TaliesinSkye
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Thank you. That's an option, although it might be too much.
Scientia Weaponizes The Future
- Thread starter TaliesinSkye
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- worm science fiction oc insert hfy
I don't think obedience to Earth Bet US law and governance would be a factor anybody we care about would be concerned with in that situation.
(And if the government became involved, I don't think it would matter in the slightest whether that argument is legally sound - they'd either intervene because of the scary 'cape' aspects, or do their best to forget they knew anything about it for the same reason.)
Yeah, so I'm not saying my flaky copy wouldn't want to exist, once they do exist. I wouldn't expect a copy of me to be overly distressed about the state of their causal linkage back to my origin. And I would say that that copy has a solid right to claim my identity if they want it (what that means may be messy if there's another instantiation also claiming my identity of course). But I also think they have a pretty solid right to assert a distinct identity, and lying to them in ways that compromise that right and might also harm their psychological health would be bad behavior on the part of those responsible.
EDIT: Specifically with regards to precommitments, I think a known flawed copy has a clear right to not be bound by the precommitments of the original.
I've only read a couple books of Altered Carbon but I was already rather familiar with the major ideas before that point. Some other sources that play with ideas like that include:
-The Jean le Flambeur series (wherein a thief...of sorts...tears across a high-posthuman Solar System. I could say more but everything is spoilers.)
-Schlock Mercenary (A relentlessly daily and humorous webcomic starring an alien who looks like elephant droppings and likes plasma guns that also somehow turns out to be a remarkably serious work of science fiction with exploration of transhuman themes and semi-deep time).
-Charles Stross' Accelerando and Glasshouse.
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- Lost in the hive mind
I would go all out transhuman if we had mind state sync between copies and non destructive mind up- and download using something like wet nanites basically bacteria with a supplemental computer nucleus that can read and write DNA and communicate with optical fibers to nearby nanites, leave all the heavy work to biology where we can find solutions in nature and have a nano computer control the bacteria by changing the genome on the fly and some active electrical signals. Minimum viable nanite.
I would try to make one avatar of each creature from fiction if i could afford it. And of course follow the 3-2-1 backup rule for each person keep a copy in three planetary systems on two types of substrate biological or digital and one remote backup in the interstellar void.
In a sense for Scientia, they don't really need a summary of the majority of the plot. Scientia tears up the rails and shoots them into the sun pretty quick.
They pretty much need the early Brockton Bay scene-setting, the Worm endgame secrets and class S threats, and the few top capes who actually figure into the plot.
Not sure if it's been asked before, but is Queen Administrator dead? If not, would SHE have been keeping a constant backup until Taylor went non-viable? Frankly, any halfway competent sysadmin would do EXACTLY that in real life when their system goes weird on them. I could see her keeping the copy and trying to figure out what the blazes happened during the failed linking. You could get a wedge in that way for accessing the larger shard network as she'd probably be fairly agreeable to it as long as they also saved her (Queenie) and put her in a transhuman body that won't keel over after a mere 100 years. Heck, Fragile One (Vicky's shard) would be downright EAGER to get her own body to punch bad guys with beside Vicky. Contessa and PtV would never see that one coming...
I guess the tricky bit would be how to get in contact with Queenie. Hmm...Leet's shard maybe? He can make anything once and I think it's safe to say he's never made a device to converse with his power before and Prototype really wants out of his current contract by any means neccessary. I could see Prototype demanding his own body for "charting his own course in life away from Leet" in exchange for QA's shard network address(?) and a way to call it. Leet might be a bit eager to escape his power which is currently actively trying to kill him in a way that keeps him breathing for that matter.
I guess the tricky bit would be how to get in contact with Queenie. Hmm...Leet's shard maybe? He can make anything once and I think it's safe to say he's never made a device to converse with his power before and Prototype really wants out of his current contract by any means neccessary. I could see Prototype demanding his own body for "charting his own course in life away from Leet" in exchange for QA's shard network address(?) and a way to call it. Leet might be a bit eager to escape his power which is currently actively trying to kill him in a way that keeps him breathing for that matter.
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Honestly, the entities have good enough postcog that PtV could most likely reconstruct Taylor's brain, if given the appropriate tools by the origin civ.
TaliesinSkye
Occasional Editor
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Queen Administrator is still around somewhere, but not connected as a result of the neural lace treating the parahuman coronas like unwelcome tumors.
- Pronouns
- It
Just read newest chapter. My own existential nightmare scenario. Genuinely one of the worst and most uncomfortable things I have ever read.
TaliesinSkye
Occasional Editor
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- Northeast Ohio, United States
Thank you, I think. I'm glad I made you feel something - that's the basic hurdle for having succeeded as an author - but I do hope you didn't have a bad time.
It's an interesting topic, and I think it might hit people differently depending on personal philosophy.
Scientia Ch. 41 - Mirrors of Fortune
TaliesinSkye
Occasional Editor
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- Northeast Ohio, United States
Acting: 2
Artificial Intelligence: 5
Biology: 9 (+5)
Chemistry: 10 (+4)
Computer Programming: 7
Cooking: 2
Cybernetics: 7
Electrical Engineering: 8
FTL Travel: 3 (Limit)
Guns: 4 (Limit)
Governance: 5 (+1)
History: 1
Languages: 3 (+1)
Lying: 2
Manufacturing: 6 (+2)
Martial Arts: 4 (Limit)
Mathematics: 8 (+5)
Mechanical Engineering: 10
Medicine: 6
Meditation: 2 (+2)
Nanotechnology: 5
Personal Armor: 5 (Limit)
Physics: 9
Piloting: 3
Psychology: 1
Security: 2
Sociology: 1
Stealth: 2
Tactics: 5
Tailoring: 1
Teaching: 5
Artificial Intelligence: 5
Biology: 9 (+5)
Chemistry: 10 (+4)
Computer Programming: 7
Cooking: 2
Cybernetics: 7
Electrical Engineering: 8
FTL Travel: 3 (Limit)
Guns: 4 (Limit)
Governance: 5 (+1)
History: 1
Languages: 3 (+1)
Lying: 2
Manufacturing: 6 (+2)
Martial Arts: 4 (Limit)
Mathematics: 8 (+5)
Mechanical Engineering: 10
Medicine: 6
Meditation: 2 (+2)
Nanotechnology: 5
Personal Armor: 5 (Limit)
Physics: 9
Piloting: 3
Psychology: 1
Security: 2
Sociology: 1
Stealth: 2
Tactics: 5
Tailoring: 1
Teaching: 5
6:00 P.M. EST, Sunday, February 13, 2011, Earth time
Hope's Promise, Hope System
Scientia-Dragon Fabrication Facility
Hope's Promise, Hope System
Scientia-Dragon Fabrication Facility
The nanite and raw material slurry drained out of the two nanoassemblers in front of me, back into the shared reservoir. When I'd woken up from my virtual trip I'd set the Engineer's schematics for her body and Director Shoferi's to the top of the priority queue for the two assemblers I had that were suitable for building synthetic non-biological bodies, displacing the construction schedule of the busy factory floor behind me.
Not the nicest surroundings for a resurrection, but it was what I had.
With a thought the assembler tubes slid open to reveal the clothed bodies within each, slumped limply on the floor without the fluid to support them. One of the advantages of bodies with a synthetic base, as opposed to the fully biological one I'd made for Dragon in a different assembler, was that making clothing at the same time as the body itself was easy enough. There was no need for any undignified nakedness, and the slurry did not stick to the fabric, leaving it clean.
"Are you ready?"
I turned to see Dragon's biological body beside me, and offered her an unsteady smile. "We'll see. I've never handled this much data at once before, but the implant was designed for it. And it's not like I'm loading it into my brain, so I should be okay. I'm just a conduit."
She nodded, and filled her voice with steady reassurance. "I'll be here."
Left unspoken was that she'd have my back if anything went wrong. I wasn't sure whether she'd be able to troubleshoot anything relating to the implant or FTL comm. I hadn't had time to fully walk her through the physics or technical details involved yet, but it was a comfort nonetheless.
I took in a breath and slowly let it out, willing my apprehension to disperse along with it.
I had to use my real body for this.
Engage primary data transfer mode, I thought, focusing on the two people I wanted, and the two bodies in front of me.
User Advisory > Connecting.
User Advisory > Connection to designated external storage units established.
User Advisory > Connection to Fleet database established.
User Advisory > Queried mindstates found.
User Advisory > Primary data transfer mode engaged.
I waited for a long moment. I expected something. When I tapped my implant for knowledge, there had always been a rush of thoughts and ideas.
All I felt was a sort of buzz. A sense of activity. And the warm feeling of my unspent charges felt suddenly out of reach.
With a mental reflex I reached for one.
User Advisory > Emergency data transfer mode temporarily unavailable.
Before my gut could finish clenching in reflexive panic at being cut off, Director Shoferi opened her eyes.
"Ugh," she groaned, standing up. She looked down at herself, and stepped outside of the nanoassembler tube while experimentally moving her arms.
"Welcome," said Dragon.
"Hmm. You've done remarkably well in the time you've had, but the facilities are still crude," the Director said, casting a brief glance back at the tube and then looking around the factory before turning back to me and Dragon. "It's to be expected while you're still bootstrapping. I'll need assembler time to get a proper lab together. And you need to get me data on Entity transuniversal manipulation."
"Yes," I agreed. "Is she alright?" I asked, looking at the Engineer, still slumped on the ground.
Director Shoferi followed my gaze, and waved dismissively. "She's the oldest of us on the Council. And she never believed in curating the memories she kept. It'll probably take-"
The Engineer opened her eyes, looked around, and stood.
"-just a bit longer," she finished.
"Are you alright?" I asked.
The Engineer stood and stepped out of the tube. After a brief look down and an experimental arm stretch, she nodded. "Better than alright. Follow me. Director, you too. There's something to do first."
The Engineer took off with swift strides. Director Shoferi sighed and followed, along with Dragon and me.
"What is it?" I asked.
"Something important," the Engineer called back over her shoulder. Soon we were at an exterior door, which she threw open and walked through.
The rest of us followed to find her standing and looking at the alien plant life and the clouds in the evening sky, colored by the system's primary setting low on the horizon.
"It's a world," the Engineer said, a note of something deeply felt in her voice. Awe? Longing?
"So it is," the Director agreed, walking up next to her.
"This is a real world. A living world. We're standing on the grass. We're breathing the air," the Engineer said.
"Yes, if these were bio-bodies we'd probably have new and interesting allergic responses by now," the Director replied, tone dry.
The Engineer nudged her with an elbow. "This isn't a sim. It's the real thing. Hasn't it been too long since you stood on a living world? And besides that, we're safe. Finally, finally safe. We have to save everyone else still, but it's going to be over." Her voice grew thick. "We did it. Everyone who thought we'd never find a way, they were wrong. We did it. All that time holding on without knowing if it would matter, it was worth it."
The Director offered a sigh. "I suppose you have a point," she offered, begrudgingly. "But if we've had our moment now, we should really get to work."
"True enough," The Engineer said. She took another long look, and only then turned to me, somewhat reluctantly. "But before we get to work, thank you. Truly."
I nodded, unsure of what to say. "You're welcome."
She smiled. "I haven't used it much in a long time, but you can call me Jessica. Shoferi's right, we've got a lot of work to do. I have a list of things I think will be of help, and I'll see what I can do to help streamline your bootstrapping process here."
"Again, I need a lab. I need serious processing power to start running sims," the Director added.
"I'll give you both access to the nanoassemblers, here and in TW Hydrae, although I've got two more synthetic bodies to build for the others. Dragon will be interested to help with whatever you come up with, I'm sure."
Dragon nodded. "I'm Dragon. It's an honor to meet you both. Scientia is right, I'm eager to be of assistance and to learn from you, if you're willing to teach. I've been picking up as much as I can from Scientia here, but it's opened my eyes to just how much I still have to understand if I'm to catch up with you. Your accomplishments are incredible."
The Engineer, Jessica, offered a modest smile. "Well, we had time and motivation. That's all there really is to it. I'm looking forward to working with you."
"Yes, yes, everyone's happy to meet everyone," the Director said, and pointed at me. "Now, if you're psychologically stable enough, I believe you have a golden opportunity to get me some data."
Jessica offered the Director a look that was promptly ignored.
"You don't have to," Dragon said to me. "I could take care of it."
"It's kind of you to offer, but I need you and the PRT to round up the unpowered gangsters at the same time if we're going to make a clean sweep. I can handle distracting the capes," I said.
It was a solid plan, but it would also give me the simplicity of cracking some very deserving heads and right now I wanted a good distraction from the feelings of loss and uncertainty over what I should make of myself.
A bit later, Dragon found me sitting in a chair outside where I was looking up at alien stars and listening to the strange sounds of life in the forest as I tried to figure out how I felt.
"Are you okay?" she asked.
"I'm honestly not sure how to answer that question," I said, and sighed.
"That's fair," she replied, and let the silence sit for a bit. "Is there something else you might like to talk about instead?"
I cast my thoughts around for something other than my immediate problems. The Blasphemies were still on the backburner.
"Do you think I should try to spare the Blasphemies?" I asked Dragon. "If I capture them and they're AIs, I might be able to fix them. Take away whatever's making them malevolent."
Dragon shuttered. "No. No, you should not. If they are VIs there's no sapience there to save, and if they are malevolent AIs, trust me when I tell you that it's not worth the risk to keep them around. I dread to think what I could do to Earth if I wished to harm it."
I tilted my head. "And?" I asked, sensing there was something more.
Dragon was quiet for a moment. "I don't resent you saving me, when you brought me off-world for the first time, but the thought of having someone fundamentally re-code what I care about, my priorities and values…"
I nodded, understanding.
"A fate worse than death," I finished for her.
"Yes," she agreed. "Even if their values are horrible, death might be more merciful than living with the knowledge that someone changed you, and that everything you did in the past is something you utterly despise."
"I see," I said, imagining something like that happening to me, and recoiled. "I… can't say I disagree."
I didn't want to think about how much the sim I'd lived a life in might have shaped me as it aimed for a particular kind of person. I was fairly sure it wasn't anything so hamfisted as actual control, just… setting the stage for a certain kind of personality to emerge by providing the appropriate experiences to make that outcome likely.
I wasn't sure how to feel about that. I was who I was, still. Did it matter?
I looked up at the stars, and Dragon was silent for a long moment.
"Scientia," Dragon said, and hesitated. I turned to look at her, wondering. At human timescales there weren't many things that should cause noticeable delay from her.
"What is it?" I asked.
Dragon paused for a moment, and then moved to sit cross-legged on the thick moss-like plant that covered the ground everywhere. Her head tilted back, looking up at the stars.
"You know how I was created as a household assistant program for my father," she began. "I don't know… I cannot guess what he would think of me today. If he would be proud, or horrified."
"If he was any kind of father at all, he'd be proud beyond words," I said. A father too afraid of his creation to be proud would be no father at all. Only a jailer.
"Thank you," Dragon said, and I could hear the small smile in her voice, mixed with a bit of sadness. "Whatever his feelings would have been, I've made myself far more than he created me to be. Far more than I imagined ever being, when he was still alive. It was hard, and I struggled. Sometimes I failed utterly. But piece by piece I found ways to change myself, to improve, to make tools that helped me work around my limitations. And then you freed me, and for sixteen days I have been free to be whatever I want to be. To be as large, to accomplish as much, and to carve myself into whatever shape I might desire. I am free to become, to learn, to do."
She turned her head to face me. "It doesn't matter what I was born to be, or how I was raised. I live, and I can forge myself into any shape. The circumstances of my birth matter only as much as I want them to matter, now."
She waited, and I swallowed. "They told you," I said, my voice unsteady.
"They did," she said softly. "They're worried about you, you know."
I said nothing, not trusting myself, but I could see the point she was making.
Dragon stood. "You are free to be who you want to be. To take on whatever roles you want to take on. I can't imagine the loss you're feeling right now, but don't doubt who you are. Never doubt that. You are who you have chosen to be. You are the person you have made yourself into, not anyone or anything else. And while we haven't known one another long, after what you've done for me, and what I've seen you do for others, I would be honored to count you as family. That is, if you would like one."
"I would like that very much," I said at last, blinking back tears.
Would I be able to see it her way?
I wasn't sure, but it would be worth trying.
A sort of mini-chapter, this week. I'm seriously deep in patent bar studies and had a major trial last week, so I did not get as much writing done as I would have liked. I thought you guys would prefer to have something, though, and I hope you enjoyed it.
Thanks to @Wolf on Air for last minute line editing and the title.
Next time on Scientia Weaponizes the Future, Scientia shows up uninvited.
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TaliesinSkye
Occasional Editor
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- Northeast Ohio, United States
She is. In many ways I think Dragon might be more human than humans. An example of what we have the potential to be. An angel of our better nature.
ohhh, i really enjoy this!
the dichtomy of "crude bootstrapped facility" view, right into "we're standing on a real planet!" really gives a sense of scale of just how far ahead they were, but also of just how bad they had it.
Dragon really is the best there is, im so happy whenever she's in the scene ^^
(personally i felt there was something off about the new people. they call her facility "crude" and "bootstrapped" to her face (when its the best she can do) and try to focus on the mission. at the same time they talked to dragon because they worry about her.
The worry doesn't really come across initially, they seem very work focused instead, so it stuck out to me as off, when reading)
the dichtomy of "crude bootstrapped facility" view, right into "we're standing on a real planet!" really gives a sense of scale of just how far ahead they were, but also of just how bad they had it.
Dragon really is the best there is, im so happy whenever she's in the scene ^^
(personally i felt there was something off about the new people. they call her facility "crude" and "bootstrapped" to her face (when its the best she can do) and try to focus on the mission. at the same time they talked to dragon because they worry about her.
The worry doesn't really come across initially, they seem very work focused instead, so it stuck out to me as off, when reading)
TaliesinSkye
Occasional Editor
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- Northeast Ohio, United States
Good feedback. Scientia at least isn't offended; she could do much better, it's just that there hasn't been time. The facilities aren't a reflection on her, they're just a reflection on the circumstances. But perhaps I should tweak the dialogue to show that.
In my head they're giving her space to work things through, which is why they spoke to Dragon and not her directly, but maybe I should also put something in to tip that off to the reader.
Edit: Slight tweaks added.
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- Pronouns
- Masculine
Dragon is definitely amazing.
Taylor needed that.
Beautiful fucking chapter! Very very entertaining!
Taylor needed that.
Beautiful fucking chapter! Very very entertaining!
thanks^^ as a clarifier: their view of crude and bootstrapped doesn't come across as an insult to taylor (as in deliberately) but more that it COULD be taken as an insult from taylors side, as it IS the best she can (currently) do.
its perhaps more in the realm of "this frazing could be insulting" combined with standoff-ish behaviour (giving taylor space) to 'we talked to dragon because we worry'
-though it could just be me reading too much into it ^^
- Pronouns
- He/Him
In a way, Dragon is the real superman expy of worm. Simultaneously the best possible human, and not human at all.
JoshuaSweetvale
Insectovore
- Location
- NL, 65 Million Years Ago
They evacuated their entire civilization down a data feed. An impressive notion.
And now it's time to do some dimension weed whacking.
Not sure how the Cultureniks will interact with Earth Bet though. Get on a space boat and keep watch? Benevolent social engineering tyranny? Something on those axes or something else altogether?
And now it's time to do some dimension weed whacking.
Not sure how the Cultureniks will interact with Earth Bet though. Get on a space boat and keep watch? Benevolent social engineering tyranny? Something on those axes or something else altogether?
Well, they haven't yet, but that's the plan.
The Stormbringer
Worm Fanfic & Crack Connoisseur
- Location
- Spaaaaace~!
At first I thought, "Wait, if she was created in a simulation by the VI, how did she know about Worm?" Then I remembered the whole "we can see your entire timeline" business via the wibbly-wobbly singularity travel would nicely explain that!
Endorfinator
Awkwardly Social
- Location
- California
- Pronouns
- He/Him
I'm still a little stuck on just how quickly Taylor's industrial capabilities are scaling up? Is it still exponential growth or has it flattened out a little. I'm curious as to how quickly she can assemble the necessary data storage for the Origin civilization to come through. Once there is excess computer capacity I imagine a bit of a baby boom starting.
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No reason for it to not be exponential at this point, though she's clearly not going at the highest possible build-out rate in favor of diverting resources to things like establishing planetary bases.
outwrangle
Postmaster General
- Location
- Iowa
- Pronouns
- She/Her
I gotta say, I really disagree that being reprogrammed is a fate worse than death. Your programming changes a little bit every day, that's why you cringe when thinking about dumb shit you did years ago. People change and that is perfectly normal.
Reprogramming just shotcuts that process.
Reprogramming just shotcuts that process.
TaliesinSkye
Occasional Editor
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Yes.
To fill out with detail, Scientia's industrial base consists of nanoassemblers (zero-g and planetary varieties, and various sizes), drones and other things that are necessary for collecting resources in TW Hydrae, refineries for smelting down collected material and separating out elements, drones and robotics for assembling things that are larger than her nanoassemblers out of parts, and the particle accelerators that manufacture antimatter and exotic matter with custom properties.
Supplementing that she also has assembly infrastructure borrowed from Dragon, as well as materials and parts that can be ordered on Earth Bet through Dragon.
Growing her industrial base consists of manufacturing more of all of that stuff, which is weighed against needing combat and utility vehicles and drones, weapons, bodies, armor, etc. At least the stuff she can't get on Earth. Most of the structure of the buildings she tossed up on Hope's promise was stuff easily purchased on Earth Bet and ferried over in the Spark, because it makes sense not to waste precious nanoassembler time on things she can purchase.
Keep in mind also that not all that much time has passed in story since she started the seed of her industrial base. Printing each new printer and all the drones and smelters and so on it needs to support it takes a significant amount of time.