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Even Further Beyond [Complete]

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Shard said:
Lemme see, Vault at FB...

Hab 7
Acc 3
Size 5
Sec 2
Sign 7
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You'd probably want to go

Hab 5
Acc 2
Realm 7
Size 5
Sec 5

And let your Artifact raise the Size / Sec / Realm stats. That gets you almost everything you want - Monster spawning, Fate resistance (Sec), and enough space to put a small Empire. Low Acc means it'll still be hard to convince the Empire to actually enter your Vault, of course.

Or you could just not spend BP here and save up for an undiscounted EFB! Not even the Truth can replicate the benefits of an EFB Dao, after all.
 
[X] Vault of the Ur-Pharaoh
-[X] Go Further Beyond
[X] Journey to the West

Tentative. FB Vault is fantastic, and all of the arguments since the last update still apply. I'm not really a fan of Beyond Palimpsest, but whatever is hiding behind the "spiritual presence" is interesting. For the golem, I don't particularly want a new minion, but living armor could be alright.

For the adventure, I'm inclined to go save the elves. The focus on Earth is weirding me out a bit. Get the greatest minds of Earth to help us work our a Dao? Surely the greatest minds of the Labyrinth would be more useful in every conceivable way for that? Iunno, but I'm gonna ignore that and focus on the elves and the other isekai person.
 
A sudden thought - What were the Daos the Black Ravens have? Might give us a guideline on what not to select.
 
Projectile said:
For the adventure, I'm inclined to go save the elves. The focus on Earth is weirding me out a bit. Get the greatest minds of Earth to help us work our a Dao? Surely the greatest minds of the Labyrinth would be more useful in every conceivable way for that?
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Why do you believe that? They've had civilization since the Diagram Nations were founded and yet they still haven't invented the Internet!

Shard said:
Actually, does fighting monsters count as Adventuring for purposes of Deliberation MM drip?
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It depends, but it can if the monsters are dangerous and novel enough.
 
Palimpsest for 2 BP with Form of Balance alone lets us
  • get a 0.5 Stage bonus that stacks with everything else
  • get a multiplier to cultivation speed
  • get a moderate bonus to all physical actions which stacks with buff of Fated Overlord to all Physical actions​
That's like the weakest form with two BP. Others only get better. We can remove the Kong-contamination, making him unable to read our mind.
 
[X] Tomb of the Netherine
[X] Vault of the Ur-Pharaoh

First of all, these are close to my school colors which is fun.
More pertinently, while I would prefer to be more prepared for the Tomb, I suspect putting it off will mean not doing it, and so I feel we ought to take the risk. Xiaoling can party and Suizhen can train and both will cultivate; this will have to suffice for the time we are within.
Concerning the spells, I'm wowed by several of the available options but Kong Zang is waiting and time is burning so I must opt for the esoteric capabilities of the Monster Vault. That flesh diagram is seductive though.

Also calling it now: Kong Zang has been to the Tomb before, but was not able to claim more than half its real bounty.
 
[X] Journey to the West
[X] Palimpsest of the Nameless One
-[X] Form of Balance
-[X] Go Further Beyond

But who will be our Sun Wukong?!
 
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[X] Journey to the West
[X] Palimpsest of the Nameless One
-[X] Form of Balance
-[X] Go Further Beyond

Oh man, our own diagram, and it has an EFB? Naming something after how Nameless we are? That is the height of irony right there. A man with no name naming something after themselves.
 
Rihaku said:
Why do you believe that? They've had civilization since the Diagram Nations were founded and yet they still haven't invented the Internet!
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Psh. The Earthlings have been civilized for ten thousand years and haven't produced a single Ego Barrier cultivator.

Unless you're suggesting that Nameless should create a Dao of the Internet? Instead of Kong's infinite inner world, Nameless's would be distributed into a bunch of other inner worlds that communicate with each other?

That sounds totally rad, actually, but I'm not sure we have time to create an Internet Sect.
 
[X] Tomb of the Netherine
[X] Vault of the Ur-Pharaoh

We need this power yesterday. The elves will keep until then
 
George said:
Concerning the spells, I'm wowed by several of the available options but Kong Zang is waiting and time is burning so I must opt for the esoteric capabilities of the Monster Vault. That flesh diagram is seductive though.
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The Flesh Diagram means he can't read our mind, and possibly do worse once he's out of his cocoon. We can grab Truth and then remove the weakness we input in our body.

Plus, it gives us hilarious levels of combat buffs at EFB.

Rozencrantz said:
We need this power yesterday. The elves will keep until then
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Palimpsest is much superior for personal power, if you want that. Vault is a utility thing mainly.
 
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We don't need to spend the 2BP to Go Further Beyond now for this inscribed Diagram, as I understand it. So saving Beyond Points is probably worthwhile, whatever is chosen.
 
My initial reaction to the spells is:

Pick standard Vault now as we can improve it later, reseach the FB version of the Palimpsest of the Nameless One later.

Will think more about this before voting.
 
Rask said:
Pick standard Vault now as we can improve it later, reseach the FB version of the Palimpsest of the Nameless One later.
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We ideally want EFB Palimpsest - it lets us remove the Eyes of Kong, so Kong Zang can't read our mind at will. It also lets us fight three stages above our level. No other EFB had such a big combat boost. Along with other benefits like Blood Sign spellspam.
 
Projectile said:
Psh. The Earthlings have been civilized for ten thousand years and haven't produced a single Ego Barrier cultivator.
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The physics of Earth do not contain Thriesis flowers! To get a sense of a civilization's intellectual advancement, one should look at what they have produced with their minds alone, in the context of their metaphysics.

VNodosaurus said:
We don't need to spend the 2BP to Go Further Beyond now for this inscribed Diagram, as I understand it. So saving Beyond Points is probably worthwhile, whatever is chosen.
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Yup, especially if you're going for Palimpsest (its FB is weakened due to your being a Lich, though its EFB solves this). Vault and Protector both have functions that may benefit your Cultivation speed if you take them now, though you'd be trading off BPs that you could potentially use to go EFB for your Dao - or some other undiscounted EFB.
 
[X] Palimpsest of the Nameless One
-[X] Form of the Elder Beast

I'm going with Form of the Elder Beast because it give us a 120% cultivation accelerator, vs 40% for Form of Balance. It does give us a minor penalty to complex physical actions, but I'm not sure we actually need those.
 
Since we are now always cultivating it seems like a good idea to grab Palimpsest now so we can get that 120% increase in cultivation speed.

We shouldn't drop any BP on it though since we can do that later.
 
Rihaku said:
You'd probably want to go

Hab 5
Acc 2
Realm 7
Size 5
Sec 5

And let your Artifact raise the Size / Sec / Realm stats. That gets you almost everything you want - Monster spawning, Fate resistance (Sec), and enough space to put a small Empire. Low Acc means it'll still be hard to convince the Empire to actually enter your Vault, of course.

Or you could just not spend BP here and save up for an undiscounted EFB! Not even the Truth can replicate the benefits of an EFB Dao, after all.
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Seems greedy to me! Why keep both paths open with a Fate-resistant Vault when every vote can serve as a referendum on Kong Zang vs the Fates? If we go with
Hab 7
Acc 3
Realm 7
Size 5
Sec 2
Then we can optimize for Monster quality and enjoy the benefits of Fate's assistance with our progression simultaneously!
 
[X] Journey to the West
[X] Palimpsest of the Nameless One
-[X] Form of Balance

Once we invest in this, it'll become excellent. I revoke all my previous words on Beyond Cultivation- this is everything I wanted. We get the superior combat AI of the Sword when we get it's EFB and three stage fightin' increase. Screw beyond Cultivation, this is where it's at.
 
[X] Journey to the West
[X] Vault of the Ur-Pharaoh

Let's save using the BP until later, I really want a EFB Dao.
Especially if it is a Dao of Humanity.
 
Interesting, I thought Elvegekere's Protector was an Essence Diagram:
Rihaku said:
Elvegekere's Protector, Haltsuphrect's Tenfold Plagues, Baenlixnaire's Vicissitude - all the most fearsome secrets of the Diagram lie within the Sign of Essence.
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[X] Tomb of the Netherine
[X] Vault of the Ur-Pharaoh
-[X] Go Further Beyond

Anyway, Tomb of the Netherine is everything I wanted out of Southern Vane in the first place. The secrets of past Ages, hidden lore, uncertain risks and equally mysterious rewards. Its contents could be outside Kong Zang's world-spanning calculations. Cursebearer was appealing in part because it allowed us to overturn Divine tyranny; this might let us defy the predictions of someone whose intellect has weighed and measured the entirety of creation. If we fight for all those who have come before, it's only fitting that we should seek their strength. Also, it uses the same hex code as Throne of Stars. If you need a reason to pass up Journey to the West and its focus on Earth, I refer you to Nameless' own thoughts:
Rihaku said:
A miserable existence, but that was the past, and he was never, ever going back.
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