Mandat de l'impératrice des Cieux - Imperial Princess Troubleshooter Space Opera Quest

I was at one point considering the "Appeal to patriotism" option but I think I saw it as "too good to be true" when Whiskey mentioned less favours needed. I know this quest isn't dice based but it very much felt like a "high risk, high reward" option. I don't like risk so I did not want to take it.

Then I voted for "The power of moe compels you", not realising that while it would endear Ahri to the general that would not help Yui in any way.

Yui: Look, here is the empress. Is she not worthy of protection?
General: She is. *Shoots Yui*

I mean it would be interesting to read so... :whistle:
Lmao, theres a very high chance that it would have worked actually imo. Because turns out when you walk the walk, you get much more rep out of it. Lemme ask you this. If she asks you to prove your patriotism, could you cite past actions? So far, i can think of at least 2.
 
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Lmao, theres a very high chance that it would have worked actually imo. Because turns out when you walk the walk, you get much more rep out of it. Lemme ask you this. If she asks you to prove your patriotism, could you cite past actions? So far, i can think of at least 2.
Does nearly starting a civil war because your empress wants to check out something that worries her count? I guess paying for the maintenance of her fleet from her own pocket also counts. Joining the navy at all probably counts because there is no way that was the most lucrative path for her as a high ranking noble.

Finding reasons isn't hard. I am just sus of any option that says anything like "if this works less favours are needed".
 
Does nearly starting a civil war because your empress wants to check out something that worries her count? I guess paying for the maintenance of her fleet from her own pocket also counts. Joining the navy at all probably counts because there is no way that was the most lucrative path for her as a high ranking noble.

Finding reasons isn't hard. I am just sus of any option that says anything like "if this works less favours are needed".
Two public action of note in this quest. Yui gave up her fleet for the greater good. Second that vote on that naval act thing? Abstaining with the rest of the armed forces? Thats some solidarity with the rest of the shooty bangers, that you shoot and bang, not make the decision.

Quite frankly, you can argue that yui is a patriot based off what y'all can control, thats publicslly known anyway.
 
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Yui: Look, here is the empress. Is she not worthy of protection?
General: She is. *Shoots Yui*

I mean it would be interesting to read so... :whistle:

Thanks, now it's confirmed:



Live action Ahri is played by IU, Korea's little sister, who everyone wants to protecc. (I'd cast Yoo In-na as live-action Yui; acting ability and charisma over appearance - both of them are tiny.)
 
In an unrelated note, I am leaking something whiskey and I conferred over somewhere else in relation to this quest.

The Fox-Thought of the Day Calendar.
 
I should also note, by the way, that we are no longer playing with a safety net. Y'all fuck up means you gotta deal with the consequences of your actions.
Uh, this also means that you need to make sure players already fully understand the context of the quest. You'd probably hinted at the context earlier. But, if you're going to hint at the context of the quest and have players figure it out themselves, you need a safety net, because otherwise the players won't last long enough to figure out how to play. Safety nets don't exist to make players not need to deal with the consequences of their actions, they exist to allow players to do so rather than auto-losing or ruining things forever. Take, for example, real life. In real life, when doing a suspended obstacle course, you don't wear a safety harness to prevent falling off and having to start over; you wear a safety harness so that, when you do fall, you don't get severely injured or killed.
The safety net doesn't need to take the form of abrogating the consequences of a choice; it can even be just allowing your players to start over or try again when they make a choice that has consequences they can't deal with. Note that "they can't deal with" here means "are literally unsolvable."
I have an idea: When you make a vote, think "What decision would Yui make if this was a non-quest story and she was IC, and what knowledge would she use to make it?" Then, make sure all of that knowledge is clearly available to the player (rather than having to be teased out from between lines,) and, unless this is a vote where you want to make people come up with options themselves, also provide the option to make that decision.

Don't take the above as an attack on you; it isn't. Instead, those are suggestions for what to do in the future: Put in a safety net, so that players can't lose because they didn't already know and understand the context when starting to read and participate in the quest; make sure players have the information needed to decide to do what the PC would if there weren't players, and make sure that option is available.
-snipped attempt to crowd out other poster-
Uh, dude. Not cool. Not cool at all. When someone says they feel like an idiot, it's not cool to go up to them and tell them how stupid and worthless they are and how bad they should feel for wasting other people's air.
 
Uh, this also means that you need to make sure players already fully understand the context of the quest. You'd probably hinted at the context earlier. But, if you're going to hint at the context of the quest and have players figure it out themselves, you need a safety net, because otherwise the players won't last long enough to figure out how to play. Safety nets don't exist to make players not need to deal with the consequences of their actions, they exist to allow players to do so rather than auto-losing or ruining things forever. Take, for example, real life. In real life, when doing a suspended obstacle course, you don't wear a safety harness to prevent falling off and having to start over; you wear a safety harness so that, when you do fall, you don't get severely injured or killed.
The safety net doesn't need to take the form of abrogating the consequences of a choice; it can even be just allowing your players to start over or try again when they make a choice that has consequences they can't deal with. Note that "they can't deal with" here means "are literally unsolvable."
I have an idea: When you make a vote, think "What decision would Yui make if this was a non-quest story and she was IC, and what knowledge would she use to make it?" Then, make sure all of that knowledge is clearly available to the player (rather than having to be teased out from between lines,) and, unless this is a vote where you want to make people come up with options themselves, also provide the option to make that decision.

Don't take the above as an attack on you; it isn't. Instead, those are suggestions for what to do in the future: Put in a safety net, so that players can't lose because they didn't already know and understand the context when starting to read and participate in the quest; make sure players have the information needed to decide to do what the PC would if there weren't players, and make sure that option is available.

Uh, dude. Not cool. Not cool at all. When someone says they feel like an idiot, it's not cool to go up to them and tell them how stupid and worthless they are and how bad they should feel for wasting other people's air.
I suppose its alright to passive aggressively accuse all of the non american posters of racism, Mister White Knight?
 
I'm not accusing anyone of racism. How do you even get that from my post?
Oh you didn't even bother reading what always late posted did you? Then agaim given the sheer lack of reading on your part, I'm not particularly suprised either.

Then for your benefit, he literally accused all of us of being racist towards americans, given that quite a fair bit of the writing team and quite a fair bit of the people who read the quest are south east asians. This was after the author and several other posters politely informed him about his lack of perspective.

If you want to defend someone like that, by all means go ahead. But put some time into actually figuring out how whiskey runs this quest.
 
Oh you didn't even bother reading what always late posted did you? Then agaim given the sheer lack of reading on your part, I'm not particularly suprised either.

Then for your benefit, he literally accused all of us of being racist towards americans, given that quite a fair bit of the writing team and quite a fair bit of the people who read the quest are south east asians. This was after the author and several other posters politely informed him about his lack of perspective.

If you want to defend someone like that, by all means go ahead. But put some time into actually figuring out how whiskey runs this quest.
I did, in fact, read. I put in every effort to be accurate in my posting, up to and including looking up any information I post to make sure it isn't wildly off the mark. (And if you're going to go after my reading comprehension next, please don't; I have a visual disability that makes reading much harder, and while my glasses help and I'm not all that bothered by it, I would not like to be attacked over it.) Always Late didn't accuse anyone of being racist toward Americans. Those posts were self-deprecation and irony. ("Party" is absolutely Always Late; the post is nonsense otherwise.) I'm rather unsure how you arrived at the conclusion that they did.
It would be nice if Whiskey could perhaps have provided more indication as to how they run this quest. (Whiskey, if you're reading this, you have provided some, and other questers have filled in the rest. My few requests w.r.t this are in my previous post. I'm not attacking you.) This quest basically assumed that everyone already understands its context, and hey, maybe you did. But it's not cool to look down on the rest of us for not already having understood the context of the quest going in.
 
Uh, this also means that you need to make sure players already fully understand the context of the quest. You'd probably hinted at the context earlier. But, if you're going to hint at the context of the quest and have players figure it out themselves, you need a safety net, because otherwise the players won't last long enough to figure out how to play. Safety nets don't exist to make players not need to deal with the consequences of their actions, they exist to allow players to do so rather than auto-losing or ruining things forever.
No, there will be no safety net.

I believe the recent post mortems have made it clearer the assumptions this quest is operating under, and I believe I've been making good faith efforts to explain the thinking behind how I run this quest. It's why I did the post mortems, why I write the sidestories to expand the world, why I write the Informational posts, why I use explanation of choices as a mechanical abstraction of Yui's Politics SSR. There's only so much I can do, so much I can say, if people aren't reading what I've written, if they're clinging to their own preconceived notions of this quest. I've had questers refuse to understand why we were not supplanting the Imperial Chancellor and making votes based on monthly turns and reworking the tax code, even after I told them that is not what this quest is about, that this is a narrative-focused quest driven by choices, not mechanics.

Take, for example, real life. In real life, when doing a suspended obstacle course, you don't wear a safety harness to prevent falling off and having to start over; you wear a safety harness so that, when you do fall, you don't get severely injured or killed.
The safety net doesn't need to take the form of abrogating the consequences of a choice; it can even be just allowing your players to start over or try again when they make a choice that has consequences they can't deal with. Note that "they can't deal with" here means "are literally unsolvable."

An obstacle course, on the other hand, is a highly specific, confined, repeatable activity. Life is not that specific, confined, repeatable activity. Real life doesn't allow us to start over or try again. (God, how I wish I could have redone the laste fifteen years.) Once you make a bad impression on someone, you don't get a do over. When you make a bad judgement call at work, you have to reap wha you sow. What you can do, if you get the opportunity, is to try and mend things, and mitigate the bad results.

I think that at times people are concerned about the wrong things in this quest. Do I want my readers to act more judiciously? Absolutely. But at the same time, it's not like you're going to autofail the quest from a single wrong move. Yui isn't ending up in Foxthot Gitmo anytime soon. Depending on the players' actions, we can either end up with Yui soft couping or hard couping Ahri, or staying by her side as trusted advisor as she rules... or the Empire fragments, and we preside over securing what territory we can and establishing a rump successor state. My philosophy with success and failure in this quest is that, just like in real life, it's not a binary condition but a scale, a sliding curve. The end result is the culmination of choices made along the way. If you make bad choices, you deal with the consequences of those choices and try to mitigate what you can. (I have made some pretty bad judgement calls, some poor decisions, and I fell so hard off the fast track that a decade later my career still has not fully recovered. I don't think it ever will recover. The CEO is never going to consider me for another leadership position in the call center, which is galling because I wrote the call center's SOPs, I was the one who trained the mangers and staff... but on the other hand, I have this project now where I'm working for him. writing the process flows and SOPs for the Marketing department. Win some, lose some.)

That is what my life has been. Sure, fiction is an escape from reality. But it's not completely divorced from reality either. Ultimately, my experience of life has influenced and shaped how I run this quest.

I have an idea: When you make a vote, think "What decision would Yui make if this was a non-quest story and she was IC, and what knowledge would she use to make it?" Then, make sure all of that knowledge is clearly available to the player (rather than having to be teased out from between lines,) and, unless this is a vote where you want to make people come up with options themselves, also provide the option to make that decision.

Don't take the above as an attack on you; it isn't. Instead, those are suggestions for what to do in the future: Put in a safety net, so that players can't lose because they didn't already know and understand the context when starting to read and participate in the quest; make sure players have the information needed to decide to do what the PC would if there weren't players, and make sure that option is available.
Welcome to the balancing act I'm doing with every update, trying to balance player agency vs what would be in-character for Yui to do with all her knowledge, experience and biases. I feel it's a slippery slope from "only offer options that are IC for Yui" to railroading this quest, and I've never been very enamored of GMs railroading quests. If I was going to be railroading, then I've got no business writing a quest: I should be writing a story instead. It's the difference in player agency between something like XCOM or Mass Effect, and something like Black Powder Red Earth.

As for information being teased out between the lines... I mean, I went to school in a literal jungle, and despite the failings of the Malaysian education system I was still taught reading comprehension and how to see the explicit and implicit messages in a literary text. Interpreting implicit contractual terms is thing at A-levels (upper secondary education). This is a quest with political maneuvering amongst nobles who are not going to speak plainly, who have their own agendas. If you're referring to the conversation with Manandal, where all the write-ins missed the implicit question she was asking... I mean, that's why the default options were aimed at addressing her implicit question. Sure, we miss things in live conversations, but this is a quest, that's why there's a voting moratarium period, so that there's time to read and digest and consider.

It would be nice if Whiskey could perhaps have provided more indication as to how they run this quest. (Whiskey, if you're reading this, you have provided some, and other questers have filled in the rest. My few requests w.r.t this are in my previous post. I'm not attacking you.) This quest basically assumed that everyone already understands its context, and hey, maybe you did. But it's not cool to look down on the rest of us for not already having understood the context of the quest going in.
Like I've said before, I wonder at times whether the problem is I'm too subtle with my writing, or whether there's a cultural gap that's too large to get past. By and by, I've noticed that my Southeast Asian readers get the quest and what I'm trying to convey more than my Western readers. (Amusingly, where other readers have talked about how politics this is, @Slayers148 has asked me, "Whiskey, the slice of life is fine, but when are we getting to the real politics?" Then again, he's from Thailand.)
 
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Rules 2 & 3: Don't Be Hateful & Be Civil
I did, in fact, read. I put in every effort to be accurate in my posting, up to and including looking up any information I post to make sure it isn't wildly off the mark. (And if you're going to go after my reading comprehension next, please don't; I have a visual disability that makes reading much harder, and while my glasses help and I'm not all that bothered by it, I would not like to be attacked over it.) Always Late didn't accuse anyone of being racist toward Americans. Those posts were self-deprecation and irony. ("Party" is absolutely Always Late; the post is nonsense otherwise.) I'm rather unsure how you arrived at the conclusion that they did.
It would be nice if Whiskey could perhaps have provided more indication as to how they run this quest. (Whiskey, if you're reading this, you have provided some, and other questers have filled in the rest. My few requests w.r.t this are in my previous post. I'm not attacking you.) This quest basically assumed that everyone already understands its context, and hey, maybe you did. But it's not cool to look down on the rest of us for not already having understood the context of the quest going in.
Oh, I'm so sorry that you a visual disability, perhaps I was in the wrong here.

Oh wait, I wasn't the one who threw the first punch by bringing up a topic that has clearly been settled over the past few days. It's kind of amusing every time I accuse someone of not reading the information, they usually go belly up and say they are disabled, expecting some kind of leniency. I must be some kind of prophet.

Yup. This isn't the first quest where Party Is Teh Dumb American stereotype, can't articulate himself, and is so utterly overworked that re-reading mean choosing whether or not to meet my extremely aging relatives. And it won't be the last.
(note that I have not use the quote function because I'm respecting his withdrawal and don't want to bring him back in.)

Yea, he literally implied that the reason why whiskey and quite a few of the posters chided him over his lack of perspective was that he was american and not because of all those long effort posts explaining that no, the setting of this quest is not some democracy and that he decided to make snide and sarcastic remarks that oh he should have pretended this is some kind of anime warhammer quest. And he literally used his poor dying relatives for a pity party over why he can't re-read it. Nevermind the fact that he didn't need to because whiskey has always brought up relevant information to any discussion and has cleared up any misconceptions about anything during discussions about the vote. Never mind that I myself also make it a point to remind people of relevant information that they might have missed out when a discussion breaks out.

Like the fact that he literally does chime in on any plans that are made is already a step above most other QMs, where all you get is Xanatos picture or some vagueish maybe yes maybe no answer that helps no one.

If you have been provided the relevant information, have constant reminders of any important information that you may have missed out and ample amount of time to make a plan of action and you choose not to use it?

It's your own damned fault that you cocked up, no excuses.
 
Wow. So, first of all, thank you so much for writing these massive walls of text for us, Whiskey. I really think that they do help explain a lot of the context and the issues surrounding not just the Egon vote, but especially this one, and the direction of the quest as a whole.

Additionally, I think you're right that a lot of us (myself included) have probably been lead astray by cultural bias towards institutionalism. Now that I look back on it, I personally was viewing the Empire and our actions in it through the lens of factions, not people. I probably wrongly inferred that the Empire was a lot more institutionalized than you've presented it as. Hopefully, this explanation will help to reframe my viewpoint towards something a little more useful. (Or I might still be completely wrong, and screw up horribly.)

I mean, the ideal that people serve the institution which serves state isn't completely successfully implemented in Western democracies either, so I'm not sure why some people thought it would go differently. Just look at how badly Trump and his agenda fucked over the US federal government's institutions. The people who serve are at the mercy of the institution, while the institution is beholden the state - and after 500 years, a lot of different people in that institution have different ideas of who they are beholden to. Add to the mix the weakening power of the Imperial throne, from neglectful and weak Empresses, add in feudal factionalism, add in various players all trying to suborn institutions, add in internal factionalism and cults of personality, of people hitching a ride on other people's coattails out of self interest. IMO, at its core it's nothing really different from what happens IRL today. I'm remembered of the factionalism in the Malaysian civil service after the 2018 General Election, where you had the supervisors and directors being uncooperative and disobedient to the PH government out of loyalty to the BN government that allowed them to wallow in corruption, while the young juniors supported PH. And then you have the Royal Thai Navy which is China-aligned, while the Royal Thai Army is US-aligned (becuase the US-aligned faction managed to play out the China-aligned faction that was previously in charge of the RTA...)

And then you've got the IRG who don't need any external factors stirring up factionalism, they can do it all on their own :V

At the same time, though, I can sympathize with some of what Always Late was saying. An empire built on personal loyalty is built on a foundation of sand. It leads to crises like the one we're currently trying to deal with, and can eat the person at the top who has to balance all the demands, loyalties, favours, and expectations. Right now, Ahri doesn't want to be that person, and I'm not sure that given another choice, we would want her to be. But right now, we don't have another choice, and moving away from the system of personal loyalties isn't something that can be easily done under crisis conditions.

So I at least think I understand how they feel. I don't want the Empire to work like this. But at the same time, it does work like this, and we have to play the hand we're dealt.
It's kinda the problem you have when your founding Empress was hypercompetent and really charismatic and fox culture prioritises having people in your pocket rather than institutional strength, yes. From an out of universe perspective, this is absolutely not a sustainable political system - well, it can be a sustainable political system* if your Empresses are competent and on the ball, but they weren't, and the power and influence of the Imperial Throne is in decline - and thus the Empire is in decline, as people start getting more ideas about carving out their own fiefs and principalities.


* For a given value of sustainable, anyhow.


Anyway, work is progressing on the next update. My back has decided to start hurting beyond just where the surgical wound was (why do my ribs hurt when I sneeze smlj), but I'm powering through. Once I'm done with this paid commission I'm working on, I can go full speed ahead on the update (as it stands, I'm alternating between the commision and the update, using the update to help me recover from the SAN loss-inducing commission i'm writing.

It's cursed (T_T), but it paid for my covid test and hospitalisation deposit and the commissioner paid up in advance, so yeah.
 
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I have full confidence Whiskey can write an interesting story no matter what option we pick during votes. What is the point in always picking the optimal option all the time anyway? The arc before this we dealt with navy personnel and now we get to learn about the IRG. I have to admit that I severely overestimated the power of "Touch Fluffy Tail" and "The Power of Moe Compels You" to the point I barely registered the first half of the write in :V
 
Plus like I said I mean sure we chose the less optimal option here but thibgs worked out, and we massively increased Johnny's salt.

Which means that Maggie will need to manage his salt levels. Hence handcuffing him to the chair and tilting him by her very existence. :V
 
Like I've said before, I wonder at times whether the problem is I'm too subtle with my writing, or whether there's a cultural gap that's too large to get past. By and by, I've noticed that my Southeast Asian readers get the quest and what I'm trying to convey more than my Western readers. (Amusingly, where other readers have talked about how politics this is, @Slayers148 has asked me, "Whiskey, the slice of life is fine, but when are we getting to the real politics?" Then again, he's from Thailand.)
I've resigned myself for an interesting ride.

Tied down, perhaps, but it might be more interesting for it.
 
@ckk185 Look I am not going to pretend that you don't have some points amongst your last few posts or that Always Late can sometimes come across as insensitive or oddly blunt about things but can you please dial it down. I get that you are insulted on behalf of Whisky Golf but you have been far more hostile and self-righteous than needed. Which is making the points you are trying to make incredibly difficult to actualize.

@Whiskey Golf I do in fact think it is probably at least somewhat of a cultural thing unfortunately for the western viewers of this quest. That has not stopped me from enjoying this quest so far and I hope it doesn't stop others.
 
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Yes, Whiskey, when are we getting real politics and not playing babysitter :V
I mean technically right now we're playing the advisor so there's some politics...

@Whiskey Golf I do in fact think it is probably at least somewhat of a cultural thing unfortunately for the western viewers of this quest. That has not stopped me from enjoying this quest so far and I hope it doesn't stop others.
In hindaight I think a french title was a mistake, but I was wanting to be fancy and stylo milo. Still, we're about 2.5 years to late to fix that, so we just gotra deal with it.

Mandat Maharani Mahakuasa might have been a better title (and more ironic, given it translates as Mandate of the Almighty Empress :V).
 
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I'll be honest, I was expecting aristocratic politics simulator: Inner Sphere Edition, due to the number of accidental parallels with Battletech. Probably colored my impression of the story.

Would the whole interpersonal relations angle be there if we were playing as either of the other options for protagonist?
 
I'll be honest, I was expecting aristocratic politics simulator: Inner Sphere Edition, due to the number of accidental parallels with Battletech. Probably colored my impression of the story.

Would the whole interpersonal relations angle be there if we were playing as either of the other options for protagonist?
Because it is. The writing team drew a lot of inspiration from the star league actually.
 
I'll be honest, I was expecting aristocratic politics simulator: Inner Sphere Edition, due to the number of accidental parallels with Battletech. Probably colored my impression of the story.

Would the whole interpersonal relations angle be there if we were playing as either of the other options for protagonist?
Well I mean, battletech was an inspiration, but honestly the reason we have five Great Houses and the Imperial House was so that you have 6 Great Houses and they're 3:3 balanced against each other, and Hagoromo was being merciful and generous to her rivals who bent the knee, which is why she elevated 3 of them to Great Houses and only 2 of her followers to Great Houses (and luckily Peyrac and Beausoli fell in love and got married so that solved the problem of which one of them does she choose :V)

...it's not because I was running out of ideas for another three extra Great Houses. Honest.

The interpersonal relational relation angle would still be present if we were playing as Alastor or Salt Admiral, just that there would be different flavors of it. In Alastor's route, we'd start with Ahri crushing on him, and Yui still playing babysitter advisor/guardian to the Empress, so Alastor route would have a fair bit of charming Ahri while trying to get on Yui's good side. Potentially, players might not only have been able to waifu the Empress, but also Princess Yui as well, making Count Alastor von Toth the first man to sucessfully have two foxes. :V Because Alastor's route would be more combat focused-ish, you'd also need to be working on building alliances with other Navy leaders (such as getting on Johnny's good side), since Alastor route would start by establishing that Alastor intends to build a power base to ride out the inevitable (so he thinks) Balkanisation of the Empire.

In Salt Admiral Quest: The Saltening, aka Pillars of Salt: Admiralty House Edition, Johnny's interpersonal relationships would have been focused on building a personal rapport with Ahri, advising her as she deals with the bureaucracy, maintaining his relationships with his gang, and trying to get his students to pls don't sohai, can or not, can you all like just fucking shut up and do your jobs and help me, I swear to a God I no longer believe in* if i have to come over there and smack some sense into you... also, because Johnny is the MC here, his relationship with Maggie would also feature more prominently. (This might be a turn off for some people, I know there are people who complain about the Salt Thirst sides :V) (Also because Salt Admiral Quest is the Hard Mode story of a man sustained only by salt, Yui is not Uncle Johnny's niece, but merely the daughter of his Navy acquaintance Masatada, who was one of his students.) So the interpersonal relationships wouild be on building rapport with Ahri - because Johnny starts at the lowest affection and most distance from Ahri: Low (Subject). Alastor is Medium (Crush) and Yui is of course High (Onee-sama).

...shit I just realised this is basically Gran Torino, except that it's Johnny yelling at people to get of Ahri's lawn. :V


*In all incarnations of Johnny, he's a lapsed Jew who basically lives as if he's an athiest (note the super atas non-kosher Ramly Burger he was cooking in the first side). This changes when he goes home for Chinese New Year or Hanukah, at which point he pretends to still be Jewish so as not to disappoint his mom. :V
 
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