Hard Enough - Pokemon SI

Voted best in category in the Users' Choice awards.
It was a shame that Brock didn't have another bug-rock pokemon… that would be cool. But there were no chances of that. Nope! Zero!
They're going to be very surprised once they learn that Brock has an Anorith that he's planning to train and evolve into an Armaldo. It might be funny after Brock evolves her into an Armaldo that Gawain will develop a crush on her or vis versa. Brock's Anorith is female right? Or am I misremembering?
Bugsy tilted his head. "But… I did that last week to book a match?" he said.

Johnny blanched but recovered quickly "For non-gym purposes! You can't just walk up to him about his Elite pokemon!"

Bugsy nodded slowly, understanding Johnny's true brilliance. "Right! I'll ask him after our match!" he said, clenching his fists. Bugsy then levelled a megawatt smile at the rest of the group. "Want to come to watch my match? Then we can see it together if he says yes!"
Happy to see Bugsy here in Pewter. Looks like I was right that he'll be the next future Gym Leader to challenge Brock. I really hope that Brock uses Gawain in his match with Bugsy. I'm also hoping that Brock will try to befriend Bugsy like he's done with the Future Gym Leaders of Hoenn(Brawly, Roxanne, and Flannery). Maybe after the match while Brock his showing Bugsy and the Bug Catchers his Kleavor and Anorith he might mention to them that while researching ancient Pokémon he discovered that Yanma can evolve after learning Ancient Power. He already mentioned the existence of Yanmega to Lorelei so he might as well tell Bugsy.
 
Brock also cheats with Aura empowerment, but isn't outright messing with Pokemon moves.
It's not illegal; when literally every Trainer does it, it's what causes Whiteouts when someone's Pokemon are knocked out, the aura backlash.

Even Brock using it better than most Trainers know how to do isn't cheating. Will having a seventh pokemon active while another's already on the field definitely is.
 
I wonder if Will is strong enough to be boosting his Pokemon himself somehow, or if the reason he stopped telepathic orders is just because he is using them elsewhere, now.
 
People on SB are guessing it's a Xatu

That's right and here's your guys copy of the 'stop guessing Mewtwo' message.

"Do... Do people not know that Will's got a Xatu, which learns everything that's needed to pull of his cheating (Teleport, Baton Pass, Psych Up, Telekinesis, Trick Room, etc.).

I honestly don't get why people are stuck on Mewtwo when it's bound to the main Team Rocket opposing Mamavanni."
~ My Drunk Ass, from the QQ thread
 
That's a good point about the Xatu. Using it also explains why Will wanted permission to teleport into the Gym, which would have required Brock to drop the anti-psychic barrier. Xatu would have plenty of places to hide and lend a wing. With the shield still up, Xatu needs to be inside it to be effective. Unless it's powerful enough to reach through that shield, in which case...yeesh.

But it's probably not, which means it'll be found. Probably right before or after a victor is called.

Edit: Xatu's presence also explains why Will is speaking now. He's psychically talking to Xatu while verbally issuing orders.
 
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Yea outright cheating doesn't seem Wills style or fit his goals (he's got 7 other gym leaders including Sabrina to beat aswell), rather than a bunch of stuff that's on the line.
 
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Yea outright cheating doesn't seem Wills style or fit his goals (he's got 7 other gym leaders including Sabrina to beat aswell), rather than a bunch of stuff that's on the line.
Yeah no, he mind controlled police in order to make Brock look bad, cheating is definitely something he'd do. I don't know where you got the idea of Will's personality you have in your head from, but it's not here.
 
How that self destruct plays out is really going to determine who has the advantage here Brock still has relatively fresh Shrek and Jorm along with Titan who probably won't be knocked out just from that especially with Brock's aura boost but we'll have to wait to see how damaged he is. Will still has relatively fresh Alakazam, injured Slowking and on the ropes Jynx.

What is important to note though is Titan's sand stream will have sandstorm up giving him a 50 % sp def boost and injuring all of Will's mons tho he may choose to let Titan recover to wait out his minute to stall that out. Additionally, Gawain got a Stone Axe or two off so low stealth rocks is possibly still in play. That means the Jynx is probably not next since the rocks if they survived and the sandstorm would drop it fast if not right away though again Will may choose to do that to wait out the sandstorm.

I really will be disappointed if he's actually cheating… Will's giving a hell of a fight so far

He pretty much has been confirmed to be by Sabrina detecting something there along with all the odd movements and moves especially blatant was Gawain's return with Jynx somehow being forewarned of his strongest atks, tanking the big stone axe hit, against medicham stumbling at a key moment and the protect failing. His use of tk on Brock at the start arguably could count too since he tried to sabotage Brock's big leaping entrance to say nothing of his pre battle things like with the police.

I think Will is in for some serious trouble with this with his tactics and tanking his popularity especially with the pokeball thing probably blocks him from the elite 4 but by this point he probably has annoyed people enough they'll pick over this fight and point out all the oddities which again given the sheer number of them will not be good for him.
 
I really will be disappointed if he's actually cheating… Will's giving a hell of a fight so far
It's about a 99% chance that's where the story's going.

There's kind of a shape to this, when a story like this introduces a character in an antagonistic position. The story will feature a series of moments along the way that you can read to figure out how you're intended to feel about a particular character.

For example, when the upcoming fight was with Lance, you were presented with a series of scenes with Lance. He was sent back to his clan in Johto, where they specifically chided him about his actions and talked down to him about picking a fight with Brock; this is a scene intended to make it clear that this was specifically a fuck-up on Lance's part, and evoked a little sympathy for him. He then proceeded to have several moments throughout his fight where he engaged in the same kind of excitement in battle as Brock did, engaged in the same manner of fighting as Brock did, and lost graciously.

All up, this is intended to evoke a situation in which the reader feels great about Brock overcoming Lance, but leaves Lance in a situation where the reader likes him in the losing position and wants to see him better himself after that.

The opposite is true with Will. He's been presented in a purely antagonistic manner so far, with actions practically designed to remove any desire to sympathize with him; it's strongly implied that he was the one targeting Forrest when he got arrested, he's the one who mind-whammied Brock's lawyer, he's tied with Team Rocket, etc, etc.

Now, in the fight, actions are being set up specifically to make you feel antagonized towards Will again. The story is continuing to hammer home the point that everyone dislikes his actions, and the story goes out of its way to condemn his tactics with Trick Room, etc, despite noting that they're valid tactics within the rules as they stand. Sympathetic characters are given the spotlight to talk down on Will's actions; the entire cut-away section to Gary is there to give the perspective from other characters that it's not just Brock who dislikes Will's tactics.

It's extremely likely that the fight's going to end either with Will being found to be cheating so that Brock wins the match and gets to rub it into Will's face while Will is publicly humiliated, or else that the match is going to be cancelled due to some kind of a technicality and no victor will actually be announced.

There's a bit of a chance that this segment will end with an attempt to make Will sympathetic by playing into his plight as a Psychic-type trainer who's being used by the people around him, but I don't rate that chance very highly.

To be somewhat frank, Hard Enough isn't exactly a story that's particularly interested in having Brock ever actually legitimately lose a fight without coming out ahead regardless (outside of Gym battles where the point isn't for him to win), so I wouldn't walk into this expecting Will to legitimately pull out a win or come out of this with an overly sympathetic depiction.

It's kind of a shame, because I agree- Will's by far the most interesting opponent to be faced in the entire fic, and it's fun to see a trainer whose underlying strategy isn't just 'have really powerful Pokemon use funny combinations of moves'. He's fighting dirty and using tactics that Brock can't easily counter, and in a story that was interested in having its protagonist actually be challenged, he'd be the perfect kind of opponent to throw up against Brock. There's a lot of lessons Brock could take away from the fight that could make for interesting stuff being brought up in future.

It's also just interesting to see a legitimately skilled trainer with a complex strategy and set of moves that doesn't immediately move to become one of Brock's friends. It would be good to see that there's an entire ecosystem of powerful trainers outside of the protagonist's viewpoint that will totally just see him as an obstacle to overcome because they don't care about him from their point of view.

But by far the most likely result is that Will's just going to be caught out for cheating and it's going to be explained that Brock definitely would have won on his own merits if it weren't for Will's underhanded tactics.
 
Will's poisoned the well on multiple occasions, specifically just mentioning the entire lead up where he paid people and gave them psychic Pokemon to fight Brock? That's going to yank his reputation. The Pokémon balls issue that Erika is very much highlighting? Corporations are going to be very pissed. The rules issue! Oh boy lots of folks mad. If it's truly revealed about the seventh Pokemon? Will isn't just screwed. He's got three compounding issues then followed up by a very special one guaranteed to likely get him kicked out of the league and barred from every tournament possible.

He's at the edge where he has to win this or he's guaranteed to be fucked forever.
 
Will has to be aware that actually ordering his pokemon to explode is not a good look right?

Especially airing on live television.

It's like telling your pokemon to rip off it's own arm just for an*chance* at beating your opponent
I think we're well past that. Will is ruthless and is pursing every single advantage he can get. In fact, I'll be honest? Will is playing almost like a player would. Maybe not fully, but the willingness to save an otherwise powerful pokemon specifically to explode and suicide a powerful opponent? That is something I've seen players strategize with.

But moreover, Will is not playing to look good. He is playing to win and crown his accomplishment. Never mind that he will be a villain in the process. Hell, if anything, he might be hoping to play that to his advantage in his pursuit of a championship spot.
 
It's about a 99% chance that's where the story's going.

There's kind of a shape to this, when a story like this introduces a character in an antagonistic position. The story will feature a series of moments along the way that you can read to figure out how you're intended to feel about a particular character.

For example, when the upcoming fight was with Lance, you were presented with a series of scenes with Lance. He was sent back to his clan in Johto, where they specifically chided him about his actions and talked down to him about picking a fight with Brock; this is a scene intended to make it clear that this was specifically a fuck-up on Lance's part, and evoked a little sympathy for him. He then proceeded to have several moments throughout his fight where he engaged in the same kind of excitement in battle as Brock did, engaged in the same manner of fighting as Brock did, and lost graciously.

All up, this is intended to evoke a situation in which the reader feels great about Brock overcoming Lance, but leaves Lance in a situation where the reader likes him in the losing position and wants to see him better himself after that.

The opposite is true with Will. He's been presented in a purely antagonistic manner so far, with actions practically designed to remove any desire to sympathize with him; it's strongly implied that he was the one targeting Forrest when he got arrested, he's the one who mind-whammied Brock's lawyer, he's tied with Team Rocket, etc, etc.

Now, in the fight, actions are being set up specifically to make you feel antagonized towards Will again. The story is continuing to hammer home the point that everyone dislikes his actions, and the story goes out of its way to condemn his tactics with Trick Room, etc, despite noting that they're valid tactics within the rules as they stand. Sympathetic characters are given the spotlight to talk down on Will's actions; the entire cut-away section to Gary is there to give the perspective from other characters that it's not just Brock who dislikes Will's tactics.

It's extremely likely that the fight's going to end either with Will being found to be cheating so that Brock wins the match and gets to rub it into Will's face while Will is publicly humiliated, or else that the match is going to be cancelled due to some kind of a technicality and no victor will actually be announced.

There's a bit of a chance that this segment will end with an attempt to make Will sympathetic by playing into his plight as a Psychic-type trainer who's being used by the people around him, but I don't rate that chance very highly.

To be somewhat frank, Hard Enough isn't exactly a story that's particularly interested in having Brock ever actually legitimately lose a fight without coming out ahead regardless (outside of Gym battles where the point isn't for him to win), so I wouldn't walk into this expecting Will to legitimately pull out a win or come out of this with an overly sympathetic depiction.

It's kind of a shame, because I agree- Will's by far the most interesting opponent to be faced in the entire fic, and it's fun to see a trainer whose underlying strategy isn't just 'have really powerful Pokemon use funny combinations of moves'. He's fighting dirty and using tactics that Brock can't easily counter, and in a story that was interested in having its protagonist actually be challenged, he'd be the perfect kind of opponent to throw up against Brock. There's a lot of lessons Brock could take away from the fight that could make for interesting stuff being brought up in future.

It's also just interesting to see a legitimately skilled trainer with a complex strategy and set of moves that doesn't immediately move to become one of Brock's friends. It would be good to see that there's an entire ecosystem of powerful trainers outside of the protagonist's viewpoint that will totally just see him as an obstacle to overcome because they don't care about him from their point of view.

But by far the most likely result is that Will's just going to be caught out for cheating and it's going to be explained that Brock definitely would have won on his own merits if it weren't for Will's underhanded tactics.

This does bring a question to mind: what would be considered an event in this story that has legitimately been a hindrance or setback to Brock for more than a chapter or two?

/I honestly don't even count what happened with Forrest at the police station
//because Brock proverbially bulldozed way through it, making the mayor and Will look bad in the process
///he got an apology from the police chief
////and it rather neatly solved the dilemma (if you will) of who would be accompany Ash and Misty (because IIRC, he had still been pondering whether or not his presence alongside Ash in the "plot heavy" stuff outweighed his need to remain at the Gym)
 
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You know, I was not expecting someone else to come out and say it, but here we go. Will has almost intentionally been built up as an antagonist to the point it'd almost be narrative whiplash if it turns out...no, he's just a really good trainer who is willing to use every advantage. I mean, I know nothing about him for the games, but his entire motivation for becoming a pokemon Ace trainer and the championship could be to live up to a terminal sibling's expectations of him and make them proud. I say this "could" be his motivation, not that it is-we just haven't see much of what Will's character is and he always seems to be scheming or lurking when he does show.

Hell, half of me expects with current trends that Brock wandering into Will in a cafe would've seen Will somehow evilly drinking coffee and eating a bagel.

The trends thus far have built Will up as an antagonist and a more nuanced characterization has carefully not been shown with Will, outside a minor moment where he was startled and even fearful when Brock went full dark aura mode on him which, to be fair, Brock can bench press a Golem. I'd be scared of Brock for that feat alone.
 
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People keep saying that they want Brock to lose this fight and learn a lesson from it, but, like, I can't think of a lesson that he could learn from this that wouldn't make him worse of a person, because the only half-way decent lesson he culd learn from this is "expect to face the scummiest and dirtiest of humanity when doing Battles" which would rightly get people angry with him until he gets it beaten out of him again.

What "lesson" would he be supposed to learn from this? Cause I don't see one. There's no improvement he could make as a Trainer or as a person that could have made his chances better here, this is entirely because of how shit Will is.
 
Will has to be aware that actually ordering his pokemon to explode is not a good look right?

Especially airing on live television.

It's like telling your pokemon to rip off it's own arm just for an*chance* at beating your opponent

Pokemon are smart enough to not obey orders that are suicidally stupid. Exeggutor was already worn out and damaged from his fight with Shrek. This probably was the best play Will had available against an ace that naturally counters his typing and that has been trained against the premier Psychic team in the region (and maybe the world).
 
I'm just getting tired with this.

So there is no general rule about unsportsmanlike behaviour or actively hindering medical aid?
Is everyone who works at he league an absolute moron?
Because i would have expected those two, or at minimim the later one, to be the first rules to be written down back when they invented writing.

And to pre empt a response i got elsewhere for this.

No, i don't buy that Will is just that scummy of a human being, that nobody ever has been as scummy?
I do not buy it.
It breaks SoD.
And even ignoring the "intentionally fucking with rules bit", pokemon battling probably comes from a dueling tradition, i would fully expect there to be legacy rules about injured and/or incapacitated opponents.
Because accidents happen and technology is not faultless.

I would find it much more believable that the ref could have called a disqualification right there, but did not because Brock wants to break Will here and now.

Also, yes, there is nothing for Brock to learn from loosing this battle.
Except maybe "blatantly cheating works", or possibly "universe hates you, personally."
 
I looked up Sabrina's first anime episode, Abra and the Psychic Showdown, in hopes of getting an idea on what might be going on with this match. Before reading that page, I was wondering if a psychic pokemon could turn itself invisible, and a combination of Telepathy and Future Sight were allowing Will's hypothetical seventh pokemon to avoid all dangers.

The episode's battle, ah... Well.
Sabrina and the little girl move over telekinetically as the arena lights up. The little girl tosses a Poké Ball, sending out an Abra while Ash sends in Pikachu. Pikachu bounces around, though he notices that Abra is sleeping. Ash checks his Pokédex and it says that Abra sleeps eighteen hours a day but can employ telekinesis while asleep. Pikachu fires off a Thunder Shock, but Abra wakes up and uses Teleport to dodge and get behind Pikachu. Sabrina then uses her Psychic powers to make Abra evolve into Kadabra. Ash checks his Pokédex again. He thinks that it is unfair due to it being a one-on-one match, but Misty informs him that evolving during the match is within the rules. Ash orders Pikachu to fill the stadium with lightning to negate Kadabra's teleportation. Pikachu launches a Thunder attack at the ceiling, pooling it into a massive vortex that starts raining down lightning bolts towards the field. However, Kadabra uses Confusion to control the attack and redirect it towards Pikachu. The individual lightning bolts combine to form a dragon, and the attack quickly catches up to Pikachu, causing serious damage. Kadabra then uses Psychic to control Pikachu's body, forcing him to dance. Ash is initially amused by Pikachu's routine, though Misty corrects Ash before Kadabra slams Pikachu into the ceiling and back down, repeating the Psychic attack several times. Ash intervenes, rushing to Pikachu's side, and decides to forfeit the match.
Aside from "using psychic power to evolve" catching my interest, I don't think these have applied to the current match. Medicham seems to be key here as a pokemon with a strong kit to counter Brock.

And yet nothing quite comes to mind, beyond that Seventh Pokemon idea. Maybe the psychic moves Guard Split, Power Split or Guard Swap are at play? Or Skill Swap is giving Will's pokemon overpowered abilities?
 
My suspension of disbelief in Will being an asshole in the match and getting away with it so far, is still going.

The war is in living memory. The Pokemon League was only established after the war ended. There have only been 3 champions in that time. Oak, Pryce, and Lance.

It's not that strange to me that when they had to rewrite the rules after the war they missed loopholes.

I mean, look at the mess that is IRL sports.

As for Brock not being prepared after being so convinced for so many chapters. The great spicy chicken answers that.
 
In addition to the above, the very nature of pokemon training nearly always requiring empathy and compassion to succeed at a high level makes dirty shenanigans unlikely at those levels. Since they're the ones who wrote the rules it's entirely reasonable for them to miss that sort of thing.

I mean, Oak probably wrote the rulebook, and he's basically a kid at heart. It wouldn't surprise me in the slightest if he genuinely never thought of this sort of thing. It's not something that would come up in a fair match or in a war.
 
The league, as it exists now, was built after a huge war, the idea that someone raining pokemon might not abuse theirs, let alone their opponents, not coming up seems, unlikely.
Even assuming that League was built out of nothing, instead of, what i suspect is much more likely, being either a continuation, or replacement, of a much older tradition (people tend to start at Pewter for a reason).
 
Other than what SirKaid mentioned. The omission of such rules might also be on purpose.

Remember the attitude toward the war is: Yes, the war happened, it's over now. Moving on.

I'm sure if you ask Blaine or Agatha or many other war vets they can come up with some horrific strategies and the rules needed to stop them. But are you sure they would even want to hint that those strats are possible?

Making completely full proof rules is second to making sure young trainers, that might fall into darker paths, do not know that there is a way to train mean look to lock pokeballs.

Putting them in the rules is acknowledging that it is possible.
Aura is not in the rules and Aura is something kept secret till a trainer is high level enough that they find out about it themselves or they get mentored.

Mega evolution is not in the rules. Even tho the steel worker in Pewter knows enough about Mega Steelix to warn Brock.

So, yeah I can believe the rules are not perfect.
 
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I mean, Brock has dealt with unsportsmanlike trainers before, usually with overwhelming force.

He has been mode changing between Gym Challenge mode, Peer Challenge mode and Crisis mode.

Peer Challenge has respect, but Will is starting to trigger Crisis mode.
 
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