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Aes Sedai Quest [Wheel of Time]

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Hmm. I don't think making a scene or getting loud is the way to go. She isn't directly suicidal now, and I don't like to betray whatever little trust she has for us.

[X] Grab hold of her, ask if you have caused harm. If any of the Aes Sedai, Accepted and Novices she has seen so far been known to cause harm. If she had caused harm.
-[X] Point out to her that she doesn't have to make that decision, to choose if she has to live or die, yet. She can wait, and watch the other Aes Sedai to see for herself if they really are causing harm, if they really are as bad as she thinks they are.
-[X] Also argue that the One Power and the Aes Sedai are created by the Creator too. Why would he create something that is an abomination to Him?

A little unsure about this, which is mainly a modified version of @veekie's vote. What I'm trying to do is get her to look around her, and get her to question what she has been told. Ever since she was little she has been told Aes Sedai are irredemable monsters or madwomen, it's clear this is not true, if she is willing to accept it.

I admit that basically saying "you don't have to kill yourself now, you can do it later if you still want" is a desperate measure that may backfire. However, I think (and hope) she still wants to live, on some level. She somehow survived this far, so its clear she didn't follow her own advice when she found out she could Channel. A lot of suicidal people don't really want to die, at least most of the time. She might be looking for any justification or excuse for not going through with it.

The last bit about the Creator is one argument I think could work, she seems to be a religious person. It's an argument I'm surprised nobody used in canon. It might backfire though, if she has been told the Dark One or something like it is really responsible for the One Power. But if I don't remember wrong the Dark One is mostly a myth at this point, and the Whitecloaks believe the Creator to be all-powerful. (Ironically, they might be right about this since the last book reveals the Dark One actually never had or will have a chance of winning, ever.)

As I've said, I'm a little unsure about this. Does anyone have any thoughts? Any better ideas?
 
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I'm not really enthused about having to write-in our way through this entire encounter. @Choo Choo couldn't we just give a general approach to the conversation and you take it to its conclusion? I'm not sure what the benefit is for players to pick the exact wording for why Lucia doesn't think the One Power is evil. Do you feel like this is character-establishing in some fundamental way?
 
Honestly, I think the best thing is to point out that even if she does think that suicide is the only surefire way...well, it self-evidently is never going to happen. The Children of Light have been at this for how long now? How much success have they found in purging the world of channelers? Nobody is ever going to ensure that all of the channelers die. The only reasonable solution is to make sure that they can control their gifts.
 
PoptartProdigy said:
Honestly, I think the best thing is to point out that even if she does think that suicide is the only surefire way...well, it self-evidently is never going to happen. The Children of Light have been at this for how long now? How much success have they found in purging the world of channelers? Nobody is ever going to ensure that all of the channelers die. The only reasonable solution is to make sure that they can control their gifts.
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There is evidence actually, the numbers of Aes Sedai have visibly and clearly been in decline...though the Whitecloaks take credit, it's really the Aes Sedai's increasingly ivory tower(heh) isolationist stance that caused it.
 
While there may be a true decline, there are also many more channelers that don't find their way to the White Tower than the Aes Sedai assume.
 
PoptartProdigy said:
I thought that wasn't public knowledge for most, though.
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People have eyes to see. There just aren't as many Aes Sedai around anymore as there used to be.

Romv said:
While there may be a true decline, there are also many more channelers that don't find their way to the White Tower than the Aes Sedai assume.
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Yes.
But Whitecloaks simply notice that there are less Aes Sedai than there used to be so it has to be their work!
Otherwise everything they had done would be pointless and the Light would never allow that!
 
Briefvoice said:
I'm not really enthused about having to write-in our way through this entire encounter. @Choo Choo couldn't we just give a general approach to the conversation and you take it to its conclusion? I'm not sure what the benefit is for players to pick the exact wording for why Lucia doesn't think the One Power is evil. Do you feel like this is character-establishing in some fundamental way?
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It is absolutely character-establishing, and I will continue to use write-ins for social interactions in the future. For trivial dialogue and situations I'm obviously not going to ask you to dictate every word she says, nor have I, but for a situation as delicate as this I have no wish to influence or limit options. If I wanted that, this would be a fanfic. :)
 
Just to recap, how much does lucia know about the dark one getting sealed by men? Because as terrible as men going mad was, the dark one being free would have been worse.

She need not know that humans unsealed the dark one in the first place.
 
PoptartProdigy said:
Honestly, I think the best thing is to point out that even if she does think that suicide is the only surefire way...well, it self-evidently is never going to happen. The Children of Light have been at this for how long now? How much success have they found in purging the world of channelers? Nobody is ever going to ensure that all of the channelers die. The only reasonable solution is to make sure that they can control their gifts.
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Yeah. That's what i was saying.

[X] PoptartProdigy

Now feel the obligation to make it exist
 
fractalman said:
Just to recap, how much does lucia know about the dark one getting sealed by men? Because as terrible as men going mad was, the dark one being free would have been worse.

She need not know that humans unsealed the dark one in the first place.
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It's common knowledge that Lews Therin and the Hundred Companions sealed away the Dark One, and that this allowed saidin to be tainted. Opinions differ on whether this meant that saidar was luckily spared, and that the world would have Broken beyond repair with all channelers mad, or if the lack of saidar was the reason it didn't fully work and that saidin wouldn't have been tainted if female channelers were presented. The Aes Sedai of today will of course say that not going along was the right decision to make.
 
redzonejoe said:
Yeah. That's what i was saying.

[X] PoptartProdigy

Now feel the obligation to make it exist
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aaaaaaaaawhyyoudothistome ;)

Okay, here's my stab.

[X] State this firmly -- not aggressively, but assertively.
-[X] Tell her that that's not going to happen. You want to live. Every Novice wants to live. Every Accepted. Every Aes Sedai. Every one of them will fight to live. It will do nobody any good to kill yourself, because there will still be all those women, living. So you're going to learn to control this, and make sure that you do right by the world. You're going to do the only thing you can do to ensure that the Power isn't misused -- you're going to use it well, support your sisters and make sure they do the same, and you're going to be a good person.

Thoughts?
 
I say it works.

[X] State this firmly -- not aggressively, but assertively.
-[X] Tell her that that's not going to happen. You want to live. Every Novice wants to live. Every Accepted. Every Aes Sedai. Every one of them will fight to live. It will do nobody any good to kill yourself, because there will still be all those women, living. So you're going to learn to control this, and make sure that you do right by the world. You're going to do the only thing you can do to ensure that the Power isn't misused -- you're going to use it well, support your sisters and make sure they do the same, and you're going to be a good person.
 
Yeah that seems to be the most reasonable way to go about it.

[X] State this firmly -- not aggressively, but assertively.
-[X] Tell her that that's not going to happen. You want to live. Every Novice wants to live. Every Accepted. Every Aes Sedai. Every one of them will fight to live. It will do nobody any good to kill yourself, because there will still be all those women, living. So you're going to learn to control this, and make sure that you do right by the world. You're going to do the only thing you can do to ensure that the Power isn't misused -- you're going to use it well, support your sisters and make sure they do the same, and you're going to be a good person.
 
[X] State this firmly -- not aggressively, but assertively.
-[X] Tell her that that's not going to happen. You want to live. Every Novice wants to live. Every Accepted. Every Aes Sedai. Every one of them will fight to live. It will do nobody any good to kill yourself, because there will still be all those women, living. So you're going to learn to control this, and make sure that you do right by the world. You're going to do the only thing you can do to ensure that the Power isn't misused -- you're going to use it well, support your sisters and make sure they do the same, and you're going to be a good person.
 
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Magosophobia, 5
  • Threadmarks
    • You hold her eyes and shake your head, slow and definite. "That will never happen," you say. The very thought of all the women of the White Tower agreeing to kill themselves is stark, raving mad. Of course, there are better ways to put that. "I want to live, Ellyne. Every Novice, they do be wanting to live. Every Accepted. Every Aes Sedai, the Amyrlin, all of them. They will fight for their lives, if they do be threatened." You picture Ellyne going up to Tamra Ospenya suggesting that she join in a suicide pact, and the mental image is every bit as ridiculous as one might think.

    "I know." Ellyne looks away again. You can see her throat working as she swallows. "I know I cannot make anyone agree with me, I cannot make you see the truth. But I still have a choice-"

    "And what good do you be thinking that killing yourself will accomplish, hmm?" you cut in. You don't want to let her finish that sentence. "I will be alive. Every other channeling woman will still be alive."

    Ellyne curls into herself, wrapping her arms around her knees. "It is the only thing I can do," she whispers.

    "No." You put a tentative hand on her shoulder. To your cautious relief, she doesn't pull away. "You can live. You will live, and you will learn to control the One Power - and you will do the right thing, by the world. You will use the Power, and you will no misuse it. The rest of us, you will make certain that we do no misuse it either. You will watch that we do no, and you will help us." You put your free hand on her other shoulder, gently turning her to face you. "Ellyne, you do be a good person, by the Light."

    "So it's just... that easy?" She looks up at you again. Her eyes are full of tears, but she looks more angry than sad. "Just throw away everything I have ever been taught and embrace the heresy?"

    "The Aes Sedai, they do no be going away anytime soon," you say. "And, knowing the Aes Sedai, do you think anyone but an Aes Sedai be able to hold them accountable for their mistakes, if they did overstep?"

    She shakes her head after a long pause.

    "Do no throw your life away, Ellyne. Please." You smile at her, the most encouraging smile you can muster. She doesn't return the smile, but the anger has bled out of her face. "You do bring an important perspective, I do think." It could do with a little less inclination towards forming a suicide cult, but you're taking one thing at a time, here. "It do be valuable, and it would be a shame to lose it."

    Ellyne is silent, staring at you with an expression you can't read for all the conflicting emotions on her face. Your hands tremble with her. "... I should go," she says after a few eternal seconds, her voice so quiet that you can barely hear her. "I should- I should go and find Accepted Elin. She must be looking for me."

    You breathe an inward sigh of relief, covering for it by standing up and smoothing down your skirts. "I will go with you," you say, and offer her a hand up.

    After a moment's hesitation, she takes it.
    ​
    [OPTION SELECT]​
    [] Spend more time with... (pick 3 - she'll spend time with all of them, but to greater or lesser degree)
    -[] Rielin
    -[] Tiravia
    -[] Ninea
    -[] Addrie
    -[] Janna
    -[] Nacelle
    -[] Kiyoshi
    -[] Marissa
    -[] Ellyne
    -[] Try to befriend someone else
    --[] Amarya

    [] Focus your studying on... (pick 2 - she'll cover all of this, of course, but to greater or lesser degree)
    -[] History
    -[] Law
    -[] Diplomacy and etiquette
    -[] Mathematics
    -[] Geography
    -[] Sciences
    -[] Philosophy

    [] Extracurricular activities and hobbies (pick 2)
    -[] Music
    --[] Harp, flute, or vocals
    -[] Cooking
    -[] Gardening
    -[] Sewing
    -[] Reading circle
    -[] Continue swordwork
    --[] Resume teaching Janna

    ~

    Time for another big timeskip. You know the drill!
     
  • Threadmarks
    • [X] Spend more time with... (pick 3 - she'll spend time with all of them, but to greater or lesser degree)
    -[x] Rielin
    -[x] Kiyoshi
    -[x] Ellyne
    [X] Focus your studying on... (pick 2 - she'll cover all of this, of course, but to greater or lesser degree)
    -[x] Diplomacy and etiquette
    -[x] Philosophy
    [X] Extracurricular activities and hobbies (pick 2)
    -[x] Gardening
    -[x] Continue swordwork
    --[x] Resume teaching Janna
     
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