- Location
- Sydney
[X] Book of Ebon
Black Kingdom Rising - Anime Villain Quest [CK2 Quest]
- Thread starter shibosho
- Start date
- Superhero
Been lurking (on this quest and the evil minion quest) but thought I'd share my thoughts
For those debating on going for shinies or "ease" of getting one of the keys this handy dandy guide by the QM should be kept in mind.
For something like life energy for the Mantle as an example 10,000 people would be about 5,000,000 LE, however note even draining 10 life energy can make a person feel winded. At the current base of 40 shadows that means at most they can hold is 2000 life energy per outing (not sure how many they can do in a week). Assuming a shadow is able to drain at least 1-5 LE per person and do about 3 full returns a day that would result in potentially 6,000 LE per day or about 42k a week (assuming again no increase in the number of shadows and assuming LE returns to a person at a fairly fast rate when its a tiny-ish amount being drained). So in about 17 weeks the players would have 5 million LE. This in turn would be sped up faster by spending ebon power. Well that is unless the QM makes by fiat that it has to be external sources only to make the items.
That said I'm not quite convinced the items are the protag's to use.
For those debating on going for shinies or "ease" of getting one of the keys this handy dandy guide by the QM should be kept in mind.
For something like life energy for the Mantle as an example 10,000 people would be about 5,000,000 LE, however note even draining 10 life energy can make a person feel winded. At the current base of 40 shadows that means at most they can hold is 2000 life energy per outing (not sure how many they can do in a week). Assuming a shadow is able to drain at least 1-5 LE per person and do about 3 full returns a day that would result in potentially 6,000 LE per day or about 42k a week (assuming again no increase in the number of shadows and assuming LE returns to a person at a fairly fast rate when its a tiny-ish amount being drained). So in about 17 weeks the players would have 5 million LE. This in turn would be sped up faster by spending ebon power. Well that is unless the QM makes by fiat that it has to be external sources only to make the items.
That said I'm not quite convinced the items are the protag's to use.
NIghtmareNursery
Scheming Spectator
- Location
- Earth \ AU
My question is what are we using for the battery to hold all of these energies? Unless we're capable of even handling that much power...
*Deep bow* My apologies Shibosho sama. I can offer no excuse for my behavior, nor anger during my request. And my thanks for answering this low one's impertinent demand/request. *Rises*
So... okay, it appears I was wrong about the black sword too, and we can get a head start on it with Ando's ninja conflict without helping Ando's side in any great measure. Though apparently still wouldn't be enough to form the thing, and we apparently need a large array to collect the energy of conflict between warring clans.
The great mantel might not require us to kill anyone but, anyone whom survives getting ki/chi/life drained isn't going to be hopping around anytime soon, so it'd still be make Ando's enemies easier for him to deal with, which is all the reason I need to conclude 'nope' regarding the mantel's construction at this point in the quest, what since the most obvious, and likely not what we think it is, source would be Ninjas because of their usually greater life force. And we don't need to be helping Ando's quest by making it easier for him when we'll have to fight him later. He's too much of a good guy to side with us, and even if we pull off that dark, edgy, good guy act; he'll figure out eventually that we're not a good guy, in both senses.
Ebon Book, still remains the lowest hanging fruit.
We don't know if we need to personally collect hellfire, and heavenly flames to smelt a thousand souls into a crown, and we don't have anything to store souls in till we can conduct the ritual to make it. Sure we can research it, but... yeah... moving on from that bag of wet, angry cats; last is the ever heart. Apparently it was covered before, and I still don't know what we'd need to look for in 7 pure hearts and 7 Evil hearts. So... *shrugs*
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This is one piece of logic I don't quite get... If anything, making his quest easier makes things easier for us when we have to fight him later, since he'll have less experience and be under-prepared for the power levels we can wield. Higher threat levels mean he's likely to be stronger when he's facing us. He's basically guaranteed to win his story eventually what with being a protagonist, but as a protagonist, his power levels are mostly going to be around the level of his opponents, so the bigger gap there is between us and his opponents, the better.
Of course, a faster conclusion to his story also means that he can get more potential training in, but there is a difference between training where there's no real threat and actual combat. If we're assuming that completing his quest gives him super ninja abilities (which has been implied), sure, but that's going to happen whether we want it to or not. Whether it's easier or harder isn't going to make a difference. Would you rather deal with someone with super ninja abilities who has experience with them when lives are on the line, or someone whose only real experience has been using them in safe conditions?
...That being said, the argument can go the other way too, as the more he uses them, the higher the chances we get to see them and make appropriate counters, but I don't think "making things easier" should really make a big deal either way.
It's more an issue of forces vs forces. Yeah, Ando himself will be stronger, but his troops will be fewer. Strong yes, but in this case it'll be an issue of quantity vs quality with his forces vs. ours when we fight him. With him having fewer, higher quality troops, yeah we'll loose a lot of forces facing him, but we'll also have a lot more left over when the battle's done. And as you said, the more we know about how he fights, the better we can counter him. Yes he would be stronger, but he'd be a known quantity that we can confidently face.
As opposed to curb stomping the mighty Ninja Jesus that doesn't have an ounce of experience only to turn and find all his good troops in good to fair condition, and ALL our forces stomped into the ground just like we did Ando. And some of the mooks even still able to fight. We might be strong, but there's no way we could win against two to three clans worth of Chunin, Jonin, and the better than they look Genin by ourselves.
As opposed to curb stomping the mighty Ninja Jesus that doesn't have an ounce of experience only to turn and find all his good troops in good to fair condition, and ALL our forces stomped into the ground just like we did Ando. And some of the mooks even still able to fight. We might be strong, but there's no way we could win against two to three clans worth of Chunin, Jonin, and the better than they look Genin by ourselves.
- Location
- Earth: Universe Meta - 1
Ladies, Gentlemen, others. You're making a horrible assumption. One that's probably correct, but you still shouldn't make. That we even are going to fight our good friends.
If we ever end up in a situation like that, our first priority should be to, you know, talk to them. Sure, our diplomacy sucks, but explaining why we're doing things is important. Especially if we can justify it by somehow not killing any of the good guys.
Side note. That seven pure souls thing could cause us some serious problems. I'm not just talking PR wise either. I mean, killing an innocent could, potentially, cause some trauma.
If we ever end up in a situation like that, our first priority should be to, you know, talk to them. Sure, our diplomacy sucks, but explaining why we're doing things is important. Especially if we can justify it by somehow not killing any of the good guys.
Side note. That seven pure souls thing could cause us some serious problems. I'm not just talking PR wise either. I mean, killing an innocent could, potentially, cause some trauma.
Considering that the OP said that the con for this path that we chose was that one of our good friends was a hero of the light reborn. I'm going to go out on a limb here and guess that they're going to decry "Villain!" and the other two are going to listen, and ignore anything else other than "We were asked to serve him." Even if we lead with "He asked me to save him. To save him from the oblivion that the last so called hero cosigned him to with his defeat." All they're going to hear is "I work for the Ebon Emperor, prepare to die."
Keep in mind, that our friends will be, themselves, Shonen protagonists each of their own stories, so they won't be thinking 'grey area' but "Black, white, good, evil. Evil must die."
Would it be nice if we really could talk them out of fighting us, you bet. Should we count on not having to fight them, hell no! This is definitely a case of walking softly, carrying a big stick. Have it, but hope we won't need it, instead of needing it, but not having it just because we thought "Surly we don't need to fear our friends striking us out of fear of the Ebon Emperor." But hey, I just don't think that our friends being known as the good guys triumphing over us is the good end, but what do I know? It's not like Shonen manga never let the bad guy win; oh wait, they don't.
I can see your point however...
Ninjas = No way either side hasn't done anything unethical [Grey]
Company Magical Girl = Considering what type of magical girls there based on...yeah [Grey]
Exorcist = All exorcists shows have heroes making tough calls [Grey]
Yokai Magical Girl = I give you that one [White]
Even if im wrong there shonen protagonists obvious here going to try to redeem us.
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- Location
- Voidbetweenstars
Which still means beating us not siding with us.
Its better than calling us a villain and trying to kill us, plus they have been friends for years, I doubt they would go against him that easily even if they dont believe his story and think he's being influenced. Plus If we help our friends(aka protagonists) and their factions enough then our chances will be far better.
- Location
- Voidbetweenstars
Unless of course they all believe he willing betrayed them and was simply moving to set them all up for himself, after all it is not that hard to point our that we were simply getting rid of rivals.
True, however do you really expect anybody to believe that Jacob decided as a kid to make friends with future heroes for his future evil plan. This is disregarding the fact that his parents were likely heroes themselves and somehow didn't notice their son was 'evil'. Plus im pretty sure they have some way to tell if he's lying or not, a potion, spell, genjutsu...anything.
Also the likelihood of him knowing that all of his best friends would become heroes is small to say the least especially considering they didn't know themselves(im guessing). Also what makes them think hes betraying them unless Jacob does something that directly or indirectly harms his friends then I dont see how its betrayal, it just happens to be convenient.
Im pretty sure he'll just end up looking like a Noble Demon to a lot of people.
Or at the very least misguided, which...might be true.
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Derek58
Rocket Punch is Best Punch
- Location
- Getter Valhalla
Vote Tally : Superhero - Black Kingdom Rising - Anime Villain Quest [CK2 Quest] | Page 63 | Sufficient Velocity [Posts: 1560-1684]
##### NetTally 1.9.7
[X] Book of Ebon
No. of Votes: 31
Master Basher
Basarin
Blonddude42
Chrestomanci
EmperorArthur
Enso
Icefyre
Olgol2
pkong
PurposefulZephyr
ReaperofInterest
Timaeus
Void Traveler
zxzx24
ComradeH
Aiden
bioticgrunt
DaLintyGuy
Derek58
Dylan Bailey
Happerry
NIghtmareNursery
PsyFarrow
taovkool
TwistedJester
WCSII
Pred1059
Naron
Omergosh
Twiggierjet
bryanfran36
[X] The Ever-Heart - The Kingdom's Heart, that which binds the hearts of all who follow the Ebon Emperor together as one. As long as power flows through the Ever-Heart, none who follow the Black King shall be found wanting in strength, both mind, body, and soul. Seven souls of pure light and seven souls of pure darkness must become one to start the beating of the Black Kingdom's Heart
No. of Votes: 15
giodan
archangis
Dragonjackel
frozenchicken
hcvquizibo
Hikari
Lalzparty
Muramasa
PyrrosWarrior
Raven's Requiem
the swarm
tri2
veekie
buli-buli
Speed53066
[X] The Black Sword - The symbol of violence and war. Violence is life's most primal force, an eternal force that will never disappear as long as life exists. Violence for the sake of others. Violence for the sake of one's self. Violence for the sake of Violence. All becomes fuel for the might of the Black Kingdom. The vehemic energy of a city at war with itself would bring forth the sword of the Black King.
No. of Votes: 11
Cybandeath
ebolasos
HorizonWanderer
Karugus
Marlin
Raptor580
reborn214
SpeckofStardust
Random Member
Larekko12
mastigos
[X] The Soul Crown - The symbol of the Ebon Emperor's rulership over all things that live and die in this world, the crown that grants dominion over the powers of life and death, such is the Soul Crown. The soul essence that binds together the structure of a thousand souls, melted down and forged by the flames of heaven and hell to craft this piece of the Black King's regalia. The Living and the Dead must pay their due to the Black King.
No. of Votes: 7
Khepri14
Deathbybunnies
Erehwon
ShadowNic94
Tel Janin Aman
Camellia
Umi-san
[x] The Grand Mantle
No. of Votes: 1
Yeangst
Total No. of Voters: 65
##### NetTally 1.9.7
[X] Book of Ebon
No. of Votes: 31
Master Basher
Basarin
Blonddude42
Chrestomanci
EmperorArthur
Enso
Icefyre
Olgol2
pkong
PurposefulZephyr
ReaperofInterest
Timaeus
Void Traveler
zxzx24
ComradeH
Aiden
bioticgrunt
DaLintyGuy
Derek58
Dylan Bailey
Happerry
NIghtmareNursery
PsyFarrow
taovkool
TwistedJester
WCSII
Pred1059
Naron
Omergosh
Twiggierjet
bryanfran36
[X] The Ever-Heart - The Kingdom's Heart, that which binds the hearts of all who follow the Ebon Emperor together as one. As long as power flows through the Ever-Heart, none who follow the Black King shall be found wanting in strength, both mind, body, and soul. Seven souls of pure light and seven souls of pure darkness must become one to start the beating of the Black Kingdom's Heart
No. of Votes: 15
giodan
archangis
Dragonjackel
frozenchicken
hcvquizibo
Hikari
Lalzparty
Muramasa
PyrrosWarrior
Raven's Requiem
the swarm
tri2
veekie
buli-buli
Speed53066
[X] The Black Sword - The symbol of violence and war. Violence is life's most primal force, an eternal force that will never disappear as long as life exists. Violence for the sake of others. Violence for the sake of one's self. Violence for the sake of Violence. All becomes fuel for the might of the Black Kingdom. The vehemic energy of a city at war with itself would bring forth the sword of the Black King.
No. of Votes: 11
Cybandeath
ebolasos
HorizonWanderer
Karugus
Marlin
Raptor580
reborn214
SpeckofStardust
Random Member
Larekko12
mastigos
[X] The Soul Crown - The symbol of the Ebon Emperor's rulership over all things that live and die in this world, the crown that grants dominion over the powers of life and death, such is the Soul Crown. The soul essence that binds together the structure of a thousand souls, melted down and forged by the flames of heaven and hell to craft this piece of the Black King's regalia. The Living and the Dead must pay their due to the Black King.
No. of Votes: 7
Khepri14
Deathbybunnies
Erehwon
ShadowNic94
Tel Janin Aman
Camellia
Umi-san
[x] The Grand Mantle
No. of Votes: 1
Yeangst
Total No. of Voters: 65
Book of Ebon has a huge lead.
meganeshounen
*tips glasses*
- Location
- Far East Asia
I suppose because we can farm the Magic Cores off Witches and the like?
Unlike the other objects that require beings of certain "alignments", the Book isn't specific on that.
It only requires pure magic.
Unlike the other objects that require beings of certain "alignments", the Book isn't specific on that.
It only requires pure magic.
reborn214
Deep in thought
- Location
- California
life energy also has no morality requirement, and our MC has no problems murdering evil people I.e rapist and ninja head's minions rapist minions.
- Location
- I think somewhere. I might be nowhere though
Man I wanted to form Kingdom Hearts 
chocolote12
A Penguin Flailing Against The Keyboard Of Life.
Everybody has magic. Including bad guys. It's just a collection goal that we've already undertaken the steps to begin to reach.
It's more that the high level of demand, the fact that quality matters, and the fact that draining once for the book of ebon means we won't be able to do that again to that person for an unknown (but indicated to be long) amount of time means that we're going to be hard pressed to complete it if we don't become every magic user's bogeyman for a while. None of these are easy, and draining normal people isn't going to work very well in the case of the Book of Ebon. 1111 pages does not mean that we just need 1111 people. What if a single ordinary person is a paragraph at best?
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Daniella_c2
Commie Ice fairy
- Pronouns
- She/Her
[X] Book of Ebon
@shibosho just wanted to ask for a quick clarification. With regards to the keys to the black kingdom, can they be used by the protag or are they just goal items? The reason I ask is I've seen in other quests (and hell even in games) where a player assumes they will be able to use this awesome item only to find out they can't interact with it and if they had known it earlier they would have changed their actions.
shibosho
The Face of Procrastination
- Location
- The Land of Oz
Oh, the player can use them. However, the nature of the Kingdom Key is more than just some powerful object. Remake one and you'll see. Here's a hint. Think carefully on what happened when the Book of Darkness, what the Book of Ebon based off of, was completed in Nanoha.