Also, Tifa says Cloud "doesn't look bad, if you don't look closely," which, girl, I can assure you I have all of Wall Market to testify that Cloud is, in fact, the hottest girl in town.
Thinking about how Remake strands you in that sewer for an hour because boy did they pad that out with extra 'dungeon' time, though it's still not the most egregious example on display.
I actually think the most interesting part is how the Remake's characterization of Aerith in the Honey Bee scene is explicitly sexual? Not sexualized, but she is actually extremely horny for Cloud and it shows then and there. And in the original, she's a gremlin who is developing feelings for him but there's not so much of an emphasis on sexual desire outside of what is implied via romantic desire.
It really fits the character, but it's also kind of new.
Maybe early 2000s anime fandom broke me, but I can't see a girl getting extremely into putting a smexy bishie in a skirt as anything other than a raging maelstrom of horniness.
We find a woman horribly sick in the bathroom, give her a digestive which cures her, and she gives us the sexy perfume we need to seduce Don Corneo. This game's sidequest are on another level. What kind of a level, I'm not sure, but another for certain.
Like… It's not that the game has to say "btw ecoterrorism is wrong," it's that the inherent tragedy of resorting to necessary violence against exploitative regimes who will take advantage of it to crack down further is just one of the core dynamics of any violent revolutionary struggle that makes it interesting to explode
It's really notable how, from the moment they met each other, Aerith and Tifa started having interactions with each other, because that was a big missing spot in, say, Celes and Terra in FFVI.
Our next step also takes place in the food court, and is a little weird. Remember when we got that Pharmacy Coupon? We can head to the convenience store (pharmacy, I guess?),
I dunno what it's like in other countries, but having lived in quite a few different parts of America... yeah, you get a lot of pharmacies (pharmacy chains, even) that are basically straight up a convenience store, in both structure and the items they stock. They just... stock more medicine and you can get your prescription meds there? But they look a lot like convenience stores.
...Man, that really is about all they ever got in terms of actual personalized conversations, isn't it? All the other interactions I can think of was stuff where you had Select Your Party going on so it was generic lines.
Guess that's one thing FF7 has over FF6 so far... though we're also early on enough in the game that party interaction is still easy since there's so few of them being shuffled around. FF6 didn't really start having issues in that department until full party swapping came into the equation.
I dunno what it's like in other countries, but having lived in quite a few different parts of America... yeah, you get a lot of pharmacies (pharmacy chains, even) that are basically straight up a convenience store, in both structure and the items they stock. They just... stock more medicine and you can get your prescription meds there? But they look a lot like convenience stores.
In a college town in a state where they're allowed to sell it, CVS stocks ping-pong balls in the wine isle. Your one stop shop for medicine for your health and beer pong, for your "health."
Wall Street is definitely a... place. I have seen some stuff that Japanese crossdressing culture is quite different to their Western counterparts but lacking specifics I can't say much more than that.
Honestly I wouldn't say it's as bad as it could have been apart from the Honeybee bodybuilder scenes.
She's been fleecing the locals by selling them flowers at outrageous price. What a girl. It's a good reminder that she's grown in the slums all her life and she's far from helpless when alone, and in fact can have most men wrapped around her finger in little time. Which… Let's put a pin in that.
Everyone is briefly knocked out on impact, and Cloud wakes up first. We manually go to each girl in turn to ask if they're alright (Tifa: "Man! This is terrible." Aerith: "Well, the worst is over… Maybe not…" and then, a monster attacks!
So fun fact, who you checked on first actually has some mechanical effect. It'll be a while yet before anything happens though, and other things will also affect it.
An actual wave of dirty sewer water washes over the screen, hitting everyone, Aps included, for… Honestly fairly low damage (23 on Aerith who is in the back row, 47 on Tifa, 44 to Cloud, but 180+ on Aps itself).
The trick for Aps is that the Sewer Tsunami move can come from two directions, behind Aps or behind you. If it comes from behind Aps, it'll do more damage to the boss than you. On the other hand, if it comes from behind you, you'll take more damage while Aps will be mostly spared.
I need to thank @Geckonator again for introducing this FFVII script site, so I can compare the Japanese and English text. Which is what I'll be doing here. (Omicron, please do not click that link. The chapter titles are completely spoilery.)
Quotes will probably jump back and forth randomly in Omicron's post, as I find new things to talk about.
It's very 90s, because the Japanese text for that choice is 焼肉定食, "Yakiniku Teishoku": "Barbecued meat set meal". Now, we all probably know what "yakiniku" is, due to the proliferation of Japanese places offering that around the world, but the origin of Japanese yakiniku is, indeed, Korean barbecue. (From post-WW2 Korean restaurants introducing that specific grilled meat cuisine to Japan.)
So calling it "Korean BBQ plate" is one of those cases where it's probably the more familiar reference to an English speaker in the 90s. Honestly I would have translated it to "grilled meat plate", and accepted the loss of nuance that it's specifically freshly grilled and still sizzling meat.
Also "Sushi Plate" is more accurately "Sashimi Plate", but again I understand that the difference between "sushi" and "sashimi" might not have been obvious back in the 90s.
We're given two options to pick from, twice, asking for something "that feels clean"/"that feels soft" and "shiny"/"that shimmers." I pick soft/shimmers, though it's not clear what the distinctions are, but 'shiny' feels a little too tacky and clean more like it prioritizes comfort over appearance, which is the opposite of what we want here.
It's tricky to translate this bit, because it works more on Japanese grammar word order. The first choice is Aerith choosing something "that feels clean/soft as it touches the body", and the second is "how it shines".
The words for the choices are done with onomatopoeia, like many Japanese words: "clean" is さらっと ("saratto"), which I'd translate more like "smooth". "Soft" is さわっと ("sawatto"), which does give the impression of "soft", in the "light as a cloud" (pun unintended) sense.
"Shiny" is きらきら ("kirakira"), which does literally translate to "shiny", but I'd use "glittering" or "sparkly" to differentiate from the other choice. "Shimmers" is つやつや ("tsuyatsuya"), which doesn't translate to "shimmer", but rather "glossy" or "slick".
This is the gym. It is full of 'gym bro' characters using special, 'buff men' models, who are all engaged in squats, punching a bag, or sparring in the ring, and one character who uses one of the generic "female townsfolk" models, and who could previously be seen weighing herself on a scale and complaining about needing to lose weight.
This is also shown in the big neon sign above the gym entrance, but the gym's name is "男男男". The idea is a gym literally called "MAN MAN MAN" in all-caps.
Both of these translations are seemingly trying to translate a particularly tricky exchange. If we go from Tim Rogers' live translation of the scene over at Kotaku, the exchange, in a more literal sense, is Cloud going "Wait, does that mean you are-" and Aerith cuts him off saying something roughly like "You're one pretty Big Bro," with his read of the exchange being that Cloud only just now, this way into the conversation, realized that it was this character he thought was a woman is the one these characters keep calling 'Big Bro,' and now he's about to ask if he's Big Bro in a rude way and Aerith cuts him off to compliment him.
I can kind of understand the official translation going "Are you...", because it's a literal translation of what Cloud says (well, specifically "Could it be that you are..."). And without the benefit of subtle body language or facial expression hints, it's vague what he was going for: it could be Cloud starting "are you a man", or it could just be Cloud going "are you the one we are looking for". The rest of the entire Wall Market section would imply the first, but I can't discount the second interpretation either.
As for Aerith saying "beautiful Big Bro", this is another case of different ways of saying "big brother" in Japanese; consider the previous discussion of how Reno says "Sis". In this case, everyone else in the gym refers to Big Bro as 兄貴 ("Aniki"), which is a slang-y yet respectful "big brother"; think of it as addressing a senior in a gang, like "boss bro".
However, Aerith initially addresses him as "beautiful Onii-san" (お兄さん), which is using a polite version of the literal meaning of "aniki". The effect is if the other gym members are calling the person "Big Bro", and Aerith goes "oh, you must be Mister Big Brother, who is beautiful". It's Aerith misunderstanding (deliberately or otherwise) the concept of the "Big Bro" title.
This guy is called 'Mukki' and, aside from being a bodybuilder, I assume he's another employee of the inn - perhaps one meant for their male-favoring clientele - who got called in for the emergency?
"Mukimuki" (ムキムキ) is the Japanese onomatopoeia adjective for "muscular", or "swole" as current slang says. Mukki is spelled differently (ムッキー), but the intended reference is there.
Cloud says he's not feeling so great, Mukki tells him to relax and count to ten, and then starts asking him about his age (this is how we learn in-game that Cloud is 21), and asks him if he wants to join his 'Young bubby's group' who are planning to take a trip to a cabin in the country.
Mukki talks in a very bombastic manner. For example, "Young bubby's group" is 青春サークル ("Seishun Circle"), which translates to "Group of Youthfulness", where "youth" is in the sense of "springtime of life" or "youthful energy". "A trip to a cabin in the country" is expressed as "a training camp in a country where sunshine rains down upon us" (太陽のふりそそぐ国での合宿). "Country" as in "state"/"nation", rather than "the countryside".
What I'm saying is Mukki's dialogue needed to be even more extra.
The other two rooms are exclusive, we can only pick one; once we do, a scene will play out and after it's done, we'll be locked out of the Honey Bee Inn. Those are the two rooms the Honey Bee is asking us to pick from and enter; when we pick one, she asks us if we're certain, and our options are "I'm still trying to decide" or "Don't make me repeat myself," which prompts the girl to plead Cloud not to be angry with her and to reflect that he is probably "the violent type."
This is another case where the Japanese dialogue is less fraught with implications, but in a way that kind of feels like it's making light of the situation. For example, the girl asking Cloud not to be angry does so with a little heart emote, and the cutesy lengthening of syllables. However, she only does that out loud, while her inner thoughts are fairly dismissive and condescending of Cloud.
Interestingly everyone in the Honeybee Inn, including Mukki, calls Cloud "ムッツリさん" ("Muttsuri-san"), which means "Mr. Gloomy"; the translation has it as "You moody creepo". Cloud's stoic "I'm too cool and indifferent" facade isn't impressing anyone.
This is a clear mistranslation. She's not saying Cloud is "the delicate type", but that he's one of the types "with no delicacy", ie has no tact or sense of personal boundaries. Which is a fair cop, since he's wandering around the dressing room staring at women doing their makeup.
This is another disconnect of context in the translation as well. One of the dialogue bits here has the woman (or one of the women) think to herself that Cloud is so annoying and lacking in common sense that he's no better than a dog. So she decides to call him "Pochi", which is the stereotypical name for a generic dog, like "Spot" in English, or occasionally translated as "Pooch".
The moment we come in, we're accosted by a woman in a bee costume who clearly thinks we're someone she was expecting and who breathlessly asks us to hurry and 'pick a room.'
So in the Japanese text, the woman starts lines with "Po-" before going into customer service mode. The English translation appears to interpret this as the woman being out of breath due to hurrying or nervousness.
But with the context from above, the more natural interpretation is the woman is barely able to stop addressing Cloud with the insulting nickname she came up for him in her head.
Interestingly everyone in the Honeybee Inn, including Mukki, calls Cloud "ムッツリさん" ("Muttsuri-san"), which means "Mr. Gloomy"; the translation has it as "You moody creepo". Cloud's stoic "I'm too cool and indifferent" facade isn't impressing anyone.
It's hilarious - in the mid to late 2000's, that kind of aesthetic was seen everywhere, where Cloud kind of became a bit of an emblem of it along with a certain other character.
And yet here? It's made fun of constantly, because everyone finds him coming across as tryhard.
It's hilarious - in the mid to late 2000's, that kind of aesthetic was seen everywhere, where Cloud kind of became a bit of an emblem of it along with a certain other character.
And yet here? It's made fun of constantly, because everyone finds him coming across as tryhard.
Also, Tifa says Cloud "doesn't look bad, if you don't look closely," which, girl, I can assure you I have all of Wall Market to testify that Cloud is, in fact, the hottest girl in town.
It's another mistranslation. Tifa actually says "Now that I look again, you look good, don't you". So it's not "don't look too closely", but the opposite: upon a closer look, Tifa agrees with the popular opinion of Wall Market that Cloud is gorgeous.
Cloud learned a new Limit Break, Cross Slash, which has a complex animation in which he delivers several blows which draw a kanji on the screen that then explodes. It looks sick.
It's almost like the people writing these characters were smart enough to know that a certain attitude was popular but also silly and childish, so they portrayed it as something to be lightly lampooned and certainly outgrown, and then people who didn't want to hear the message took it 100% seriously as cool and worth copying. That's a sadly common refrain in popular media.
In any case, I agree that the Wall Market section of FFVII is one of the game's highlight so far - certainly the most interesting part of the Midgar section - and is thus justly iconic. I also agree that FF7R did a great job of adapting it, primarily by means of expanding it with additional missions/side content, more interaction with more well-developed NPCs, and a bit of characterization work on the protagonists - with the latter adding nothing new to the characterization itself, just providing a more detailed outlook to it. It's the FF7R formula, mostly, and for something like Wall Market where the setting and interaction with the characters were the highlights and the limited amount of time spent there one of the biggest weaknesses it has, it worked excellently.
Of course, that's not a one-size-fit-all approach that would work on other parts of the game, as it could disrupt pacing or make some characterization points come across as repetitive if abused... but as far as Wall Market alone is concerned, separated from the rest of the surrounding game, the FF7R treatment is probably the most and more complete improvement to be achieved by the remake.
Cloud learned a new Limit Break, Cross Slash, which has a complex animation in which he delivers several blows which draw a kanji on the screen that then explodes. It looks sick.
Oh yeah, that's getting into Limit Break naming fights. The Reunion translates it directly to Curse Slash because that's what it is given the paralysis effect and edgy kanji. I presume the original translator either couldn't see the kanji in the animation or assumed that the average American player wouldn't understand the implication and would just see it as Cloud doing a particularly cool sword combo.
Although... now that I think about it, where does the power of a lot of these Limit Breaks come from in-universe, when all the "normal" magic is manufactured Materia? Like, Tifa's just doing some really flashy grapples, Aerith having some inherent restorative/spiritual magic separate from her Materia makes sense, Barret probably has extra attachments and special weapons besides his current gun arm, but now Cloud has the power to channel some evil, menacing power through his sword?
Let's put a pin in that for some later Limit Breaks I've already seen in my game...
His opponents are frozen in place in sheer shock of someone actually trying to be that edgy in real life
Jokes aside... yeah that's a good question. Like, the closest explanation we get is in the two kids fighting in the tutorial zone, and it seems to be akin to venting ones frustrations?
Although... now that I think about it, where does the power of a lot of these Limit Breaks come from in-universe, when all the "normal" magic is manufactured Materia? Like, Tifa's just doing some really flashy grapples, Aerith having some inherent restorative/spiritual magic separate from her Materia makes sense, Barret probably has extra attachments and special weapons besides his current gun arm, but now Cloud has the power to channel some evil, menacing power through his sword?
Wasn't a huge fan of this bit. At this point Cloud still feels a lot like a blank slate, put yourself in their place type of protagonist, and I personally have no real interest in cross dressing. Looking at it now, I can appreciate the work put into this arc, and that the Remake has Cloud as a more active participant, but…
Really, my biggest complaint with the wall market sequence is…not being able to bypass it completely. And that's on me and my own views of mechanical obstacles in games that don't make sense narratively. By all rights, narratively, Cloud should be able to waltz right through every goon in the building before interrogating the Don at sword point. It just makes me remember the stupid sapling blocking my way in Pokémon.
The most egregious example of this that I've encountered recently is Gerudo Town in BotW. To get in, you have to wear the Vai outfit. And that's fine, I want to re-iterate that I have no issue with this being an option. But its the only option. In a game defined by its many solutions to every problem, you only have one path. You can't sneak in, can't climb the walls, can't HALO drop in. you have to wear the specific outfit, which to add insult to injury, can't be upgraded. And it drives me nuts.
Wasn't a huge fan of this bit. At this point Cloud still feels a lot like a blank slate, put yourself in their place type of protagonist, and I personally have no real interest in cross dressing. Looking at it now, I can appreciate the work put into this arc, and that the Remake has Cloud as a more active participant, but…
Really, my biggest complaint with the wall market sequence is…not being able to bypass it completely. And that's on me and my own views of mechanical obstacles in games that don't make sense narratively. By all rights, narratively, Cloud should be able to waltz right through every goon in the building before interrogating the Don at sword point. It just makes me remember the stupid sapling blocking my way in Pokémon.
The most egregious example of this that I've encountered recently is Gerudo Town in BotW. To get in, you have to wear the Vai outfit. And that's fine, I want to re-iterate that I have no issue with this being an option. But its the only option. In a game defined by its many solutions to every problem, you only have one path. You can't sneak in, can't climb the walls, can't HALO drop in. you have to wear the specific outfit, which to add insult to injury, can't be upgraded. And it drives me nuts.
The main problem with getting in via force is that they don't know why Tifa's there. If she's, say, making contact with Corneo in order to make an under the table alliance between him and AVALANCHE, busting up all his shit is a bad idea. It's safer to hedge their bets until they make contact with Tifa and learn what's going on.