A Simple Transaction I
- Thread starter Rihaku
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Fanwork#2139 Words
Reaction: "Thunder of Blood"
I'm no less guilty of that, of course, partially because seeing Hunger develop his own powers is so fascinating, partially because for all his potential power Versch is still an external tool and less reliable than our sword-hand. The Temple is just one such circumstance where he cannot follow us, there will undoubtedly be other situations where we'll be on our own. Too bad our best ability doesn't mesh very well with Verschlengorge, our Blade would be but a toothpick in his hands. Though maybe we could still use it for Ultimate blade winds? Or... can the Blade be temporarily resized? We could bond with Versch over teaching him the wonders of SORDing!
He's awfully expressive for a giant robot, I say. Is it maybe another facet of Rank? Oh my god, does it let people do anime faces?! Maybe that one Microwave picture of Hunger was more spot-on than we ever knew!
I wonder why she's changed her hair color? Maybe it's the equivalent of letting their hair down in her culture? Or Hunger's lecture about having confidence in being herself has finally percolated through her head and had this effect.
Hunger: ...Just who do you take me for?
Letrizia: Someone with an excessively sad backstory!
These people should have colonization down to a science, I think, so the attitude might be entirely normal for these polities. I mean, she's probably at least partially joking, but every joke has a measure of truth in it, and it would be understandable for the developed civilizations to look down on their less advanced neighbors.
It's of note that Versch seems to use Rank in a very different way than we do. Where we focus on imbuing external objects, the Armament has organs that guide Astral Pressure in influencing the world. Were the Foremost, perhaps, believers in the might of Muscle Wizardry?
What an exquisite security mechanism. Even if their programming failed and the Armaments decided that they knew better than all those stupid pilots, they can't properly function without one. Hmm, now I'm thinking whether there's an Armament somewhere out there that rebelled against its Foremost-created purpose and decided to strike out on its own. Maybe it even subverted its mechanisms enough to capture and control its pilot instead of the other way around.
And I suspect we'll need a vacation from our vacation soon enough.
I know that's not what he meant, but sometimes it isn't that difficult to understand why some people would think he's evil.
Curious what those Shroud-derived powers look like, maybe we'll see when we finally get to piloting the fucking robot.
Reaction: "Thunder of Blood"
I wonder what Verschlengorge's blood is actually like physically and if we can research it to improve our own Blood enhancements. He's the culmination of Foremost research on the Cursebearers and should embody the best of their technological and magical knowledge. Frankly, it's a damn shame that it had taken us so long to take a closer look at him, even if there were always distractions and other concerns. We know that Armaments at their full power are so high above us that it would take years at the very least to approach their realms of power, yet we've let this resource languish by the wayside in pursuit of personal power. We haven't piloted him even once!
I'm no less guilty of that, of course, partially because seeing Hunger develop his own powers is so fascinating, partially because for all his potential power Versch is still an external tool and less reliable than our sword-hand. The Temple is just one such circumstance where he cannot follow us, there will undoubtedly be other situations where we'll be on our own. Too bad our best ability doesn't mesh very well with Verschlengorge, our Blade would be but a toothpick in his hands. Though maybe we could still use it for Ultimate blade winds? Or... can the Blade be temporarily resized? We could bond with Versch over teaching him the wonders of SORDing!
No wonder we get along so well with the big guy. We both like eating, sleeping and fighting! We're simple men with simple desires.
He's awfully expressive for a giant robot, I say. Is it maybe another facet of Rank? Oh my god, does it let people do anime faces?! Maybe that one Microwave picture of Hunger was more spot-on than we ever knew!
He might not be a dog, but he's still man's best friend! He carries stuff, he protects us, he can even find his own way out of tough situations. We should teach him fishing.
I wonder why she's changed her hair color? Maybe it's the equivalent of letting their hair down in her culture? Or Hunger's lecture about having confidence in being herself has finally percolated through her head and had this effect.
If I didn't know better, I would suspect that she's having us on. It's little tidbits like this that showcase just how different their society has become after all this time. It's a wonder and testament to the party's social skills that cultural clashes don't occur much more often.
Letrizia: Huh, you're not going to get into a monologue about your pet's tragic death and how it set you on the path of heroism?
Hunger: ...Just who do you take me for?
Letrizia: Someone with an excessively sad backstory!
Ahh, what has the world come to? Abandoning pets in favor of their synthetic equivalents, no wonder the Geas set us the task of conquering the Human Sphere! What next, did people start collecting virtual friends because real ones are too annoying?!
I'm tempted to tell her that in some countries people ate dogs. That'll teach her to look down on our barbaric ways!
These people should have colonization down to a science, I think, so the attitude might be entirely normal for these polities. I mean, she's probably at least partially joking, but every joke has a measure of truth in it, and it would be understandable for the developed civilizations to look down on their less advanced neighbors.
An interesting question: was most Foremost technology rooted in biology? We've only seen a single example in Versch, but it would be funny if the Foremost turned out to be space elves. Hey, maybe we'll still have a chance to pretend that we're an Elf Lord in some Foremost ruins! Hopefully they won't be too angry...
I would say I trust Verschlengorge to lead us towards safety more than I do Hunger's 'heroic' instincts, but he led us straight to the King Fish, who delivered the map that showed the path to the Temple. Not saying it was his fault we were crazy enough to follow through on the bait, of course, but I think our Armament might be more adventurous than people give him credit for!
The Forebear would know. I expect us to discover that sort of EFB among his arsenal any day, as he seemed like a man of culture.
Man, all that tasty technology, just ripe for the picking if we weren't so terrible with research. Maybe fighting alongside Versch would let us understand his internals better and thus steal some interesting features for ourselves?
Versch must have been through a lot. Just how many hands has he been passed through till he ended up with Letrizia, how many civilizations has he seen rise and fall? He might not remember all that much of his perspective is exclusively focused on combat, but I bet there's still some tasty lore hidden within his heads. Information about the Foremost and the Cursebearers might be gated behind mysterious access restrictions, but surely knowledge about civilizations that immediately succeeded the Foremost is not as secured? And from there we might be able to extrapolate some stuff about things we actually want to know.
Yeah, the Foremost sure knew how to design their weapons. When you create an intelligent one, you make sure it actually enjoys its purpose and doesn't rebel against being used as a tool of war. Though this does give me pause, as Letrizia mentioned the Elder Implements were much more than weapons way back when she explained them to us. Maybe they specialized in certain fields of endeavor and Verschlengorge is an example of an Armament that is heavily focused on fighting?
You know, that sounds like a lot of intelligence to grant to something that was supposed to be a tool, emotional intelligence at that. It can feel sympathy, pity, loyalty... is all of that really necessary for an Implement? Or was it an inevitable design decision when creating something of such incredible complexity? The Armaments carry Curses around, and those might refuse to be bound to anything of lesser intelligence.
The Forebear might tell you a thing or two about that. While he had probably started out as a normal human, the determination shown in his myths is pretty impressive. We've already started on that path with Uttermost, maybe we'll understand it even better after getting Cut Through.
...is that the writing system of the Praxis? Holy shit, might we be able to learn the Noble Praxis by studying Verschlengorge's internals?! I don't really know what 'instinctual Cursebearer language' could refer to otherwise, unless there was some other magic the Accursed used to construct his Cursebearer interfaces.
It's of note that Versch seems to use Rank in a very different way than we do. Where we focus on imbuing external objects, the Armament has organs that guide Astral Pressure in influencing the world. Were the Foremost, perhaps, believers in the might of Muscle Wizardry?
Rank, rank, rank. It always comes down to Rank. Can never have enough of it, but we can't really take it on every occasion either. It's some motivation to get that improved Blood Domain Augmentation at least. At least getting to the Ring will probably boost our Rank something fierce, assuming we don't die to the myriad dangers that surround it.
With duct tape, obviously. Something being beyond their technology levels has never stopped people from tinkering with stuff until it worked! And the Foremost presumably made the Armaments robust (and patient) enough that the inevitable ensuing violence when the attempts failed didn't lead to either the Armament or the technicians breaking down. Hell, maybe Versch knew enough to teach them how he's supposed to be repaired! That would be convenient, a tool with an inbuilt repair manual.
Hey, thinking about it, Versch's method of Affliction mitigation seems to be better than ours, assuming it doesn't require dramatically appropriate opponents, just challenging ones. Can't imagine him being stationed anywhere near civilization otherwise. So since we've merged our Curses, if we repair him enough to unlock this option again, can he go off on his own to hunt appropriate targets in order to Mitigate our Curse? That would free up our time for other pursuits.
I wish Hunger wasn't speaking from experience here. Though the question is valid. Long ago we'd assumed that he'd suffered some kind of spirit damage in an ambush or was just starved for energy, but apparently that isn't the case.
Versch: Telling the square-cube law to fuck off ain't easy.
What an exquisite security mechanism. Even if their programming failed and the Armaments decided that they knew better than all those stupid pilots, they can't properly function without one. Hmm, now I'm thinking whether there's an Armament somewhere out there that rebelled against its Foremost-created purpose and decided to strike out on its own. Maybe it even subverted its mechanisms enough to capture and control its pilot instead of the other way around.
Heh, I can just imagine Letrizia with her nose in the air dispensing her knowledge while subconsciously shouting 'Praise me more!'
Yes, it's clearly Letrizia and Gisena that need a vacation, not Hunger. He sure knows how to party unlike those two workaholics! His liver can attest to that.
Vanreir might have crippled our liver, but I think a no less serious wound was the one he dealt to Hunger's conscience. No matter how terrible things were in the last world, he knew he fought for the right thing without a shade of doubt. Even after killing the Tyrant he still tried to improve people's lives, much as the nobility didn't appreciate those efforts. Now? Now he's killing people, sometimes good people, in order to save an inanimate object. That their way of life is based on the Lunar Ring's torture is unconscionable, but that doesn't make doing the deed easier.
They're like cockroaches, you can find them all over the place. Wherever you go, whatever you do, you can bet they're just a stone's throw away. They even manage to get involved when you're in negotiations with the Accursed!
Unsurprisingly, the Amarlt got their grubby hands on the Armament with the Brand of Excessive Fabulousness. As the Forebear's descendants, being men of taste is in their blood, and what other Curse is better for proclaiming one's badassery? Sometimes I still wish we'd picked the Plenary Brand, no matter how much of a bad idea it was. Hmm, maybe we can still get something good out of piloting Procyon? I don't know how an Armament would interact with a Cursebearer that doesn't carry its associated Curse, but just imagining it is so cool...
Hunger can be surprisingly tactful at times, doing his best to distract sad daughteru from bad memories.
And I suspect we'll need a vacation from our vacation soon enough.
"We're planning to kill lots of people, but that doesn't mean we can't have fun in the process!"
I know that's not what he meant, but sometimes it isn't that difficult to understand why some people would think he's evil.
So what you're saying is that you wanted the Really Scenic Route back then, Letrizia? No problemo, next time we have a suicidal option on offer, we'll remember your preferences!
That too was speculated upon pretty heavily. We even guessed some of the reasons, their magic sometimes not working outside the Voyaging Realm among them. That the Voyaging Realm is somewhat sentient or at least follows certain rules makes me kind of nervous though. Hmm, I wonder how the Foremost managed to create such a place. It apparently accommodates any mages that land here and lets them use their abilities unimpeded despite those magic refusing to function in the wider world outside. Shouldn't that cause some kind of conflict if different magic systems depend on conflicting physical/magical laws to work?
We would probably have been OK in any case thanks to King's Scepter. Though saying that Accretion isn't magic seems like splitting hairs to me. Yes, I suppose it might qualify as more of a science to people that spend their lives researching Astral Ranks, but it's hard to see our conceptual effects as anything but magic.
Curious what those Shroud-derived powers look like, maybe we'll see when we finally get to piloting the fucking robot.
What is this. Is our daughter dissing us for not being a proper mage? She hadn't been bitten by the Groundskeeper when we weren't looking, had she?
Next she'll say she wants to learn cooking from the Sorceress! Though I suppose Gisena is uniquely qualified thanks to perceiving the structure of magic so directly. Still sounds weird to me.
I eagerly await the appearance of Magical Girl Letrizia, fighting to protect justice and healing the world with her cuteness.
TwistedJester
Tired Lurker King
- Location
- Hell
Thanks for the catch man.
Huh, didn't really consider that. Was always thinking about Mitigation flowing from the other direction. This would be quite nice though. Only issue is the range limitation, it's not a big deal now but once we start hitting the interstellar distances of the sphere "More than a planet" starts looking a little insufficient. Hopefully increased rank on both ends can help shore up the connection for greater separation.
You have that problem, too? Determining whether a thing is magic, sorcery, or just mysticism is such a crapshoot. It's all supernatural transubstantiation!
OctarineShrike
Avatar of Mandos
I realized something. Astral Shadow implies a light source. What is the light source in some inscrutable dimension that makes people cast shadows onto the Astral Plane?
Maragas
Nothing to see here.
- Location
- Tree House
To be honest, I go by the feels. What feels magical is magic for me. For example, Tolkien, WoD Mage, Exalted and HP magic all very different from each other but all of them feels like magic, you got me? But FMA Alchemy or Diagram from EFB both too science-y for me.
[X] Cut Through
[X] Super Juggernaut Undead Chimera
[X] A Besieged Colony
[X] To Rank 5.25
[X] 1 re-roll to be used on checks this update
[X] Super Juggernaut Undead Chimera
[X] A Besieged Colony
[X] To Rank 5.25
[X] 1 re-roll to be used on checks this update
Question, why are people voting for Wandering Magus' EFB Equivalent? Out of the entire lineup, it is the one we are least likely to ever get. It needs several additional conditions fulfilled just so it becomes available:
Look, it's impossible. We're never getting this EFB, and choosing it now wastes one of our two picks.
- Meeting the Magus - judging by the votes, a 50/50 chance
- Getting her to agree to teach it i.e. paying for it with "quality goods or service"
- Actually getting magic to win a build vote
- Picking this magic out of all available
Look, it's impossible. We're never getting this EFB, and choosing it now wastes one of our two picks.
DarkSideBard
Flying, without moving on
These are all good points, but none of them are actually addressing the main reason that I'm voting for that EFB: I'm curious.
I'm fond of the term "supplemental physics".
Magic is generally a violation of the natural laws of physics, an imposition of a higher being/realm that supersedes natural cause and effect. It's a little more obvious if you read the real world "magics" that inspire fiction writers. The purpose and function of mysticism, is to provide firm answers to questions with no intellectual or physical knowledge to guarantee truth. Things like life after death, purpose, self-transformation and self-realization, and proper behavior. Magic systems in fiction are inspired by mysticism, and so often share mysticism's sensibilities. Mysticism does not adhere to physics because it is not physics, it is a system of thought concerned with answering certain questions that cannot be answered by physics. So naturally there is an implicit assumption that magic is separate from physics, that either it supersedes physics, or that physics invalidates it and reveals it to be a bunch of fraudulent nonsense.
Unlike mystics, fiction authors are under no obligation to insure that their magic is "real", and the distinction between magic and not-magic breaks down when tarot cards actually work and you can visit the afterlife. I view the way we differentiate between magic and not-magic as a vestigial remnant of the thoughts and ideas and assumptions of the mystical ideas that inspire current fantasy fiction magic systems.
Rihaku
The Internet
Lord Hunger, now in JRPG sprite form!
I came up with a random level, but I'm pretty sure his class would be Cursebearer.
Great job! He probably would be somewhere around Level 200...
Well, from my PoV, that benefit is already folded into the 4 pick choice. I'm looking more at overall utility, not marginal increase in utility in any single vote.
I'm not concerned with what counts for not dying in that, though. More the enjoyability of reading about it.
I wanted hunger to be a leader, not a superweapon that demands submission and then delegates all the decisions.
I can't speak for anyone else, but I had no concern for that. I voted against Gabrielle because she sounded like she'd use up alot of screentime regardless of subsequent choices, and her themes mentioned in the blurb didn't sound very interesting, and the possibility of her immediately flipping out (or being flipped out at) right after Hunger got trashed by yet another excessively dangerous fight.
Here, there is no strong indication that the Magus is quite a undesirable in themes, and there is exceedingly low odds of a double overwhelming/otherwise unfavored odds fight.
[X] Super Juggernaut Undead Chimera
[X] Cut Through
Out of those we've yet seen, I favor Once and Future. 25 arete advancements are defining in their own right, so I'd like one that meshes well with Hunger's defining advancements, and this lends itself to the same means of action as Uttermost: Pressure, and the Sword. (Wouldn't have voted for Uttermost if I'd been around and voting at the time, but that's neither here nor there.) And Astral Rank is versatile enough in its uses that committing pretty heavily to it is a fine choice.
[X] Cut Through
Out of those we've yet seen, I favor Once and Future. 25 arete advancements are defining in their own right, so I'd like one that meshes well with Hunger's defining advancements, and this lends itself to the same means of action as Uttermost: Pressure, and the Sword. (Wouldn't have voted for Uttermost if I'd been around and voting at the time, but that's neither here nor there.) And Astral Rank is versatile enough in its uses that committing pretty heavily to it is a fine choice.
OctarineShrike
Avatar of Mandos
I had an unfortunate, too late realization. How powerful would rank 5.75 Verschlengorge be with Lord Hunger's rank 4.3ishness as the pilot and using totality so they're metaphysically one being? Would Verschlengorges Astral Rank exceed 6 from the union?
Edit: Could we have taken the Republic Kill Team like that?
Edit: Could we have taken the Republic Kill Team like that?
Last edited:
Rihaku
The Internet
Update in 30.
Cutting through another group of Astral invaders, Hunger frowned. There was some disquieting symmetry to the whole situation. The invaders were driven by an inescapable need to destroy Verschlengorge and were blind to the strength of its defender. Was that not an uncanny mirror of his own situation with the Imprisoned Ring? He too was compelled to reach it, and similarly ignorant of its ultimate guardians. Was it even possible for him to prevail here, when the Temple had stood unconquered for millennia before? What if its final defender was simply so powerful that no amount of strength accumulated against its lessers would suffice to challenge it, as he himself was to these beasts?
A simple massive discontinuity in combat strength would serve as a hard deterrant against invaders like himself or Ber, whose growth was rapid but fundamentally incremental in nature. A meta-contextual moat of sheer ability. The torment of the Ring was nearly unbearable, but even more unbearable was the prospect that he could fail.
Cutting through another group of Astral invaders, Hunger frowned. There was some disquieting symmetry to the whole situation. The invaders were driven by an inescapable need to destroy Verschlengorge and were blind to the strength of its defender. Was that not an uncanny mirror of his own situation with the Imprisoned Ring? He too was compelled to reach it, and similarly ignorant of its ultimate guardians. Was it even possible for him to prevail here, when the Temple had stood unconquered for millennia before? What if its final defender was simply so powerful that no amount of strength accumulated against its lessers would suffice to challenge it, as he himself was to these beasts?
A simple massive discontinuity in combat strength would serve as a hard deterrant against invaders like himself or Ber, whose growth was rapid but fundamentally incremental in nature. A meta-contextual moat of sheer ability. The torment of the Ring was nearly unbearable, but even more unbearable was the prospect that he could fail.
Dark Abstraction
Infrequent Participant
- Location
- United States
Aaaaand apparently I'm slow as hell and the update's coming.
Never mind.
Never mind.
Lealope
Not yet invincible
- Pronouns
- She/Her
Starting to think that we might just want to eat the Rank penalty, go find somewhere to grind for a few more days and then come back to kill these guys while the Apocryphal's on. I think if we manage to get Cut Through or some other EFB and a few picks that suit it well, we might be alright even if those guys and Bearic teamed up.
- Location
- Pindorama
EFB is a priority then; hopefully plan SAVE was the winner here; we'd be close to 10 Arete. If we do well fighting the Rotbeast; we might get out of there with Cut Through, hopefully. We just need 2~3 updates of effort, and we're in.
I think it was, with a respectable omake power and vote lead. If not, well, that's really bad but 2 Arete points are not impossible to overcome.
Lealope
Not yet invincible
- Pronouns
- She/Her
I'd love to but we're nowhere near as hardcore as the Forebear. Not after we decided not to take What Rains May Come and just murder Bearic right away. Now our boy is infected by our suboptimality instead of the purity of the Forebear's purpose, which means we need to compensate with grinding. Hopefully, we can dump a million points into Willpower and create a build with a system of incentives that allows for our purpose to be keener though.
I think 4.5 won because these guys are total chumps. 5.25 would have had the enemies present be at least noticeable.