Scientia Weaponizes The Future

Multiply it by thousands of predictive shards, all shards influencing the users and recurrency where one prediction engine attempt to predict other engine. It all makes for one great mess where no real prediction is possible. Unless shards cooperate and work closely together. Although we know they do not.

Well that's where Thinker interference comes into play, though I can't remember if that's a fanon or canon idea.
It's a big part of why the Simurgh and PTV are such a big deal - they always come out on top of any such precog-combat, unlike other instances.
 
This is the one you're talking about:

Never having played Robot Unicorn Attack, some of that doesn't actually compute all that well for me, but I'm sure Aisha will be delighted to have a Robot Unicorn of her very own....

Edit: It mentions "other" rainbow creatures...could he make a rainbow robot dog that had the requirements that Bitch's power would work with it? And if he could, is there any reason he would or should?

Double Edit: How about rainbow robot hordes of Insects and Arachnids that Taylor's power could work with?
I think you might be in the wrong thread. That said, can you tell me what the right thread is?

Edit: Ah. Brockton's Celestial Forge, apparently.
 
That's why I figure if shards go the simulation route they must be taking shortcuts left and right.
Yeah, there's also another side of it. We already know that every Shard masters their parahuman to increase aggression and encourage conflict. Could be the simulations of humans are made easier by having some measure of control of the actions of parahumans. With that kind of processing power even tweaking the brain to have a stronger fight or flight response at the pivotal moment could have massive knock on effects. Factoring every parahuman in a given situation in, that kind of influence would probably simplify predicting the outcome by several orders of magnitude. Also, you don't have simulate every particle of the entire mass of the earth. Large abstractions can handle the totality of macro effects like plate tectonics, volcanic effects, weather etc without modeling every single atom of iron within the earth's core.

The biggest issues would be quantum effects which can have large macro effects when taken as a whole over uncountable many interactions, and whatever truly governs consciousness, which is probably quantum effects too to be honest. People are really hard to predict, though cultures as a whole are somewhat easier.

Dinah's Shard may give us a hint of how the precog thing works. It gives her probabilities. Could be that their simulation accounts for difference in decisions and branches the simulation for major divergences, with weightings for the likelyhood of them occurring. We'd be back to the original problem you point out though ; branching simulations means even more computing power needed, thus even more mass for the computers.

There's potentially billions of shards though, so given how bullshit tier the Shards are in Worm already, I wouldn't put it past them to have a couple solar system sized simulation machines.
 
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Several Earths worth of mass might let you simulate one Earth in full deterministic mode. (If we also assume that deterministic simulation is possible, because quantum effects of course throw a huge wrench in that.) To simulate vast numbers of potential future Earths it stands to reason you'd need way

The amount of mass we are trying to comprehend when talking about Entities is outright absurd.
You have to to keep in mind that shards are N-dimensional, we don't exactly know how many dimensions they have, but we know that an Endbringer core is just the protrusion of a Shard in 3 dimensions, and an Endbringer core mass is counted in Galaxies.
To that add absolutely flawless understanding (or at least far far more sophisticated, even if instinctual, than ours) of quantum processes.
Add to that millions of years of evolutionary pressure towards energy efficiency.

Flawlessly simulating a whole planet in the medium term is a trivial matter, what's harder is simulating other shards.

They cannot fully simulate a cycle because the energy costs get impossibly massive when looking too far in the future, not because the simulation would be inaccurate, at least that's what WoG implies to my understanding.
 
The amount of mass we are trying to comprehend when talking about Entities is outright absurd.
You have to to keep in mind that shards are N-dimensional, we don't exactly know how many dimensions they have, but we know that an Endbringer core is just the protrusion of a Shard in 3 dimensions, and an Endbringer core mass is counted in Galaxies.
To that add absolutely flawless understanding (or at least far far more sophisticated, even if instinctual, than ours) of quantum processes.
Add to that millions of years of evolutionary pressure towards energy efficiency.

Flawlessly simulating a whole planet in the medium term is a trivial matter, what's harder is simulating other shards.

They cannot fully simulate a cycle because the energy costs get impossibly massive when looking too far in the future, not because the simulation would be inaccurate, at least that's what WoG implies to my understanding.
There's ambiguity there, but I think when WoG said that getting to an Endbringer core was as difficult as digging through a spiral galaxy's equivalent of matter it was emphasizing how difficult it was to get through the compressed layers by analogy, not giving an actual mass measurement. Doing construction on the order of that much mass seems well beyond the energy budgets and size of the entities as described. There's also the point that Scion's beams would take a very long time to disintegrate a galaxy's worth of mass, if he even has the energy budget to do so, and yet he kills Endbringers fairly quickly.
 
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There's ambiguity there, but I think when WoG said that getting to an Endbringer core was as difficult as digging through a spiral galaxy's equivalent of matter it was emphasizing how difficult it was to get through the compressed layers by analogy, not giving an actual mass measurement. Doing construction on the order of that much mass seems well beyond the energy budgets and size of the entities as described. There's also the point that Scion's beams would take a very long time to disintegrate a galaxy's worth of mass, if he even has the energy budget to do so, and yet he kills Endbringers fairly quickly.

I disagree entirely.

The end of the cycle event, which both detonates multiple parallel Earths and fuels up the shards' power stores, is them destroying over 1x1080​ Earths. That's enough energy to destroy 1.9x1050​ universes.

Interlude 26 said:
The energy is released, and the planet shatters.

The shattering is so extreme that it extends into other worlds, through the same channels that the fragments used to extend into other realities. Every single one of the remaining habitable worlds is destroyed in the ensuing blast.

[...]

That the number of worlds exceed the number of particles that might exist in one world's universe is inconsequential.

IRC Chat said:
IRC Convo said:

[19:29] <logiccosmic> Hey WB, quick question. Probably can't answer because its spoilers, but how do the entities power themselves? And the shards? Is it heat, mass annihaltion, or what?
[19:31] <logiccosmic> Or is it just unknown, and will remain unknown?
[19:46] <Wildbow> They gather and store a vast quantity in their 'birth' and then hold on to it over time, spending it like currency.
[19:46] <logiccosmic> Got it.
[19:47] <logiccosmic> And that's all from shattering planets/harvesting realities?
[19:47] <Wildbow> Yes.
[19:47] <Wildbow> They also absorb some energy while traveling and/or while bonded to hosts, but that's more like using a solar panel to delay the battery running out.
[19:47] <logiccosmic> Energy, as in physical energy, or some sort of spirtual/fancy/weird energy?
[19:49] <Wildbow> Yes.

Individual Entities have access to more energy than exists in every burning star of a single universe by a metric fuck ton.

Scion's beams also in Ward, are described as cutting through multiple worlds simultaneously. When he blows up Bet's United Kingdom? He's blowing up countless Untied Kingdoms as well.

Interlude 8x said:
He'd joined the Fallen because all that selflessness and communication had amounted to nothing but whole universes of ruin- great golden beams that had cut through the lens, through the Earth Bet he knew and into the seemingly infinite Earths that were included in that package, that were used for predictions and simulations, for templates and data. It was too vast to comprehend, so people didn't bother comprehending. Nothing meaningful had changed since that point.

The Endbringers individually each having a whole galaxy of mass? It's kind of on the small side compared to all this. Scion killing them quickly is just him being that powerful.

So, on the whole, the shards having more mass than the Earth to calculate things deterministically? Is entirely feasible. Hell, not all the shards have even landed yet. It'll take over a hundred years before all the shards have landed on an Earth of their own.

Interlude 26 said:
Both are trailed by a cloud of shards now, each cast off in such a way that it won't reach its target location until a set time and date.

[...]

The focus is on one reality. They will subsume it first, then expand to others.

[...]

It will take one hundred and sixty revolutions before their destination reality hits critical mass.

Three hundred and thirty-one revolutions before the shards reach a critical mass and enough information is gathered.

[...]

The entity has cast off all but the most essential parts of itself, distributing the shards throughout this reality. More shards will shower on other realities in time, likely around the point the first have started fragmenting in greater numbers.
 
...Their scale of actual operations is ridiculously small compared to those sorts of exponents.

Earths like Aleph and Bet are literal petri dishes to them; a petri dish in a lab full of equipment and machines that are far larger and more massive than the subject being studied and analyzed.

Each parahuman is connected to a piece of alien crystal that are the size of literal continents, and will over the cycle's lifespan consume all the mass of the Earths they're on.

The scale of how a cycle figures out data is ridiculously small compared to what the shards and entities actually are, even including the fact they're studying multiple earths at different levels of intensity. When Bet eventually breaks, they'd move their primary study to another Earth, start a golden age of parahumans all over again, and repeat.

Still, at the end of every cycle, they're throwing universe shattering energy around. They dump all the used petri dishes into the furnace, killing untold amounts of life that can only be properly shown in exponents, and moving on to the next world to experiment on.
 
You say literal petri dishes, but that's an overstatement by a lot of orders of magnitude. The entire solar system is around 10^57 daltons. By your numbers, their overall operations are on a scale where one Earth is a ridiculous number of orders of magnitude smaller than any human perspective on a single hydrogen atom.

And they managed to lose.
 
You say literal petri dishes, but that's an overstatement by a lot of orders of magnitude. The entire solar system is around 10^57 daltons. By your numbers, their overall operations are on a scale where one Earth is a ridiculous number of orders of magnitude smaller than any human perspective on a single hydrogen atom.

And they managed to lose.

The cycle was doomed the moment Eden started texting while driving, crashing into Earth, and allowing Contessa as a little girl to kill her with a knife of all things. Sure, it was a PtV guided knife, but still. Even then, Scion ultimately was defeated during Gold Morning, not because his power was overcome, but because he literally got too depressed to fight anymore and lost the will to live after Taylor bullied him relentlessly about his dead wife. Then he stood still in front of the giant doom cannon, and got blasted.

The Entities are eldritch beings with incomprehensible scale and power at their backs... but are as creative as bricks and as emotionally stable as dioxygen difluoride.
 
The cycle was doomed the moment Eden started texting while driving, crashing into Earth, and allowing Contessa as a little girl to kill her with a knife of all things. Sure, it was a PtV guided knife, but still. Even then, Scion ultimately was defeated during Gold Morning, not because his power was overcome, but because he literally got too depressed to fight anymore and lost the will to live after Taylor bullied him relentlessly about his dead wife. Then he stood still in front of the giant doom cannon, and got blasted.

The Entities are eldritch beings with incomprehensible scale and power at their backs... but are as creative as bricks and as emotionally stable as dioxygen difluoride.
But also apparently astonishingly physically fragile, because even if they're not putting up any active resistance the giant doom cannon (let alone the knife) has to be able to actually damage them despite being proportionately sub-atomic in scale.
 
But also apparently astonishingly physically fragile, because even if they're not putting up any active resistance the giant doom cannon (let alone the knife) have to be able to actually damage them despite being proportionately sub-atomic in scale.

The Warrior =/= Scion. The Thinker =/= Eden.

Scion and Eden are less than the equivalent of a hair to the Warrior and Thinker. Less than a cell really.

The full Entities and their avatars during the cycle are two different things.
 
The Warrior =/= Scion. The Thinker =/= Eden.

Scion and Eden are less than the equivalent of a hair to the Warrior and Thinker. Less than a cell really.

The full Entities and their avatars during the cycle are two different things.
Which doesn't change that stabbing that tiny portion with an even tinier weapon effectively killed The Thinker as a whole. (And shooting the other tiny portion did a number on The Warrior, though not having read Ward I hesitate to say quite what.)
 
I disagree entirely.

The end of the cycle event, which both detonates multiple parallel Earths and fuels up the shards' power stores, is them destroying over 1x1080​ Earths. That's enough energy to destroy 1.9x1050​ universes.

Individual Entities have access to more energy than exists in every burning star of a single universe by a metric fuck ton.

Scion's beams also in Ward, are described as cutting through multiple worlds simultaneously. When he blows up Bet's United Kingdom? He's blowing up countless Untied Kingdoms as well.

The Endbringers individually each having a whole galaxy of mass? It's kind of on the small side compared to all this. Scion killing them quickly is just him being that powerful.

So, on the whole, the shards having more mass than the Earth to calculate things deterministically? Is entirely feasible. Hell, not all the shards have even landed yet. It'll take over a hundred years before all the shards have landed on an Earth of their own.
Blowing up planets costs energy though, it doesn't give you energy. Overcoming the gravitational binding energy of a planet is a huge power sink. That was one of Wildbow's bigger physics fails; I think he may have corrected it later to be a thing that's done to not leave any potential threats behind or aid in shard collection, but I don't have a citation on that at the moment.

Everything gets warped into absurdity if you try to peg Endbringers at a literal galaxy worth of mass each. An Entity mass on the order of a moon to a few planets makes a lot more sense for the scale of things we see them doing, the descriptions of their size while traveling which are large like planets but not blotting out galaxies large, the number of shards there appear to be, and the size of the shards.

Wildbow, while a good writer, isn't a physicist or engineer. When there's a conflict between descriptions and what makes sense and a number he gives, I'm personally going to go with something based on the descriptions.
 
Blowing up planets costs energy though, it doesn't give you energy. Overcoming the gravitational binding energy of a planet is a huge power sink. That was one of Wildbow's bigger physics fails; I think he may have corrected it later to be a thing that's done to not leave any potential threats behind or aid in shard collection, but I don't have a citation on that at the moment.

Everything gets warped into absurdity if you try to peg Endbringers at a literal galaxy worth of mass each. An Entity mass on the order of a moon to a few planets makes a lot more sense for the scale of things we see them doing, the descriptions of their size while traveling which are large like planets but not blotting out galaxies large, the number of shards there appear to be, and the size of the shards.

Wildbow, while a good writer, isn't a physicist or engineer. When there's a conflict between descriptions and what makes sense and a number he gives, I'm personally going to go with something based on the descriptions.
If blowing up planets is a power sink (and they're not doing some exotic multidimensional mass-energy conversion shit to get energy out of it) then they kind of need to be that big though. Moreover the entities have no reason not to be that big, given the amount of alternate worlds there are in the universe they inhabit. Using them all, or at least a large fraction of them, gives them more processing power, more energy, more capability in general. They'd have to be dumb not to.

Furthermore, my personal interpretation of that is that they're moon-sized in any given 3-space, but obviously much bigger in total. (much bigger than a moon in any given 3-space would also make them too big to land on a planet, so that tracks) Also, this is the full entity, not the incredibly diminished Scion the characters fight. Also, his interlude explicitly states that one shard can be big enough to need multiple earths, so that alone makes an entity much bigger than a planet, assuming they have anywhere near the amount of shards they're both stated and shown to have.
Interlude 26 said:
One shard is capable of settling in a grouping of near-identical worlds, drawing energy from all of those worlds at once.

I also don't see why the endbringers having a galaxy's worth of mass warps things into absurdity. They have the capability, in terms of reach, to access that much mass. I'd even go so far as to say a galaxy's worth of mass is insignificant to them. 10^80 alternate earths means taking just one atom from each of those earths gives enough mass to make an absolutely absurd amount of galaxy-massed endbringers.

The main counterargument against this sort of thing I've encountered is the fact Scion needed to ration his energy, but frankly, he was running on battery power. And he had enough of it to keep going for 3000 years of activity, when he only expected to need 300 years. Do you build a laptop with a battery lifespan ten times as long as you expect to need it? Not plugging himself into some kind of centralized energy storage or building a multidimensional mass-energy conversion reactor (or at worst, fusion) that could've kept him going indefinitely is a failure of planning, not of capability.

More than anything, in my experience with these sorts of arguments that go 'the entities aren't that big!', there is a failure to grasp the difference between the full entity and the diminished form that is Scion. Scion is not an entity. Scion is a few vital shards in a trenchcoat with a couple of multitools hooked up to a battery, responsible for running (his part of) the cycle and dealing with problems that arise. And even then he was only beaten when he allowed himself to be beaten.
 
Which doesn't change that stabbing that tiny portion with an even tinier weapon effectively killed The Thinker as a whole. (And shooting the other tiny portion did a number on The Warrior, though not having read Ward I hesitate to say quite what.)

Well, yes, but most of that is the Warrior and the Thinker dividing all of themselves into trillions upon trillions of shards and only taking a few shards to make an avatar rather than dozens, hundreds, or even thousands.

Humanity would have zero hope against a full Entity just deciding to kill all life on all Earths.

Also, this is the universe where a bug-controller killed the Superman expy by stuffing bugs down their throat... despite them being capable of flying at super-sonic speeds. There's a level of suspension of disbelief that has to be involved.

Blowing up planets costs energy though, it doesn't give you energy. Overcoming the gravitational binding energy of a planet is a huge power sink. That was one of Wildbow's bigger physics fails; I think he may have corrected it later to be a thing that's done to not leave any potential threats behind or aid in shard collection, but I don't have a citation on that at the moment.

No, it's still canonically how they gain energy at the end of the cycle and explicitly how they reproduce. The end of the cycle produces more entities than what started it. Ward didn't change that. It's just it also is how they remove the evidence of them ever being there. If you remove or ignore this aspect, the Entities make zero sense on how they're an existential threat to the setting with their ultimate goal of filling the multiverse with themselves.

Besides, they don't shoot a Death Star style beam at all the Earths separately or anything, wasting energy. They channel all of their power into one planet via dimensional effects, which causes it to go boom, and the way they've set up portals through all the Earths has the explosion engulf all the earths that ever exist. I'm not sure if this is a chain reaction or what, but they absorb the energy from the explosion and ultimately get more than they put in.

Everything gets warped into absurdity if you try to peg Endbringers at a literal galaxy worth of mass each. An Entity mass on the order of a moon to a few planets makes a lot more sense for the scale of things we see them doing, the descriptions of their size while traveling which are large like planets but not blotting out galaxies large, the number of shards there appear to be, and the size of the shards.

Except Entities are explicitly larger than that scale.

Interlude 7x said:
It wasn't big in the sense that the trees or even the mountains were big. It was big in the way that transcended what she could even see or feel. It was like seeing something bigger than the whole wide planet, except more – this thing that was too large to comprehend to start with, it extended. She didn't have a better word to describe what she was perceiving. It was as though there were mirror images of it, but each image existed in the same place, some moving differently, and sometimes, very rarely, one image came in contact with something that the others didn't. Each of the images was as real and concrete as the others. And this made it big in a way that she couldn't describe if she were a hundred year old scholar or philosopher with access to the best libraries in the world.

Snare 13.9 said:
Two beings spiraled through an airless void, past suns, stars and moons. They rode the ebbs and flows of gravity, ate ambient radiation and light and drew on other things I couldn't perceive. They slipped portions of themselves in and out of reality to reshape themselves. Push further into this reality to ride the pull of one planet, shift into another to ride that slingshot momentum, or to find some other source of momentum elsewhere. Ten thousand thousands of each of the two entities existed simultaneously, complemented each other, drew each other forward. They shrugged off even the physical laws that limited the movement of light, moving faster with every instant.

Each body is larger than Earth by some unknown amount, and they exist across ten million universes simultaneously. At the very, very least, you're already dealing with two creatures that are the equivalent of twenty million earths. That's bigger than our sun.

Wildbow, while a good writer, isn't a physicist or engineer. When there's a conflict between descriptions and what makes sense and a number he gives, I'm personally going to go with something based on the descriptions.

Yeah, but the descriptions include destroying more planets than there are particles in a universe, and getting a net-positive amount of energy from it. That has to inflate them to ridiculous levels, and being crucial to their reproduction, ignoring it means the setting's wider cosmic horror aspects make zero sense at all.
 
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Some universe Facts, to give perspective:
Approximate Mass of milky Way (our Galaxy): 10^42 kg
Approximate mass of sun: 10^30 kg
Approximate Mass of earth: 10^24 kg
 
Also, his interlude explicitly states that one shard can be big enough to need multiple earths, so that alone makes an entity much bigger than a planet, assuming they have anywhere near the amount of shards they're both stated and shown to have.
One small point I would make in response here; that's large enough to cover the surface of a planet, which while big is trifling compared to the whole volume of a planet. One figure I found for the mass of the Earth's crust is 2.77 x 10^22 kg, compared to 5.972 × 10^24 kg for the whole Earth. I suspect a shard would be a fraction of the mass of the entire crust, which is 5-70 km thick of rock, even if it covered the whole planet. It could take thousands of those super-big shards to add up to one Earth mass.
 
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One small point I would make in response here; that's large enough to cover the surface of a planet, which while big is trifling compared to the whole volume of a planet. One figure I found for the mass of the Earth's crust is 2.77 x 10^22 kg, compared to 5.972 × 10^24 kg for the whole Earth. I suspect a shard would be a fraction of the mass of the entire crust, which is 5-70 km thick of rock, even if it covered the whole planet. It could take thousands of those super-big shards to add up to one Earth mass.

Entities when whole have "trillions upon trillions upon trillions"/"a trillion times a trillion" shards. Taking the second at face value, that's 1.e+24 shards.

Interlude 18 + 26 said:
They were one, they were all. A collective, a single entity, a trillion times a trillion entities. Each with a function in the whole, each with a role in the cycles, each with an individual identity.
--------------
Each signal is nuanced, shaped with subtle details and clues by the trillions upon trillions upon trillions of individual shards that make up the entity. Through these nuances, it conveys more information than an entire planet of sentient beings might in a hundred revolutions.

And when they separate their shards and form their avatar, those avatars become 1/10000 of a percent of what they once were.

Interlude 26 said:
The entity is satisfied. In terms of raw size, it is but a small fragment of what it once was, barely a cluster of shards now. Its part in this phase of things is nearly done.

The next part of the cycle begins.

It chooses an unoccupied reality. A barren planet. Its perceptions focus on the landmasses in idle curiosity. Different from the focus reality, but similar.

They have reached the solar system in question now. They brush up against one another, and the entity shores up its counterpart where it can, sacrificing its own shards in the process.

Acceptance. Gratitude.

The counterpart's message is thin, but the entities are but a ten-thousandth of a percent of their original size.

They definitely have the numbers to have more than several Earth masses with just continent sized shards, let alone shards that need multiple earths to support them.
 
Entities when whole have "trillions upon trillions upon trillions"/"a trillion times a trillion" shards. Taking the second at face value, that's 1.e+24 shards.



And when they separate their shards and form their avatar, those avatars become 1/10000 of a percent of what they once were.



They definitely have the numbers to have more than several Earth masses with just continent sized shards, let alone shards that need multiple earths to support them.
I'm not sure it's a safe assumption that the figurative speech is a literal count of the number of full sized shards. Could be smaller sub units, and each continent sized shard is many.
 
I'm not sure it's a safe assumption that the figurative speech is a literal count of the number of full sized shards. Could be smaller sub units, and each continent sized shard is many.

Why wouldn't it be a safe assumption given everything else stated about them? It comes up twice, specifically from their perspective and not a human's, and isn't contradictory of anything. It lines up well with all the other huge scaling throughout the Entity interludes. The same as using up a supernova's worth of energy to use Broadcast, it taking centuries for all the shards to even land on an earth, them capable of traveling at millions of times the speed of light, the whole destroying more planets than particles in the universe and The Warrior and Thinker having done so three thousand times, or Endbringers' having a galaxy's worth of mass each.

And that quote that's about a trillions times a trillion entities making up an Entity is from a Shard's own perspective and memories, specifically Noelle's. While the Entities are a colony life-form, the Shards that make up an Entity aren't. When the Warrior and Thinker talk about needing to discard pieces of themselves, they talk about shards. There isn't anything in the setting that is the equivalent of sub-units that make up a Shard but are also its own entity.

During the cycle, sure there's buds, but Shards aren't made of buds. They only bud during the Cycle after acquiring enough data, and when Shards bud, they don't create a smaller aspect of themselves, they create entirely new Shards of their own. For example, the Fragile One is Vicky's Shard that is literally only a few years old when Vicky triggers. It's made up of a conglomerate of multiple Shards' "waste," but is still a Shard in its own right.

It's not a sub-shard or a physically a piece of its progenitors.
 
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Why wouldn't it be a safe assumption given everything else stated about them? It comes up twice, specifically from their perspective and not a human's, and isn't contradictory of anything. It lines up well with all the other huge scaling throughout the Entity interludes. The same as using up a supernova's worth of energy to use Broadcast, it taking centuries for all the shards to even land on an earth, them capable of traveling at millions of times the speed of light, the whole destroying more planets than particles in the universe and The Warrior and Thinker having done so three thousand times, or Endbringers' having a galaxy's worth of mass each.

And that quote that's about a trillions times a trillion entities making up an Entity is from a Shard's own perspective and memories, specifically Noelle's. While the Entities are a colony life-form, the Shards that make up an Entity aren't. When the Warrior and Thinker talk about needing to discard pieces of themselves, they talk about shards. There isn't anything in the setting that is the equivalent of sub-units that make up a Shard but are also its own entity.

During the cycle, sure there's buds, but Shards aren't made of buds. They only bud during the Cycle after acquiring enough data, and when Shards bud, they don't create a smaller aspect of themselves, they create entirely new Shards of their own. For example, the Fragile One is Vicky's Shard that is literally only a few years old when Vicky triggers. It's made up of a conglomerate of multiple Shards' "waste," but is still a Shard in its own right.

It's not a sub-shard or a physically a piece of its progenitors.
Perhaps I'm thinking about it like a computer scientist, but think recursively. What if the minimum size of a shard isn't something the size of a continent, but something the size of a baseball? What if the continent sized shards are themselves made out of millions of things that could be called shards? What if many continent sized shards can be joined together into greater pieces that are still called shards?
 
Perhaps I'm thinking about it like a computer scientist, but think recursively. What if the minimum size of a shard isn't something the size of a continent, but something the size of a baseball? What if the continent sized shards are themselves made out of millions of things that could be called shards? What if many continent sized shards can be joined together into greater pieces that are still called shards?
This is reaching, my dude. The scale of an individual shard is admittedly debatable (and likely just straight-up variable), but the range of that debate goes from 'fuckbig' to 'fuckbig plus'. At the very least, that grouping of worlds quote provides a scale for an ordinary shard, considering scion said nothing about 'the most important shards can settle in a grouping of worlds' or 'the largest shards can settle in a grouping of worlds', even if you assume the shard doesn't cover any individual world entirely. Shards are big. Even normal shards are big. Not baseball-sized.

Edit: Moreover, even assuming shards are made of subunits, calling those subunits shards as well would just introduce needless confusion and that is clearly not Wildbow's intent. I'm a human made of human cells, not a human made of tinier humans.
 
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