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[Exalted, ?] Most High

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Orm Embar said:
Eleven apparently carries over into the Age of Sorrows and wreaks havoc on Ulyssian's personality and relationships, which I am invested in emotionally to an enormous degree, so we are in accord there. By the way, I think it is worth noting that canonical Odyssial probably did not have the Apex, as he was 'stuck' at a flat nine Greatness.
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Are we sure? He certainly met the prerequisites for Apex, and I don't see him Not going for it if he had a chance.

But yeah, my gut's telling me the last Epoch is going to be "What do you do during the Usurpation", where our options are going to be where Odyssial's efforts are being spent building his time capsule, where we get the chance to provide some story protection at the cost of further Heartlessness (Likely by dint of committing atrocities to buy time to make his preparations) or by spending XP (Spending himself and his efforts to buy time and distractions) There would still be a chance at these resources carrying on into the Second Age for Ulyssian to acquire, but they would be based on our previous decisions, and otherwise up to chance to see if they survive.

Like, for instance, the Apex Flight option would give us a free "You can stuff one Artifact away that will automatically be in Ulyssian's possession" in the final bit, but we could spend other actions to hide away stuff like treasures, scatter followers, and distribute sleeper cells with his own hypercompetence to ensure they survive, rather then have to endure a millenia of predation.
 
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Alectai said:
Are we sure? He certainly met the prerequisites for Apex, and I don't see him Not going for it if he had a chance.
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Yeah, he met the prerequisites, but they were his final values. If he'd had the boost, he'd have been higher. I'm not one hundred percent sure, but it's not like the man with the answer to this question isn't right here, so getting a definitive answer ought to be easy enough.
 
[X] Sorcerer of the Adamant Circle
[X] Apex Flight
[X] The Blade of the Battle-Maiden
[X] Petals of the Rose

I am in favor of this build to max out on the social links and continue the small circle of friends theme. Odyssial's ability to affect his reincarnation should benefit thematically from both adamant sorcery and apex flight as he pushes the limits of solar ability.

One thing though is not accept the reduction in heartlessness from the petals of the rose in order to be able to reduce it with xp. If the xp bonus of 1.6 from Heartless might remains in place after the spending of xp to reduce H10 to H8, then we only need to have accumulated 165,450 xp since the last count post of 640,800 xp since the extra 350k with the 1.6 multiplier would be enough to carry us over the 1.05 mil mark to get Greatness 10.

If not then we would need to get a lot more xp then. On the other hand if the xp modifier of heartless might went down then we would be able to buy off one level of heartlessness with our current xp count post of 640,800. As the 1.05 mil/1.4= 750k and minus the bonus 350k leaves 400k plus 250k for -1h is 650k xp.

I want to continue romance of Lea and Ody into the Age of Sorrows.

@Rihaku if we get the two titles offered here that would give us 3 total, would that trigger aggression from enemies that would obstruct work?



 
[X] Subduer of the Wyld
[X] Apex Flight
[X] Blade of the Battle Maiden
[X] Petals of the Rose

Petals of the Rose seems to be the only really controversial choice here. However, as much as the loss of flexibility in the next Epoch might rankle, it avails us nothing to save Lealope (as we would undoubtedly vote for) if she goes insane later on. There is no question in my mind that we'd spend a choice on saving her next round (if this one doesn't insure her survival anyway) so we may as well pay out now. Loss-aversion may be a fallacy, mind, but on the whole a sane Lealope with enhanced combat potential is what we want; and the epic (if very, very weird) romance between the two is fitting.

We'll also be at Heartlessness 9, which gives us one final Heartless Might choice to reach 10, if needed in addition to the extra choice from Greatness 10; and our Heartlessness would be attenuated by iron self-discipline and a broader personality from Petals of the Rose. Or we could not take Blade of the Battle Maiden and stay at Heartlessness 8, but I'm prioritizing characters in my voting at the moment. In any case, under no circumstances are we likely to vote for Heartlessness 11.

I did ponder at length the option to head off the Wracking, though. I expect some combination of the choices would produce "canon" Exalted or something similar where the Sidereals remain comparatively more on top of things and where Creation does not face immenant destruction. In some ways that would be a true Hard Mode special feature. Still, I don't particularly value the fidelity of Odyssial's reincarnation and taking Adamant Sorcery would also require giving something else up in turn.
 
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I would be willing to second Cavalier's voting block. It's not completely unobjectionable, and we should have at least two picks between our Greatness and an emergency one final Heartless Might activation.

Three to four if we start with a couple by default, though I imagine there'll be a lot of fires to put out there! And we'll likely need at least one reserved to finish the Unfinished Blade.

That being said, I do hope a sane Lealope isn't going to go "Hey, Ulyssian is totes Odyssial... KILL THE SPARE" if we focus heavily on her. I like Moon! She and Ulyssian are adorable together!
 
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Alectai said:
I like Moon! She and Ulyssian are adorable together!
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Holy shit, we agree on something! Anyway, I'm kind of leery of taking Petals, both because it kills our flexibility in the final (and probably most important) epoch and because it kinds of locks us onto a route in the AoS. A sane Lealope is good, yes, but where's the fun in having a First Age Lunar who is both sane and affectionate? No dramatic tension!
 
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Yeah, like I said, my chief concern if we go even further into the Lea route here is that she might decide to play a Hikaru Genji Plan while ensuring she KILLS THE SPARE.

I mean, if she's still sane, that's unlikely to happen (And we did avoid Yandere route so far), but I would probably scream loudly if it happened :(
 
Orm Embar said:
Yeah, he met the prerequisites, but they were his final values. If he'd had the boost, he'd have been higher. I'm not one hundred percent sure, but it's not like the man with the answer to this question isn't right here, so getting a definitive answer ought to be easy enough.
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Yes, he did have Apex. XP doesn't exist for NPCs, though.
 
Orm Embar said:
Holy shit, we agree on something! Anyway, I'm kind of leery of taking Petals, both because it kills our flexibility in the final (and probably most important) epoch and because it kinds of locks us onto a route in the AoS. A sane Lealope is good, yes, but where's the fun in having a First Age Lunar who is both sane and affectionate? No dramatic tension!
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A less sane Lealope is probably more likely to go full yandere and try to make Ulyssian hers rather than less likely. If she survives with her mentality intact, with memories of a more balanced Odyssial, she may be more inclined to respect Ulyssian's choices and differences rather than wanting to force him into the mold of her old love. And of course, the agency in a quest is that of the MC. We get to choose the waifu(s).

And as far as flexibility, meh. We have a maximum of four choices here, same as before. There's no chance you'd vote for spending XP to pay down Heartlessness, anyway.
 
A fair point friend Cavalier.

Shall the three of us consolidate our votes then?

[X] Subduer of the Wyld
[X] Apex Flight
[X] Blade of the Battle Maiden
[X] Petals of the Rose
 
If we are voting for Petals of the Rose, how would everyone react to Ulyssian in a polygamous relationship, because by taking this choice we are investing a great deal of effort on keeping Lealope close to Odyssial and in turn Ulyssian in the second age, and I myself am opposed to Ulyssian breaking off his relationship with Empty Moon so their will be some friction between the two to get Ulyssian's affections.

Though I do have to admit, watching Ulyssian squirm would be quite entertaining.
 
Mannan said:
If we are voting for Petals of the Rose, how would everyone react to Ulyssian in a polygamous relationship, because by taking this choice we are investing a great deal of effort on keeping Lealope close to Odyssial and in turn Ulyssian in the second age, and I myself am opposed to Ulyssian breaking off his relationship with Empty Moon so their will be some friction between the two to get Ulyssian's affections.

Though I do have to admit, watching Ulyssian squirm would be quite entertaining.
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I'm not doing it for "Close to Lealope" I'm doing it because "Insane Elder Lunar = Pain"
 
Rihaku said:
He would have to be nerfed hard to make it not a stomp. Hell, Mortal Ulyssian with TMA and Sorcery would probably have a good shot, just because of his "Magus Killed turned up to 11" ability to strike from any angle.
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Well, every servant is heavily nerfed in a grail war canonically ;)

Prana + servant class limitations. Actual heroic spirits are preeeeeetty friggin scary.
 
[X] Subduer of the Wyld
[X] Apex Flight
[X] Blade of the Battle Maiden
[X] Petals of the Rose
 
[X] Subduer of the Wyld
[X] Apex Flight
[X] Blade of the Battle Maiden
[X] Petals of the Rose

Salient points. If we can accrue the self-augmentation benefits of Sorcery by the simple expedient of threatening other people into doing the Workings for us, then we retain the same heights of power even if we focus on Lealope. Also, with diminished fidelity of reincarnation, there is a higher chance of Ulyssian distinguishing himself from Odyssial and being free to pursue his own relationships, while we still get to experience a poignant and intimate dynamic with Lealope in the Age of Dreams. Yes, I can live with this.
 
Personally, I prefer Sorcery to Wyld or Battlemaiden, though I'd take any over Petals. Sorcery gives root level access to reality, and is thematically suited for our "Above all" stuff. We hated the Primordials so much that we stole their right to control reality. Also, if we prevent the Wracking it isn't necessarily incredibly dangerous to us, as we'll likely have at least one Elder Gold-faction member surviving who liked Ody. Seriously, Solar Workings can change the metaphysics of the entire setting, and Ody has done multiple to augment himself. Do you trust other people to be as good at Sorcery as Ody?

Cavalier said:
It's fucking Exalted.
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And yet people don't want Ody to be a First Age Solar. I wonder how that works.
 
Menwearpink said:
Well, every servant is heavily nerfed in a grail war canonically ;)

Prana + servant class limitations. Actual heroic spirits are preeeeeetty friggin scary.
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A prana limitation does nothing to stop hypercompetence, though. If he gets actual maximum Excellency use and War / Lore / Bureaucracy planning charms, that's just unfair.

Servants are very strong, I know their high end feats well. But they would literally be nothing more than a speck against full power Odyssial or even grail-nerfed Odyssial if he's a Solar. It's just not remotely fair. The Grail is more than powerful enough to make defense as strong as Avalon and offense as strong as Ea, so it's more than powerful enough to manifest Odyssial at a level strong enough to solo the setting. Assuming he doesn't figure out an exploit and spontaneously regenerate his original power level via World Egg Inversion or something.
 
Alectai said:
I'm not doing it for "Close to Lealope" I'm doing it because "Insane Elder Lunar = Pain"
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Yeah I know, but a sane affectionate elder lunar that still loves Odyssial, will mean that she will in turn develop a close relationship with Ullysian, since she pretty much centered her entire being on loving Odyssial, who is supposed to be Ulyssian's past life.

Cavalier said:
It's fucking Exalted.
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Oh, I know that, I was simply asking what the reactions would be of the people participating here, since in many cases I have seen, a threesome with one being an Elder Lunar will be a major thing to balance out, and I don't want to devote so much on keeping Lealope close to Odyssial and then just abandoned by Ulyssian, and am in turn unwilling to break it off with Empty Moon.


Also, changed my vote:
[X] Sorcerer of the Adamant Circle
[X] Apex Flight
[X] The Blade of the Battle-Maiden
[X] Petals of the Rose
 
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