There Was An Idea: A Kevin Feige Quest

[X] Follow Daredevil with Luke Cage.

I like the idea of Luke Cage being more colorful and lighter in tone to contrast against Daredevil and Jessica Jones. Not fully sold on all ages live action cartoon. This is an opportunity to make a more mature statement. The fact that Luke is a bulletproof inner city black man in today's America can really say something meaningful. I would like to propose dealing with real world issues stemming from racial and economic injustices a core concept of the show.

Instead of the idea of broadening Luke out to more of the city, I'd like to suggest keeping him in Harlem for the most part this season. I assume Daredevil is largely in Hell's Kitchen. So what we could do is give Jessica her own neighborhood too. I suggest the Lower East Side. When we get to Iron Fist, he can have the Upper West Side or UES. But whatever the Hand is up to endangers the entire city, or at least all of Manhattan, so that's why our heroes team up in The Defenders.
I don't know. I mean if we limit Iron Fist to the Lower East Side then we can't truly tell the story of him taking the fight to the Hand. I mean, I hardly think that they are going to limit themselves to a single neighborhood, and I don't think Luke Cage, Jessica Jones, or Danny Rand should either.

Daredevil is more understandable, so he can keep Hell's Kitchen.
 
Show 1. Daredevil Season 1 (2013)


Marvel's Daredevil
Season One

"It means that I'm not the Samaritan. That I'm not the priest, or the Levite. That I am the ill intent... who set upon the traveler on a road that he should not have been on."

Showrunner Steven S. DeKnight
Starring Charlie Cox, Vincent D'Onofrio, Deborah Ann Woll, and Elden Henson
10 Episodes (Average 54 Minutes)

Production Budget: $49,873,454
Attorney Matt Murdock (Cox) was blinded as a boy in a tragic accident which also imbued him with extraordinary senses. Murdock sets up practice in his old neighborhood of Hell's Kitchen, New York, where he now fights against injustice as a respected lawyer by day and a masked vigilante by night. After taking on the case of the falsely accused Hector Ayala (Zayas), Matt finds his two lives intertwining as he endeavors to uncover the truth about Wilson Fisk (D'Onofrio) and his plans for New York. The show has been widely praised for its fight choreography - some of the best in the MCU thus far - and a number of memorable and sympathetic characters. Fisk has been described as an unexpected gem in a universe already known for the depth and quality of its villains, and there has been considerable interest in seeing more of him, Murdock, and the various supporting characters. Renewal seems almost certain.
 
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88. Planning Session: Luke Cage Initial Discussion
The Winning Vote said:
[] Follow Daredevil with Luke Cage.

You've decided to follow Daredevil with Luke Cage. Marvel is already pretty ahead of the game when it comes to female superheroes, but the man with unbreakable skin would be exploring new ground. Not to mention he's sort of topical with all the police violence going on in the country. Unlike Daredevil or Jessica Jones, there isn't someone immediately coming to mind as the main antagonist. It's not that you aren't familiar with the character, it's just that he has his origins rooted in Blaxploitation stories and you need to be careful as you adapt the character to modern times. Now is a time to begin tossing around ideas for villains, stories, showrunners, actors, and anything else you can conceive of being important for the show. You're going to sit down with the whole team and see what they think. Anything you like will be added to the list when it's time for you and Donald to make a decision on that particular topic.

This is a vote for suggesting ideas on the property. Write-in whatever you would like and if I think it's a good fit or idea I'll add it to the upcoming polls. You can push for anything else you want using the [Additional] option.

[] [Villain Idea] Write-in
[] [Show Story Idea] Write-in
[] [Actor Idea] Write-in
[] [Showrunner Idea] Write-in
[] [Additional] Write-in
 
Likely to be Completely controversial idea here, feel free to veto it.

Why don't we have an (indirectly) Purple Man controlled Jessica Jones as the villain, with some hand nonsense running around in the background (things like them hiring the 'cleaning crew' or pushing that fun stuff on the streets.
 
We're making sure there's an afro gag somewhere right? Along with the most garish of his outfits?

Maybe as his first hero costume or in a montage where he tries to find something comfortable?
 
I don't know, we could just keep the canon storyline for the most part, with Luke hiding out under his assumed name and protecting his neighborhood from Cottonmouth while Mariah rises to power. Change Diamondback though, either inter-grate him earlier and in a different way or don't use him, he was sloppily done.

For Jess, we could have her still under Purple Man's control, and have her be around as this weird girl around town who they interact with a few times before Revas mysterious murder.

Alternatively, she's an alcoholic, so if she's free she could be a regular at the bar who gets involved when Cottonmouth starts shit.

Maybe she introduces herself as a PI investigating Revas murder, trying to find out what she knew that Kilgrave wanted to kill her for, all the while feeling extremely guilty about it.
 
What about doing something like have the antagonist be a substantial Bloc of the NYPD that's been coopted by kingpin?
 
I know it is wacky, but how about using Leader here? Basically, he would just be trying to build up his resources again with a minimum of risk by doing subtle crime stuff at a place noone would expect him to stay and where a bunch of mutants appearing wouldnt raise any suspicion. Then a hero he had no reason to expect shows up and messes with his plans.

We have established Leader as an immensely threatening villain, but here he lacks information about his opponent, has no dosh and prep time and has a heavy incentive to not go all out.
The victory for Cage would then just be Leader deciding that running away and setting up elsewhere is the wiser choice.

Leader would definitely be the sort to use the racist institutions as a weapon against Cage, which is why I like him a ton here. The enhanced henchmen Leader can create also make for cooler opponents than just some desparate fools with guns the protagonist is immune against anyway.

All the gang violence stuff will still be there for later seasons, lets tie this into the Avengers aftermath and make use of the fact that right now, we have a leftover established villain licking his wounds with a reason to be in the area. Luke Cages origin story set within our current decade can definitely use the time and focus we can free up by not having to establish a fresh bad guy.
 
What about doing something like have the antagonist be a substantial Bloc of the NYPD that's been coopted by kingpin?
Very on point with Black Lives Matter/Police Brutality movement, perhaps too on point. Having evil cops be the villain is pretty not subtle, beating you on the head with "YO THIS IS HAPPENING IN REAL LIFE AND IS BAD!" Subtlety is usually, less is more.
I still think we are lacking in the department of villains being evil for the sake of being evil.

Yeah there was just the Red Skull really. We don't have a lot of this coming our way really, Killgrave and Killmonger are both great villains, and the former approaches for the EVULZ, but the actual Jones plot was so much better than that.

I mean, for villains like that there's Mephisto, Dormammu... Annhilus? I don't think we have a lot o villains like that, and they to tend to be pretty one note anyway, so I'm not that sad about it.

And definitely not Leader, he deserves a proper end in the movies and Luke Cage deserves its own villain to fit its themes. A cameo at the most, and I still don't like it. Really, Leader would be better off appearing in the Agents of Shield show.
 
Very on point with Black Lives Matter/Police Brutality movement, perhaps too on point. Having evil cops be the villain is pretty not subtle, beating you on the head with "YO THIS IS HAPPENING IN REAL LIFE AND IS BAD!" Subtlety is usually, less is more

Having them be on the take off an established supervillain eases the blow a bit. People are more able to deal with a relative few bad cops than the real systemic issues. Being set in new York makes it harder though
 
Hmm... I still think we should have Cottonmouth as the main villain of the season, with Mariah slowly rising to power. I think the plot could be pretty much the same, with Luke trying to take down Cottonmouth's operations around Harlem.

I'm also in for having Jessica in a supporting role, having it not too long after she was released from the influence of The Purple Man, so she is constantly drunk and perhaps being associated with Luke will inspire her to become a private detective, or have her being a private detective who assists Luke find out more about Cottonmouth's crime rackets, as well as kick some ass together.

Who do you want as the show runner?
 
How about doing something like a prison break? Luke Cage and a few superpowered or normal human allies try to escape from a prison where they were being experimented on.
 
Maybe as his first hero costume or in a montage where he tries to find something comfortable?
Having him looking for something to wear in a costume shop or something after his clothes get torn up in a fight and look at the classic costume for a second or two before dismissing it because it looks absurd would work.
 
And definitely not Leader, he deserves a proper end in the movies and Luke Cage deserves its own villain to fit its themes. A cameo at the most, and I still don't like it. Really, Leader would be better off appearing in the Agents of Shield show.

I agree that it would be weird to end the Leaders story in a series, but that wasnt what I proposed. What I am thinking of is the classic comic thing where an established character appears, plays their part in the arc and then disappears again without the arc having been some life changing experience for them. Leader should get a big movie role afterwards, but since we dont have any good opportunities lined up for him in the next batch, we can easily use him as a static adversary here.

And I dont really see how one would have trouble fitting Leader into the themes of a Luke Cage story. He was a white rural working class guy who was granted super powers after someone experimented on him. Especially worth noting is that his new intelligence didnt turn him into some wellspoken nerd who drinks tea out of a porcelain cup while reading poetry.
And he opens up all the stories about racism in the police department, since his smart combined with his perspective positions him perfectly for manipulating the situation to make them be the worst cops they can be.
 


Marvel's Daredevil
Season One

"It means that I'm not the Samaritan. That I'm not the priest, or the Levite. That I am the ill intent... who set upon the traveler on a road that he should not have been on."

Showrunner Steven S. DeKnight
Starring Charlie Cox, Vincent D'Onofrio, Deborah Ann Woll, and Elden Henson
10 Episodes (Average 54 Minutes)
Attorney Matt Murdock (Cox) was blinded as a boy in a tragic accident which also imbued him with extraordinary senses. Murdock sets up practice in his old neighborhood of Hell's Kitchen, New York, where he now fights against injustice as a respected lawyer by day and a masked vigilante by night. After taking on the case of the falsely accused Hector Ayala (Zayas), Matt finds his two lives intertwining as he endeavors to uncover the truth about Wilson Fisk (D'Onofrio) and his plans for New York. The show has been widely praised for its fight choreography - some of the best in the MCU thus far - and a number of memorable and sympathetic characters. Fisk has been described as an unexpected gem in a universe already known for the depth and quality of its villains, and there has been considerable interest in seeing more of him, Murdock, and the various supporting characters. Renewal seems almost certain.

 
Very on point with Black Lives Matter/Police Brutality movement, perhaps too on point. Having evil cops be the villain is pretty not subtle, beating you on the head with "YO THIS IS HAPPENING IN REAL LIFE AND IS BAD!" Subtlety is usually, less is more.
Since when was the successful and effective addressing of social injustice ever subtle?

That is to say, I see this sentiment a lot in fiction that subtlety rather than directness is the golden rule applicable to all topics and all stories and that is simply untrue. It's also a frequent criticism from ruffled parties to films that addresss social or historical subjects, which is typically a veiled way of expressing displeasure for being forced to confront a subject in any respect.

When a work explores a subject that is present, real, and happening widely and strongly within the realm it is being written, it has a responsibility to do two things: to tell a great story and to tell it as loudly as possible. The two things are not mutually incompatible. Was Ellen Ripley a lesser character for the overt themes of womanhood throughout Aliens, down to punching out an evil matriarch bitch to defend a child that isn't her own? Was Fury Road a lesser film for the Wives outright shouting that they are not Things?

My point being, if you want to avoid offending the disaffected crowd who pays lip service to the topics of Luke Cage, you don't rock the boat and play it safe. If you want this work to actually resonate with real experiences and solidify itself as a powerful and unapologetic statement, you do the right thing and be honest instead of polite. Subtlety comes when the crisis has been addressed, not before.
 
Hmm, I wonder if we can work Alan Tudyk into our Guardians of the Galaxy.

[] [Villain Idea] Villain of the week, something like half of them being Luke trading their defeat for favors/information. Diamondback as the season villain.
[] [Show Story Idea] RAG's Idea is Long

Backstory: Carl Lucas spent his youth as a thief and thug on the streets of New York, but when it became clear his actions hurt his family he tried to change. This got him scarred, framed for murder by his best friend (Stryker) and 25-to-Life. Though Stryker paid for it when an angry Lucas snitched, Lucas was to spend decades behind bars. Transferred to Seagate after multiple escape attempts to go to his father's funeral, Lucas found himself offered a deal. Act as a test subject for secret medical research in an underground fighting ring, and after 5 years he would be free to go. Lucas accepts and spends the next three years in endless fighting under sadistic guards and vat treatments, turning to a mixture of meditation/prayer towards his father and 1970s films/shows (all the jail really had in terms of media) to keep himself sane. Eventually Lucas learns that nobody actually goes free and they're either killed or shipped off to another facility. A particularly sadistic guard (Rackham) finds out and causes an 'accident' to kill Lucas and any other test subjects he might have spoken to. Lucas survives the explosion, granted enhanced strength, healing, and unscarred bulletproof skin/invulnerability. He escapes the wreckage in the confusion, presumed dead. Our story begins a month later as Lucas (now under the false identity Luke Cage and shaved bald) gets off the bus in New York city. With his old life unusable, father dead, and three years of hell behind him, Luke Cage is a man aiming to start over. He has nothing and no one, but with a good attitude and super powers he'll start himself a new life here. First, finding a place to stay and a job.

Story: Given the lack of references he struggles to find work mostly until he chases some thugs away from someone and gets an apartment out of it (first month free), from there he's bouncing around NYC trying to find jobs, running into weird shit, and playing hero in return for favors/information/money/etc. At some point Cage finds out Stryker is still around (now as the crimelord Diamondback) and finds himself clashing several times with his men in Harlem. With Stryker in reach Cage has hope that maybe he can undo the framejob on Carl Lucas. Also possibly goes to his father's (fake) grave and perhaps even gets in contact with his brother James Jr. (though maybe not since he knows J Jr. hates him). Maybe he finds a name he recognizes from his time in Seagate in NYC and tries to learn more about the people that turned him into a superhuman. Either way, the season ends with him really embracing being a local hero rather than the jobs he's been doing being temp. work until he can find a proper job or something. Meanwhile, Stryker is gathering all his forces (and all his influence) n order to both expand out of Harlem... and to take down Luke Cage.

[X] [Actor Idea] Mahershala Ali as Diamondback (Stryker)

Is this too much?
 
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I'm also in for having Jessica in a supporting role, having it not too long after she was released from the influence of The Purple Man, so she is constantly drunk and perhaps being associated with Luke will inspire her to become a private detective, or have her being a private detective who assists Luke find out more about Cottonmouth's crime rackets, as well as kick some ass together.
Maybe a mix of both with a major element from the former? Jessica is a drunkard who unintentionally and reluctantly helping Luke kicks the villain's arse because somehow she gets roped into it. And in the end she decides to stop moping and become a PI.

I think this will show her character progression better. From jaded and bitter drunkard accidental anti 'hero' in this series to a still jaded yet a genuine anti hero in her own series.
 
[X] [Villain Idea] Cottonmouth, a gangster in control of Harlem's Paradise seeking to expand his control by developing legal enterprises alongside his illegal ones.

[X] [Show Story Idea] Luke Cage, brought against his will into conflict with Cottonmouth, seeks to use his strength and invulernability to remove Cottonmouth. Yet he quickly figures out that strength is not enough, as Organized Crime is not that way to remove. He has to deal with trigger-happy cops, corruption and institutionalized opposition, and more. Along the way, he is forced to contend with the fact that strength isnt enough, that many of the gang members he fights enter through coercion and circumstance (like his enemy Cottonmouth himself) and that he needs to be, more than anything else, a symbol for the people of Harlem.

[X] [Actor Idea] Mahershala Ali as Cottonmouth, Chad Coleman for Luke Cage
Mahershala Ali is sublime as Cottonmouth, one of the best acting perfomances in the MCU. For those who don't know, Chad Coleman is Cutty in the Wire, he has the physique and he is a great actor. He would be a bit older than Luke Colter's IRL Cage, but he is a great actor and Cutty has a similar 'coming out of prison to help the people' story.

[X] [Showrunner Idea] Spike Lee (assuming higher rolls for directors), otherwise Lee Daniels and Danny Strong
Lee Daniels and Danny Strong are the creators of Empire, which I have heard good things about. They also made The Butler together, which I liked when I saw back in the day. Tbh I dont know showrunners well. If anyone has a better suggestion please share.

[X] [Additional] Method Man cameo and Bulletproof Love

One of my favorite MCU scenes all together
 
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