Knight of Wessex (A Written World Quest)
- Thread starter Alectai
- Start date
- Original Fantasy Alt. History
AeonIlluminate
The power of friendship and aggressive landscaping
- Pronouns
- They/Them
Right, bugger. Wreastling. I kinda assumed that Sanctity of Motion would mostly cover it. Is gaining control over a grapple something that then gives us narative space to do grapple stuff to the enemy, or just a +x to grapple stuff, or what? Basically, is it worth heavy investment in grapple or is just a escape button is good enough.
Going off the comments in the post and previous plans, for Zeal I feel a Combat Rank for 32, an Athletics and Horsemanship rank for 4 each spends 40, leaving 12 left over. Maybe drop 8 more in Athletics, but no more spending after that I feel. Gimmie a bit and I'll throw out some Training ideas.
EDIT: Deadman, does taking a skill higher than Soma is also give a chance of exploding like it does with stats?
Going off the comments in the post and previous plans, for Zeal I feel a Combat Rank for 32, an Athletics and Horsemanship rank for 4 each spends 40, leaving 12 left over. Maybe drop 8 more in Athletics, but no more spending after that I feel. Gimmie a bit and I'll throw out some Training ideas.
EDIT: Deadman, does taking a skill higher than Soma is also give a chance of exploding like it does with stats?
Last edited:
- Pronouns
- He/Him
They'd be in serious trouble if it were proven. Proving it is a bit tricky, though, we're in "he said, she said" territory...you could maybe make it stick on the messenger, less likely on Holman since you haven't actually seen evidence directly of him being involved.
The Armour Trait provides a modest bonus to defense against being grappled in the first place and a very large bonus to keep you from being completely pinned, but it does very little to prevent the strategy that actually almost worked where someone grabs you and uses wrestling moves that deal damage.
A move to gain control of a grapple would enable other grappling moves more easily and allow acquiring additional grapple specialized moves that are, kinda definitionally, better for their price point due to having a prerequisite of 'need to have foe grappled'. On its own it doesn't do much beyond get control of a grapple (which would potentially prevent moves like the Norseman's eye-stabbing thing as well as preventing them from escaping...they'd still be able to make non-grapple specialized attacks that made sense like basics, though), but it's probably more of a foundational thing than a complete fighting style in its own right. You could get Limb-Breaking Hold up to Refined and make a decent 'wrestling combo' with just those two though (that combo would allow grappling someone and holding them down while you broke their limbs pretty decently). The advantage here is that this is a whole style of combat and if you're better at it than your opponent, you can really mess them up. That probably involves raising Fyrdman yt Wol, and as mentioned getting multiple Rotes for this in the long term.
Alternatively, a maneuver simply to escape a grapple that does nothing else probably provides a solid bonus on doing exactly that, and is likely either quite cheap, or alternately more expensive but doesn't take an action to perform, allowing for slipping away and still making normal actions thereafter. The advantages here would be that you only need the one maneuver, you get a bonus when using it, and it's likely either quite cheap or not an action.
Gaining a flat bonus to grapple moves in general is a Meditation, and you'd probably want something to get control of a grapple first, so it's more a supplement to the first of those two options than its own choice.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Absolutely true, yeah. If that was unclear in the above my apologies. I was just saying all the other things you could also do with that, while a Rote that only escapes does only that.
In terms of Styles, actual control of a grapple is definitely Fyrdman yt Wol. Escape alone you might be able to get under Hard-Fall.
CedeTheBees
Probably high right now
- Location
- Somewhere
- Pronouns
- They/Them
[X] Plan: Mail Sleuthing
-[X] [Focus Action] Collect evidence of your mail being interfered with.
-[X] [Secondary Action] Kill two birds with one stone by having Gilbert assist you with your evidence collecting. Sleuthing is great bravery training.
-[X] [Secondary Action] Continue attending mass. Subtly drop hints with the bishop that there might be some mail mischief afoot.
-[X] [Chancellery] Pick Red-Black Lightning
-[ ] Training and Zeal (30 Training, 52 Zeal)
–[ ] Spend 30 Training on whatever you desire (15 at most may be spent on Feats and Shapes)
–[ ] Spend 0-52 Zeal on ???
Will think of training actions later. Mail is sacred, we cannot allow this travesty to go unpunished.
-[X] [Focus Action] Collect evidence of your mail being interfered with.
-[X] [Secondary Action] Kill two birds with one stone by having Gilbert assist you with your evidence collecting. Sleuthing is great bravery training.
-[X] [Secondary Action] Continue attending mass. Subtly drop hints with the bishop that there might be some mail mischief afoot.
-[X] [Chancellery] Pick Red-Black Lightning
-[ ] Training and Zeal (30 Training, 52 Zeal)
–[ ] Spend 30 Training on whatever you desire (15 at most may be spent on Feats and Shapes)
–[ ] Spend 0-52 Zeal on ???
Will think of training actions later. Mail is sacred, we cannot allow this travesty to go unpunished.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Yeah, and to be clear, even the actions spent thus far accelerated the timetable rather than getting you Grace you wouldn't have gotten otherwise. But, of course, getting an extra Grace a turn or three earlier is quite nice.
Okey, I don't think wrestling is a high priority as ideally, we won't get grappled but I've spent some training in getting a feat to escape such grapples, it would be at rough but that should at least give us a fighting chance.
Other than that, I'm refining pulling the web (because its too good to ignore) and faulty ground (because we already invested training there) and getting hard fall to 3 as that style is basically our attack and defense.
I'm also getting (and refining) a defense meditation form the hard fall style, we have the replenish and capacity to add it to our arsenal and we need some extra defense.
For zeal I bring combat to 6 and athleticism and horsemanship to 3/4 respectively to hopefully improve our odds to place in the different tournaments.
This only leaves us with 4 zeal but it should be enough, if were at the point of burning zeal to win were reached our limit and its likely we can only clinch a win or two with it before we spend our supply, so better to spend it on the skills needed for success and leave enough for a fight (or two).
Also I'm doing the responsible thing and casting "I summon bigger fish" regarding our mail
[X] Responsible adulthood.
-[X] [Focus Action] Bring your master into the fact that your mail is being interdicted, don't mention Gilbert but messing with your stuff is a whole different beast so be the responsible adult and go to the authority in charge, you're a squire an attack against you is an attack against your master.
-[X] [Secondary Action] treat Crowlly to good food.
-[X] [Secondary Action] Train with Gilbert
-[X] [Chancellery] Pick Red-Black Lightning
-[X] Training and Zeal (30 Training, 52 Zeal)
–[X] Spend 30 Training on whatever you desire (15 at most may be spent on Feats and Shapes)
--[X] hard fall style to 4. 8 training.
--[X] a hard fall defense meditation (one seemlier to vanguard prayer) 9 training to get it and then refine it.
--[X] Faulty ground refined. 4 training.
--[X] a wrestling Rote to escape grapples. 3 training.
--[X] pulling the web to refined. 6 training.
–[X] Spend 0-52 Zeal on ???
--[X] 32 to get combat 6.
--[X] 4 to get athleticism 3.
--[X] 12 to get horsemanship 4.
--[X] 4 left over.
Other than that, I'm refining pulling the web (because its too good to ignore) and faulty ground (because we already invested training there) and getting hard fall to 3 as that style is basically our attack and defense.
I'm also getting (and refining) a defense meditation form the hard fall style, we have the replenish and capacity to add it to our arsenal and we need some extra defense.
For zeal I bring combat to 6 and athleticism and horsemanship to 3/4 respectively to hopefully improve our odds to place in the different tournaments.
This only leaves us with 4 zeal but it should be enough, if were at the point of burning zeal to win were reached our limit and its likely we can only clinch a win or two with it before we spend our supply, so better to spend it on the skills needed for success and leave enough for a fight (or two).
Also I'm doing the responsible thing and casting "I summon bigger fish" regarding our mail
[X] Responsible adulthood.
-[X] [Focus Action] Bring your master into the fact that your mail is being interdicted, don't mention Gilbert but messing with your stuff is a whole different beast so be the responsible adult and go to the authority in charge, you're a squire an attack against you is an attack against your master.
-[X] [Secondary Action] treat Crowlly to good food.
-[X] [Secondary Action] Train with Gilbert
-[X] [Chancellery] Pick Red-Black Lightning
-[X] Training and Zeal (30 Training, 52 Zeal)
–[X] Spend 30 Training on whatever you desire (15 at most may be spent on Feats and Shapes)
--[X] hard fall style to 4. 8 training.
--[X] a hard fall defense meditation (one seemlier to vanguard prayer) 9 training to get it and then refine it.
--[X] Faulty ground refined. 4 training.
--[X] a wrestling Rote to escape grapples. 3 training.
--[X] pulling the web to refined. 6 training.
–[X] Spend 0-52 Zeal on ???
--[X] 32 to get combat 6.
--[X] 4 to get athleticism 3.
--[X] 12 to get horsemanship 4.
--[X] 4 left over.
Last edited:
AeonIlluminate
The power of friendship and aggressive landscaping
- Pronouns
- They/Them
Training wise, 4 points in Faulty Ground to finish it off is a given. 26 to spend for the turn realistically. 9 Training to get a "get out of grapple" button immediately to Refined sounds like a very good idea. If we want to go cheap, build into grappling a bit, and claim that the "take control of the grapple" move is also our escape button, that's a viable method, as we cover 2 bits in one with the control move and then its 6 Training to Refine Limb-Breaking Hold and 4 more to get a rank in Frydsman Yt Wol. Yeah, that's 9+6+4=19 Training this turn but it fills out a solid combat style we haven't really touched yet and defends us from the same, rather painful, style.
For other Training, assuming we spend all 19 on the above build for grapples then we only have 7 left which fits perfectly into getting a rank in Hordebreaker for that tasty Rebuke point, and something new at Rough. Someone floated a defensive version of Vanguard's Prayer last turn, which sounds like a good idea, and if we get lucky and learn it as a Hordebreaker Meditation then the Speed boost of Vanguard's might turn into a Rebuke point, although I expect a Stamina point is more likely.
If we don't pivot into grapples nearly as much, we could Refine that defensive Vanguard's Prayer to have it not cost like 12 Fervour a round, and get a higher defence bonus, although I feel like a Refined solution to getting grappled is very important to get and a rank if Frydsman Yt Wol is also relatively important, which locks us up on 17 of our 30 Training after the 4 to finish Faulty Ground. 13 to throw around isn't nothing tho. Getting the rank in Hordebreaker for the Rebuke point also seems like a rather good idea, leaving us with 9 to throw around. Get a new prayer and Refine something? Rank up both our Shapes? Rank up Hard-Fall? Maybe a Tactics Prayer to learn more specific stuff about the opponent and Refine Sweeping Slash to have some AoE stabbyness.
For other Training, assuming we spend all 19 on the above build for grapples then we only have 7 left which fits perfectly into getting a rank in Hordebreaker for that tasty Rebuke point, and something new at Rough. Someone floated a defensive version of Vanguard's Prayer last turn, which sounds like a good idea, and if we get lucky and learn it as a Hordebreaker Meditation then the Speed boost of Vanguard's might turn into a Rebuke point, although I expect a Stamina point is more likely.
If we don't pivot into grapples nearly as much, we could Refine that defensive Vanguard's Prayer to have it not cost like 12 Fervour a round, and get a higher defence bonus, although I feel like a Refined solution to getting grappled is very important to get and a rank if Frydsman Yt Wol is also relatively important, which locks us up on 17 of our 30 Training after the 4 to finish Faulty Ground. 13 to throw around isn't nothing tho. Getting the rank in Hordebreaker for the Rebuke point also seems like a rather good idea, leaving us with 9 to throw around. Get a new prayer and Refine something? Rank up both our Shapes? Rank up Hard-Fall? Maybe a Tactics Prayer to learn more specific stuff about the opponent and Refine Sweeping Slash to have some AoE stabbyness.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
This would be a Rote, not a Feat, for the record.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
[X] Responsible adulthood.
CedeTheBees
Probably high right now
- Location
- Somewhere
- Pronouns
- They/Them
[X] Responsible adulthood.
- Pronouns
- He
[X] Responsible adulthood
AeonIlluminate
The power of friendship and aggressive landscaping
- Pronouns
- They/Them
Thus would be Hard-Fall to 4, it's already at 3. Right cost tho.
Overall a plan I mostly like, bit of a disagreement on some of the training spending as I feel Pulling The Web is in a good enough spot right now and instead raising Hordebreaker as I really like Rebuke points, especially at our power level as none of us have the Fervour to spend on getting past the bloody thing, so bullying the other Squires with more Rebuke than we should have is rather nice.
[X] Defensively Trained Responsible Adulthood
-[X] [Focus Action] Bring your master into the fact that your mail is being interdicted, don't mention Gilbert but messing with your stuff is a whole different beast so be the responsible adult and go to the authority in charge, you're a squire an attack against you is an attack against your master.
-[X] [Secondary Action] treat Crowley to good food.
-[X] [Secondary Action] Train with Gilbert
-[X] [Chancellery] Pick Red-Black Lightning
-[X] Training and Zeal (30 Training, 52 Zeal)
–[X] Spend 30 Training on whatever you desire (15 at most may be spent on Feats and Shapes)
--[X] Hordebreaker and Frydsman Yt Wol both to 3 - 8 training.
--[X] a Hard-Fall defense meditation (one similar to Vanguard's Prayer) 9 training to get it and then refine it.
--[X] Faulty ground refined. 4 training.
--[X] A Wrestling Prayer to escape grapples. 9 training.
–[X] Spend 0-52 Zeal on ???
--[X] 32 to get combat 6.
--[X] 12 to get athleticism 4.
--[X] 4 to get horsemanship 3.
--[X] 4 left over.
Just changed around some Training. Moved the Refined points from Pulling the Web to the wrestling prayer and changed the rank in Hard-fall to one in each of Hordebraker and Frydsman Yt Wol for a Rebuke point and a minor wrestling buff.
[X] Plan: Decisive Strike
Last edited:
- Pronouns
- She/Her
There's something I would like to know before I formulate a plan to deal with Waering. How often is mail sent?
Ideally I would want to follow Waering's underling back to his meetup with him and then figure out where he's stashing our mail. Then on the mail route after that, I'd want to bring witnesses to that same meeting and also bring someone to that mail storage for evidence.
Ideally I would want to follow Waering's underling back to his meetup with him and then figure out where he's stashing our mail. Then on the mail route after that, I'd want to bring witnesses to that same meeting and also bring someone to that mail storage for evidence.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
This turn is 6 months so there's definitely time for this plan.
- Location
- Earth
[X] Plan: Gathering evidence and polishing skills
-[X] [Focus Action] Collect evidence of your mail being interfered with. Ask Gilbert to assist.
-[X] [Secondary Action] Ask Reinald for advice on how best to confront Waering. It's regarding the mail theft and not the fight involving Gilbert, so it shouldn't break your promise!
-[X] [Secondary Action] Socialise with the other Squires and junior Thanes
-[X] [Chancellery] Pick Red-Black Lightning
-[X] Training and Zeal (30 Training, 52 Zeal)
–[X] Spend 4 Training to get Faulty Ground to 6/6 to Refined.
–[X] Spend 4 Training to get Hordebreaker to rank 3
–[X] Spend 12 Training to get Fyrdsman yt Wol to rank 4
–[X] Spend 1 Training to get Ground Shape to 1/4 to rank 3
–[X] Spend 9 Training to learn and refine a wrestling Rote to escape grapples.
–[X] Spend 32 Zeal to get Combat 6.
–[X] Spend 12 Zeal to get Administration, Horsemanship and Athleticism to 3.
–[X] Save 8 Zeal.
Another variation on the plans being thrown about! I think we need an action to socialise with our peers, just to head off any attempts by Waering to smear us or turn others to his cause. The Hordebreaker and Fyrdsman boost will bring them up to par (I picked Fyrdsman as the rank 4 since we can use it with both our other Styles). The one Training left had to go somewhere so I picked Ground Shape for now.
For Zeal Combat 6 is obvious; however I added Admin 3 to the plan partly so all our Knightly skills are at least 3, but also because after the Tourney we'll be introduced to the Estate mechanics, and I'd like to make sure we don't stumble with those. More Admin might also help if Waering tries to pull any tricks with our letters.
-[X] [Focus Action] Collect evidence of your mail being interfered with. Ask Gilbert to assist.
-[X] [Secondary Action] Ask Reinald for advice on how best to confront Waering. It's regarding the mail theft and not the fight involving Gilbert, so it shouldn't break your promise!
-[X] [Secondary Action] Socialise with the other Squires and junior Thanes
-[X] [Chancellery] Pick Red-Black Lightning
-[X] Training and Zeal (30 Training, 52 Zeal)
–[X] Spend 4 Training to get Faulty Ground to 6/6 to Refined.
–[X] Spend 4 Training to get Hordebreaker to rank 3
–[X] Spend 12 Training to get Fyrdsman yt Wol to rank 4
–[X] Spend 1 Training to get Ground Shape to 1/4 to rank 3
–[X] Spend 9 Training to learn and refine a wrestling Rote to escape grapples.
–[X] Spend 32 Zeal to get Combat 6.
–[X] Spend 12 Zeal to get Administration, Horsemanship and Athleticism to 3.
–[X] Save 8 Zeal.
Another variation on the plans being thrown about! I think we need an action to socialise with our peers, just to head off any attempts by Waering to smear us or turn others to his cause. The Hordebreaker and Fyrdsman boost will bring them up to par (I picked Fyrdsman as the rank 4 since we can use it with both our other Styles). The one Training left had to go somewhere so I picked Ground Shape for now.
For Zeal Combat 6 is obvious; however I added Admin 3 to the plan partly so all our Knightly skills are at least 3, but also because after the Tourney we'll be introduced to the Estate mechanics, and I'd like to make sure we don't stumble with those. More Admin might also help if Waering tries to pull any tricks with our letters.
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Okay, good. Now I want to figure something out to do in addition to that, because a plan with a single point of failure is no dang good.
First of all, yes, we do. We have 40 replenish we can quite easily get over rebuke even if we spent zeal and brought our rebuke to 10 we can still easily get over it with most of our attacks and if our opponents are at or above 0 beads of the third decade so will they.
The single point won't do much but getting hardfall, would add to both all of our defense rolls (the one we use clever deflection for) as well for our Gkb strikes, its important and impactful.
Secondly, getting better manipulating for our telekinesis is good for us because it something we can use as a "free" action.
We are not wrestlers, this is not our combat style, getting a trick to defense against it is wise I'm not so sure about investing more than a half of our training a turn before a tournament we want to place well in. especially when its in place of the fighting style that governs our defense (you know the thing our opponent would need to get through to grapple us in the first place).
we have several turns before we get there.
- Location
- Pittsburgh PA
- Pronouns
- He/Him
[X] Responsible adulthood.
- Pronouns
- He/Him
To be clear, Fyrdman yt Wol will be added to rolls only for Limb-Breaking Hold and maybe your grapple-breaking Rote. Not much else...it can also add to basics in grapples due to how those work, technically, but this implies it'll add to other stuff, it does not.
You won't be introduced to the fief mechanics immediately after the tournament. Well, probably not anyway.
Note: You cannot just spend extra Fervour in unlimited quantities. It maxes out at double the original cost of the Rote at Refined and up. Several of your Rotes can't get to that threshold, depending. If you upped it to 12 the literal only thing Audrey could get through that with is Giant-Killing Blow, and she couldn't afford to do that on every attack.
Now, that's with Zeal, the non-Zeal version is easier to get through by a lot and most of her rotes do it...but not for free by any means. And people with decently pricey defenses, well, it can get dicey for them to get through that repeatedly.
Last edited:
Fair, but darting strike was 5, Francisca toss was 8? (I think) and all of this only applies if we use that bonus instead of hard fall which adds to our tactics (which I think is more impactful).
1 or 2 more rebuck isn't going to make that big of a difference, not against a peer and that's what were going to fight in the short term.
- Location
- Space between realms
- Pronouns
- He
[X] Defensively Trained Responsible Adulthood
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Darting Strike is 3 and Francisca Toss is 6 at Refined. Technically Francisca Toss would thus do it, but likely only once in the entire fight, and it and GKB are the only ones that would at Rebuke 12. And, of course, needing to make 12 per attack definitely restricts you to either 3 attacks and no Meditations, or two attacks per turn. Halving your Speed is no small thing.
Going Hard-Fall instead is certainly also valid. I'm just noting that you're underselling Rebuke if you think you have an easy time getting through it using whatever Rotes you like at this level. It's a highly meaningful restriction even against peer opponents with a Zeal investment. Without Zeal investment it's not quite as good, but it can make them either need to run at a deficit or be forced to use only smaller attacks even at the base levels.
That's all also with perfect knowledge...knowing how much you need to spend to get through Rebuke is not automatic. It's the sort of weakness Hard-Fall will usually pinpoint, but not everyone has that. Which, of course, is an argument for Hard-Fall as much as Hordebreaker, just noting it for the record.