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Across The Spider-Verse

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I agree with the sentiment that miguel is wrong, but I do think they are going to try and redeem him, cause the trauma

of loosing his daughter, finding a universe where she survived and he died, and then loosing her a second time after replacing his dead version to the universe collapsing with seemingly no explanation

is a perfectly understandable reason to become hard line insistent that it doesn't happen again, and setting up the spider man multiverse crew is a way for him to tell himself that it both wasn't some random tragedy and tell himself that he's doing something about it.

What we see of his second life in the second universe implys he was there for at least a few months, and we don't see the source of the universe collapsing like we do with pavitrs universe. I feel like its entirely likely that alchemax just fucked up and destroyed his universe with the megacollider if it existed in that universe, as by the nature of there being so many experiments that involve tearing holes in space time going on at the many alchemax at least a few of them probably go SUPER BADLY. Heck, I wouldn't be surprised if the reason that the disaster happened in that universe is that the one cause of the collapse is that experiment in every universe they exist, and the local spiderman is meant to stop it. By replacing the dead spiderman and possibly neglecting his job as spiderman, miguel might have missed the obvious danger before it was too late.

Miles being an anomaly caused by one of the experiments resulting in pulling a spider from another dimension, implies that if that hadn't happened his universe may have collapsed due the possibility that his universes spiderman may have died in the collider that day even if he hadn't distracted his peter momentarily. Kingpin had goblin, tombstone, prowler and himself all there in the collider that day, its entirely possible that peter might have died that day either way. I would be way more down with the idea that in universes with alchemax there needs to be a active spiderman to stop them from destroying the universe by accident than the idea that spiderman has to have certain events happen to him or the universe dies
 
nicholasm10 said:
I agree with the sentiment that miguel is wrong, but I do think they are going to try and redeem him, cause the trauma

of loosing his daughter, finding a universe where she survived and he died, and then loosing her a second time after replacing his dead version to the universe collapsing with seemingly no explanation

is a perfectly understandable reason to become hard line insistent that it doesn't happen again, and setting up the spider man multiverse crew is a way for him to tell himself that it both wasn't some random tragedy and tell himself that he's doing something about it.

What we see of his second life in the second universe implys he was there for at least a few months, and we don't see the source of the universe collapsing like we do with pavitrs universe. I feel like its entirely likely that alchemax just fucked up and destroyed his universe with the megacollider if it existed in that universe, as by the nature of there being so many experiments that involve tearing holes in space time going on at the many alchemax at least a few of them probably go SUPER BADLY. Heck, I wouldn't be surprised if the reason that the disaster happened in that universe is that the one cause of the collapse is that experiment in every universe they exist, and the local spiderman is meant to stop it. By replacing the dead spiderman and possibly neglecting his job as spiderman, miguel might have missed the obvious danger before it was too late.

Miles being an anomaly caused by one of the experiments resulting in pulling a spider from another dimension, implies that if that hadn't happened his universe may have collapsed due the possibility that his universes spiderman may have died in the collider that day even if he hadn't distracted his peter momentarily. Kingpin had goblin, tombstone, prowler and himself all there in the collider that day, its entirely possible that peter might have died that day either way. I would be way more down with the idea that in universes with alchemax there needs to be a active spiderman to stop them from destroying the universe by accident than the idea that spiderman has to have certain events happen to him or the universe dies
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This also explains why Indian Spiderman's world started collapsing. It wasn't the canon event, it was the collider
 
Absolutely wonderful movie, I can't recommend it enough. I can't quite call it one of my favourite movies, primarily because it's still got to stick the landing, but it's absolutely amazing how a sequel like this made a perfectly self contained movie feel retroactively incomplete to me. It's also amazing how the movie throws unbelievably good designs at me (Renaissance Vulture my love) and then casually tops them with even more inspired ideas. Hobie as a character and as a design is so good it's legitimately baffling to me that they were able to do so much without the script just physically catching fire from the sheer based energy.
no. said:
Just saw the movie. I had a good time overall, though I have my issues. Mostly, it's a problem that all multiverse-style stories have: the scope is so unfathomable that it's a little hard to care at times. The interpersonal drama of the characters? That was all great. Miles' struggle to find himself and assert his right to live as such? Pretty good, though it does retread the first movie a little. The multiversal Spider-Man army, with their vaguely-defined technology, arbitrary rules and strange worldbuilding? That part lost me. The Spot also sucks. Like I get the idea of elevating this D-lister to world-shaking threat, that's fun. But he has no real relationship to any other character, he's just some guy. A walking plot device and nothing more.
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I can understand being a bit lost by the greater scope problems, yeah. Though I do very much like The Spot as an extension of the metanarrative of Spiderman the franchise chained down by convention, since he's sort of a foil to Miles as the 'deviant' Spiderman by being the 'deviant' villain. He's in universe called out as a villain of the week, as petty, self-obsessed, and incompetent, but he throws the trajectory of the story completely off the rails by defying his role and becoming an absolute monster. He (and I think Miles too? I'll have to rewatch) still retains the faint outline of his joints of a design sketch, literally being unfinished. The fact he has no relation to people is kiiiind of the idea? Though, really, a lot of villains have no relation to the main characters, Spiderverse just lampshades how The Spot has a hilariously shallow grudge against Miles that's really more his fault than anything.

Incidentally, wrt Canon Events, I'm gonna have a hot take that they are actually real, and Pavitr's event being disrupted did cause the issues we see. I don't think Miguel is entirely correct, I think he's misinformed on some crucial details, but I think the delay on his second chance being deleted was for dramatic effect, so he could have a real dark (second) origin story. After all, we absolutely see Miles have something like a canon event, don't we? It's him cradling his uncle in an alleyway as he bleeds out. Though it does diverge a bit. After all, it's not 'great responsibility', it's 'you're on the right path'.

Really though, the main reason I think that canon events are real, and that there's some punishment for averting them, is that for both movies now they've had that opening screen of 'Approved By The Comics Code Authority'. I think that Beyond is going to have Miles meet some greater force that's deciding these canon events for the Spiderverse. And I will be kinda salty if Beyond doesn't start with 'NOT Approved By The Comics Code Authority' or summin'.
BossFight said:
If Spider-Gwen misses a "Canon Event" then the comic can lose readers who came to the comic looking to read the same familiar story. And if too many of them leave then the comic might be cancelled.
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…son of a bitch, 'it's a metaphor for capitalism', Hobie I love you so much.
 
Execute/Dumbo said:
…son of a bitch, 'it's a metaphor for capitalism', Hobie I love you so much.
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The genius of the character of Hobie is that at first glance he looks like your usual caricature of an anarchist rebel that's shown in most big budget stories, while he actually understood everything that's going on and deliberately plays with said caricature to get under everyone's radar. It took me someone else pointing it out for me to realize that him taking away seemingly random bits of tech to customize his jacket was actually how he acquired the pieces to build his own inter-dimensional bracelets right under Miguel's nose.
 
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ElMariachi said:
The genius of the character of Hobie is that at first he looks like your usual caricature of an anarchist rebel that's served in most big budget stories, when he actually understood everything that's going on and deliberately play with said caricature to get under everyone's radar. It took me someone else pointing it out for me to realize that him taking away seemingly random bits of tech to customize his jacket was actually how he acquired the pieces to build his own inter-dimensional bracelets right under Miguel's nose.
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Lmao, I just finished watching the movie a second time and noticed the exact same thing. It's amazing realising what he plays up and what he doesn't, and that underneath the punk rock contrarianism he's one of the most thoughtful and intelligent Spiderpeople in the movie.
 
no. said:
the scope is so unfathomable that it's a little hard to care at times
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I feel like it does the same thing as Everything Everywhere All At Once though: it uses the multiverse for what seems to be a high stakes story, but ultimately is really about a personal story. EEAAO had the multiverse in danger of collapsing, but was actually about family, nihilism, depression, and how to go about each day despite past mistakes and regrets about roads not taken. Similarly, the Spider-Society and the multiverse are only there to tell a story about Miles, about what it means to be Spider-Man/a hero, about people trying to tell him how his life should go, and, ultimately, about wanting to save his dad. Like, the Spot is a danger to the multiverse but it's telling that his goal isn't domination or decimation, but killing someone's loved one.

The multiversal stuff, as in EEAAO, is window dressing, a setting for the actually far smaller story. You shouldn't get distracted by the jargon and mechanics that mostly don't matter to the overall themes, it's a waste of time and missing what the story is actually about.
 
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It got kicked off the top spot this week by the new Transformers movie, but who cares?
variety.com

‘Spider-Man: Across the Spider-Verse’ Surpasses First Film’s Entire Box Office Total After Just 12 Days

After less than two weeks of release, “Spider-Man: Across the Spider-Verse” has surpassed the entire box office run of its predecessor, 2018’s Oscar-winning “Spider-Man: Into the Spider…
variety.com variety.com
Over the weekend, the comic book sequel hit $226 million in North America and $390 million globally. It now stands as Sony's highest-grossing animated release in history. The original film, also a box office winner, tapped out with $190 in North America and $384 million globally.

Despite competition from Paramount's "Transformers: Rise of the Beasts," which opened to $60 million and targets a similar audience of younger males, "Spider-Verse" added $55 million in its second weekend of domestic release, a decline of 55% from its huge $120 million debut.

... Long before "Across the Spider-Verse" even opened in theaters, Sony announced a third installment, "Beyond the Spider-Verse," for 2024.
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In light of the recent bullshittery with the Amazing Spider Man line, this movie was so cathartic to see from a meta perspective.
 
Sumanai said:
Is this the Kamala stuff, or has some other bullshittery happened?

I dropped out of the Marvel comics side a long time ago, but I remain morbidly curious
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Yes and no. I'm specifically talking about all of the BS in the recent line where ASM broke up MJ and Pete again, had him go through another round of needless serialised tragedy and then, keep up the status quo.

In fact, the film questions and grapples down hard on the entire idea of the status quo. Still need about a day to digest my thoughts.
 
My eyeballs have been massaged for two hours.

That said. Alright you fucks.

You brought in Miguel O'Hara.

You brought in Ben Reilly.

Now do it. I fucking dare you.

Not as a background extra.

Front and center. Let him leave his mark.

Bring in Kaine.


 
Third watch, this time with my ma, what struck me this time was how sympathetic Miguel is to Miles. I vaguely recall a tweet about someone working on the movie who said they toned down how villainous Miguel felt, and I'm really glad they did. He makes an honest attempt at connecting with him, tries to minimise how far he's going when Miles refuses ('we'll only keep him there for a few days'), and even when he's at his absolute peak of stress-induced psychosis, it's clear that it's as much guilt and frustration as it is actual dislike for Miles being an anomaly. Him trying to reassure the other Spider-people they're the good guys clearly chokes in his throat a little.
 
When Lyla first appears, one scene has her take a screenshot of Miguel with bunny ears and the other doesn't.
 
Damnit, I suspected that. Until now I wasn't sure if I was just misremembering, but I was shocked on my second viewing to notice Miles' response to Pavitr's rant about Chai being 'I'm sorry' instead of 'no'. It even looked a bit off since the mouthing was kept the same, but I just kinda assumed it was a last minute change after release for whatever reason.
 
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www.theverge.com

Across the Spider-Verse’s animators allegedly worked under unsustainable conditions

In a new report, multiple animators who worked on Spider-Man: Across the Spider-Verse describe Phil Lord’s overreaching, erratic management style as the source of unsustainable working conditions.
www.theverge.com www.theverge.com
... According to a number of artists who contributed to the film, however, the working conditions they were made to operate under during the film's production were unsustainable, erratic, and largely the result of producer Phil Lord frequently overriding Across the Spider-Verse's three directors in order to make endless last-minute changes.

In a rather damning new report from Vulture, four animators who worked directly on Across the Spider-Verse described the project as a grueling professional crucible that drove around 100 of their colleagues to leave before the film was fully finished as those who stayed were "pushed to work more than 11 hours a day, seven days a week" at certain points.

According to the artists, who all spoke out pseudonymously, presumably out of concern for potential retaliation, virtually all of the struggles they dealt with on the film — like long working hours and constant revisions to already-completed shots — could be attributed to Lord's management style. Despite Lord serving as a co-writer and a producer on Across the Spider-Verse, he allegedly demanded final approval of all of the film's shots while his co-writer, fellow producer, and frequent collaborator Chris Miller was mostly absent day to day.

...

Iterative editing processes are common in animation, but the animators speaking out claim that Lord struggles with visualizing 3D animation when it's in its earliest stages, which, when combined with his fondness for making granular changes, led to multiple rounds of edits on work that was already well into the late-stage rendering phase. This potent blend of inefficiency, the animators said, led to things like the way Across the Spider-Verse's production out of Sony Picture Imageworks' Vancouver offices was effectively halted for three months, leaving employees with little to do but sit around and wait, knowing that "an avalanche of work" was coming down the pipeline.
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I've already seen comments that abuse is good actually because the movie was so good. Can't believe we're hearing the same abuse apologia from the video game industry here.
 
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