In the Beginning, There Was Man: Cosmic Dust

Stickied Info

Betas
My betas are: @Snowfire, @Icipall, @Ruirk, and @Chief18753. They will occasionally be announcing when moratoriums and voting times are over. You can also consider their words to be Word of QM if they say "Torr said..."

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@torrmercury
Is it possible to extend the voting time? I'll have more time tomorrow to convince people.
Many of the votes are just trying to get the second worse rather then the worst (in their minds anyways)
more than a few have expressed obvious sentiments that make it obvious that their not anywhere close to #1
(Doing this well before the time is up so you can decide)
I can extend the vote till Tuesday or Wednesday. I would like to have everybody who's invested not rage quit due to playing something they can't stand.
 
I can extend the vote till Tuesday or Wednesday. I would like to have everybody who's invested not rage quit due to playing something they can't stand.
Not to be a dick Torr but EVERY Chargen does that. No need to get that worked up over it, because SOMEONE is ALWAYS going to disagree with the chargen plan, and leave. The only questions are 'How Many' and 'How loudly will be they on the way out.'
 
I can extend the vote till Tuesday or Wednesday. I would like to have everybody who's invested not rage quit due to playing something they can't stand.
That's fine, I want to get a chance to try to get a compromise vote, that which will hopefully lessen those who leave, intrigue those that lost it, while it might not win, I can at least try to give everyone a fraction of what they want, while making it not completely appalling to those that don't get what they want due to us only having so much space.
*Waiting for a vote change, a counter point... or anything in regards to it*
 
I don't like that compromise vote. Manifest Destiny and Traders kinda irks.
 
Compromise?

[x] Just because it's the End doesn't mean we can't work this out.
-[ ] Stratified Democracy
-[ ] Psionically Fertile (3) Mutually exclusive with Psionically Barren
-[ ] Curious (1)
-[ ] Cultured (1)
-[ ] Vindictive (-1)
-[ ] Duty's Burden (1)

Space magic is a given.

Qualified people vote on what they understand.

We're curious about everything. Ruins, alien cultures, that black hole that's way too big don't get so-

We like nice things. The universe might be ending, but we don't have to live in boxes and wear paper just to survive. Also we love hats.

We don't take slights well. We like being friends, but the gloves can come off and it will get ugly.

We did have a time limit to not die futility, not pitching in would be unacceptable. All work is valued.
 
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Manifest Destiny turns us into serious expanding monsters, and Traders explicitly states making us pathetically easy to bribe.

Eugh.
 
Manifest Destiny turns us into serious expanding monsters, and Traders explicitly states making us pathetically easy to bribe.

Eugh.
Manifest Destiny makes us expand quickly, but If its ANYTHING like Kaelor's, we don't expand into other's lands. It just makes us more expansive.
Traders, it give us much needed money, but it would lower our strife w/e, however we can take steps to address that, these traits are not So absolute, that would be dumb.
 
Traders, it give us much needed money, but it would lower our strife w/e, however we can take steps to address that, these traits are not So absolute, that would be dumb.
If you switch something w/ Duty's Burden (the name of which I dislike; it's not an adjective) the emphasis on doing your duty would balance out the likelihood of bribery and provide a pressure to act in a way that fosters communal interests rather than pure greed.

Personally, I would prefer switching out Manifest Destiny. Cultured provides a good draw for xenos and gives a certain cultural resistance. Curious provides science and self-challenge. Adaptive is just all around good. MD's benefits can be gained by just expanding more often manually. And not having an internal pressure to do so would allow us to expand steadily, rather than hastily.

But, and forgive me for this, were I interested in a compromise vote I would be more likely to vote for "[] Just because it's the End doesn't mean we can't work this out." It includes Psionically Fertile which, while I personally don't see as necessary, is an interesting trait that provides fairly substantial benefits (at the cost of getting 3 other beneficial traits, of course). Cultured and Curious are the minimal societal pair, imo. Duty Bound keeps us internally strong and fights the potential fracturing and party politics that a stratified democracy might result in. Vindictive is a negative trait but will likely make gameplay more interesting. It's just an elegant vote.
 
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If you switch something w/ Duty's Burden (the name of which I dislike; it's not an adjective) the emphasis on doing your duty would balance out the likelihood of bribery and provide a pressure to act in a way that fosters communal interests rather than pure greed.

Personally, I would prefer switching out Manifest Destiny. Cultured provides a good draw for xenos and gives a certain cultural resistance. Curious provides science and self-challenge. Adaptive is just all around good. MD's benefits can be gained by just expanding more often manually. And not having an internal pressure to do so would allow us to expand steadily, rather than hastily.

But, and forgive me for this, were I interested in a compromise vote I would be more likely to vote for "[] Just because it's the End doesn't mean we can't work this out." It includes Psionically Fertile which, while I personally don't see as necessary, is an interesting trait that provides fairly substantial benefits (at the cost of getting 3 other beneficial traits, of course). Cultured and Curious are the minimal societal pair, imo. Duty Bound keeps us internally strong and fights the potential fracturing and party politics that a stratified democracy might result in. Vindictive is a negative trait but will likely make gameplay more interesting.
I am perfectly willing to change to make people vote for it.
I got rid of Curious and NOT manifest destiny, because again this is a compromise vote, this gives reason to the Militaristic side of the voters to war or AT least expand rapidly. Traders, Cultured, and Duty's Burden gives bonuses to both Internals and diplomacy (and wealth of our faction as a whole).
If its an absolute Deal breaker i'll try to find another trait that can replace MD.


[] Plan Compromise
-[] Stratified Democracy
-[] Cultured
(1) Mutually exclusive with Blunt
-[] Traders (1)
-[] Manifest Destiny (1)
-[] Duty's Burden
- [] Adaptive (1)
 
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Wow it feels like a lot of people are trying to be this benevolent enlightened empire wannabe. I mean a direct democracy would be more of a clusterfuck than anything.
 
I got rid of Curious and NOT manifest destiny, because again this is a compromise vote, this gives reason to the Militaristic side of the voters to war or AT least expand rapidly.
While the below quote definitely points toward a desire for more Territory, or at least explains why humans would have a cultural impetus toward expanding, I don't think that the military voters actually want a war. They just want to not suck when one occurs.
Considering how many people want to be xenophilic, as the vote tallies, I believe that trying to change the aspects chosen here will be an uphill battle that would only breed divisiveness and resentment from the other players. I would much rather leave and drop a quest where I don't agree with the choices chosen than stay and try to create tension and bitterness. That way I won't grow too invested with something that will most likely let me down, not through the nature of the quest itself but due to the origin chosen.

I also wanted Psionically Fertile to be one of the winning aspects due to the fact that the first voting decision made was to make it so the only macguffin superpower or unobtanium available to us and everyone else was Psionics. The fact that we are not exploiting what is probably going to be a key technology is something I find to be a waste.



I would be willing to edit for a compromise, however I think that the visions from the voters who are voting for my plan and theirs are dramatically different.

If I am going to be honest, my main contentions with the Swiss Equality plan, aside from its weird name, are as follows.

Firstly I don't believe that the Direct Democracy type of government will be a very effective form of government. While in principle a democracy should have a well-informed populace that will make it so any decision chosen by the majority is a wise one, in practicality I think that is easier said than done, especially since the text for the option itself made it clear how broad the powers wielded by the citizenry are. For example one of the things that the vote option said citizens could vote for was not only appointing Officials but also being able to cast ballots to determine foreign policy. I know that this a sci-fi setting where information is likely to be abundant, but that doesn't change the fact that not every citizen will be well informed when it comes to complex issues such as dealing a foreign power, especially when those foreign powers will not be human but will be alien. To me the Direct Democracy Government choice is one that I believe will have many flaws attached to it. The fact that almost every issue can be brought to the ballot by the citizenry is something that suggests to me that this choice of government will be one that deals poorly with strife as almost any issue that comes to the governments attention can be voted on by the entire populace. Politics is a volatile business, and when every citizen can become a player or demagogue in the game, tensions will no doubt flare. The fact that this plan does little to address the initial Strife Threshold, which is determined by SW + PW + Ec, makes me even more leery of it because of the obvious Achilles Heel.

Secondly, the other problem I have with the Swiss Equality Plan is the fact that it has too many holes and weaknesses that cripple it's probable focus and specialties. For example I can understand why Curious and Problem-Solvers was chosen, as they both will likely offer a good boost to the research and development speed. That being said, while being technologically advanced is a great advantage, that does not mean anything if we don't have the industry (Territory stat) or economy (Economy stat) to both utilize as well as fund our research developments. Another thing, while being Xenophilic and Cultured does offer a lot when it comes to diplomacy with any other alien faction, it does nothing to help us when we encounter something that will not come to the diplomatic negotiating table, such as the extra-galactic invaders. The main weakness I see in the Swiss Equality plan were things that made it ironically unlike it's namesake. Unlike the actual Swiss this plan does not give us a good military or a strong economy. None of the traits chosen seem to explicitly benefit either from what I can read from the flavor text. The Swiss in real life were noted for being a very well-armed fighting force that were able to punch above their weight class, while at the same time having powerful financial institutions, on top of their very defensible geographic location. Frankly speaking this plan offers none of that as it seems to focus almost entirely on research and development and diplomacy, while leaving key areas like Economics, Territory, and Warfare weak due to there being no aspects chosen to improve. The fact that the initial Strife Threshold is based off of our Planetary Warfare, Space Warefare, and Economics stats makes me believe that the Swiss Equality option will bring with it internal troubles due to this oversight.

Finally, the other reason I don't like the Swiss Equality Plan is one I have mentioned briefly before, it seems to be too focused and not very versatile. With its emphasis seeming to be on research and diplomacy, I feel that in the event that the players are confronted with a dilemma where neither of those work, such as a militant civilization, a not too uncommon sci fi trope, the players will struggle to adapt due to having a not very strong military or economy. While our Mastery of the End Tech Tree will be a great boon to us, it may not be as strong as we think it is due to the fact that certain techs work better during certain eras due to the conditions of the universe at that time.

Altogether aside from the story elements that I feel would make me drop the quest, my main contentions with the Swiss Equality Plan are that I don't like its government type, and I don't like the way it works mechanically.



If you want to see my reasoning for why I chose those aspects, just look at the quote below where I wrote paragraphs explaining things.





That's somewhat disingenuous to suggest that those who want to be of a more militaristic bent are doing it plainly for mechanics and are not at all interested in the story. Frankly speaking I am very interested in the story, and some of the reasoning behind my choices illustrated above can give you my perspective for why I felt some of the choices made fit thematically. While the analysis I did for my own plan does go into detail as to why my plan is advantageous mechanically, that should be something that is expected considering how you have to use logos as well as pathos to make a convincing argument.

Anyways, his points against the Swiss thing were good so I'm temporarily changing my vote, though I still support the Swiss choice over the Federation vote.
[x] Just because it's the End doesn't mean we can't work this out.
 
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While the below quote definitely points toward a desire for more Territory, or at least explains why humans would have a cultural impetus toward expanding, I don't think that the military voters actually want a war. They just want to not suck when one occurs.
That's true, but I was hoping to catch some of those types in the net of my vote! I want to expand quickly and far.

If there is anything the Imperium of Mankind was right about, its having a huge ass population!
Are their any quest where we literal play as the bad guys because that sounds interesting.
No, at least not an empire one that I recall anyways



:( so far I have garnered no votes for compromise *cry*
 
Are their any quest where we literal play as the bad guys because that sounds interesting.
I've read threads where we're the "bad guys" but even then we're less bad and more like people who suck at being antiheroes because we're too white knight to wear a leather coat.

If there is anything the Imperium of Mankind was right about, its having a huge ass population!
A widely dispersed population so that they can exterminate planets that are too infected, maybe. But if we're speaking pure population you can fit so, so, so many people in a ringworld.
 
I am starting to fear its to late to change people's vote... hopefully once I get back from school tomorrow I can focus on convincing people.
 
Are their any quest where we literal play as the bad guys because that sounds interesting.

I'm sure there are, I just haven't really run into any. (And it's kinda hard to do "bad guy" when you're running a civ-quest, unless you've got some sort of established backstory like say D&D's Drow, or possibly a 40k quest [although a lot of the 40k quests tend to fall into the trying to be the Federation of Planets against the Grim Darkness of the Far Future].)

Besides running the standard "good guy" there's some quests where the PC is flawed and, honestly, done well it's pretty great. [I'm not sure if my own Terrors in the Night (see the link below) qualifies, but I hope it does... I look forward to restarting work on it hopefully here in a month or so. (Real life got... out of hand.)]
 
*offers the literally countless number of Mind Control quests on Anonkun*
I hope you didn't mean one with actual plot.
Please tell me those aren't harem quests or something.
Also, I hate mind control. It's both something I deeply fear and, like, crude in comparison to orchestrating events such that people do what you want of their own accord.
 
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