then, I seriously doubt we'll be able to do that without any troubles and there's a chance that Marius will survive this war. I don't think we'll be able to take control of the legion, not with Cassianus here. Plus, I seriously doubt the 6th will go over to Sulla since they have a 10/10 with Marius, I reckon the idea of that would make them disgusted with us unless we somehow crit a diplomacy role with our Legion. And if Marius dies, I seriously doubt that Marius doesn't have some sort of second in command or someone he trusts more than the other Legates in this army, the army wouldn't fall apart at Marius' but there would be a lot of confusion I imagine
 
We WILL need logistics though. That's how wars are won. Not with tactics or strategy. It's how Rome beat Hannibal.
OK, but don't think of "how wars are won," think about what we, specifically, are being asked to do right now in the context of this campaign. Marius has specifically got us (and Cassianus) commanding the legion in battles.

We can entrust the logistics to an experienced centurion. We can't entrust leadership of (half of) the legion to a subordinate.

Right now, our specific use of the Military skill on the battlefield is going to make a big difference. Logistics rolls are in play, they're not irrelevant, but we're integrated into a larger army that has other Logistics experts besides just us.

I'm not saying Logistics is unimportant or unnecessary, to be very clear. What I'm saying is that buying a +2 to all our Military dice rolls for the rest of the campaign until such time as we would finally have earned like 5000+ Military XP the hard way is worth a lot.

We are the guy who takes over the legion if Marius dies. It goes us than Marius.
Not really.

Right now Atellus and Cassianus are co-commanders of one legion. There are several other Marians who have more seniority than us and much higher political rank and informal status. Carbo, for instance.

Atellus doesn't somehow end up in command of this gigantic military force of multiple legions and Greek mercenaries and whatnot if Marius dies.

Of course, if Marius dies, we're likely to be screwed and have the army fall apart... but if our having +4 bonus on Military rolls instead of +2 won't save us from that fate, then having marginally less-bad Logistics skills won't save us either.

When Marius dies not much will be holding the 6 legions and mercenaries together other than fear
Yeah- but again, having slightly less-bad Logistics rolls won't help us with that more than good Military rolls, not in an obvious and clear-cut way. Both skills are important and I'm pretty sure that sometimes they even contribute to the same roll!

Oh that's what you meant by. Well, even then, I seriously doubt we'll be able to do that without any troubles and there's a chance that Marius will survive this war. I don't think we'll be able to take control of the legion, not with Cassianus here. Plus, I seriously doubt the 6th will go over to Sulla since they have a 10/10 with Marius, I reckon the idea of that would make them disgusted with us unless we somehow crit a diplomacy role with our Legion. And if Marius dies, I seriously doubt that Marius doesn't have some sort of second in command or someone he trusts more than the other Legates in this army, the army wouldn't fall apart at Marius' but there would be a lot of confusion I imagine
Given that Atellus is at like 9/10 with the legion, he probably COULD sway them to Sulla if Marius were dead... and if Cassianus, who as a novus homo to beat all novus homo, weren't absolutely sure to complicate the situation.

Legions take a lot of money and effort to maintain. They don't fight just for ideology; they fight for a commander who has what it takes to reward them with riches, status, and land. If Marius dies, "Marianism" is going to fall apart pretty badly, because none of his individual supporters really have the clout to promise that to a large army.
 
Given that Atellus is at like 9/10 with the legion, he probably COULD sway them to Sulla if Marius were dead... and if Cassianus, who as a novus homo to beat all novus homo, weren't absolutely sure to complicate the situation.
I'll admit that it's possible for us to sway the Legion to Sulla's side but I still think it'll be tough to convince the legion. We'd be running off right after Marius dies and while all of the men are grieving for him, the Novus Homo who raise all the way to the top. If I was a legionnaire and some kid who wasnt even 20 told me to pack up our stuff and go to Marius' enemy, and Marius is a guy I respect and love, I'd be pissed off at this patrician kid.


Also, a side note for everyone, do we know where Sulla is? We just know he's in Bithynia right? If he isn't, I don't like the odds of marching around in contested territory with Mithridates and angry Marian forces near by.
 
I'll admit that it's possible for us to sway the Legion to Sulla's side but I still think it'll be tough to convince the legion. We'd be running off right after Marius dies and while all of the men are grieving for him, the Novus Homo who raise all the way to the top. If I was a legionnaire and some kid who wasnt even 20 told me to pack up our stuff and go to Marius' enemy, and Marius is a guy I respect and love, I'd be pissed off at this patrician kid.
Oh, I figure we'd have to wait a while for the legionnaires to grieve and all that.

But eventually they're going to have to figure out "what the fuck do we do now," and there are only so many answers to that.

The time to make the switch would come soon enough, unless one of Marius' other subordinates such as Carbo really surpasses himself.
 
Oh, I figure we'd have to wait a while for the legionnaires to grieve and all that.

But eventually they're going to have to figure out "what the fuck do we do now," and there are only so many answers to that.

The time to make the switch would come soon enough, unless one of Marius' other subordinates such as Carbo really surpasses himself.
Okay, yeah, waiting would be the best choice. After we wait a bit and suck up to our legion and maybe Cassianus, we can then switch sides
 
Cassianus is so novus homo that he might very well actually be ideologically opposed to ever joining Sulla personally. Even with Marius dead, his prospects might very well be no worse aligned against Sulla than they are aligned with him.
 
As a purely technical matter, Cassianus isn't a novus homo. He's a member of the Scipione branch of the patrician gens Cornelia, even if only by adoption. He's not necessarily vehemently opposed to Sulla.

(In fact, if origins factor into it, Cassianus has far more in common with Sulla than with Marius.)
 
Cassianus stood there and watched his adoptive father be demolished by Marius, just seconds before sucking up to him. I doubt it will be too hard to convince him to switich sides after the Marians start falling apart. That guy is just as pragmatic and ambitious as we are.
 
Cassianus is so novus homo that he might very well actually be ideologically opposed to ever joining Sulla personally. Even with Marius dead, his prospects might very well be no worse aligned against Sulla than they are aligned with him.
Leaving aside Cassianus' fast switching when his patron was disgraced, we have a wiki article written by Telamon that says that Cassianus made a good career after Marian cause died at Meander. It's not exactly hard canon, but it's another indication of his pragmatism.
 
Logistics is likely to come in handy if, by some lucky alignment of the stars, we would be able to actually carry out the Egyptian campaign later. Given that the climate and the terrain would pretty much make it a southern equivalent of invading Russia in winter.
 
Logistics is likely to come in handy if, by some lucky alignment of the stars, we would be able to actually carry out the Egyptian campaign later. Given that the climate and the terrain would pretty much make it a southern equivalent of invading Russia in winter.
By that time, after that many turns, we'll have had ample time to level up the overarching Military stat AND the Logistics skill.
 
True, but right now we have ample opportunities for gaining Military XP via direct practice, while a chance to study Logistics is unlikely to turn up for quite a long time (I think, it was even referenced explicitly that Thalatta is going to be our last stop for Personal actions before a very long break).
 
True, but right now we have ample opportunities for gaining Military XP via direct practice, while a chance to study Logistics is unlikely to turn up for quite a long time (I think, it was even referenced explicitly that Thalatta is going to be our last stop for Personal actions before a very long break).
Ample opportunities that come from battles that we have to command, with Military stat being extremely relevant. Logistics, on the other hand, is something that we will likely be able to delegate until we have a chance to learn them.
 
True, but right now we have ample opportunities for gaining Military XP via direct practice, while a chance to study Logistics is unlikely to turn up for quite a long time (I think, it was even referenced explicitly that Thalatta is going to be our last stop for Personal actions before a very long break).
I actually think it would be appropriate to use the next narrative break to study Logistics (or Engineering/Sailing). All these skills are at terrible levels right now and spending our hard earned free xp will still leave them in a bad state. If we go back to year long study action over whatever break follows this arc, then we should be able to make more significant gains in at least one of these areas.

In general, skills are something that can gain large study boost until you reach a certain (so far unspecified) point. From then on only practical experience (aka taking related actions) will advance that skill. Thus I think it makes more sense to grind low skills with study actions instead of free xp.
 
You would delegate it. Atellus isn't stupid — you can safely assume in all situations where his subordinates or followers might be better at something, he'll delegate, unless it is a situation where he clearly cannot or it would cause harm to his reputation.
Here. We have an WOG.
 
I'm against putting it in logistics at the moment. The result would only be that we would be less terrible at it and that we would still leave the task in the hands of our more capable subordinates.

By contrast getting to rank 15 is a massive increase in our second best stat which I'm sure will be noticed by others around Atellus.

While I want to get logistics sooner than later, we aren't currently in desperate need of it and in our 9-10 years left in service will surely get to learn more about it.
 
True - I kind of forgot about the option to delegate logistics to the officers.

Which - if we do go down the Egyptian route later on, Sailing is going to be another skill worth investing in side by side with logistics once we get a break. Maritime battles proved to be pretty vital in determining Egyptian campaigns historically.
 
I'm not sure if a truly great military commander can afford to be bad at logistics. Delegating it to underlings works on a tactical scale, bit no strategy is sound without taking it into account. It's better to earn it early, rather than be made a consul and discover we can't make a strategic plan worth a second glance.
 
I'm not sure if a truly great military commander can afford to be bad at logistics. Delegating it to underlings works on a tactical scale, bit no strategy is sound without taking it into account. It's better to earn it early, rather than be made a consul and discover we can't make a strategic plan worth a second glance.
Good thing then that Atellus still has around 24 years to learn it.
 
Last edited:
There is also the factor of just how many points we need - our next Military threshold is 7500 XP away, so even if we sink all our free 4800 XP into it it's not going to help us rank up in the nearest future, while the Logistics demands are much lower (I mean, our next rank is literally 102 XP away rn), so our free XP bounty is going to make much more difference there.
 
Back
Top