Attempting to Subvert the Plan: Dominion Edition

[X] Plan: Nephor Lives? V3C--Tool, and Die w/Raynor
[X] Plan: Nephor Lives? V3B w/Raynor

[X] Plan: Nephor Lives? V3C--Tool, and Die w/Raynor
[X] Plan Can I Have Some SCVs Please

[X] Plan: Profit and Reputation.

Infrastructure 5/5 Dice 60 R
-[X] Korhal: Capital City Augustgrad (Phase 1) [MANDATORY] 93/300 2 dice 20 R
-[X] Brontes: Orbital Cleanup (Phase 1) [Reconstruction] 172/300 2 dice 30 R
-[X] Nephor II: Planetary Reconstruction (Phase 1) [Reconstruction] 1 dice 0/500 10 R
Heavy Industry 8/4 Dice 100 R
-[X] Korhal: Keresh Mining Complex (Phase 2) 14/300 4 dice 40 R
-[X] Vardona: Ardonin Heavy Vehicle Factory (Phase 1) 153/300 4 dice 60 R
Light and Chemical Industry 4/4 Dice 40 R
-[X] Tyrador IX: Refugee Workshops (Phase 1) [Reconstruction] 271/400 2 dice 20 R
-[X] Nephor II: Phoros Neotextile Fabrication Plant (Phase 1) 78/200 2 dice 20 R
Environmental 4/4 40R
-[X] Tyrador IX: Establish Farmsteads (Phase 1) [Reconstruction] 269/400 2 dice 20 R
-[X] Nephor II: Cap'n Yum-Yum's Fantabulous Foodularium 0/200 2 dice 20 R
Services 4/4 30 R
-[X] The Dominion Health Service (Phase 1) 170/300 3 dice 30 R
-[X] Re-Establish the Universal News Network [Reconstruction] 0/100 1 dice 10 R
Military 5/5 50 R
-[X] Tyrador IX: Military Recruitment Offices 115/200 3 dice 30 R
-[X] Nephor II: Fort Horner Marine Training Camp 0/200 2 dice 20 R
Research 4/4 Dice 70 R
-[X] Korhal: Broken Mesa Xenobiology Institute 0/200 3 dice 60 R
-[X] New Model Weaponry (Phase 1) (Tech) 0/150 1 dice 10 R
Bureaucracy 4/4 Dice 30 R
-[X] Truth and Reconciliation Committee (Idealistic) 24/200 2 dice 10 R
-[X] Conduct a Dominion-Wide Census [Reconstruction] 0/300 2 dice 20 R
Personal 4/4 Dice 40 F
-[X] Private Investments 4 dice DC 30/50/70 40 F

420/425 Resources
40/50 Discretionary Funds
4/4 Free dice

Taliys said:

Military 5/5 50 R
-[X] Tyrador IX: Military Recruitment Offices 0/200 3 dice 30 R
-[X] Nephor II: Fort Horner Marine Training Camp 115/200 2 dice 20 R

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I think you mixed up these progress bars.
Tyrador IX has 115/200 progress not the training camp.

Etranger said:

[] Nephor II: Fort Horner Marine Training Camp
One of the most punishing experiences in the Great War was urban combat, as power-suited Marines struggled to make their way through tight corridors, debris-strewn streets, and piles of destroyed vehicles. In order to ensure that the next generation of jarheads is fit for purpose, the Defense Ministry has called for the construction of a military training camp in a stretch of the Nephor megacity that was particularly harrowing during reclamation operations.
(Progress 0/200, -10R per die, -5 Paranoia)

[] Tyrador IX: Military Recruitment Offices
While the plan is to engage in mass conscription to refill the ranks of the army, it's always preferable to secure willing volunteers over resentful voluntolds. A series of recruitment offices across Tyrador IX's refugee-swollen second continent will offer an escape route for those capable individuals prepared to risk their lives in service to the Dominion.
(Progress 115/200, -10R per die, -5 Paranoia)

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[X] Plan: Nephor Lives? V3C--Tool, and Die w/Raynor
[X] Plan: Nephor Lives? V3B w/Raynor

[X] Plan Can I Have Some SCVs Please
-[X] Infrastructure 5/5 75R
--[X] Korhal: Capital City Augustgrad (Phase 1) [MANDATORY] 2 dice + 1 free die 30R 10%
(Progress 93/300, -10R per die, -10 Paranoia when complete)
--[X] Brontes: Orbital Cleanup (Phase 1) [Reconstruction] 3 dice 45R 61%
(Progress 172/300, -15R per die, Resource gain)
-[X] Heavy Industry 4/4 70R
--[X] Vardona: Ardonin Heavy Vehicle Factory (Phase 1) 4 dice 60R 83%
(Progress 153/300, -15R per die, +5 Paranoia when started, +5 Paranoia when complete, multiple projects finish faster)
--[X] Nephor II: TerraUnion Tool and Die Works (Phase 1) 1 free die 10R 0%
(Reduces some project lengths) (Progress 8/200, -10R per die)
-[X] Light and Chemical Industry 4/4 60R
--[X] Tyrador IX: Refugee Workshops (Phase 1) [Reconstruction] 4 dice + 2 free die 60R 95%
(Progress 271/400, -10R per die, Resource income)
-[X] Environmental 4/4 40R
--[X] Tyrador IX: Establish Farmsteads (Phase 1) [Reconstruction] 4 dice 40R 74%
(Progress 269/400, -10R per die)
-[X] Services 4/4 40R
--[X] The Dominion Health Service (Phase 1) 3 dice 30R 48%
(Progress 170/300, -10R per die, +5 Paranoia)
--[X] Re-Establish the Universal News Network [Reconstruction] 1 die 10R 0%
(Progress 0/100, -10R per die, +5 Paranoia)
-[X] Military 5/5 50R
--[X] Nephor II: Fort Horner Marine Training Camp 2 dice 20R 0%
(Progress 0/200, -10R per die, -5 Paranoia)
--[X] Tyrador IX: Military Recruitment Offices 3 dice 30R 87%
(Progress 115/200, -10R per die, -5 Paranoia)
-[X] Research 4/4 55R
--[X] Korhal: Broken Mesa Xenobiology Institute 1 die 20R 0%
(Progress 0/200, -20R per die, -10 Paranoia)
--[X] Tyrador IX: Imperial Science University 1 die 15R 0%
(Progress 0/200, -15R per die, +5 Paranoia)
--[X] New Model Weaponry (Phase 1) (Tech) 2 dice 20R 6%
(Progress 0/150, -10R per die, -10 Paranoia)
-[X] Bureaucracy 4/4 30R
--[X] Truth and Reconciliation Committee (Idealistic) 3 dice 15R 26%
(Progress 24/200, -5R per die, +5 Paranoia)
--[X] Conduct a Dominion-Wide Census [Reconstruction] 1 die 10R 0%
(Progress 0/300, -10R per die)
-[X] Personal 4/4 10F
--[X] Hire Advisors 2 dice 10F DC40 79%
(Provides project die bonuses) (DC 20/40 to determine personnel quality, -5R or F per die, +5 Paranoia)
--[X] Send a Letter "Home" 2 dice DC40 79%
(Unlocks Raynor's Raiders Personal projects) (DC 40 to avoid +10 Paranoia)
-[X] Free Dice 4/4
-[X] 1 in Infrastructure
-[X] 1 in Heavy Industry
-[X] 2 in Light and Chemical Industry
-[X] Resources stockpile 120/120 Income 300/330 Total 420/450
-[X] Discretionary Funds (F) stockpile 10/25 Income 0/25 Total 10/50

[X] Plan: Nephor Lives? V3B
[X] Plan: Nephor Lives? V3B w/Raynor
[X] Plan: Nephor Lives? V3C--Tool, and Die
[X] Plan: Nephor Lives? V3C--Tool, and Die w/Raynor

[X] Plan Slow and Steady
-Infrastructure (5/5 dice, -3 per die)
--[X] Korhal: Capital City Augustgrad (Phase 1) [MANDATORY] 1 die, 10 R 0%
--[X] Brontes: Orbital Cleanup (Phase 1) [Reconstruction] 3 dice, 45 R 61.14% (71.6% with a +15 omake)
--[X] Nephor II: Planetary Reconstruction (Phase 1) [Reconstruction] 1 die, 10 R 0%
-Heavy Industry (4/4 dice, -3 per die)
--[X] Vardona: Ardonin Heavy Vehicle Factory (Phase 1) 3 dice, 45 R 47% (58.21% with a +15 omake)
--[X] Nephor II: TerraUnion Tool and Die Works (Phase 1) [NEW] 1 die 10 R 0%
-Light and Chemical Industry (4/4 dice, -3 per die)
--[X] Tyrador IX: Refugee Workshops (Phase 1) [Reconstruction] 3 dice, 30 R 60.41% (70.94% with a +15 omake)
--[X] Nephor II: Phoros Neotextile Fabrication Plant (Phase 1) [NEW] 1 die, 10R 0%
-Environmental (4/4 dice + 2 free dice, -8 per die)
--[X] Tyrador IX: Establish Farmsteads (Phase 1) [Reconstruction] 4 dice, 40 R 74.58% (82.04% with a +15 omake)
--[X] Korhal: Regreening Effort (Phase 1) 2 dice, 10 R 0%
-Services (4/4 dice, -8 per die)
--[X] The Dominion Health Service (Phase 1) 4 dice, 40 R 75.12% (82.49% with a +15 omake)
-Military (5/5 dice, -3 per die)
--[X] Tyrador IX: Military Recruitment Offices 2 dice, 20 R 59.95% (72.25% with a +15 omake)
--[X] Nephor II: Fort Horner Marine Training Camp 3 dice, 30 R 30.41% (41.06% with a +15 omake)
-Research (4/4 dice, -8 per die)
--[X] Iris-class Light Airship (Tech) [NEW] 2 dice, 20 R 6.3% (12.75% with a +15 omake)
--[X] New Model Weaponry (Phase 1) (Tech) [NEW] 2 dice, 20 R 6.3% (12.75% with a +15 omake)
-Bureaucracy (4/4 dice, -3 per die)
--[X] Truth and Reconciliation Committee (Idealistic) 4 dice, 20 R 59.57% (68.91% with a +15 omake)
-Personal (4/4 dice + 2 free dice, -13 per die)
--[X] Hire Advisors 2 dice, 10 F 90.1% DC 20/79.2% DC 40 (ignores omakes)
--[X] Send a Letter "Home" 2 dice, 0 F 79.2% DC 40 (ignores omakes)
--[X] Nephor II: Contact the Industrial Workers' Trust [NEW] 2 dice, 20 F 90.1% DC 40 (assumes Uncrowned Queen applies, 79.2% otherwise)

[X] Plan Raynor! 355/425R
-[X] Infrastructure 5/5 65R
--[X] Korhal: Capital City Augustgrad (Phase 1) [MANDATORY] 2 dice, 20R 0%
--[X] Brontes: Orbital Cleanup (Phase 1) [Reconstruction] 3 dice 45R 61%
-[X] Heavy Industry 4/4 60R
--[X] Vardona: Ardonin Heavy Vehicle Factory (Phase 1) 4 dice 60R 77%
-[X] Light and Chemical Industry 4/4 40R
--[X] Tyrador IX: Refugee Workshops (Phase 1) [Reconstruction] 4 dice 40R 85%
-[X] Environmental 4/4 40R
--[X] Tyrador IX: Establish Farmsteads (Phase 1) [Reconstruction] 4 dice 40R 75%
-[X] Services 4/4 50R
--[X] Mass Literacy Movement (Phase 1) 4 dice + 1 free dice 50R 57%
-[X] Military 2/5 20R
--[X] Tyrador IX: Military Recruitment Offices 2 dice 20R 60%
-[X] Research 4/4 70R
--[X] Korhal: Broken Mesa Xenobiology Institute 3 dice 60R 7%
--[X]New Model Weaponry (Phase 1) (Tech) 1 dice 10R
-[X] Bureaucracy 1/4 10R
--[X] Truth and Reconciliation Committee (Idealistic) 1 dice 10R 0%
-[X] Personal 4/4 30F
--[X] Send a Letter "Home" 3 dice 97% (contact Raynor without Paranoia cost)
--[X] Hire Advisors 1 dice +1 free dice 10F 90%/79%
--[X] Private Investments 2 free dice dice 20F 85%/72%/55%

[X] Plan: Nephor Lives? V3C--Tool, and Die w/Raynor
[x] Plan Boring But Practical v2

[x] Plan Boring But Practical v2

Now see, my thing is, Horner said "I know this prison camp exists because I did time there, asshole!"

The Mar Sara magistrate would never have had time to get thrown into a Confederate prison camp.

Etranger said:

The basic idea I have is that Chuck spent time in the Sons under a pseudonym after Korhal, eventually moved to Mar Sara (either to legitimately retire or as part of an op), got appointed Magistrate, and then called Mengsk in when things got dicey.

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Ehhh, that could work, but it relies on some pretty weird shenanigans being pulled to get Horner made magistrate on Mar Sara.

Shenanigans that would be hilarious in hindsight.

"This guy with suspiciously big gaps in his life story, few legitimate connections, and no education becomes colonial magistrate!"

GOOD shenanigan country.

The Laurent said:

If we spend everything we have, then we'll wind up having to leave basically all of our dice other than on literally required areas fallow, even though this is far from ideal. Right now our income isn't actually sufficient, which is why we both need to massively increase it (while your plan pursues only two revenue increasing actions), while also preserving it. We shouldn't spend ONLY what we make each turn at this point, because that's too little, but we need to keep enough seed money to help us actually build up. Because the way your plan is going we'll have to basically leave not just six dice but a dozen fallow for the next three turns to make up for it... and what do you get that's worth it?

Fleshing out the bureaucracy? When we already need to increase Resources to use the dice we have? Ignoring the Census when it's both required and will pave the way for future income through the fact that census=taxation.

It's a flawed plan that sacrifices all future flexibility in the name of... not much, to be honest.

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The key, I think, is to make very sure that every point of R we spend over our income is on something that is very much worth it. We should probably have a plan that leaves dice fallow this turn, in areas where the economic stimulus effect is likely to not be so great.

NickAragua said:

In Starcraft terms, leaving resources unspent is called "floating minerals" or "floating gas" and is generally regarded as a bad idea - minerals sitting in your bank aren't out there harvesting more minerals or blowing up enemy bases or projecting power or whatever.

So unless we have the means to drastically increase our resource income if we save up a little, we should just spend it as it comes in.

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Right, but in Starcraft terms, it's also a bad idea to spend resources on anything other than the units, structures, and upgrades that will be most effective. If you're expecting the enemy to attack you with fliers, you don't waste time upgrading your melee-armed Zealots or Zerglings. Because what are they going to do, stand there angrily waving their blades at the shit that's bombing your base from above?

So if we're going to blow our whole reserve budget, we need to make damn sure we are blowing it on optimally effective things. That means no overkill unless we're very sure the rewards of early completion outweigh the cost of the extra dice. And no doing projects that aren't either:

1) Strictly necessary
2) Very cheap, or
3) Very likely to pay off quickly in material rewards.

[X] Plan: Nephor Lives? V3B
[X] Plan: Nephor Lives? V3B w/Raynor
[X] Plan: Nephor Lives? V3C--Tool, and Die
[X] Plan: Nephor Lives? V3C--Tool, and Die w/Raynor

[x] Plan Boring But Practical v2
[X] Plan: Nephor Lives? V3C--Tool, and Die w/Raynor

And yeah, right now the only areas that aren't probably pretty important to the economy right this second (as opposed to the medium term) are Research, Military, and Personal.

(Note, Personal is important to the future of the entire Quest, and also doesn't owe its budget to the rest of it, so.)

@The Laurent , I am psychologically incapable of sorting through four nearly identical subtly variant plans to pick the one I like better. At least right now. Sorry. Ugh.

grimely said:

I really don't understand why so many plans only put 2 dice into projects that could complete if 3 or 4 were put into them.

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When it's me, it's usually because the project has a low chance of completing with two dice, a medium chance with three, and a high chance with four... And I'm trying not to waste dice on overkill, so I roll two, then wait and decide whether I'm going to roll zero, one, or two next turn.

Given the sheer size of the Progress costs for projects in this game, it's usually a bad idea to have more than two projects going in one category in one turn- one that might finish this turn, and one that you're starting.

Enthusiast#117 said:

Semi-relatedly, it hurts my soul to ignore important projects, only to crash-build them several turns later with tons of dice.

It makes much more narrative sense to me to more slowly progress at a steady pace in several fields at once. It makes the government look more stable.

Being seen making progress is often just as important as actually making progress.

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In this context, it frankly makes a lot of sense. Concentrating the Dominion's scattered and very depleted resources on the specific projects that will make it easiest to bring other projects online is, frankly, exactly the kind of thing you'd expect. Putting one die on each of four infrastructure projects per turn or whatever, not so much. That's the act of a government that, importantly, is not desperate. One that is not anticipating attack or major crises and where there are no great humanitarian problems- no particular sense of urgency, just the pleasant smile of things slowly and smoothly ticking over.

Simon_Jester said:

@The Laurent , I am psychologically incapable of sorting through four nearly identical subtly variant plans to pick the one I like better. At least right now. Sorry. Ugh.


When it's me, it's usually because the project has a low chance of completing with two dice, a medium chance with three, and a high chance with four... And I'm trying not to waste dice on overkill, so I roll two, then wait and decide whether I'm going to roll zero, one, or two next turn.

Given the sheer size of the Progress costs for projects in this game, it's usually a bad idea to have more than two projects going in one category in one turn- one that might finish this turn, and one that you're starting.


In this context, it frankly makes a lot of sense. Concentrating the Dominion's scattered and very depleted resources on the specific projects that will make it easiest to bring other projects online is, frankly, exactly the kind of thing you'd expect. Putting one die on each of four infrastructure projects per turn or whatever, not so much. That's the act of a government that, importantly, is not desperate. One that is not anticipating attack or major crises and where there are no great humanitarian problems- no particular sense of urgency, just the pleasant smile of things slowly and smoothly ticking over.

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I'll tell you more about it in a bit, currently in a meeting.

[x] Plan: Nephor Lives? V3B
-[X] Korhal: Capital City Augustgrad (Phase 1) [MANDATORY] (2 dice, 20 R)
-[X] Brontes: Orbital Cleanup (Phase 1) [Reconstruction] (3 dice, 45 R)
-[X] Nephor II: Planetary Reconstruction (Phase 1) [Reconstruction] ( 1 Free dice, 20 R)
-[X] Nephor II: TerraUnion Tool and Die Works (Phase 1) [NEW] (1 dice, 10 R)
-[X] Nephor II: Nephor Industrial Megacomplex (Phase 1) [Reconstruction] (3 dice, 1 Free dice, 40 R)
-[X] Tyrador IX: Refugee Workshops (Phase 1) [Reconstruction] (3 dice, 30 R)
-[X] Nephor II: Phoros Neotextile Fabrication Plant (Phase 1) [NEW] (1 die, 2 free dice, 10 R)
-[X] Tyrador IX: Establish Farmsteads (Phase 1) [Reconstruction] (4 dice, 40 R)
-[X] The Dominion Health Service (Phase 1) (3 dice, 30 R)
-[X] Re-Establish the Universal News Network [Reconstruction] (1 dice, 10 R)
-[X] Tyrador IX: Military Recruitment Offices (2 dice, 20 R)
-[X] Korhal: Broken Mesa Xenobiology Institute (1 dice, 20 R)
-[X] Truth and Reconciliation Committee (Idealistic) (3 dice 20 R)
-[X] Conduct a Dominion-Wide Census [Reconstruction] (1 dice, 10 R)
-[X] Hire Advisors (2 dice, 10 F)
-[X] Nephor II: Contact the Industrial Workers' Trust [NEW] (2 dice, 20 F)
- [x] Fallow: 3 Research dice, 3 Military dice.

Is it bad that I've long since lost track of what's being proposed?

[X] Plan: Nephor Lives? V3C--Tool, and Die w/Raynor
[X] Plan: Nephor Lives? V3B w/Raynor

Simon_Jester said:

@The Laurent , I am psychologically incapable of sorting through four nearly identical subtly variant plans to pick the one I like better. At least right now. Sorry. Ugh.


When it's me, it's usually because the project has a low chance of completing with two dice, a medium chance with three, and a high chance with four... And I'm trying not to waste dice on overkill, so I roll two, then wait and decide whether I'm going to roll zero, one, or two next turn.

Given the sheer size of the Progress costs for projects in this game, it's usually a bad idea to have more than two projects going in one category in one turn- one that might finish this turn, and one that you're starting.


In this context, it frankly makes a lot of sense. Concentrating the Dominion's scattered and very depleted resources on the specific projects that will make it easiest to bring other projects online is, frankly, exactly the kind of thing you'd expect. Putting one die on each of four infrastructure projects per turn or whatever, not so much. That's the act of a government that, importantly, is not desperate. One that is not anticipating attack or major crises and where there are no great humanitarian problems- no particular sense of urgency, just the pleasant smile of things slowly and smoothly ticking over.

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The big differences are: Raynor versions switch Union for Letters Home, and the Tool and Die version, instead of 4 NIM and 1 Tool and Die go 2 NIM and 3 Tool and Die and are otherwise the same. Which creates four possibly slightly different variations.

Simon_Jester said:

Right, but in Starcraft terms, it's also a bad idea to spend resources on anything other than the units, structures, and upgrades that will be most effective. If you're expecting the enemy to attack you with fliers, you don't waste time upgrading your melee-armed Zealots or Zerglings. Because what are they going to do, stand there angrily waving their blades at the shit that's bombing your base from above?

So if we're going to blow our whole reserve budget, we need to make damn sure we are blowing it on optimally effective things. That means no overkill unless we're very sure the rewards of early completion outweigh the cost of the extra dice. And no doing projects that aren't either:

1) Strictly necessary
2) Very cheap, or
3) Very likely to pay off quickly in material rewards.

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Yeah, I'm with you there. Now I just need to spend a bunch of time parsing the various plans and figuring out which ones meet those criteria.

[x] Plan: Nephor Lives? V3B
-[X] Korhal: Capital City Augustgrad (Phase 1) [MANDATORY] (2 dice, 20 R)
-[X] Brontes: Orbital Cleanup (Phase 1) [Reconstruction] (3 dice, 45 R)
-[X] Nephor II: Planetary Reconstruction (Phase 1) [Reconstruction] ( 1 Free dice, 20 R)
-[X] Nephor II: TerraUnion Tool and Die Works (Phase 1) [NEW] (1 dice, 10 R)
-[X] Nephor II: Nephor Industrial Megacomplex (Phase 1) [Reconstruction] (3 dice, 1 Free dice, 40 R)
-[X] Tyrador IX: Refugee Workshops (Phase 1) [Reconstruction] (3 dice, 30 R)
-[X] Nephor II: Phoros Neotextile Fabrication Plant (Phase 1) [NEW] (1 die, 2 free dice, 10 R)
-[X] Tyrador IX: Establish Farmsteads (Phase 1) [Reconstruction] (4 dice, 40 R)
-[X] The Dominion Health Service (Phase 1) (3 dice, 30 R)
-[X] Re-Establish the Universal News Network [Reconstruction] (1 dice, 10 R)
-[X] Tyrador IX: Military Recruitment Offices (2 dice, 20 R)
-[X] Korhal: Broken Mesa Xenobiology Institute (1 dice, 20 R)
-[X] Truth and Reconciliation Committee (Idealistic) (3 dice 20 R)
-[X] Conduct a Dominion-Wide Census [Reconstruction] (1 dice, 10 R)
-[X] Hire Advisors (2 dice, 10 F)
-[X] Nephor II: Contact the Industrial Workers' Trust [NEW] (2 dice, 20 F)
- [x] Fallow: 3 Research dice, 3 Military dice.

If we're doing a lot of Nephor stuff we should contact the industrial workers at nephor over talking to raynor.

[X] Plan Boring But Practical v2

[X] Plan: Nephor Lives? V3C--Tool, and Die