A Simple Transaction I

[Genesys]

I thought the line separators are caused by the default font not supporting the line separator character(U+2028)and rendering it as that instead for whatever reason on desktop Chrome. But actually, this is wrong, since Arial should support the character, and probably most of these other fonts. It's strangely unilateral. Also, since it is a whitespace character, if it was not supported it should render as invisible. So I am no longer sure why the character appears. It probably has something to do with how the browser renders the fonts, since it is browser specific, but I can't really narrow it down since it doesn't seem to be font-specific.
Default: The quick brown fox jumped over the lazy dog. 

Arial: The quick brown fox jumped over the lazy dog. 

Book Antiqua: The quick brown fox jumped over the lazy dog. 

Courier New: The quick brown fox jumped over the lazy dog. 

Georgia: The quick brown fox jumped over the lazy dog. 

Tahoma: The quick brown fox jumped over the lazy dog. 

Times New Roman: The quick brown fox jumped over the lazy dog. 

Trebuchet MS: The quick brown fox jumped over the lazy dog. 

Verdana: The quick brown fox jumped over the lazy dog. 


 

[Rihaku]

You guys may want to start thinking about long term plans, as @George has... while it's likely not sustainable to remain in the Voyaging Realm indefinitely, due both to your time limit and the increasing slim chance of finding worthy opposition (to say nothing of what the Decimator's Affliction might do), you don't have to stick with Letrizia once she makes it back to the city. Alternatively you could delay the final return and extend your time with Letrizia so that you're more powerful when the time to interact with her civilization finally comes. Or, if you've plenty of +Intelligence and +Charisma, simply waste no time and go directly!

Ruling the Human Sphere is one thing. Getting a reasonably maximal amount of power from this universe is another!

Is alt!Seram even a cursebearer in this timeline? We did end up with alternate universe Gisena so maybe Seram's currently best friends with Control at the moment or fulfilling whatever destiny the accursed hinted at for him before he contracted.

Click to shrink...

One possibility is that most of Seram's measure is off with Control or living miserably in his home dimension while one Seram is a Progression-type Cursebearer! But of course, any experienced Progression-Type Cursebearer with a degree of fellow-feeling for their alternate selves - or that has united with them - or for the places they have visited, have ways to ensure that ill things do not befall those places and selves...

I'm guessing it won't happen, but going to an alt world where alt!Seram and alt!Jotarun are fighting it out would be pretty awesome.

This probably isn't news since it costs 7 Arete, but Sevenfold is really good. It empowers every strike letting us grind down tough opponents, while also giving us insane burst that scales letting us kill less tanky opponents quickly.

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Tanky or evasive opponents, if you have good Wits!

 

[Shard]

You've immediately managed to make me much more satisfied with our curse load out. The relinquishment schadenfreude morale benefit is definitely real.

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And imagine if we had Brand of the Wretched! So much for curse mitigation.. (I'm disappointed in younger version of me, we didn't even think about using Gisena as curse mitigation - I think?)

I think Slumber and Champion wouldn't have hurt us too much as at yet, due to our Hunger-based build making chronomancy not as important. Although Apocryphal + Slumber might have been really bad.

 

[DkArthas]

[X] Forebear's Blade - Echo of the Forebear
-[X] 2 Arete: Undying Echo
[X] Forebear's Blade - Fell-Handed Stroke

Yeah, we need to increase our survivability and this does it pretty well. Though, I am tempted by the idea of saving Arete.

 

[Thomasfoolery]

You guys may want to start thinking about long term plans, as @George has... while it's likely not sustainable to remain in the Voyaging Realm indefinitely, due both to your time limit and the increasing slim chance of finding worthy opposition

Click to shrink...

Hmm, if we drop her off at the city, go back in and get caught in a trap of not finding enough enemies to advance in Rank enough to navigate the area then wasting our time trying to get out for years that could be very bad. So convincing Letz to make this a summer joyride and delay getting back the corporate grind for as long as feasible seems like the better option. Especially since we chose to build a rapport with her.

 

[Rihaku]

Hmm, if we drop her off at the city, go back in and get caught in a trap of not finding enough enemies to advance in Rank to navigate the area then wasting our time trying to get out for years that could be very bad. So convincing Letz to make this a summer joyride and delay getting back the corporate grind for as long as feasible seems like the better option.

Click to shrink...

And to do that, you need to... show her the joys of Fishing!

And imagine if we had Brand of the Wretched! So much for curse mitigation.. (I'm disappointed in younger version of me, we didn't even think about using Gisena as curse mitigation - I think?)

I think Slumber and Champion wouldn't have hurt us too much as at yet, due to our Hunger-based build making chronomancy not as important. Although Apocryphal + Slumber might have been really bad.

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But think about the hidden drawbacks of Slumber - not getting access to the Sleep-based Hunger votes!

 

[Orm Embar]

Is alt!Seram even a cursebearer in this timeline? We did end up with alternate universe Gisena so maybe Seram's currently best friends with Control at the moment or fulfilling whatever destiny the accursed hinted at for him before he contracted.

Click to shrink...

I think getting nabbed by the Black Portal is the destiny he hinted at, just going by Occam's Razor. All of the above are probably true to some degree, given the omniversal scope of things.

One possibility is that most of Seram's measure is off with Control or living miserably in his home dimension while one Seram is a Progression-type Cursebearer! But of course, any experienced Progression-Type Cursebearer with a degree of fellow-feeling for their alternate selves - or that has united with them - or for the places they have visited, have ways to ensure that ill things do not befall those places and selves...

Click to shrink...

Hm, so from the Heroic conquest of the AU Manifest Realm we can determine that Seram's not a significantly advanced Progression-type? Or just didn't care to expend effort on Joania's behalf, beyond the Geas-mandated assassination? That would be in-character, though he did get along well with Jeanne.

In addition, it's also the only one that doesn't stem from an existing power or trait of the H-man. I think it makes the most sense to try and pursue Evening Sky right now instead of other choices that will reappear later, given that it allows for avenues of future progression and makes us immune to several avenues of attack. I wonder, though, if we killed the charming protagonist pirate of another story, and I imagine that if we took Retinue he wouldn't be a bad choice to add to our motley crew.

Click to shrink...

Evening Sky's unique to this update, but King of Thieves is as well. If we somehow manage to afford the former, it'd dovetail nicely with our charisma boost and make us less squishy. It has an amazing aesthetic, though if either of our resident artists don't find it appealing, it should be avoided no matter what. Hunger is by his own admission a shadow of his former self, but he could just be a shadow in general! Our nameless adversary managed to imbue his crew with shadows of the Evening Sky, maybe we could turn it into a bargain-bin Retinue?

 

[LordOfMurder]

I wonder what the alternate universe versions of hunger are doing?

 

[Byzantine]

It does seem like this is the time to begin to think longer-term.

On that thought then it seems like the best way to handle the geas is to intentionally get to the edge of completion and then just farm power (through fights and just sleeping, at this point) finishing it when we need need to. Decimator makes this more difficult than it would otherwise be, though. Fortunately the area of the realm is quite vast.

 

[Rihaku]

I wonder what the alternate universe versions of hunger are doing?

Click to shrink...

Assuming they're not dead? Probably something very interesting...

I think getting nabbed by the Black Portal is the destiny he hinted at, just going by Occam's Razor. All of the above are probably true to some degree, given the omniversal scope of things.
Hm, so from the Heroic conquest of the AU Manifest Realm we can determine that Seram's not a significantly advanced Progression-type? Or just didn't care to expend effort on Joania's behalf, beyond the Geas-mandated assassination? That would be in-character, though he did get along well with Jeanne.

Click to shrink...

He doesn't appear to be a High Cursebearer at this point in "time," at least. Or perhaps he didn't get every Manifest Realm.

Evening Sky's unique to this update, but King of Thieves is as well. If we somehow manage to afford the former, it'd dovetail nicely with our charisma boost and make us less squishy. It has an amazing aesthetic, though if either of our resident artists don't find it appealing, it should be avoided no matter what. Hunger is by his own admission a shadow of his former self, but he could just be a shadow in general! Our nameless adversary managed to imbue his crew with shadows of the Evening Sky, maybe we could turn it into a bargain-bin Retinue?

Click to shrink...

Hm... the Evening Sky wouldn't shroud him completely, nor would it need to to provide its protective effects under Accretion's influence. Can't have a single object take over the impression of the panoply, after all!

One consideration would be available panoply slots, but the three artifacts you've got on hand are plenty versatile. Two objects imbued with a spark of power from the Accursed and one spun and clotted through the efforts of a Progression-Type Cursebearer!

 

[Orm Embar]

I wonder what the alternate universe versions of hunger are doing?

Click to shrink...

Dying's the safe bet, sadly. Alternate universe nepotism's going to have to wait a long, long time in Hunger's case.

Letrizia's agency likely exploits the Voyager's Realm somehow and has multi-national backing. We could do the mercenary thing with (never for) them, building our legend while collecting money until we outscale or Decimate too much of the Voyager's Realm. Astral farming sounds like the endgame to me, and cool enough that it'd be worth doing on its own merits. Shame we don't have someone who did time in some kind of Astral Exploratory who could tell us more about it...

 

[Sickul]

Sevenfold just lets us punch so much farther up, The Evening Sky does have quite the coolness factor though. Charisma only takes you so far, being able to Fell Handed Strike from range though... there will be other cool Artifacts eventually I'm sure.

Though if I knew The Sky would let us make our own crew via the power of Nakama, it would still probably be the wrong choice but one I might be compelled to take.

 

[Talace]

Our nameless adversary managed to imbue his crew with shadows of the Evening Sky, maybe we could turn it into a bargain-bin Retinue?

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Our own Royal Retinue, forever inferior to the superior lore of the Imperial Retinue!

 

[Rihaku]

Sevenfold just lets us punch so much farther up, The Evening Sky does have quite the coolness factor though. Charisma only takes you so far, being able to Fell Handed Strike from range though... there will be other cool Artifacts eventually I'm sure.

Though if I knew The Sky would let us make our own crew via the power of Nakama, it would still probably be the wrong choice but one I might be compelled to take.

Click to shrink...

Well, they provide different kinds of advancement. The Evening Sky is a defensive asset without peer among those you presently have access to, preventing you from losing to a variety of conditions that might otherwise disable you.

 

[Orm Embar]

Our own Royal Retinue, forever inferior to the superior lore of the Imperial Retinue!

Click to shrink...

Technically it'd be the Noble Retinue, since we've got a Duchess and Sorceress so far!

Sevenfold just lets us punch so much farther up, The Evening Sky does have quite the coolness factor though. Charisma only takes you so far, being able to Fell Handed Strike from range though... there will be other cool Artifacts eventually I'm sure.

Click to shrink...

If we take A Thousand Cuts, does that mean we can literally be... avenged sevenfold? It's a great power, even the baseline ruinous effects of the Forebear's Blade are neat. Everything looks so cool! It's worth wading through build vote hell to ascend to build vote heaven.

Speaking of looking cool, Microwave's HANGRY pic would be a good thread icon for drawing people in. I can set it as such if you'd like, though you should have the permissions too.

 

[ImperatorV]

So, I was re-reading EFB recently, and it occurred to me that many of the curses we see in this quest were likely conceived for the Cursebearer option in EFB. The Tyrant's Doom, Decimator's Affliction, and Plenary Brand all fit the idea of a dark overlord pretty darn well. Would have been fun to run a build like that, although I think the elves would have been upset about Decimator.

Another thing that occurred to me... I wonder how the powers granted by Regalia and King's Scepter to a combat-type compare to the fully unleashed Diagram and Artifice? Regalia can grant two powers, I imagine they'd have to have lower potential then Diagram and Artifice, otherwise Cursebearer+Cultivation would have been Thrice-Great but better! And as we know Thrice-Great had better long term potential then cursebearer, so that puts a cap on how powerful the granted powers of Regalia can be on a Combat-Type. That makes little sense though - a starting combat-type cursebearer is said to be able to take down Grand Solipsists, so the powers granted would have to be pretty darn strong - no Diagram mage would be able to take down a stage 6 cultivator after all! Maybe since Regalia is focused around versatility the raw power would be lower, but even then I feel like the powers granted would have to be pretty good.

So how do we reconcile Thrice-Great having better long term potential then Cursebearer? Perhaps the powers granted to a combat-type cursebearer would be entirely oriented around battle, thus denying them the cross-school interactions that make Thrice-Great so ridiculous? That would solve the paradox I guess. I'm just wondering about builds not taken, and if it would be possible to come up with a Cursebearer build that could match or approach the long-term potential of Thrice-Great without the risks of that perk. Perhaps it is possible, just more expensive - 5 orbs (4 for cursebearer, 1 for another magic system to get 3 total) and three curses vs 4 orbs and no curses.

...Sorry to be discussing old quests, but I love analyzing magic systems and EFB provides some interesting comparisons to be made. And we haven't yet played a combat-type, so there's a lot of mysteries as to how they work.

 

[Shard]

So, I was re-reading EFB recently, and it occurred to me that many of the curses we see in this quest were likely conceived for the Cursebearer option in EFB. The Tyrant's Doom, Decimator's Affliction, and Plenary Brand all fit the idea of a dark overlord pretty darn well. Would have been fun to run a build like that, although I think the elves would have been upset about Decimator.

Another thing that occurred to me... I wonder how the powers granted by Regalia and King's Scepter to a combat-type compare to the fully unleashed Diagram and Artifice? Regalia can grant two powers, I imagine they'd have to have lower potential then Diagram and Artifice, otherwise Cursebearer+Cultivation would have been Thrice-Great but better! And as we know Thrice-Great had better long term potential then cursebearer, so that puts a cap on how powerful the granted powers of Regalia can be on a Combat-Type. That makes little sense though - a starting combat-type cursebearer is said to be able to take down Grand Solipsists, so the powers granted would have to be pretty darn strong - no Diagram mage would be able to take down a stage 6 cultivator after all! Maybe since Regalia is focused around versatility the raw power would be lower, but even then I feel like the powers granted would have to be pretty good.

So how do we reconcile Thrice-Great having better long term potential then Cursebearer? Perhaps the powers granted to a combat-type cursebearer would be entirely oriented around battle, thus denying them the cross-school interactions that make Thrice-Great so ridiculous? That would solve the paradox I guess. I'm just wondering about builds not taken, and if it would be possible to come up with a Cursebearer build that could match or approach the long-term potential of Thrice-Great without the risks of that perk. Perhaps it is possible, just more expensive - 5 orbs (4 for cursebearer, 1 for another magic system to get 3 total) and three curses vs 4 orbs and no curses.

...Sorry to be discussing old quests, but I love analyzing magic systems and EFB provides some interesting comparisons to be made. And we haven't yet played a combat-type, so there's a lot of mysteries as to how they work.

Click to shrink...

Cultivator+Reincarnation+Cultivation would probably have nearly as good scaling as Thrice-Great. Which starting from a higher base.

Probably. But Reincarnation is random-ish kind of, and Thrice-Great also provides literally divine talent at combining the three different schools of magic into a powerful and cohesive whole. The statement is more on having a better curve though (IIRC) , Progression is better than Thrice Great in the long run, but Thrice Great ramps up way faster. In the long run, Combat Class with Praxis would probably triumph over Thrice Great, but that would take basically forever. Depends on the Praxis mystery box really.

 

[Fumbles]

[X] Forebear's Blade - Echo of the Forebear
-[X] 2 Arete: Undying Echo
[X] Forebear's Blade - Fell-Handed Stroke

 

[Rihaku]

So how do we reconcile Thrice-Great having better long term potential then Cursebearer? Perhaps the powers granted to a combat-type cursebearer would be entirely oriented around battle, thus denying them the cross-school interactions that make Thrice-Great so ridiculous? That would solve the paradox I guess. I'm just wondering about builds not taken, and if it would be possible to come up with a Cursebearer build that could match or approach the long-term potential of Thrice-Great without the risks of that perk. Perhaps it is possible, just more expensive - 5 orbs (4 for cursebearer, 1 for another magic system to get 3 total) and three curses vs 4 orbs and no curses.

Click to shrink...

The Remittances offered to Nameless wouldn't be the same ones offered here. As for advancement, the Praxis would probably be your best bet for long-term potential as a Combat-type, though it can lack some of the extreme utility needed to flourish in EFB's setting at a beginning Combat-type's level. But yes, there's no reasonable way for a Combat-type to outscale a Thrice-Great given similar orb counts and optimization. Nameless got to trans-universe-busting levels in... what, a few years of training and then less than two of adventuring (...partying)? And he didn't even go for the highest power option (True Form Of Rain), nor did he bother risking Immortal Tribulation or hyper aggressive Jotunheim scaling, and his Extrusion was lazy, etc...

A Progression-type might be able to do it, if the universe they explore is as fertile for personal power as Nameless' was. Nameless' mastery of the Diagram and cross-system interactions (represented as Beyond Points) would make him fairly difficult to outscale if starting out from his position, though.

 

[Shard]

I wonder if the Tyrant's ability to triumph over destiny was a result of extensive teaching from the Forebear? A desire to usurp Destiny?

Did the Forebear die, or did they simply ascend to become a Hidden Master?

 

[Orm Embar]

I wonder if the Tyrant's ability to triumph over destiny was a result of extensive teaching from the Forebear? A desire to usurp Destiny?

Did the Forebear die, or did they simply ascend to become a Hidden Master?

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If the Tyrant benefited from his teachings, it wasn't directly:

The Forebear is actually the tyrant's distant ancestor, and it is said he died peacefully at a very advanced age!

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It being 'said' he died at an advantaged age sure is some interesting wording, what with the power levels at play. Hunger's a bona fide immortal already; perhaps the Forebear reached the far side of the board and ascended from piece to player.

 

[Wolfy]

[X] Forebear's Blade - Echo of the Forebear
[X] Forebear's Blade - Fell-Handed Stroke

Financial responsibility, saving for our college etc.

You played EFB, you know how this works.

 

[Rihaku]

[X] Forebear's Blade - Echo of the Forebear
[X] Forebear's Blade - Fell-Handed Stroke

Financial responsibility, saving for our college etc.

You played EFB, you know how this works.

Click to shrink...

Not quite! There's a difference between a Cultivator hoarding their BP for the best moment when they already possess overwhelming strength, and a Cursebearer with unlimited Progression trying their best to survive some dire circumstances!

 

[Shard]

[X] Forebear's Blade - Echo of the Forebear
[X] Forebear's Blade - Fell-Handed Stroke

Financial responsibility, saving for our college etc.

You played EFB, you know how this works.

Click to shrink...

Our choices in EFB would have been significantly different if we had the ability to 'go back' and then upgrade an option with more BP. We'd probably have advanced way faster, to begin with. Plus even in EFB we ended up selecting a lot of 1-BP options early in the game. I think our first EFB was Daoless, actually. After we already achieved Titanic-level power.

 

[Rihaku]

Current vote count?

Our choices in EFB would have been significantly different if we had the ability to 'go back' and then upgrade an option with more BP. We'd probably have advanced way faster, to begin with. Plus even in EFB we ended up selecting a lot of 1-BP options early in the game. I think our first EFB was Daoless, actually. After we already achieved Titanic-level power.

Click to shrink...

All Paths, yup. Your access to multiple FB-level effects and the Chronoreactor, plus synergies between your systems, allowed you to hit Titanic level fairly quickly, at least in bodily strength. Diagram buffs!