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A Villain In A World Of Heroes

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Night_stalker said:
Reminds me, we really need to find that git Hero. I'm not spending half the game in the tutorial village.
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First, we need to find some way to make money. We have no source of income beyond whatever gold we stumble upon.

[X] Ignore him, go to your room and pack your stuff.
-[X] Move to the warehouse.

We already established that we have a habit of disappearing. We also don't need to stay here anymore. All we need to do is buy some supplies for the warehouse and we are set to live by our selves.

@Dark Ness Two questions. What is religion like in this world? Can we cook?
 
RandomLurker said:
@Dark Ness Two questions. What is religion like in this world? Can we cook?
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Ploythestic and very varied, there are at least thousands of religions, and lots of regions have their own unique ones. Also, you can cook. Not well, nor anything fancy, but you can make stew or something. Not that you really need to, as long as you have access to raw meat.
 
Dark Ness said:
He doesn't like what the hero did, who would? But, trying to fight against the hero would make him a villian, a fate some consider worse then death. It isn't just that he doesn't have away to get justice, but that he, like almost every sensible person, is very afraid of the consequences of doing so.
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Wait... so even hiring another hero to fight the bad hero would still make someone a villain?

What kind of crapsack world is this?

Makes think of Steelheart and The Reckoners series by Brandon Sanderson.

Maybe we ought to expand our sights to fighting against all heroes... or whatever the heck has inflicted heroes on us.
 
Elder Haman said:
Wait... so even hiring another hero to fight the bad hero would still make someone a villain?
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The definition of what a villain is is really vague. A villain is anyone who "opposes" a hero. They are then cursed by fate to always lose in the end.

That raises the question of, "What does 'oppose' mean?" Does arguing against a hero count as "opposing." Does refusing their romantic advances count? What about playing in a tournament a hero is in? Driving their suppliers into bankruptcy? No one wants to test this because villains have a habit of dying.
 
Dark Ness said:
Maybe, maybe not. But, would you risk it?
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More important question:

Will you allow someone else to risk it and not hinder her? And maybe even give her indirect help by letting her know about possible ways to grow her business, which is only tangentially related to her plan for vengeance which as expressed to you may not even go into villain territory.
 
RandomLurker said:
The definition of what a villain is is really vague. A villain is anyone who "opposes" a hero. They are then cursed by fate to always lose in the end.

That raises the question of, "What does 'oppose' mean?" Does arguing against a hero count as "opposing." Does refusing their romantic advances count? What about playing in a tournament a hero is in? Driving their suppliers into bankruptcy? No one wants to test this because villains have a habit of dying.
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Obviously we need to become the hero for villains everywhere.
 
Elder Haman said:
More important question:

Will you allow someone else to risk it and not hinder her? And maybe even give her indirect help by letting her know about possible ways to grow her business, which is only tangentially related to her plan for vengeance which as expressed to you may not even go into villain territory.
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Maybe? Vote for it and find out. In general, though, when a person finds out that someone else is a villian, they tend to avoid them like the plague. They also warn their loved ones, and then they warn theirs, and so on and so forth. This usually leads to the villian being found out. The reason why most avoid them (besides worrying about being labeled a villain themselves) is that a villain's end can sometimes be catastrophic. (This is just in general, who knows if it applies here?)

You can draw parallels between villains and lepers.
 
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Current tally (not representative of final votes)

Vote tally:
##### 3.21
[X] Well, I can't use those but I know how to use a sword! And I can use magic! I bought a basic spellbook, and I used a spell to hunt. *If he asks, show it to him.*
No. of votes: 1
BBBence1111

[x] Allow the facade to crack, and a certain degree of upset frustration to leak through.
[x] I'm trying! I really am... My home is gone, my family is gone, and.. and I can't stay here forever. If I want my father to be proud of me, to be at peace..
[x] I'm going to be the best! I have some training, but that's not enough to be a master craftsman, and I won't sully his name with some crappy amateur shop.
[x] I figured I could get some books, to learn something from, or learn fighting or magic...
[x] But it just keeps failing! I can't understand all the fancy words in the books, and my fighting skills are horrible, and I nearly got myself killed just trying to use magic to clean up a room!
[x] I'm not going to just end up dead in a ditch, or sold to a.. to.. I can actually take care of myself! Even if I fail, I'm not going to give up!
No. of votes: 1
Kinematics

[x] Thanks, I really appreciate that you care. I promise I will be careful
No. of votes: 1
mrttao

[X] Agree reluctantly and quietly Okay, but let's talk about it later. Whisper, In private.
No. of votes: 1
Elder Haman

[X] Ignore him, go to your room and pack your stuff.
-[X] Move to the warehouse.
No. of votes: 1
RandomLurker

[] Be indignant
-[] "I did get a pelt, I'll show you. But you have to promise not to tell anyone else." Show him the Fenric Pelt.
-[] When he freaks out over the fact that it's not a normal wolf pelt answer: "Well of course, If I want to get heroes to buy from me I can't have ordinary leather, I have to have something special."
-[] If he wants to know how you killed a Fenric wolf, tell him you bought a spell book that has an ice spell. You used it to freeze it's joints so it couldn't move fast, and then you put an icicle through it's eye into it's brain.

I don't see anything too objectionable in this vote (aside from the mentioning of hiring Heroes, which I removed for the purposes of this post). It will almost certainly cause him to be even more concerned about us, but honestly I think that might actually be good for Cedra (having someone who genuinely cares about you is a good thing). We could promise not to go out to the forest again and leave our sword with him or something as a symbol of that promise if we need to. (not like we've been using that thing in town.)

Another vote I didn't think we too bad was mentioning trying to practice summoning magic, and showing him the Scroll of Summon Earth Elemental that we found. We could say we tried to cast it and passed out from the effort, and didn't wake up again until the next morning. Though there is something I would like to ask of Dark Ness in regards to that.

@Dark Ness is it common knowledge what happens to a person if they try to cast a spell that is too far above what their mana reserves can handle (like us and the Summoning spell we found).


edit: I am glad that I am not the only person that thought we should thank Carlo at some point for caring about us.
 
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Night_stalker said:
Now that I think about it.....

Public confrontation work? We get him in the open, call him out on his crimes?
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If you're referring to the Hero, that is unlikely to work unless there is a highly justice-oriented Hero around as well. Remember that as soon as we mentioned a Hero burned down our house/shop, all the concerned people that came to see what happened left.
Dark Ness said:
Snapped out of your shock by his disappearance, you rush over to your father, and quickly grab him while the fire starts to spread through the shop, burning through the wooden walls. You run out of the shop, and you take the time to look at your father. There is a hole burned into his chest he-he-he is dead. Your neighbors come out to watch and one insensitive, stupid, prick asks you "What happened?"

You reply "A hero, a hero did this." and everyone leaves, heading back to tthere homes, and now you are alone with your father's body. "Why, why Dad, why? Why did you have to leave me, why couldn't you live?" you say to him as you hug your father close, and tears fall from your eyes. You let out a wail of grief as you remember all the times you spent together, playing games as a child, talking and laughing over dinner, no matter how great or megar it was, just working together in the shop, and now, now he is gone.
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Dark Ness said:
Unconsciousness if you are lucky, death if not. And yes, this is pretty much common knowledge.
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Thank you.

(I'm unsure how person became perhaps when I wrote that)

Follow-up question: Is the Earth Moving spell we found something that a Novice mage would normally be unable to cast, or is it on a similar level with our ice and fire spells?
 
Thank you for the fast responses.

----

With that known, it might be reasonable to tell him we've been practicing magic and tried to cast a spell that wound up being too much for us. We then fell unconscious and didn't wake up until the next day. Still cause for concern, but we can show him the Earth Elemental summoning spell as to back up the story.

As it stands, this or showing him the pelt are what I'm considering right now. Would appreciate discussion regarding them if anyone has anything to tweak the vote with or can point out any obvious flaws I've missed.

I would very much like to not snub one of the only people that cares about us.
 
Joining now, with a couple questions.
Are there any deities that clearly intervene in the real world? Any that are just vague forces that still give powers? Or none of such?
How rare are heroes among the population? One in a thousand? A million?
How often do they have magical powers and/or artifacts? Do they need to train their skills, or do they just rely on their luck?

I've been thinking, if a little 14-year old girl can acquire that many powers in such little time, there's probably so much untapped stuff that eventually we may be able to sever a hero's connection with their "blessing" instead of facing them on their own terms. From what it looks like, these heroes basically always get a 100 on their rolls, and as long as that is true, well... Imagine if it was us, to get an idea. A super-skilled assassin tries to sneak up on us, we roll a 100, and as per cliché they step on a convenient stick, alerting us with a loud snap, and get killed. A sorcerer summons an army of giant monsters, we keep rolling 100's, they all inexplicably miss us, we get the sorcerer and kill him. And the list goes on. That's why unless we manage to set up the situation well enough that the hero dies even when rolling a 100, facing them directly on their own terms doesn't look like the best idea.

Even more satisfying would be to brutally murder fate, or whatever/whoever is responsible for all this. But that may be a bit of a long term goal. Just a bit...
 
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Arkatekt said:
With that known, it might be reasonable to tell him we've been practicing magic and tried to cast a spell that wound up being too much for us. We then fell unconscious and didn't wake up until the next day. Still cause for concern, but we can show him the Earth Elemental summoning spell as to back up the story.
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Yeah, this is probably the best way to explain it. It gives an adequate reason for our absence, isn't something to be ostracized about, and, if we're lucky, he could decide to help us a bit more by referring us to a friend of his who knows a mage, or a friend of a friend of a friend who is one or something. In short, connections could be had. Maybe.

Hey, @Dark Ness , what's the general population's opinion on mages? Good? Bad? "Wizards, no sense of right and wrong"*?

*Think about owl bears. Wizards made those. And a good section of the D&D monster manual besides. This statement can be very accurate in some settings.
 
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Tentative vote. Critique appreciated.

[] I've been practicing magic, and I tried to cast a spell I found. The next thing I knew it was the next morning and I didn't want to make you mad and getting lost while hunting sounded better than telling you I passed out for most of a day because of I wasn't smart enough to realize my limits...
-[] If he asks for proof, show him our non-spell magic
--[] If he absolutely refuses to believe our story, show Carlo the Earth Elemental Summoning spell scroll.

It will probably need a revision or two, and we may want to think of a place to make up for where we were practicing so we aren't left flailing on that if he asks where we passed out.

Considering adding a demonstration of Sphaera Ignifera or Nova Glaciem before jumping to the earth elemental scroll.

Oh! I forgot we had this. @Dark Ness is sectione ventus at a similar "level" to our other spells? or is it a higher "level" spell? (I'm getting the impression the shorter the incantation, the easier it is in general to cast)
 
Arkatekt said:
Tentative vote. Critique appreciated.

[] I've been practicing magic, and I tried to cast a spell I found. The next thing I knew it was the next morning and I didn't want to make you mad and getting lost while hunting sounded better than telling you I passed out for most of a day because of I wasn't smart enough to realize my limits...
-[] If he asks for proof, show him our non-spell magic
--[] If he absolutely refuses to believe our story, show Carlo the Earth Elemental Summoning spell scroll.

It will probably need a revision or two, and we may want to think of a place to make up for where we were practicing so we aren't left flailing on that if he asks where we passed out.

Considering adding a demonstration of Sphaera Ignifera or Nova Glaciem before jumping to the earth elemental scroll.

Oh! I forgot we had this. @Dark Ness is sectione ventus at a similar "level" to our other spells? or is it a higher "level" spell? (I'm getting the impression the shorter the incantation, the easier it is in general to cast)
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Perhaps just say in an abandoned building? That's sufficiently vague, while still being accurate.
 
chocolote12 said:
Hey, @Dark Ness , what's the general population's opinion on mages? Good? Bad? "Wizards, no sense of right and wrong"*?
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Meh? It really depends on the mage, the type of mage, and the culture of the area. But, in your city, as long as the mage isn't harming people or doing "evil" magic (summoning demons may not be something you want regular people to know about), they don't really care.

Arkatekt said:
Oh! I forgot we had this. @Dark Ness is sectione ventus at a similar "level" to our other spells? or is it a higher "level" spell? (I'm getting the impression the shorter the incantation, the easier it is in general to cast)
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Spells don't really have levels (with the possible exception of summoning spells, and some other types), but it is as easy to cast as your other spells, yes.
 
Kinematics said:
  • Because there's value in allies.
  • Because they're not lies (at least in my proposal).
  • Because figuring out how to spin this has actually given us a reasonable cover goal to work towards.
  • Because there's a very high probability that dismissing him here and now can get us kicked out, or leave him entirely unsympathetic if/when he discovers anything remotely suspicious about us. If she's going to reject his concern now, there's no reason for him to do anything to help her with any sort of cover story if someone (police, underworld, disgruntled merchant, someone whose house we accidentally broke, whatever) comes looking for her. Just generally, if she's going to be an ass about it, he has decades more experience in returning the favor.
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1. I absolutely agree, but webs of lies are a surefire way to lose allies because you will eventually trip up and they will unravel. lies should be simple and not interconnected
2. You admit in your very same post that we already started lying. and the proposals I have seen from others were mostly more lies to cover our previous lies (I don't remember what yours was)
3. You are over thinking it, we spent a day away from home, he suspects us of self destructive behavior like being passed out drunk in a ditch or random sex with stranger rather than demon summoning or what not. He doesn't even know that we went through a blood rite and doesn't believe we went to the forest to hunt because there is no way we could survive there, if we show him the wolf pelt it would drastically change how he views this and us
4. "I promise to be more careful" is not "dismissing him", telling him to "fuck off" or "its none of your business" is dismissing him.
There is nothing abnormal about making such a promise without revealing the details and it shows us actually warming up to him without completely gushing all over the place (which he is unlikely to be believe).

Kinematics said:
If that had been the initial reply, that would have been fine. But since people went with the deception to start with, things are trickier now.
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I disagree, I think that despite our initial deception my choice is an entirely valid response

However, if we have to reveal details to him, why not a cleaned up version of the truth?
[x] I was practicing magic last night and messed up, knocked me out and I ended up sleeping the entire night.

The fact we learned some magic isn't a secret, we learned basic swordmanship and magic in this town after all. And the above is 100% true explanation, it just doesn't detail the broken legs and healing.
 
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Officially casting a vote now. Could probably still be made better.

[X] I've been practicing magic, and I tried to cast a spell I found. The next thing I knew it was the next morning and I didn't want to make you mad and getting lost while hunting sounded better than telling you I passed out for most of a day because I wasn't smart enough to realize it was above my limits...
-[X] If he asks for proof, show him our non-spell magic. If he asks for more show him one of our other spells.
--[X] If he absolutely refuses to believe our story, even after the demonstrations of magic, show Carlo the Earth Elemental Summoning spell scroll.
 
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[X] I've been practicing magic, and Itried to cast a spell I found. The next thing I knew it was the next morningand I didn't want to make you mad and getting lost while hunting sounded better than telling you I passed out for most of a day because I wasn't smart enough to realize it was above mylimits...
-[X] If he asks for proof, show him our non-spell magic. If he asks for more show him one of our other spells.
--[X] If he absolutely refuses to believe our story, even after the demonstrations of magic, show Carlo the Earth Elemental Summoning spell scroll.

Plan plausible is a go.
 
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