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A Simple Transaction I

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Conclusion also has the meta benefit that we don't have to argue about morality for the two in game years.

I favor Evening Sky though, seems very suitable for us. Thousand Cuts potentially can pay off huge, but requires somewhat specific circumstances that aren't exactly reliable to get the most return from.
 
If we get 7 arete I am certainly voting for Conclusion.
I like my sleep with sound mind and not so guilty coincidence.
 
Sickul said:
With Sevenfold we can progress and gain more power and thus more ways to mitigate curses. It should allow us to use Tactics to slay enemies above our level catapulting our growth.

I'm shocked at the level of support Conclusion has, I was expecting if we got to 7 to argue against Evening's sky instead.
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Depends how much the xp increases for beating stronger opponents. It doesn't help that we choose all social options last time so we aren't seeking out strong people to fight.

Plus if we don't take Conclusion we're going to end up killing Gisena pretty soon if we can't find some substantial mitigation. Plus it means every time we trigger sated we get a 2 year holiday from one of our curses, which is nearly a lesser remittance worth!
 
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LordOfMurder said:
Plus it means every time we trigger sated we get a 2 year holiday from one of our curses
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I didn't read it that way when I first looked for some reason but on second read Arete is indeed changing the basic way Sated works rather than being a one time boost. That makes it quite a bit more appealing even if Sated procs are likely to be rare.

It may end making piloting/restoring Verschlengorge less easy for us though. But it's not like it's our mech in the first place.
 
LordOfMurder said:
Plus if we don't take Conclusion we're going to end up killing Gisena pretty soon if we can't find some substantial mitigation. Plus it means every time we trigger sated we get a 2 year holiday from one of our curses, which is nearly a lesser remittance worth!
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Yeah I don't think Conclusion is a bad option at all, but it's one that's hard to evaluate. It makes it risk. If we run into another guy like the pirate with Sevenfold we might be able to just destroy his ship at range with Felling Strike and help Gisena close the rift.

And I expect enemies to keep getting more difficult, I'd like the option to kill them to remain on the table.
 
Sickul said:
Yeah I don't think Conclusion is a bad option at all, but it's one that's hard to evaluate. It makes it risk. If we run into another guy like the pirate with Sevenfold we might be able to just destroy his ship at range with Felling Strike and help Gisena close the rift.

And I expect enemies to keep getting more difficult, I'd like the option to kill them to remain on the table.
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TBF, it was mentioned to have a bonus effect too, which may have utility in combat.
Rihaku said:
[ ] 7 Arete: Conclusion - Reduces progress by 25% instead, but lasts 2 years. It is easier for the hero to find some measure of peace with regards to the losses suffered at the Tyrant's hands, and is less likely to be emotionally compromised by events that remind him of such. Gives you the moral high ground and the ability to travel to lands barren of life, like outer space. Additional unknown effect.
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Update is done, writing vote options. We're not quite at 6 Arete though.

cheesyme said:
That said, a question for you @Rihaku. I haven't read the original quest, so I'm not sure the answer, how long will Elves in general and Gisena in particular likely live, without the Decimation Curse factoring in?
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Depends on a number of factors, Sorceresses of her power usually don't age much and she's still young (only a few years older than Jeanne, who was 19). If she continues to grow in power, it's possible that she can outscale the drain for a time. She's got CON 50 under Quantified World, which is a fair bit beyond peak human, so her natural lifespan is probably 2-3 hundred years.
 
Sickul said:
Yeah I don't think Conclusion is a bad option at all, but it's one that's hard to evaluate. It makes it risk. If we run into another guy like the pirate with Sevenfold we might be able to just destroy his ship at range with Felling Strike and help Gisena close the rift.

And I expect enemies to keep getting more difficult, I'd like the option to kill them to remain on the table.
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Sevenfold is great too but likely to come up in another vote since it's a blade option. We don't know how common sated procs are so I think we're better off taking the mitigation now when we have a chance. Plus 24x duration makes it more likely that we proc it again before it runs out.
 
LordOfMurder said:
Sevenfold is great too but likely to come up in another vote since it's a blade option. We don't know how common sated procs are so I think we're better off taking the mitigation now when we have a chance. Plus 24x duration makes it more likely that we proc it again before it runs out.
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We kind of go around in circles now, because we got this sated for killing someone (I'm guessing that reminded us of the tyrant). Sevenfold might let us get more Sated procs, whereas with Conclusion we could struggle to kill those needed to proc it.
 
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Adhoc vote count started by ReaderOfFate on May 25, 2020 at 10:58 PM, finished with 373 posts and 42 votes.
  • [X] 2 Arete: Sword That Was Stolen - King of Thieves
    [X] Forebear's Blade - Fell-Handed Stroke
    [X] Forebear's Blade - Echo of the Forebear
    [X] Forebear's Blade - Fell-Handed Stroke
    [X] Forebear's Blade - Echo of the Forebear
    -[X] 2 Arete: Undying Echo
    [X] Forebear's Blade - Fell-Handed Stroke
    [X] Hunger - Sleep of the Just
    -[X] 2 Arete: Slumber of Aeons
    [X] Forebear's Blade - Echo of the Forebear
    -[X] 2 Arete: Undying Echo
    [X] 2 Arete: Sword That Was Stolen - King of Thieves - It is the prerogative of the hero true to take the implements of his enemy and turn them against him. For what righteous weapon could deny the verity of his cause, or the valor with which he pursued it?
    [X] Hunger - Sleep of the Just - While sleeping, the character is massively more difficult to harm or physically move, and may choose to deny interruptions to his slumber, allowing his body to be used as a potent shield.
    -[X] 2 Arete: Slumber of Aeons - Increases well-rested threshold to 10 hours per day, but hours of sleep can now be banked up to a month in advance. Dramatically increases strength gained with age.
    [X] Forebear's Blade - Echo of the Forebear
    -[X] 2 Arete: Undying Echo
    [X] Hunger - Sleep of the Just
    [X] Hunger - Sleep of the Just
    [X] Forebear's Blade - Echo of the Forebear - Cloud-shadow of the Forebear's might. Legendary strength and speed, and the resilience to exert them. Can be taken multiple times. [+Might, +Agility]
    -[X] 2 Arete: Undying Echo - The Forebear could withstand unbelievable punishment, only to rise again. [+++Constitution]
    [X] Forebear's Blade - Fell-Handed Stroke
    [X] Forebear's Blade - Fell-Handed Stroke
    [X] 2 Arete: Sword That Was Stolen - King of Thieves
    [X] 2 Arete: Quelling
    [X] 2 Arete: Quelling
    [X] Forebear's Blade - Echo of the Forebear
    -[X] 2 Arete: Undying Echo
    [X] Hunger - Sleep of the Just
    -[X] 2 Arete: Slumber of Aeons
    [X] Forebear's Blade - Echo of the Forebear
    [X] 2 Arete: Sword That Was Stolen - King of Thieves
    [X] Forebear's Blade - Echo of the Forebear
    [X] Hunger - Sleep of the Just
    [X] Forebear's Blade - Echo of the Forebear - Cloud-shadow of the Forebear's might. Legendary strength and speed, and the resilience to exert them. Can be taken multiple times. [+Might, +Agility]
    [X] Forebear's Blade - Fell-Handed Stroke - A devastating blow of unutterable magnificence from which no recovery is possible. A powerful, but draining strike that inflicts cursed wounds from which spirit and will leak as freely as blood. Resists healing.
    [X] Forebear's Blade - Echo of the Forebear - Cloud-shadow of the Forebear's might. Legendary strength and speed, and the resilience to exert them. Can be taken multiple times. [+Might, +Agility]
    [X] 2 Arete: Sword That Was Stolen - King of Thieves - It is the prerogative of the hero true to take the implements of his enemy and turn them against him. For what righteous weapon could deny the verity of his cause, or the valor with which he pursued it?
    [X] Hunger - Sleep of the Just
    -[X] 2 Arete: Slumber of Aeons
    [X] 2 Arete: Sword That Was Stolen - King of Thieves - It is the prerogative of the hero true to take the implements of his enemy and turn them against him. For what righteous weapon could deny the verity of his cause, or the valor with which he pursued it?
    [X] Hunger - Sleep of the Just - While sleeping, the character is massively more difficult to harm or physically move, and may choose to deny interruptions to his slumber, allowing his body to be used as a potent shield.
    [X] Forebear's Blade - Echo of the Forebear
    -[X] 2 Arete: Undying Echo
    [X] 2 Arete: Sword That Was Stolen - King of Thieves
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The worst Conclusion additional effect would be turning off the active Hunger bonuses as our Hunger is sated that lasts as long as we are sated.
 
Maragas said:
The worst Conclusion additional effect would be turning off the active Hunger bonuses as our Hunger is sated that lasts as long as we are sated.
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Eh, that feels too pessimistic for a 7 Arete option.

Plus, the decrease in growth rate being -25% was already said up front. If there's an additional thing like that, that would make the previous section misleading at best.
 
Year 1: 300 Years left
Year 2: 269 Years left
Year 3: 241 Years left
Year 4: 216 Years left
Year 5: 193 Years left
Year 6: 173 Years left
Year 7: 155 Years left
Year 8: 138 Years left
Year 9: 123 Years left
Year 10: 110 Years left

Yeah, theoretically Gisena might be able to do a couple decades with us without some serious mitigation, which means she probably wouldn't still be around when we finally started our empire, let alone when it held the required 90% of the human sphere or for its 50 year required lifespan. We really be grabbing Conclusion, even ignoring how much simpler it makes life for us and the setting it makes it so much easier to keep the companion we spent a Remittance on around.
 
We haven't even seen the effects of Gisena's mitigation on our Curses. And it seems possible to me that Curses could have less of an effect on her anyway because of her Nullity.

You guys don't have to be so afraid for Gisena yet, it's going to be okay.
 
ReaderOfFate said:
Eh, that feels too pessimistic for a 7 Arete option.

Plus, the decrease in growth rate being -25% was already said up front. If there's an additional thing like that, that would make the previous section misleading at best.
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I don't think its pessimistic at all. It's getting rid of a Curse of a Cursebearer for 2 years, completely. For 7 Arete this is literally buying gold with pennies.
I feel like It's too good to be true without downsides.
 
Maragas said:
I don't think its pessimistic at all. It's getting rid of a Curse of a Cursebearer for 2 years, completely. For 7 Arete this is literally buying gold with pennies.
I feel like It's too good to be true without downsides.
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That's my biggest concern with that choice, that the mystery box is a bomb.

But then again we know this changes the way hunger sated works permanently into a 2-year mitigation instead of a month-long mitigation, which is absolutely massive even if the procs are quite rare. We're not quite at 6 arete, though.
 
Maragas said:
I don't think its pessimistic at all. It's getting rid of a Curse of a Cursebearer for 2 years, completely. For 7 Arete this is literally buying gold with pennies.
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I agree that trading a lesser Remitance for a Curse is a good trade, but the fact it would seem mechanically weird if the hidden effect was "Increase the 25% to 100%" is definitely true. It's not like we technically have all that reasonable a way of knowing about the 25% in advance but that's still listed, so separating one effect into known and mystery just feels awkward and unnecessary.
 
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What if the mystery box is that it can only happen once? It is called Conclusion after all. The Hero gets over his issues with the Tyrant but can't be sated that way again.
 
Shard said:
The LR option is 1 week/10 years, we're gettiig 100x the value in comparison,albeit only for 1 curse.
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Though at a significant cost to growth.

Still, it is an incredibly good deal.

Sickul said:
What if the mystery box is that it can only happen once? It is called Conclusion after all. The Hero gets over his issues with the Tyrant but can't be sated that way again.
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It changes the way Hunger Sated works, so now it always lasts 2 years.

Mystery box is probably not obviously related to the curse/mitigation except in a fridge logic way that becomes obvious after the fact.
 
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The mystery box might 'just' be +1 Accursed Favor, mind. We are mitigating his curse, after all.
 
If we spent 7 Arete on an option with a mystery box and proceeded to get turbofucked, why would we ever pick a mystery box again? There would be no point in offering such options in that case. If it was a normal option, sure, I can buy there might be risks to opening the box. If the flaw is something exterior to us like decreasing our affinity with Vershlengorge, I get that too. But finding out that we saved our points for the privileged of getting fucked out of nowhere would be like signing up for a meal delivery service and getting a face full of venomous spiders.

I just don't think its super likely.
 
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