That's actually a good cue, what do we do if Marius dies and we are deep within Pontic territory? Obviously we won't be able to just pack up and leave, but we want to switch sides as soon as possible.
How well does Strabo do? I don't remember it clearly, but if I'm not mistaken after Marius' death in OTL Sulla was more or less able to just bribe the Marian legions in Asia to bolster his forces. Was Strabo there? Am I remembering things wrong?
Obviously I am not expecting us to turn him, but can he keep the troops in order in case Marius dies? (Not to mention that this campaign might fatten the war chest of the Marian legions).
I, personally, do not think that Cybele's priests in and around Nicomedia had some special ability in interpreting Crone's prophecies, and so believe that temple in Sardis can do the job just as well. More than that, temple in Sardis does have a reason to be fond of Rome right now, and so their chances of giving us positive modifiers should be higher, perhaps even higher than those from Temple of Apollo. Also, there's something to be said for getting the interpretation now, and not later.
It's not a special ability I think they have; it's just experience with the Crone and greater experience interpreting her prophecies. As for any Eunuchs in Sardis, that to me seems incredibly unlikely but is hopefully something @Telamon will clarify as he was happy enough to put the chances of gaining modifiers in the other votes.
I'm afraid, on this, we're just going to have to agree to disagree.
How well does Strabo do? I don't remember it clearly, but if I'm not mistaken after Marius' death in OTL Sulla was more or less able to just bribe the Marian legions in Asia to bolster his forces. Was Strabo there? Am I remembering thinks wrong?
Obviously I am not expecting us to turn him, but can he keep the troops in order in case Marius dies? (Not to mention that this campaign might fatten the war chest of the Marian legions).
Obviously historically there was no Marius in Asia, because Marius was dead , and likewise there was no Carbo. It was Lucius Valerius Flaccus who was sent and just as happened here he was betrayed by Fimbria but he had already lost a few Legions to Sulla at that point (storms caused his advanced legions to be separated from the rest and they eventually stumbled into Sulla and went over to him).
Carbo stayed in Italy with Cinna and helped prepare the defense against Sulla. He was unable to stop Sulla and lost every battle, which is somewhat understandable given it's Sulla.
However, he seems to have been very competent and was very devoted to Marius. There's no mention of him being as hated by Sulla as, say, Sertorius was so it's possible if he'd surrendered he'd have been spared. But even with Marius dead and their hopes of victory being incredibly slim he fought on... Needless to say, I think you're probably right to say we're not bringing him over to Sulla.
As to whether he can keep control... Probably, especially as he seems to be the only Legate serving under Marius. But if we went over to Sulla (as I hope we would in that situation) and they were suddenly outnumbered 2:1 (in terms of legions) I expect a few would start to peel off.
That's actually a good cue, what do we do if Marius dies and we are deep within Pontic territory? Obviously we won't be able to just pack up and leave, but we want to switch sides as soon as possible.
How well does Strabo do? I don't remember it clearly, but if I'm not mistaken after Marius' death in OTL Sulla was more or less able to just bribe the Marian legions in Asia to bolster his forces. Was Strabo there? Am I remembering things wrong?
Obviously I am not expecting us to turn him, but can he keep the troops in order in case Marius dies? (Not to mention that this campaign might fatten the war chest of the Marian legions).
In OTL Carbo never went to Asia, only Flaccus and Fimbria went there to fight Mithridates. Which went about as well as you would expect.
With Sertorius off in Hispania Carbo rose to the de-facto leadership over the Marian faction after Cinna died. He managed to get Sulla declared enemy of the state and got himself and Marius the Younger elected as Consuls, commanding newly raised legions to oversee the defence of Italia. Here the accounts get murky, but from my understanding Carbo was unable to defeat Pompey's forces in the north and found himself outmaneuvered by the Sullan forces.
Can he keep the troops in order? Probably for some time, although we would be in a position to seriously impede that. However between Sulla and Mithridates he would soon find himself outmatched militarily. His safest bet would then probably be a full relocation to Italia, otherwise I expect the Marian legions to start deserting to Sulla once the defeats and forced retreats start.
If Marius manages to make a lasting peace with Mithridates before dying, then the situation is probably a bit more tenable, but not by much I would wager.
Well, now that I actually have some time I have a couple of concerns about a some of these plans.
As for [] Plan Gold of Heart and Red of Hand I think I've covered that sufficiently now. Suffice it to say I'm unconvinced that these Eunuchs are worth going to as I don't believe they would be as capable as the others. And, honestly, even if they are I think they represent a poor choice to go to to get the prophecy interpreted. The Priests of Apollo, who have no dislike of Rome and represent a greater chance for positive modifiers are a much better choice imo.
[] Plan Renowned Tribune
-[] Make Connections: The patriarchs of Sardis are always eager to make friends with young Roman tribunes, for young Roman tribunes often become young Roman governors, and it is always a pleasure to have a friend in high places. -[] Study: You study the campaigns of Marius against the Cimbri, in order to learn more of the legendary general's efforts against the foes who once threatened Rome itself. -[] The General: Marius. Fresh off of a victory and organizing yet another one, Marius has little time for inquisitive tribunes. Yet if you can get him to take a liking to you, your own position in Rome will surely soar. Both Sertorius and Sulla began their rise to power under his wing. -[] The City of Brotherly Love: The Sardisians claim that their rivals, the city of Philadelphia, induced Mithridates to sack Sardis, and indeed threw open their gates to the conquerors. Philadelphia is on Marius' route, and has no walls -- it would be an easy thing to sack it. You could make the request on behalf of the Sardisians. Philadelphia is wealthy enough, and sacking it might make you both friends and coin.
-[] Spend Bonus XP: If after these actions we are within reach of Military Rank 15, then spend as much Bonus XP as required.
The synergy between Make Connections & The City of Brotherly Love is just too time-sensitive and good to pass up on. I add to these the Study action from last turn (which is hopefully still available) and The General. While some here say that meeting Marius is dangerous and will immediately land us on Sulla's list, I disagree. IMO it is actually less dangerous than meeting The Marians. For one when Marius dies, so do our ties to Sulla's enemies. Secondly, becoming a "student" of Marius plays into the Omake, which tells Sulla to try and bring us to his side. Lastly, we still have that reroll when meeting a Sullan, so we might just end up relying on that and Scaevola. Edit: Alternatively, we might be able to do a double study action. That would then be less risky, both narratively and mechanically (due to the high DC of The General).
To fit in two Military XP gain actions, I had to leave out two very important actions:
1) The Mercenary, a very good action we should definitely take as soon as possible. However, I feel this connection will only become truly important when the time comes to defect to Sulla (after Marius kicks the bucket hopefully). Thus this action can probably wait one turn.
2) A Prophecy Action (probably the Pergamon Write-in), while I feel that we should deal with the augury sooner rather than later, I again feel this action is not that time sensitive. For one we don't know, if we are allowed a second opinion on the prophecy should one of these regional options provide underwhelming results. Secondly, the prophecy is unrelated to the current war. Since we are already planning to stop by in Delphi (to collect our Augury XP and free Rank-up for Intelligence), we could always just deliver it there ourselves.
My problem with this is three-fold (although when @Telamon gives us the current XP state it might lessen). Firstly, while I agree getting Renowned Military is important, I don't see the next battle as being so critical that it's necessary for us to ignore actions as important as the Mercenary and the Prophecy. The Mercenary is time-sensitive, and the Prophecy is currently a potentially huge asset we're ignoring. As a sub-point to this, there's a good chance that the gains from sacking Philidelphia + spent XP alone would be enough to get it without using those learning actions...
Secondly, we're depending on the dice. We've had study sessions where we only gained 300 odd XP, we could easily end up in the situation where even if we pass the Marius DC (more on that in a min) we could still fail to gain enough XP for the plan to work.
Lastly, as you acknowledge, the DC just to meet Marius is likely to be a high one. Unlike Sertorius he has no existing ties to us, and more importantly, he's an incredibly busy guy. He's prosecuting a war against a numerically superior force, in enemy territory, with the lack of secure supplies and cash that goes along with that. Now obviously every action has a chance of failure, but the chance of failure is simply too high here for an insufficient reward for me.
Really it comes down to this. Yes, Renowned Military (and the extra +2 it gives) is something we want to get pretty quickly. But you're sacrificing too many other opportunities to get it right now when we don't really need it right now.
Oh, and lastly (for real this time), we get a considerable amount of Military XP from every battle we're part of. We know how to get it and we're in a situation to do so quickly. There are other stats and skills that we have no such option for - Subterfuge* for example - where the XP might be better spent.
*This is not an argument to spend XP on subterfuge, just an example of another stat we can't increase as easily as Military.
[X] Plan Forging Friendships -[] Bonds, Battleforged: You gained respect from Cassianus after including him in your cult, and your joint command of the VI Legion was an unquestionable success, giving you an ample cause to celebrate. You attempt to use that celebration and his respect for you to forge a real friendship with your fellow tribune. -[] The Mercenary: Herakleo is lean, gnarled, and brown like a nut from years of fighting and dyign in other people's wars. Remembering your good experience with Veniximaeus, you attempt to strike up a conversation with him and his men. -[] Make Connections: The patriarchs of Sardis are always eager to make friends with young Roman tribunes, for young Roman tribunes often become young Roman governors, and it is always a pleasure to have a friend in high places. -[] The City of Brotherly Love: The Sardisians claim that their rivals, the city of Philadelphia, induced Mithridates to sack Sardis, and indeed threw open their gates to the conquerors. Philadelphia is on Marius' route, and has no walls -- it would be an easy thing to sack it. You could make the request on behalf of the Sardisians. Philadelphia is wealthy enough, and sacking it might make you both friends and coin.
Like I said before, in my opinion, getting a real friendship with Cassianus is worth more than Renowned Military or interpretation of the prophecy. Cassianus may be one stumbling block whatever we decide to do with the legion, and our relationship with him is not yet as solid as it could be. More than that, a real friendship with him might well serve us past this campaign - having ambitious and competent friends rising with us can always pay off. Last turn, I skipped Forging Bonds to fully concentrate on fixing the rift in our legion. Well, the rift is fixed, so I think it's time to pick up that skipped action.
Here's my plan. I agree that synergy between sacking Philadelphia and making connections in Sardis is too good to pass up, but, in my opinion, real friendship with Cassianus would serve us much better than either interpreting prophecy or getting Renowned Command.
Agumentic is right to say that we do need a better relationship with Cassianus before the campaign comes to an end. But while it's arguable whether it or the Prophecy is more important, I think the benefits that the Prophecy can give, in terms of positive modifiers, is more urgent.
Over the last few turns we've dedicated a considerable amount of our focus, and action economy, on Cassianus. Whether it's ingratiating ourselves with his followers, our initial attempts to connect with him, or inviting him to the Cult, we've spent a lot on him the last few turns. Now all of these were necessary actions, I'm not saying otherwise, but they also succeeded and we now have a solid relationship with him. We're 'close acquaintances/almost friends' and he respects us and right now, for one turn, that's more than enough.
Ultimately this is a matter of personal judgement about priorities, but what - other than a better working relationship - is a slightly better friendship with Cassianus going to give us next turn? Probably not much. On the other hand, getting the Prophecy interpreted by the Priests of Apollo gives us a high chance for positive modifiers, which we really could use as soon as possible.
I'm also quite wary of allowing the Prophecy to be put off again because there are 'more important' things to do. That was what we said last vote with the reasoning that we could safely put it off for a turn, but the argument is now that we can put it off again. While my primary desire in going to the Priests of Apollo is for the positive modifiers they can provide, I'm also very interested in the actions it can unlock. And also, somewhat concerned that we might end up missing opportunities to take those actions because we delay for too long.
I'll be all for spending a bit of time with Cassianus next turn, but I really don't think we can afford to let the Prophecy - and the associated benefits - go ignored right now.
And just in case it's not clear, I heartily recommend [] Plan Foundations for future success
Something to note, Marius has the Gift of Mars while Sulla has the Gift of Fortuna. That means, all else being equal, Marius will have a +4 over Sulla in a head to head fight (assuming Sulla has +8 to Military and Command as well).
I like this plan and definitely feel that getting the prophecy done before Rufus decides to take a gander at it is the right move. Also, getting some more positive modifiers for this battle should help us out a ton, especially as Marius just emphasized the quality of enemies we could be facing. I don't doubt that the opposition will have quite a few good commanders on their side. And the sooner we can get this done the sooner we can get the results back. After all, it will likely take a few turns before we hear back on the results of the prophecy even if we send it off now.
As for getting Military Rank 15, I agree that we probably don't need it right this turn. We aren't expecting any decisive battles anytime soon, so it is better to wait and try to get another small battle in and earn more xp before spending our banked xp on trying to reach Military 15. Lets see where we are after Philadelphia and then go from there.
Something to note, Marius has the Gift of Mars while Sulla has the Gift of Fortuna. That means, all else being equal, Marius will have a +4 over Sulla in a head to head fight (assuming Sulla has +8 to Military and Command as well).
Very true, although I'm hesitant to underestimate the sheer luck that the Gift of Fortuna provides. making the unlikely more likely to happen and a +1 to all rolls, even those you have no control over is pretty powerful. Plus if it really comes down to it a +5 in near-death situations would help even the situation up a bit.
A lot really is going to come down to their Legates I think.
A great many men, a lot of them probably richer and more knowledgeable about mining and more experienced than us, will have tried to reopen the literal gold mines.
If they failed, we have no reason to think we can succeed.
This option is almost certainly a trap- the result of someone successfully floating a scam idea to Atellus in hopes of milking him for money.
Not gonna pretend that this has no chance of being a waste of time, we're prospecting for gold, which was not known for its high success rate. The description of the action says that it has run dry, and we'd be testing that. A quick google search tells me that the area was also known for the wine it produced, so even if the prospecting falls through, we'd still own land that theoretically could be used to start another vineyard, which Atellus is at least familiar with. And remember we have Theo with us, who has the Gift of Hermes, so any deals we make are unlikely to be awful. Throw in the Make Connections action and I think we're going to be okay, the powerful of the city are unlikely to want to alienate us after we relieved the siege, rubbed elbows with them a bit, and agreed to go sack their rival. We'd have some amount of protection from both our new friends and from Theo noticing something is off that we'll be alright.
I don't like spending 3/4s of our so far accumulated Bonus XP on a Stat we are gonna use for 1(!) roll in the foreseeable future. Military and Command are the two most used modifiers when it comes to Battle Rolls. Last turn Marius took over our flank after we rolled a 2, but that might be different next time around. We could also find ourselves in a situation similar to Bovanium, where we are send away from the main force to deal with a isolated problem (e.g. the mutinous legionaries).
While reaching Renowned Military before the battle might not be possible, we will still need Bonus XP to Rank up after. Having even less Bonus XP available next turn will delay that additional +2 Modifier further.
Military and Command will always have more rolls than anything else, they get rolled repeatedly every battle. I would not be surprised to learn we've made more Military/Command rolls than every other roll combined, we're part of a legion, our entire existence revolves around military actions. There is no contest, at no point in the next 9 years attached to the legion will the frequency of our Stewardship rolls ever reach anything close to the frequency of our Military rolls.
That is not to say we should be ignoring Stewardship, taking actions to train our non-military stats and secure future income will pay dividends after our time with the 6th. Yes, we will be making 1(!) Stewardship roll this turn, compared to the 0(!) Military rolls without a fight, or the 15(!) Military rolls if there is one, but that bonus will still exist the next time we want to take a Stewardship action. We're also getting out letter from Scaevola fairly soon, so we might be unlocking a lot of options for investments in the near future.
Getting the +2 on military would be pretty important in a d20 system, but we have no guarantee of getting it this turn, and we're gaining military experience at a reasonable pace from all the battles anyway. If we get confirmation that the bonus experience is being added to the pool, then I'd change my opinion, but right now we're hoping to get about 3k experience from other actions before using the bonus experience. I'm actually kind of alright with that gamble, as it has a good payout if it succeeds, but it's still a gamble.
Bad dice rolls in combat isn't something we can really control, rolling a 2 vs the 20 of our opponent ends with us getting stomped regardless of our Military ability. If we're really worried about rolling 2's in battle, then we should be focusing on working better with Cassanius anyway as the last battle required us to pass a DC 13 roll with a +9 modifier. Failing that roll could be catastrophic, as we might end up losing his bonuses, or applying a malus to our rolls in addition to losing his rolls. We get a +5 from Cassanius, imagine losing that and then getting another -2 from conflicting orders. Deepening our bond with Cassinius or even getting the priests of Apollo to look at the prophecy would do more for us than increasing Military, if we're worried about bad rolls.
We'd have a chance of reaching the next level of Military before the battle after next, I think. We'd still have 1250 experience left in the pool before any extra gets added from the discussion we've already had. We got a little over 1k from the last battle, and we can assume similar levels from the next. Then we'd theoretically get additional experience from the discussion after the next update. We can study next turn, or seek out other sources, and we have no guarantee of another battle immediately after the next.
Not gonna pretend that this has no chance of being a waste of time, we're prospecting for gold, which was not known for its high success rate. The description of the action says that it has run dry, and we'd be testing that. A quick google search tells me that the area was also known for the wine it produced, so even if the prospecting falls through, we'd still own land that theoretically could be used to start another vineyard, which Atellus is at least familiar with. And remember we have Theo with us, who has the Gift of Hermes, so any deals we make are unlikely to be awful.
I would just point out two things here. Firstly we're making connections in the city so that we can make use of them in the future, so quite clearly we have plans to return here in the future (certainly I do). That being the case, there's no reason we need to use a lot of our XP to bump up our stewardship so we can try and strike it lucky this turn. We can make the connections now and revisit the opportunity when we're better prepared. Secondly, while the area does also produce wine it's very unlikely that the land we'd buy on Mount Tmolus for prospecting and mining would also be suitable for a vineyard.
That is not to say we should be ignoring Stewardship, taking actions to train our non-military stats and secure future income will pay dividends after our time with the 6th.
I agree wholeheartedly with this, Stewardship is something we need to make sure we're working on improving over the next 9 odd years of our Tribunate. We've not spent a lot of time on it until this point as we've needed to stabilise our position, but going forward we definitely need to keep it in mind.
But it has taken us more than a year in-game, and 200+ pages to bank 4050 XP and I don't see any need to spend nearly 3/4 of that on Stewardship simply to give us a slightly better chance on an action that we can take at a later date without consequences. It's also important to remember that the lower a skill is the easier it is to gain XP through self-study and learning, which is another argument against using our banked XP for this.
I'll vote with you in the future to improve Atellus' understanding of money, but I can't do it for this.
I'm personally hoping that we get the chance to learn under Scaevola again, because I really want to raise Atellus' administration skill and his stewardship as well.
That said, before we become a quaestor it's not that pressing as is getting a hold on the many subskills the military branch has (and no, just having a number of skilled subordinates is not enough). I'd rather spend exp on logistics and engineering than on stewardship right now.
Fun thought I've had, the game mentions us as having the Gift of Minerva, this actually gives me the idea of, in a possible future where Rick Riordan writes about Roman Gods instead of the Greek ones, he could mention that some Gods could bestow on mortals a gift, we could say that Attellus' mom was a devote worshiper of Minerva, and as a reward for her devotion, gives to her son great wisdom.
Fun thought I've had, the game mentions us as having the Gift of Minerva, this actually gives me the idea of, in a possible future where Rick Riordan writes about Roman Gods instead of the Greek ones, he could mention that some Gods could bestow on mortals a gift, we could say that Attellus' mom was a devote worshiper of Minerva, and as a reward for her devotion, gives to her son great wisdom.
So, we are 7,100 XP away from Renowned Military. With the Battle at the River Maeander coming up, we should see whether the addtional +2 bonus could be reached this turn. With that goal in mind I have wandered back into the thread to make sure we have an accurate Military and Bonus XP count before votings starts:
@Telamon There a three Omakes, which have yet to be awarded any XP:
On to our Bonus XP, which were last calculated at Page 202:
With 10 XP per page (I think) we are currently looking at ~250 XP from that.
Furthermore, there were a number of reaction posts:
Which would give us 700 bonus XP, although I'm not 100% what counts as a reaction post. I left out posts that dealt primarily with the available actions. With more reaction posts coming up after this, and further XP from simple discussion, we are likely gonna end up somewhere around 5,000 Bonus XP. If one or two of the Omakes give Military XP, then a write-in for a Study Military action could be a strong contender to bridge that gap!
I'm still interested, what you had in mind for that
Well, this has been annoying me all weekend, so have some unpolished word vomit.
Nola.
A pus-filled wound, you thought, word and city both, seeping hateful poison into flesh and mind alike. Even the air tasted foul.
Nola.
The city had starved Roman soldiers in cages during the Marsic War, you remembered. Now it starved them again. The thought lit a sour, sullen flame in you, a sick, feverish heat gnawing at your bones.
Nola.
The city had stolen something from you and the legion. As the men's flesh wasted, their humanity melted away like snow in midsummer. Wolves, the Samnites had liked to call the men of Rome. Before the walls of Nola you saw those words made truth. Wolves with empty bellies, held in check only by the will of Sertorius.
And was even his steel proof against the cesspool of Nola?
The sound of a footstep drew you from your reverie. You broke your baleful stare from the walls and turned to find Sertorius looming from the shadows and mists of the dawn, as though summoned by your thoughts. The legate nodded in greeting, his own gaze drawn to the city. The two of you stood there, scanning for any sign of weakness, any hint that might allow you to end this and remember what it was to be men again.
"Sulla won his Grass Crown here."
Sertorius spoke quietly, almost as though you were conversing over wine on a triclinium back in Rome. That startled you, almost as much as the seeming non-sequitur.
"He was besieging Pompeii," the legate continued, his voice taking on a cadence you recognised from evening discussions in his tent and long hours listening to Scaevola expound on the finer points of oratory and the courts, "when his army was menaced by a relief force commanded by one Lucius Cleuntius. Sulla was outnumbered, and his army was dispersed around the city to maintain the blockade. It should have been yet another reverse for us in the south, another army lost uselessly. Should have been, and would have been with almost anyone else in the command tent."
Sertorius shook his head.
"He might look like the favourite catamite of an Asiatic potentate, but Sulla can fight. He formed up what men he had to hand, sent orders to the rest to assemble, and attacked Cleuntius before he was out of column of march. Drove him all the the way here, and smashed him under the walls. Killed Cluentius himself, they say. That is what Sulla does better than anyone else. Marius is a better organiser, I have a better eye for ground, but Lucius Cornelius understands the bringing of power to a point better than any man since Scipio and Hannibal. He is wolf and serpent both."
He fell silent, gazing at the ground as though he could see the battle.
"A great victory, to be sure, but not what I would have thought Grass Crowns were made of," you ventured after a moment.
Sertorius grinned.
"It was perhaps a little unconventional, but the army was saved, and they presented him with the crown on the battlefield, woven from the freshly blooded grass as custom dictates. That is what matters in the end."
Silence fell again.
"What prompted this?" you ask at last.
Sertorius looked at you, and that gaze burned away some of foul miasma in which Nola had wreathed your soul. You straightened.
"Sulla killed his prisoners in sight of the walls of Nola, and marched back to take Pompeii, and Herculaneum, and Aeclanum. But Nola held, and Samnium held, because not all the savagery and low cunning of the wolf and the serpent was sufficient to conquer or cow the Samnites. Only men can manage that, Quintus Cingulatus, only men."
Above the ailing city of Bovianum, the sky slowly turned red as the sun began to set. The city life, far from what it had been before the Samnite uprising, slowly died down as men and women shuffled along the roads, not quite fleeing to the warm and safe embrace of their homes.
Roman legionaries did not patrol the city, but they were inside, watching Samnites with weary eyes, holding key locations of the formerly proud city.
Most importantly as day slowly gave way to night were what were once mighty gatehouses and the city palace.
In fact, Atellus, bent over the sturdy table writing, had posted two legionaries as guards in front of the city magistrate's solar which he now occupied like his men did Bovianum.
He had taken to spending some nights in Bovianum as a show of faith and confidence, but he was no fool, and did so only with a small guard.
Gemino's thrice damned letter in his tent has seen to that.
However, in his role of occupier, no, administrator of a Roman city, his duties often forced him, occupied him long enough that returning to the legion's camp often proved inopportune.
Trials had to be held and cases judged, food deliveries distributed, refugees from beyond the city limits needed to be taken care off...
It was never ending work and Atellus longed on certain days for the hours of riding with the Gauls, the wind brushing past his face, spear and shield in his hands, gladius at his hips.
This was not one of these days however, Gemino had not seen fit to show himself in as many weeks and the elder council had convened to discuss one matter or the other.
Atellus sighed and put the quill aside, taking the opportunity to rest his head in his hands.
Snakes, all of them, from agitators, to corrupt business men to criminals. Hackling for small concessions as Atellus was meant to direct a war to protect them.
Then a knock on the door stirred the young tribune from his grumblings and on his affirmative one of his men stepped in.
"Hail, tribune. Marius Himatus Censer asks for entry. He claims you have sent for him."
Atellus nodded, smiled and waved.
"I did indeed, thank you. Let him in."
The legionary, Lucius as Atellus recalled, nodded curtly as only a man of the army could, and let the Samnite noble in, before stepping out.
Where Atellus' face showed exhaustion, Himatus looked sharp and fresh in his rich clothes. Clearly, where Atellus felt at home in the legion's camp and on the march, the older man, a Samnite of Roman citizenship, did not wither away in the hours and hours of council meetings.
"Hail, tribune. You have sent for me?"
Again Atellus nodded and beckoned him to take a seat at the table he once might have sat on the opposite side of.
"True, and I thank you that you came to this late hour."
"As always it is an honour, tribune, and I'm a loyal servant of Rome," Himatus' face was grave, before getting softer as his eyes roamed the table and the scroll in front of the Roman, "I see that you are still hard at work despite the trying day. If I may speak so freely, I wish my son was as diligent as you."
Atellus snorted at the blunt compliment, shaking his head ever so slightly. Himatus was always quick to reaffirm his loyalty to Rome, and was a flatterer to boot.
Snakes there may have been among the men of the council fighting for his patronage, but still Himatus stood out among them for the simplest of reasons. That unlike all the others, he did not ask for power and wealth in exchange for his aid in taming his city to Roman will.
He had simply asked for help to move his family to Rome, mightiest of all cities.
Perhaps it made him a snake of a different sort then, one not to Rome, but of the eternal city, a traitor to his people.
It was this that Atellus needed in this moment.
"I thank you, but I did not send for words dripping of honey. Will the Pentri leaders still convene in Aquilonia?"
Himatus nodded in affirmation as the younger man poured wine in a cup and offered it to him.
"They still do, tribune, and the invitation is still extended to you," he he drank from the cup as Atellus watched,"it was no small task, but eventually even the heated words of the villages in the west could not prevent it," Atellus face turned into a small grimace at the mention of the west, "A shame the gathering has to be held in Aquilonia, but circumstances being as they are..."
"Travelling to Aquilonia is still safer than it is to Bovianum with Gemino in the wind, despite the fact that he and his bandits have not shown themselves for days," Atellus concluded.
"It is precisely because of this meeting that I called for you, Himatus," Atellus' arm swept across the table, calling attention to the text in front of him, "As you can see, I have been hard at work for the gathering. However, my attempts at crafting a speech have yet to yield promising returns."
Atellus raised an eyebrow and looked his client in the eyes.
"I trust you understand how important the outcome of the meeting is for Rome and Bovianum."
Those words led to a sly smile crossing the Samnite's face as he answered.
"Of course, tribune, but I fear that my skill at oratory is measly compared to yours and what Scaevola Pontifex could not have taught you, I certainly cannot do."
"Then it's of good fortune that I do not ask for your skill on the podium, but for your life experience. Tell me, Marius Himatus Censer of the Pentri," Atellus leaned forward, stern eyes caging him, "you were one of the most important administrators of the Italiots during the Social War. In fact, I sit where you once did."
"Why did you turn your back on your people and embraced Rome?"
"The glory of Rome blinded me," the Samnite immediately answered with smile which quickly died to Atellus' neutral expression. The older man sighed and drank from his golden cup.
"The war was fought because the Senate would not grant us citizenship, or at least it was the case for all but the Samnites. When it was finally granted, the Samnites fought on against that unceasing tide of swords that is the legions. All was lost and I took the citizenship as the first among many. I did not wish to see my family and myself paraded in Rome."
Atellus nodded slowly. A hint of disappointment marred his features.
"It was fear of Rome's sword, of her teeth that turned you."
Silence reigned in the solar, as Himatus averted his eyes. He closed them then, and looked back to Atellus.
"Yes, but it is not quite the whole truth," Himatus said slowly, weighing his words.
"Tell me tribune, what father could watch his children be murdered and enslaved, what husbands could see his wife raped?" he said with a quiet voice, "what man does not feel a small quiver in his bones at the thought of defying the eagle standard? It is however, not quite just fear and self interest that guided my decision...," his voice trailed off. A sigh escaped him.
"A Roman as young as you might not understand, no, you would have had to live in the time of old Carthage, when hated Hannibal roamed the width of Italia. Hatred," he exhaled, "it is like a fire, an inferno inside the man. And as all fires it, too, consumes. It feeds of the man, of his thoughts, his life, his very energy. It exhausts, it becomes one's focus."
He took a breath as Atellus took to his own wine cup, watching the man intently.
"A hate of a people is a similar, but different sort. For one man, his hate consumes him from within more than it does from without. Death may come to him because of ceaseless desire for revenge and cruelty, but it's his spirit first and foremost that is the victim."
He took a breath and looked outside the window to see the city at night.
"Hatred of a people consumes the world around it before it does the spirit. Villages burn, cities are laid to waste, famine and pestilence spread as easily as rumours of atrocities. It does not matter whose lands are raped and turned to ash, of the hated or the hating, but it's all the same! See the city, tribune, and see a city slowly burning for the hatred of the Samnites! Our walls and roads destroyed, us starving!
Atellus considered the man who had talked himself into a frenzy as he let go of long harboured feelings.
"Then it was not just fear for yourself, your family and your estate that made you turn to Rome. You could not watch these hills of yours burn. Watch your people slaughtered."
Himatus, now a little winded, but recovering, chuckled. Atellus who had been mustering him like a puzzle solved, raised an eyebrow.
"I was the administrator of theses lands as you said, tribune. I watched as harvests became smaller, the census decreased, as taxes had to be increased to see the coffers reach the same stand from years before. And what for? Because we wish not know our grandchildren's grandchildren to speak Latin before their native tongue? We do not want them to be citizens and become politicians and generals for Rome? We'd rather see our children sold as slaves in Rome and Pergamon and Alexandria?"
He shook his head.
"Gemino would see the Athens of Samnium burn like Athens in Hellas, the carcass of Bovianum a monument to his defiance. Like Aeclanum before her."
Atellus, understanding dawning on his features, finally leaned back. No longer did he feel the need to watch from up close the man like one would watch the games in the arena.
"You see folly in defying her, but safety in embracing Rome. A land not littered with the ruins of a people, but cities bustling with life, well fed and rich from trade and loot of from foreign lands. You are tired of war, death and hate," Atellus summarised, ideas swirling in his head.
"Citizenship allows a man to travel from Hispania to Hellas, knowing that he will be heard before a judge, "Himatus agreed, slowly nodding, "his life protected on the promise that his death may incur the wrath of the legions. But in her defiance of it, Samnium would rather burn as the rest of Italia flourishes... will flourish, when either Marius or Sulla find their end."
Atellus, now glancing at his scroll, rose from his seat, prompting Himatus to do the same. He walked around the table, clasping the older man's shoulders.
"Then why move to Rome?"
"Safety for my family, tribune. Whatever the outcome, there will always be those who see me and mine as traitors. There is no telling of what will become of Samnium, but there will be those who wish to kill me regardless. Everyone in Samnium can tell off loss of a family member."
"Even if these lands prosper again?"
"I believe that every Samnite is tired of war in different measures, but for some even that will not extinguish hate."
Atellus squeezed Himatus' shoulder and gave him a curt nod.
"Have no fear, I will help you and yours move to Rome," he said, "I came to Bovianum to help and reward those who stayed loyal to Rome and I will see the city safe before I leave."
He let go of Himatus and glanced back to the table with his draft.
"Thank you, now I know of what to write."
—————
Obviously I don't know if this conflicts with whatever Telamon has planned for our client since he didn't have a speaking role, but I felt like writing this.
"Okay, so I think we've narrowed it down as much as possible." You say, pacing your room slowly. Rufus sits with a wad of papers on a small stool, watching you decidedly nonplussed.
"You think?" he replies sarcastically. "So far 'Africa's heir' could be referring to Marius or Sulla, who both earned their names in Africa."
"And given the nature of prophecies," you interject. "it would not be impossible for the prophecy to refer to both at once, just to mess with us and be right whichever way the die falls."
"Precisely, it could also refer to literally any descendant of Scipio Africanus, the most relevant being Asiaticus…"
"I would struggle to call him relevant after the public execution Marius delivered."
"…and Cassianus."
"I find it unlikely to be him. He's adopted, and we seem to have hit it off recently. Still…" you trail off.
"We cannot rule out any possibility." says Rufus, finishing the sentence that had been oft repeated during the process of deciphering the Crone's prophecy. He locks eyes with you as he continues down the list and deadpans. "Then there is myself, of course."
"Even less likely than Cassianus in my opinion, but you did conquer Africa's culture by virtue of studying it, meaning you could pass on their legacy by teaching others. If that's not an heir, what is?" you question, defending the passing idea that needed to be added to the list. You could not rule out any possibility.
"Ptolemy."
"A generous reading of a map would place Egypt in Africa, and he is certainly the most heir-like we've encountered." Rufus nods his agreement.
"Lastly, and most specifically, we have literally anybody born in Africa." The last part of the sentence contains all of Rufus' frustration.
"Prophecy often hinges on the little things. We cannot only consider the great men of our era, but the insignificant ones who, by virtue of doing whatever they do in the prophecy, become great men."
"Well, that settles it. I think I know what the prophecy means."
"Really?" Excitement creeps into your query. Leave it to Rufus to deduce something first. That brain of his always was his strongest attribute.
"Yes, I've deduced that this entire thing is a waste of time." Rants Rufus. "It's so vague as to be worthless! We can't even figure out the one person who isn't us referred to directly by an epithet."
"A thought occurs." You pause in dread. "The prophecy does not say 'beware of Africa's heir', merely 'beware Africa's heir'. It may not be a message for us to beware of Africa's heir, but a more general warning that Africa's heir should beware."
"Oh, simply wonderful! We have no clue who this thrice damned prophecy refers to, and now we don't even know what it means in respect to the person we can't identify! I feel like we've made negative progress!"
Rufus airing his grievances is cut short by a knock on the door. Your friend resigns to fuming silently as you open it for the courier, who hands you several packets of documents.
"Rufus, I suspected we two men, unversed in verse, might turn up nothing. To that end, I sent several letters when we first heard the prophecy, consulting the those who might know more of how the future is read."
Understanding dawns on Rufus' face. "You've written to Scaevola! Wonderful! If anyone can decipher this nonsense, it'll be the Pontifex Maximus."
You flick the letter open and dramatically clear your throat. "It pleases me to know that my pupils has done so well for himself…" you trail off, skimming the letter for the reference to the prophecy. You'll read the rest later. "Ah, here we go. The first verse refers to you, my pupils. Until you have earned a new name, you must be wary of Africa's heir, an obvious reference to Marius, who earned his name in the land. However, given the context of the prophecy at large, it is apparent that Marius is not only a threat to you, but to the Republic of Rome itself."
"Does he mention that he wouldn't need a prophecy to tell us that much?" asks Rufus, enjoying his patron's words, even conveyed in written form.
"He does, of course." You laugh. Clearing your throat, you continue. "The she referred to in the rest of the prophecy is primarily Rome, specifically the institutions of the Republic. The second verse addresses the corruption and inefficiency that has been present since the fall of Carthage, brought to the forefront by Marius and his ilk. It further predicts the eventual fall of Rome one thousand and thirty years after it's founding, or three hundred and sixty years from this one."
"A hard date." Says Rufus, awed by how easily Scaevola has made sense of the rhyming stanzas that have perplexed the two of you on and off for months.
"However, this refers not to Rome itself, but the institutions of the Republic and democracy itself. Rome itself will continue on as a shell of its former self, more successful than ever on the outside, but hollow of the ideals and traditions that define it. While the prophecy places the fall of the Republic lifetimes from now, the events are set in motion in today's age. Marius must be stopped if the Republic is to survive. Rome needs Sulla."
"What of the last two verses?" asks Rufus. "We never got past the first, but those ones always seemed the most confusing."
"The last two verses are repetitious. This Crone would make a poor orator." The two of you chuckle at the joke injecting some levity to the dire predictions in the rest of the letter. "It purports that Rome appealed to the an unnamed goddess, likely Cybele given the source of this prophecy, for aid in defeating Carthage. Apparently, the cost for this aid was never paid by Rome, and the fall of the Republic may be averted should we balance the books of this ancient debt. I will inquire as to any offering to Cybele during that time frame, though I suspect the records lost by now."
You drop out of the (absolutely dreadful) Scaevola impression you hadn't recognized that you'd slipped into as you conclude. "He goes on to wish us the best of luck in our endeavors, go Sulla, screw Marius and the like."
Rufus pauses at that last part. "Atellus, it occurs to me that while Scaevola is the most religious man in all of Rome, he is still a man. Is it not possible that his biases cloud his interpretation of the prophecy?"
You smile at Rufus' concern and hold up the second letter. "Unlike you, my dear Rufus, I anticipated such an event when I first sent the letter. Which is why I sent a copy of the prophecy not only to our patron, but to that young priest of Jupiter."
"The one from the Triumph?"
"Exactly. As it turns out, he's Marius' nephew or some such. Regardless of the exact relation, he's decidedly pro-Marius, and we can count on his interpretation to lean in support of Marius. If we put his and Scaevola's together, we should find the truth where they agree and somewhere in the middle of where they differ."
"Should I write to Cicero and tell him to be jealous?" jabs Rufus.
"Hysterical." You deadpan. "Now onto the letter. Dear Atellus, you and I are destined for greatness. Why don't you return to Rome. My sister is attractive and dtf right now."
"Well that sounds like a brilliant idea!" says Rufus as your face contorts in confusion. "Wouldn't you agree, Atellus? Atellus? Atellus?"
XXX
"Atellus? For gods' sake man, wake up!" You groan awake to the sound of Rufus.
"Wha happun?" It's hardly intelligible as human speech, but Rufus gets the drift.
"What happened is you and Cassianus drunk yourselves into a stupor last night. I should write Cicero and tell him to be jealous the way you two have been getting along." You chuckle at real Rufus echoing what you are slowly realizing to have been drunken dream Rufus. The act of laughing drives a spear through your skull.
"Ow."
"Honestly, this is pathetic." chides Rufus. "You're obviously in no condition to do anything today, and I suspect Cassianus is no better. I'll keep the legion from falling apart for today. I'll say you two are… devising strategies or some such and don't wish to be disturbed. But you owe me for this."
Your eyelids flutter shut again, but you manage to murmur one last sentiment. "You da bes, Rufus." Then the sweet, sweet void of unconsciousness takes you.
A/N: Rufus is indeed the best. I totally didn't retcon this into a dream sequence because I have no idea what Caesar would write. No sir, not at all.
Bonus:
TL;DR lol Go Team Sulla! Fight fight fight! Fuck Marius btw
The Romans are the sons of Mars, and Minerva's position as the goddess of war has declined in Rome compared to the Greeks, who loved her in battle and shunned Ares. One so devoted or so inclined could form a cult to the mother of war.
If the gods are truly real, neither you or I can say, but one who believes he is blessed by the Soldier God in all things fights harder. One who believes Victory rides with him puts his all into every contest. One who believes that lady Luck herself dogs his shadow will fight like a fox, clever and daring. He who believes furious Bellona guides his hand will strike all the harder.
What then, of him who believes that the Lady of War and Wisdom rules his days? Maybe your bonuses aren't quite as high as they could be.
Let no man stop to plunder,
But slay, and slay, and slay;
The gods who live forever
Are on our side to-day.
Agumentic is right to say that we do need a better relationship with Cassianus before the campaign comes to an end. But while it's arguable whether it or the Prophecy is more important, I think the benefits that the Prophecy can give, in terms of positive modifiers, is more urgent.
While I do want to figure the prophecy out IC, I disagree that it is more urgent to do so now.
Very soon, I think as soon as next turn, considering that this turn is described as "brief respite", we will be fighting in the battle of Maeander. This will be a very big and important battle, and at least in one timeline, Romans suffered a catastrophic defeat there and Atellus probably died. Obviously, we should strive to avoid that fate (and that's why trying to get Military up to 15 is pretty alluring, even if I ultimately do not choose it). But, even should we avert the worst outcome, I think that it is not only possible but probable that we will have to make important choices after the battle. And, considering the legion is our main strength, I think it is very important that whatever those choices are, we have as good odds as possible to convince Cassianus that he should follow that choice, and I fear there won't be enough time to deepen our friendship after now.
But, okay, it's possible that we will have that time in the last moments before battle, and wouldn't personal modifiers be useful to us in battle? Well, I don't think so. Leaving aside that since your plan sends the prophecy to overworked priests away in Pergamon, it probably won't reach us it time for the battle, I disagree with you on the nature of those modifiers. You seem to believe that they will be fairly general, applying to a lot of rolls and thus will matter in the coming battles. In my opinion, this is not so. I think that positive or negative modifiers the prophecy gives come in situations related to the prophecy, when you think on the situation and get a flash of "Oh shit, that's exactly the situation the prophecy told about, I am sure what to do to succeed and get a +to rolls, or I'm quite afraid of the situation and get a -to rolls". And what does our prophecy tells us about? Well, the thread interpreted it as big stuff about how Roman Republic itself groans beneath the curse and falls apart, and how its in debt to Cybele, and so on. And that does ring as true interpretation. But what it doesn't talk about is anything related to the war, either against Mithridates or even the current civil war. And so I believe that what modifiers we will receive will something like "+4 to convince people about reforms in Republic" and "+6 to convince priesthood to do this or that for Cybele", stuff like that. Not anything that would help us now, either by the way of modifiers or by opening new options.
Therefore, I think we can delay the prophecy a bit longer, and do the other option delayed last turn - forging bonds with Cassianus, which, I believe, has much greater odds of being important soon.
, and likewise there was no Carbo. It was Lucius Valerius Flaccus who was sent and just as happened here he was betrayed by Fimbria but he had already lost a few Legions to Sulla at that point (storms caused his advanced legions to be separated from the rest and they eventually stumbled into Sulla and went over to him).
