Glitchrr36
Slick's Short Company, CEO
- Location
- The Wastes
- Pronouns
- He/Him
I updated my plan with the only other recommendations so that it isn't completely the same lineup when we get the final selections.
Strategic Arms Quest 3/2: Armor Edition
- Thread starter 7734
- Start date
- Original
TortugaGreen
Constantly out of the loop
- Pronouns
- She/Her
[X]Plan Tank Abuse (even though they're not really tanks).
-[X]Request that Thryssen correct the ranging table for their rocket armaments on MwF2 for any production versions. If a new, accurate, table can be gotten to us for further testing, excellent.
-[X]Request that GBA modify the Mglkw 1 to mount the newer 40mm version of the Baal gun currently in use by the Mglkw 1.
-[X]Drop the W-5J and HsKw immediately, as well as the MwF3, MwF4, and Großes Kettenkrad. Consider dropping the SkW-3fz if costs are still tight.
-[X] Re-test the modified vehicles to allow accurate gunnery estimates for the new configurations.
-[X] Run the same maintainability test as during the last competition, with the vehicles being deliberately disabled using incorrect assembly, as well as damage to likely sources of wear and critical components, and the time required to repair them being measured, once with and once without all the appropriate replacement parts.
-[X]Request that Thryssen correct the ranging table for their rocket armaments on MwF2 for any production versions. If a new, accurate, table can be gotten to us for further testing, excellent.
-[X]Request that GBA modify the Mglkw 1 to mount the newer 40mm version of the Baal gun currently in use by the Mglkw 1.
-[X]Drop the W-5J and HsKw immediately, as well as the MwF3, MwF4, and Großes Kettenkrad. Consider dropping the SkW-3fz if costs are still tight.
-[X] Re-test the modified vehicles to allow accurate gunnery estimates for the new configurations.
-[X] Run the same maintainability test as during the last competition, with the vehicles being deliberately disabled using incorrect assembly, as well as damage to likely sources of wear and critical components, and the time required to repair them being measured, once with and once without all the appropriate replacement parts.
Last edited:
Glitchrr36
Slick's Short Company, CEO
- Location
- The Wastes
- Pronouns
- He/Him
[X]Plan Tank Abuse (even though they're not really tanks).
-[X]Request that Thryssen correct the ranging table for their rocket armaments on MwF2 for any production versions. If a new, accurate, table can be gotten to us for further testing, excellent.
-[X]Request that GBA modify the Mglkw 1 to mount the newer 40mm version of the Baal gun currently in use by the Mglkw 1.
-[X]Drop the W-5J and HsKw immediately, as well as the MwF3, MwF4, and Großes Kettenkrad. Consider dropping the SkW-3fz if costs are still tight.
-[X] Re-test the modified vehicles to allow accurate gunnery estimates for the new configurations.
-[X] Run the same maintainability test as during the last competition, with the vehicles being deliberately disabled using incorrect assembly, as well as damage to likely sources of wear and critical components, and the time required to repair them being measured, once with and once without all the appropriate replacement parts
I like this better, really.
-[X]Request that Thryssen correct the ranging table for their rocket armaments on MwF2 for any production versions. If a new, accurate, table can be gotten to us for further testing, excellent.
-[X]Request that GBA modify the Mglkw 1 to mount the newer 40mm version of the Baal gun currently in use by the Mglkw 1.
-[X]Drop the W-5J and HsKw immediately, as well as the MwF3, MwF4, and Großes Kettenkrad. Consider dropping the SkW-3fz if costs are still tight.
-[X] Re-test the modified vehicles to allow accurate gunnery estimates for the new configurations.
-[X] Run the same maintainability test as during the last competition, with the vehicles being deliberately disabled using incorrect assembly, as well as damage to likely sources of wear and critical components, and the time required to repair them being measured, once with and once without all the appropriate replacement parts
I like this better, really.
CthuluWasRight
Fresh Meat for the SV Grinder
- Location
- Canada
I'm kinda worried that we bandwagoned the vote again. Methinks that will come back to bite us in the ass.
Contest 8: Testing Round 2
7734
Trust and verify.
- Location
- Philmont
After doing some quick mental arythmatic, you proceed to fill out the form rejection letters to Thryssen on the F3 and F4, another one with the word "Thryssen" crossed out in several places for the W-5J, and then one more actually reasonably personalized letter for the folks at Gronsky for the HsKw.
After that, modification requests went out fairly snappish, for a 4cm gun carrier from GBA, as well as a revised ranging table from Thryssen's Rocketry Laboratory (who were currently trying to sell the rocket launching cell concept to the Reichsmarine now; good luck on those poor rats).
Interestingly in the middle of this, Skoda voluntarily pulled the SkW-3fz on grounds they'd just gotten a massive order for tanks, and needed every hull they could lay hands on.
Re-testing prooved the rockets much more reliable, and the new fuze charts did institute a hard minimum flight launch of two hundred and fifty meters, as this was the shortest distance the rocket could fly before the fuse safety armed.
Matinence testing was to be done by dint of taking the vehicles to a destruction crew, who had an hour to do as much damage with provided equipment as they could to the vehicle before recovery units arrived to pull the unit.
The Mglkw-1 was up first, and the destructive team went ham on it. With proveded tools, they destroyed all the tires, two of the axles, dismounted the gun and affected severe damage to the operational mechanism, destroyed the majority of the radiator and engine secondary systems, and even managed to nearly crack the engine block with judicious use of a maul.
The repair team of twenty looked at the vehicle, swore, and got to work. After pulling the gun to take it to the armorer's bench, the vehicle was jacked up, and the drivetrain was laboriously repaired over the course of an hour. The work in the engine bay, however, was far more intensive. After pulling the engine and transmission, taking an hour and a half plus the six ton crane, the former was declared dead on arrival, prompting the requirement of a replacement engine. With a normal engine copy proccured without too much difficulty, it was re-mated to the transmission, tied into the wire harness and radiator, and then pronounced ready to go in four more hours- as a truck. As a gun carrier, it was much dicier, requiring about five hours of time on the armorer's bench to get the near-destroyed gun back together.
Next was the Mglkw-2. Having warmed up on it's smaller brother, the destruction team proceeded to figure out how to destroy all the driving axles, actually crack the engine block, and turn the gun into a large collection of scattered parts.
Once again in the garrage, the truck was jacked up and work started on repairing the drive train, to the tune of an hour and a quarter. Next up came the hour and a half love session with the six ton crane to pull the engine and transmission while another spare engine was aquired, mated, and installed to come up to the almost-identical time to it's sister at five hours and fifteen minutes. This hit right about the time the gunsmith said the weapons installed were unrecoverable, the mounting was unrecoverable, and that it would take his people two days and an oxy welder to smack together something at least reasonably safe to use. Since you didn't have two days of standard work time to burn, you chalked it up at eighteen hours on the armorer's bench estimated and let sleeping dogs lie.
The Ft-1 was next, and the destruction teams had to work hard to get their damage in. Once the transmission was considered junked, the team proceeded to go to work on utterly destroying the suspension system. While it was actually nearly impossible to get to the axles under the double road wheels, once teams did get in there it wasn't hard to start wrecking things. The engine escaped most of the attention, but the systems of the turret were absolutely ruined, and there wasn't much else to it after they got done banging up the breach and wrecking the driver's station.
Repair-wise, it was a mixed bag to work on the Ft-1. Getting to the damaged internals and transmission wasn't terribly hard- all that had to be done was spending a half hour taking the front roof off, then pulling the transmission and most of the driver's station with it. While this was underway, a discussion on how to handle the five damaged axles and ten ruined wheels per side was had, with the end result being to jack the tank up, pull all the wheels, and then all the axles. Two and a half hours later everything was off, and another hour of putting it all back on then killed everyone's enthusiasm for working in the turret. While it was easy to dismount and fix the gun, the sighting system with the synthetic aperture turned out to be right bastard to repair, with three hours of electricians banging away on it to no affect as the entire system actively refused to operate correctly. Finally, the repair time was clocked at nine hours with the standard twenty man crew, plus an additional two hours of dedicated electrical specialists.
Coming up after that was the MwF1, which was much harder to rip and tear into than the unarmored trucks. After driving the transmission into the ground, the destruction team removed the suspension by dint of mauls, ruined the drive wheels, and beat the everloving hell out of everything they could in the open-top turret, including the power traverse and the entire driver's station and the radio.
Repair teams, by now used to this, promptly got to work. The first step was getting the crane and jacks, as the entire front glacis managed to come off without too much trouble to reveal the transmission system. After pulling it and setting it aside for repair, the suspenssion cranks were all removed, and new road wheels were aquired while the bogeys were straightened. Re-wiring the power traverese, however, turned out to be a major issue when it turned out Thryssen used an alternating current motor and generator rig on the tank while the base only had non-alternating (or direct) current systems. This in turn meant scavenging up some parts to repair the motor from the signals station, and this delayed things considerably. In all told, it was a nine hour operation to get the vehicle back together, with much problematic drama when the signalmen returned and attempted to use ballistic rubble to reclaim their components.
The next up was the F2, which was given specialty treatement. With a clearly suicidal conscript behind the wheel who managed to drive the vehicle off a ten meter seawall at full speed, the team dubbed the now mangled, beaten, and half-submerged vehicle (and severely concussed conscript) ready for recovery and testing. After waiting for low tide to expose the vehicle, engineers managed to recover the vehicle, and drag it into the workshop.
Once it got in, the first priority was pulling every plug, gasket, and seal. With the front glacis and rear panels removed, the engine was pulled out piece by piece, and disassembly started immediately. While the vehicle was still jacked up, armor repair teams started work on determining the damage to the vehicle's glacis armor and sidewalls. Pulling the transmission normally was a no-go, since the entire disassembly apparatus had been crushed. The decision was made to get the thermal lance to cut off everything forward of the second suspension bogey, and then see what could be salvaged. At this point you wrote a theoretical recovery off entirely, and changed the time specs to where the vehicle would be not in recovery time, but in time to pull the useful parts out. After the three hour front removing operation, the turret was then pulled, and the repair team proceeded to start stripping wiring and pipes. Total time for the job was twelve hours, mostly on account of actually salvaging a lot of the transmission internals stuck in their iron coffin of the front end.
Repairs and salvaging completed, you got a note from High Command. You had a month to make up your mind, and then they needed you to get back to teaching classes. Things weren't looking good at all, and more officers were needed as soon as physically possible. According to dispatches from High Command, and more importantly from Anne-Marie and Ilse Volta, the pot in Lunesburg had gone from "simmering" to "boiling over" as Louise Victoria and Wilhelm Viktor dueled politically over who was going to recieve the crown while the international situation went topsy-turvy. Proxy wars in Mittlesee and the Pavlar Islands were heating up between your nominal allies, the Taelexi; and the no good "democratic" Constitutional Republic of Kubachin. Worse, the Balhks had started going through a major internal power struggle, with some warmongering revanchist "Marshal Reynier" fellow taking the helm while ethnic cleansings happened quietly in the south. Worse, the Wersers were pissing off the Carragians again with some ethnic dispute in the northern kingdoms, and there were rumors of a split in the monarchy underway.
Things were looking bad- you needed to work fast.
Votes
[] Plan Name
-[] MODIFY any units?
-[] TEST any units?
-[] ADOPT any units?
(REMINDER: You can adopt multiple platforms)
After that, modification requests went out fairly snappish, for a 4cm gun carrier from GBA, as well as a revised ranging table from Thryssen's Rocketry Laboratory (who were currently trying to sell the rocket launching cell concept to the Reichsmarine now; good luck on those poor rats).
Interestingly in the middle of this, Skoda voluntarily pulled the SkW-3fz on grounds they'd just gotten a massive order for tanks, and needed every hull they could lay hands on.
Re-testing prooved the rockets much more reliable, and the new fuze charts did institute a hard minimum flight launch of two hundred and fifty meters, as this was the shortest distance the rocket could fly before the fuse safety armed.
Matinence testing was to be done by dint of taking the vehicles to a destruction crew, who had an hour to do as much damage with provided equipment as they could to the vehicle before recovery units arrived to pull the unit.
The Mglkw-1 was up first, and the destructive team went ham on it. With proveded tools, they destroyed all the tires, two of the axles, dismounted the gun and affected severe damage to the operational mechanism, destroyed the majority of the radiator and engine secondary systems, and even managed to nearly crack the engine block with judicious use of a maul.
The repair team of twenty looked at the vehicle, swore, and got to work. After pulling the gun to take it to the armorer's bench, the vehicle was jacked up, and the drivetrain was laboriously repaired over the course of an hour. The work in the engine bay, however, was far more intensive. After pulling the engine and transmission, taking an hour and a half plus the six ton crane, the former was declared dead on arrival, prompting the requirement of a replacement engine. With a normal engine copy proccured without too much difficulty, it was re-mated to the transmission, tied into the wire harness and radiator, and then pronounced ready to go in four more hours- as a truck. As a gun carrier, it was much dicier, requiring about five hours of time on the armorer's bench to get the near-destroyed gun back together.
Next was the Mglkw-2. Having warmed up on it's smaller brother, the destruction team proceeded to figure out how to destroy all the driving axles, actually crack the engine block, and turn the gun into a large collection of scattered parts.
Once again in the garrage, the truck was jacked up and work started on repairing the drive train, to the tune of an hour and a quarter. Next up came the hour and a half love session with the six ton crane to pull the engine and transmission while another spare engine was aquired, mated, and installed to come up to the almost-identical time to it's sister at five hours and fifteen minutes. This hit right about the time the gunsmith said the weapons installed were unrecoverable, the mounting was unrecoverable, and that it would take his people two days and an oxy welder to smack together something at least reasonably safe to use. Since you didn't have two days of standard work time to burn, you chalked it up at eighteen hours on the armorer's bench estimated and let sleeping dogs lie.
The Ft-1 was next, and the destruction teams had to work hard to get their damage in. Once the transmission was considered junked, the team proceeded to go to work on utterly destroying the suspension system. While it was actually nearly impossible to get to the axles under the double road wheels, once teams did get in there it wasn't hard to start wrecking things. The engine escaped most of the attention, but the systems of the turret were absolutely ruined, and there wasn't much else to it after they got done banging up the breach and wrecking the driver's station.
Repair-wise, it was a mixed bag to work on the Ft-1. Getting to the damaged internals and transmission wasn't terribly hard- all that had to be done was spending a half hour taking the front roof off, then pulling the transmission and most of the driver's station with it. While this was underway, a discussion on how to handle the five damaged axles and ten ruined wheels per side was had, with the end result being to jack the tank up, pull all the wheels, and then all the axles. Two and a half hours later everything was off, and another hour of putting it all back on then killed everyone's enthusiasm for working in the turret. While it was easy to dismount and fix the gun, the sighting system with the synthetic aperture turned out to be right bastard to repair, with three hours of electricians banging away on it to no affect as the entire system actively refused to operate correctly. Finally, the repair time was clocked at nine hours with the standard twenty man crew, plus an additional two hours of dedicated electrical specialists.
Coming up after that was the MwF1, which was much harder to rip and tear into than the unarmored trucks. After driving the transmission into the ground, the destruction team removed the suspension by dint of mauls, ruined the drive wheels, and beat the everloving hell out of everything they could in the open-top turret, including the power traverse and the entire driver's station and the radio.
Repair teams, by now used to this, promptly got to work. The first step was getting the crane and jacks, as the entire front glacis managed to come off without too much trouble to reveal the transmission system. After pulling it and setting it aside for repair, the suspenssion cranks were all removed, and new road wheels were aquired while the bogeys were straightened. Re-wiring the power traverese, however, turned out to be a major issue when it turned out Thryssen used an alternating current motor and generator rig on the tank while the base only had non-alternating (or direct) current systems. This in turn meant scavenging up some parts to repair the motor from the signals station, and this delayed things considerably. In all told, it was a nine hour operation to get the vehicle back together, with much problematic drama when the signalmen returned and attempted to use ballistic rubble to reclaim their components.
The next up was the F2, which was given specialty treatement. With a clearly suicidal conscript behind the wheel who managed to drive the vehicle off a ten meter seawall at full speed, the team dubbed the now mangled, beaten, and half-submerged vehicle (and severely concussed conscript) ready for recovery and testing. After waiting for low tide to expose the vehicle, engineers managed to recover the vehicle, and drag it into the workshop.
Once it got in, the first priority was pulling every plug, gasket, and seal. With the front glacis and rear panels removed, the engine was pulled out piece by piece, and disassembly started immediately. While the vehicle was still jacked up, armor repair teams started work on determining the damage to the vehicle's glacis armor and sidewalls. Pulling the transmission normally was a no-go, since the entire disassembly apparatus had been crushed. The decision was made to get the thermal lance to cut off everything forward of the second suspension bogey, and then see what could be salvaged. At this point you wrote a theoretical recovery off entirely, and changed the time specs to where the vehicle would be not in recovery time, but in time to pull the useful parts out. After the three hour front removing operation, the turret was then pulled, and the repair team proceeded to start stripping wiring and pipes. Total time for the job was twelve hours, mostly on account of actually salvaging a lot of the transmission internals stuck in their iron coffin of the front end.
Repairs and salvaging completed, you got a note from High Command. You had a month to make up your mind, and then they needed you to get back to teaching classes. Things weren't looking good at all, and more officers were needed as soon as physically possible. According to dispatches from High Command, and more importantly from Anne-Marie and Ilse Volta, the pot in Lunesburg had gone from "simmering" to "boiling over" as Louise Victoria and Wilhelm Viktor dueled politically over who was going to recieve the crown while the international situation went topsy-turvy. Proxy wars in Mittlesee and the Pavlar Islands were heating up between your nominal allies, the Taelexi; and the no good "democratic" Constitutional Republic of Kubachin. Worse, the Balhks had started going through a major internal power struggle, with some warmongering revanchist "Marshal Reynier" fellow taking the helm while ethnic cleansings happened quietly in the south. Worse, the Wersers were pissing off the Carragians again with some ethnic dispute in the northern kingdoms, and there were rumors of a split in the monarchy underway.
Things were looking bad- you needed to work fast.
Votes
[] Plan Name
-[] MODIFY any units?
-[] TEST any units?
-[] ADOPT any units?
(REMINDER: You can adopt multiple platforms)
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We need to figure out a concisely written way to standardize our tank wrecking procedure. This was unscientific to the point of uselessness and amounted to piling money in a hole and burning it.
TortugaGreen
Constantly out of the loop
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Yeah, I'm not happy with the incobsisteinc involved. One possible solution would be to standardize the extent of specific damages, such as defining how fucked the engine should be and to what extent the structure should be torn up and so on, rather than just saying "fuck it up real bad." On the other hand, the wrecking crews were clearly rather overzealous, as the plan had noted things like malformed parts instead of good ones, some damage to important parts like knocking off a few gear teeth and so on, rather than beating the shit out of the engine with blunt impacts and driving a vehicle off a fucking seawall.
Winged_One²
SACQ Tablemaster
- Location
- Germany
Yeah this round of maintenance testing was basically worthless. @7734 can we get cost estimates before we make our decision? Since at least for the low end part, cost is going to play a major role in my decision (though I am leaning towards the Mglkw 1). Though I don't see the Ft-1 listed in the most recent update.
Winged_One²
SACQ Tablemaster
- Location
- Germany
Yes, because it only has a quad mount of 20mm SlK's, which have abysmal velocity, and it has a lot of mount vibration. If we had a better 20mm autocannon (Oerlikon or HS or 20mm Solothurn Long) I would have been far more favorable to it.
I thought we had but I didn't see a rejection letter mentioned.
A decent HE 20mm round would also have made a difference - if those spread out hits had been more destructive then the beaten zone concept could work.
7734
Trust and verify.
- Location
- Philmont
Well yes, sometimes that happens. After you blocked out an epic fuckload of cash to go do that endurance test, that naturally meant that you'd have to scrimp a little, which means you got erstazregiment conscripts. Mmmmm, conscripts. Aren't they fun?
Asking for new round development for an existing and proven platform isn't outside your power. It would be expensive, but as a fleet upgrade nobody would bat an eyelash at approving it for production.
Yeah, you can get costs.
Yeah, I rolled for Destructiveness of Testing and you got a solid 6, 4, 7, and 10. It was interesting to come up with that 10, let me tell you.
Autocannon development is kinda in the pits right now. The newest is the 35mm, and going forward there's a lot of noises about a scratch build aircraft 20mm gun, but unless the existing Slk is proven radically ineffective then you're not getting rid of it. One of the main driving factors in Irromine weapons development is having a universal weapon across as much of the armed forces as they can, which lets them dodge several literal bullets in the logistics and accounting arms. Sometimes, this comes in really handy- see the 6.5 Irrome cartridge, which is probably going to be relevant on some level for eternity- and on other fronts is a terrible pain in the ass- see the machine pistol carbine they issue.
Right now it's a problem, but later it'll probably help out again.
- Location
- NY
Not just regular conscripts, but substitute conscripts. Wow.
They got one to drive off a 30' cliff. We are not talking the cream here.
Edit: If we effectively only have a month we don't have time for a new HE round to be developed for this competition. Given the advantages of 20mm HE for air and and anti-air use we might want to write some letters to ammunition manufacturers encouraging it anyway.
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- Location
- NY
Never mind the cream, I'm not even sure we got a full crop here.
- Location
- Buskerud, Norway
We got the rotting remains of the granary!
Well, at the very least, we're aware that Thryssen's designs require removal of forward glacis - which are armored, and thus need a good crane - for any serious repair.
Honestly, I hope that Reinhardt has not screwed on this. Their machine was good on previous phase...
Honestly, I hope that Reinhardt has not screwed on this. Their machine was good on previous phase...
7734
Trust and verify.
- Location
- Philmont
The Reinhart is going on when I get home so I can make the files do the truffle shuffle to where they need to be. I've got to upgrade my systems, this losing paragraphs is getting ridiculous.
Man you're in Navy country. These were all the guys who chickened out of the Seebats or Coastal Fortifications gigs.
No, that's like the Bavarian and Schwiegen regiments. They are so infamously wastrel that they never muster because the resultant shortages are more expensive than raising new regiments.
He was trying to commit suicide and insurance fraud at the same time, this is not an average soldier.
- Location
- NY
For future reference, how's this for a maintenance testing routine?