Damn, they are good. That's some proper Oracling by Bjorn! It would be an honor to fight by their side.
Kori met his match in Bluff and Sense Motive, too. No wonder he felt uneasy putting on airs before the nobles.
Feels weird to reaize we are carrying equipment comparable to that of a royal of a major empire. Boots of Speed, Scabbard of Keen Edges, Belt of Titan's Might... The extra money bought us a way to punch several levels above our weight class.
Rings of Spell storing, filled with Caster Level 10/15/20 Hermean Potentials (level 1 spells).
"Disposable" Artifacts, designed to be the first things hit with a Mage's Disjunction, so that her other items can function regardless.
Or Artifaces with "Plane Shift", so they might resist MD.
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Edit: @DragonParadox also, I lovethis: "but before you can speak Gorok had taken out the scroll in question".
Kori's not 'in charge' and I like that he's not in charge. Kori's clever and puts-party-first, and lies good. Real good.
But the rest are also clever. And know what they value, know who they are.
And Gorok's in charge.
Why? Because he has the background [Is Gorok]. And that gives him a +7+1d4 to Sensible. And that is a power - a perspective - that the other Ghosts acknowledge as worthy of heeding.
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Edit @Goldfish: It might be good to include an explicit "we follow your lead, priority is to survive the fight, and if easy, try to take these people alive, unconscious, and throw them in a Bag of Holding."
-------------- If they lead, we will follow, lending the weight of our skills, spells, and blades to the effort of rescuing Sir Pisca and bringing this entire sordid affair to an acceptable conclusion.
To me, the above include the elves holding Pisca being taken alive if possible. If not, that's unfortunete. But optmially we'll be able to have them at minimal hp (0?) where they can't do anything.
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@DragonParadox if Mina fails her UMD check for using the scroll of Greater Teleport, then I'd really appreciate the opportunity for the party to take two rounds to plan and rapid-fire instructions, because since if we are going to need to wait for another GT scroll, we might as well wait for other stuff to be brought. [Reduce Person scrolls for teleporting back out] is my first thought, but there's a lot more.
Stuff like people casting "Bestow Insight UMD" on Mina, and giving another GT scroll (or two), and
Edit @Goldfish: It might be good to include an explicit "we follow your lead, priority is to survive the fight, and if easy, try to take these people alive, unconscious, and throw them in a Bag of Holding."
-------------- If they lead, we will follow, lending the weight of our skills, spells, and blades to the effort of rescuing Sir Pisca and bringing this entire sordid affair to an acceptable conclusion.
To me, the above include the elves holding Pisca being taken alive if possible. If not, that's unfortunete. But optmially we'll be able to have them at minimal hp (0?) where they can't do anything.
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Why would we try to keep any of them alive? They all need to die, as far as I'm concerned. They're doing some deeply bad shit, the kind of stuff that can start wars between nations, and for pretty stupid cultural reasons.
More importantly, trying to keep them alive and subdued will take time and effort better spent on dealing with the other threats in the Locker. There are likely to be Drow and Demons, and who knows what else down there. Wasting even a single round to bind and stabilize and unconscious prisoner is too much, IMO.
Bags of Holding are not indestructible from the inside, either. If we put unwilling people in one, it's not inconceivable that one could destroy it from within while trying to escape.
@DragonParadox if Mina fails her UMD check for using the scroll of Greater Teleport, then I'd really appreciate the opportunity for the party to take two rounds to plan and rapid-fire instructions, because since if we are going to need to wait for another GT scroll, we might as well wait for other stuff to be brought. [Reduce Person scrolls for teleporting back out] is my first thought, but there's a lot more.
Stuff like people casting "Bestow Insight UMD" on Mina, and giving another GT scroll (or two), and
She isn't using UMD to read the scroll. That would be ridiculously difficult, as in a DC 33 UMD skill check. For someone with a +7 UMD bonus, it would just be a waste of time.
Greater Teleport is on her spell list, though, so she will only need to make a DC 14 caster level check instead. That means she needs to roll an 8 or higher on a d20. She will get three chances to succeed between her regular roll, her Fortune Hex, and Hermean Potential.
Greater Teleport is on her spell list, though, so she will only need to make a DC 14 caster level check instead. That means she needs to roll an 8 or higher on a d20. She will get three chances to succeed between her regular roll, her Fortune Hex, and Hermean Potential.
2. Why would we try to keep any of them alive? They all need to die, as far as I'm concerned. They're doing some deeply bad shit, the kind of stuff that can start wars between nations, and for pretty stupid cultural reasons.
1.More importantly, trying to keep them alive and subdued will take time and effort better spent on dealing with the other threats in the Locker.
1. I am entirely confident that taking these surface-elves out will not alert any drow in terms of time spent. If we wait 10 minutes or 40 minutes, it's likely to be the same in terms of other threats in the locker.
I think there is a full seperation between these elves and the drow, else we won't have seen the elves have that conversation.
As such we can take out these elves/resuce Pisca, heal up and then go find Sarner's corpse and then go after the drow
In terms of 'resources', I mean "we fight as normal, but if they aren't fully dead, then we strip them, cast CLW on them from our wands, keep them unconscious (apply non leathal damage?), chuck them in an empty BoH and give them air every 7 minutes.
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I'm not looking at any of this in terms of 'justice' or 'deserve' but instead in terms of nation-state politics, or 'realpolitic' as some fools might term it.
My assumption underlying all of this: The surface-elf agents here don't know that the 90% tariff on all surface trade has been removed.
They're trying to maintain a conspiracy they don't know is has already become unenforceable.
So we take them down to 0hp or further, keep those alive that we can [while still preventing them from taking actions: If we can't prevent them from taking actions then we kill them] stick them all in a BoH and proceed to find Sarner.
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After all this, get the princess to diplomacy/bluff to whatever surface elves we capture to make them believe that she is not going to have him killed no mater what they say, but will instead be returned to his homeland and noted as a spy. Then we hit him with a Suggestion to tell the truth and since he knows that no answer he gives will cause us to kill him the spell won't break no mater what we ask. [As long as he "knows" that his fellow surface elves won't kill/harm him for answering].]
I'm thinking of this in terms of nation states playing spy-games against each other, where every one knows the other is up to shenanagins, but no one is willing to push the other into pulling the trigger, not in terms of "might cause a war", because I think that with care, this can still be walked back from if Taldor [read: Princess] wants it to, despite the capture of Pisca.
Except in this nation-state spy game, one player [surface elves] don't know the rules of the game have changed [drow can now trade with surface], so after this all plays our is when Taldor tells them.
If we can take these operatives alive without putting ourseleves at undue risk.
This isn't just nation-state vs nation-state spy games, though. They attempted to assassinate the governor of one of Taldor's largest cities, with the princess basically within arm's reach of him at the time, to cover up evidence and provide a distraction for a kidnapping.
The kidnapped victims include Pisca Fahlspar, a member of the nobility and the nephew of Grand Duchess Fahlspar. There are 12 Grand Dukes/Duchesses in Taldor, and they hold more power than anyone short of the Grand Prince (i.e. the king). And they didn't just kidnap him, but take him with the explicit intention to kill him. This is not spy games, this is Russian-style fuck fuck games.
The Elves aren't trying to push just as far as they can without causing a war. They have blatantly pushed well beyond that point now. If these people are left alive, the chance for a war increase. They can be forced to speak the truth, confess their actions, etc. The princess doesn't want a war, so the best thing that can happen is to kill them all and send a message, along with exposing the existence of the Drow for the whole world to see.
EDIT: I'll edit the plan to mention we can stabilize any defeated enemies she wishes to take alive, but I'm not going to try to recommend that she do so. She's a level 13 social-specced princess. She'll know better than us what she should do with them.
you make good points, i think? need to think when not sleepy/drunk.
not sure of utility of exposing drow.
one counterpoint: arrows are not an assassination attempt on a Taldor city governor, because of raise dead.
he'd be brought back via raise dead, and everyone knows that.
an attempt to destroy the body at minimum needs to be made before it counts as an assassination attempt on any sufficiently rich/politically powerful person.
They attempted to assassinate the governor of one of Taldor's largest cities, with the princess basically within arm's reach of him at the time, to cover up evidence and provide a distraction for a kidnapping.
I would remind you that this has not been proven yet. They used Pass Without Trace for the kidnapping, and Pepper smelled something 'eathly' at the scene of the supposed assassination. It looks increasingly likely, but they could be using the opportunity created for them by someone else.
If conflict erupts, I am in favor of capturing them the same way we did Saenar. Bludgeon them into unconsciousness and shove them in a sack. They are not going to wake up without a healer. And just as it was with Saenar, I wouldn't go out of my way to preserve their lives.
If they pushed well beyond that point, then we'd have a war. Somehow I doubt that.
Yes, Kyounin have grossly overstepped, and they are in a poor negotiating position. Sounds like Eutropia has a bargaining chip belonging exclusively to her (as the Emperor has not been informed yet, and I assume will not be). Why reduce your advantage by killing the spies when the threat is to go public with the knowledge of their actions?
Do not fear that I should fall to trickery or enchantment. The Heirs to the Lion Throne are trained from a young age to throw off such unsubtle manipulations... and also there is a counter-spell woven into the coronet."
Yes, Kyounin have grossly overstepped, and they are in a poor negotiating position. Sounds like Eutropia has a bargaining chip belonging exclusively to her (as the Emperor has not been informed yet, and I assume will not be). Why reduce your advantage by killing the spies when the threat is to go public with the knowledge of their actions?
Yes. Or at least make some radical changes so the situation does not repeat itself.
But the same is true of 'rogue agents who are in no way associated with the Winter Council' instigating trouble in Taldor. So why would we 'burn' them for them?
I guess that was the best way for me to phrase it.
I was thinking of the reckless espionage crap that apparently got pulled regularly by Russian intelligence services which would have made for proper casus belli if the Western powers were actually inclined to engage in nuclear war.
Basically, when you realize your opponent doesn't want to fight, so you keep poking them with a sharp stick just because you can, that's what I'm thinking about here in relation to the Elves.
From my interpretation, and I believe the most common one among other players, the reroll mechanic is only for those who have the spell cast on them after they have already succumbed to a mind control effect. If the PfE spell was in place beforehand, they are just immune to mind controlling effects.
From my interpretation, and I believe the most common one among other players, the reroll mechanic is only for those who have the spell cast on them after they have already succumbed to a mind control effect. If the PfE spell was in place beforehand, they are just immune to mind controlling effects.
Right, for some reason I read that wrongly, thought the PF version was deliberately weaker, so not as much of the Enchantment School could be negated by a level 1 spell.
Right, for some reason I read that wrongly, thought the PF version was deliberately weaker, so not as much of the Enchantment School could be negated by a level 1 spell.
It's just the Charm or Compulsion effects which exercise ongoing control over the target that get blocked; Charm Person/Monster, Dominate Person/Monster, Suggestion, etc.
Sleep and Confusion effects are not blocked, for example, and there are tons of other Enchantment spells that fuck with the target's mind in one way or another which don't count as ongoing control.
We just tend to focus on the outright mind control spells when thinking about Enchantment effects. At least I do.
@DragonParadox if Mina fails her UMD check for using the scroll of Greater Teleport, then I'd really appreciate the opportunity for the party to take two rounds to plan and rapid-fire instructions, because since if we are going to need to wait for another GT scroll, we might as well wait for other stuff to be brought. [Reduce Person scrolls for teleporting back out] is my first thought, but there's a lot more.
Adhoc vote count started by DragonParadox on Dec 10, 2024 at 7:33 AM, finished with 30 posts and 4 votes.
[X] We recognize their superior experience and prowess on the field of battle. If they lead, we will follow, lending the weight of our skills, spells, and blades to the effort of rescuing Sir Pisca and bringing this entire sordid affair to an acceptable conclusion. -[X] Kori will offer to cast Invisibility on the princess, if she wishes to begin the fight unseen. --[X] Ask that she use her Hand of Valor ability on Cob. It will help make up for the loss of spells we used earlier when hunting the assassin. --[X] If she is willing to share the three Potions of Delay Poison she has, we can use our scroll of Communal Delay Poison to protect the rest of the group from Poison. That will allow Kori to conserve some of his power for later. -[X] Ask Bjorn to cast Moment of Greatness on everyone before we leave and to share what other spells he feels comfortable expending, such as Shield of Faith on Gorok and Cob, who will be fighting at his side. --[X] Recommend that he take liberal advantage of his Fog Cloud spells if we are pressed, since our entire group will be able to see through them unimpeded thanks to our Ashen Path spell. -[X] It may or may not prove effective, but Gorok's Ghosts are going to disguise their appearances as average Human mercenaries. Hopefully we can come out of this without more enemies than we started with. We have a potion of Disguise Self the princess can use if she also wishes to hide her features. It may be but the slightest figleaf providing plausible deniability, but that may be enough to prevent a diplomatic incident with the Elves, if the mission goes poorly. -[X] If the princess wishes to take prisoners, we can cast Stabilize spells to keep them from dying if they are heavily injured and rendered unconscious. -[X] The party will not activate their Unfettered Shirts before teleporting. The effect doesn't last long and may be needed against the Demons or Drow.
"May the the fires of the Everbloom kindle your courage and guide your heart," the princess proclaims, setting a hearty hand on Cob's small shoulder even as you call the shadows around her that she might draw the blade from hiding. The first one to earn that blade to the vitals won't be getting up, you judge.
"The Everbloom?" You can count on the fingers of one hand the number of times you heard Sirim sound that surprised, though memory of old does not recall the name. Had you heard of her among the Bellflower? No, just two days ago Sir Pisca had made mention of her sarcastically, of how rumors make slavers into her chosen folk.
"What, master shadow? you don't think one of royal blood is worthy of her regard?" She gives a laugh unseen, more at her own expense than not you'd judge. "Mayhap you are right, small yet is the flame of my devotion before the demands of state, yet today I walk with Her unburdened by duties of the crown."
As soon be unburdened by your head, Sirim whispers to himself, almost, though he shares it at least with you. Absent is his contempt for such gods as Haggakal or his hatred of the Midnight Lord and his servants, for one who is to his mind deluded about herself and the One which she has chosen to serve.
Potions are handed out and wards against poison woven, for those about to walk into the company of drow and their light elvish kin no better disposed.
Mina had spent all this while trying to unravel the words upon the scroll. Fine and crisp they are, as though the had been burned upon the parchment by the rays of some alien star fracturing and recombining and breaking again as they describe relations arcane.
"Given infinite time, any morsel of matter can make its way to any point in the physical sphere, but time itself is inconstant, not a single stream but a vast delta flowing at times swifter and at times slower. "
After some thought you decide to suggest to the others to make use of glamor-craft to take on a more expected shape, not so much for the 'audience' waiting for you down in the Locker as any distant eyes who might pay attention to the battle, elvish or otherwise. So you do, all but Sirim hidden behind false faces again, in Cob's case a particularly floppy eared halfling.
All the while Bjron chants the names of runes in his strange northern tongue, the syllables wholly apart from the Taldan trade tongue and from the languages of the High Realm you heard in dreams. There's a touch of dwarvish there you think, but only around the edges. Whence it came you cannot say, but neither can you deny the power. As you all join hands Mina continues to read, words half understood laid down with painstaking care by a mage.
"...Between any two points there are an infinite number of paths that can be accessed, each in their own moment, but moments are a function of time, the serpent devouring its tail, and so for the experienced magician any two points at any time can be made one."
It's as though the stone underfoot, the air you breathe and all within them are woven of silk like a great tent and the hand of a giant reaches out to yank it sideways, twisting and turning, colors bleeding into each other, shapes turning inside out... Until the soles of your feet hit hard stone and the smell of fire, charred meat and unclean bodies hit your nostrils.
The good news is that Pisca is still alive, bound and unconscious on the hard stone floor and that both of the elves, warrior and wizard, are gone. The bad news is that they had managed to find and attract the Lamashans. Seated on a monstrous throne that grows like a tumor from the back of a spider larger than Warty is the three eyed drow. To her left and right are two hunched over figures the size of ogres that might once have been of xulgath stock, though worse and more vicious than even the nightmares of the People can tell. Seated between the fins are lithe figures, grey skinned save where it had been worn raw armed with hooks and blades and thing-catchers, but the things they hold are worse by far.
Once they might have been men, and indeed here and there in the masses of suffering flesh you can see remnants of humanity as they scream and howl and gibber. Chests crack open into new ravenous maws, spines wiggle like serpents out petals of sinew and veins, tentacles topped with eyes that look on in horror all too sapient
Elywa screams something that's more ecstatic prayer than warcry... and that is when you notice that there are more drow around the edges of the chamber, eight in all, each bearing some deformity of face or form, and more importantly for the moment heavy black-steel crossbows.
"The Spider, bring it down! Bring'er down!" The Ulfen seer roars so loud it seems to shake the stone.
How do you fight?
[] Write in
OOC: The clue that you were about to fight the hive was that the place Pisca was in had demon carvings all over the walls. The elves had already dragged him in, they had only to ring the proverbial dinner bell and make themselves scarce. This is not, to be clear, the encounter you would have faced if you met her in the sewers a few updates back, this is the whole hive. On the plus side, get through this and you are guaranteed to level up.
Oh god damnit, I updated the plan at the last minute to not have everyone use their Unfettered Shirts because I didn't think we would immediately go into the final boss fight. Those could have been helpful.
The chamber is about 40 ft across, you are next to Pisca and about equidistant from the enemies at the enemies in the center and the archers behind you, 20 ft in either direction.
If I were a Wizard I'd be tempted to cast room-filling Fireball until I'm out of spells or flesh to burn.
But luckily the people here have colder heads, right?
The chamber is about 40 ft across, you are next to Pisca and about equidistant from the enemies at the enemies in the center and the archers behind you, 20 ft in either direction.
