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A Play of Blood and Shot (ASOIAF NG)

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I must say I disagree with exploration, magic and technology being bad/misused/having little place/not appropriate for these games.

The most fun I've had in these games was playing an age of sail Qarth exploring the Jade Sea, Ulthos and Sothoryos. I agree however without a dedicate mod exploration can't be done well in these games. Exploration though always should have a place in a fantasy setting. Exploration is the seed that the heroes journey/epic quest can sprout from.

As for colonization i think a simple economy system would make it a lot more satisfying. Even if it's as simple as EUIV's stability system. Speaking of systems i really like @Lucienz actions system and would love to see it in more games.

I think technology and technology advancement was done well in this and the last game. It was both allowed to advance and therefore settle the desires of players and also largely not turn over the apple cart and derail the game. I feel we can reach a happy medium where a measure of stasis can prevail with minor tech advancement. Maybe heavily focus on guilds and other organizations not freely spreading knowledge and so retarding amy scientific/industrial revolution from starting.

Magic had its flaws yes, but it wasn't that bad. Magic's uneven moderation can even be representative of cannon where magic ebs and flows over the years.

CommandoHowizter said:
IMHO we should just have a fresh new game...
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I've wanted to do an all star ISOT game with faction from all the previous games included. I just want to play the Jade Covenant again.
 
Atomicwalrus said:
I must say I disagree with exploration, magic and technology being bad/misused/having little place/not appropriate for these games.

The most fun I've had in these games was playing an age of sail Qarth exploring the Jade Sea, Ulthos and Sothoryos. I agree however without a dedicate mod exploration can't be done well in these games. Exploration though always should have a place in a fantasy setting. Exploration is the seed that the heroes journey/epic quest can sprout from.

As for colonization i think a simple economy system would make it a lot more satisfying. Even if it's as simple as EUIV's stability system. Speaking of systems i really like @Lucienz actions system and would love to see it in more games.

I think technology and technology advancement was done well in this and the last game. It was both allowed to advance and therefore settle the desires of players and also largely not turn over the apple cart and derail the game. I feel we can reach a happy medium where a measure of stasis can prevail with minor tech advancement. Maybe heavily focus on guilds and other organizations not freely spreading knowledge and so retarding amy scientific/industrial revolution from starting.

Magic had its flaws yes, but it wasn't that bad. Magic's uneven moderation can even be representative of cannon where magic ebs and flows over the years.



I've wanted to do an all star ISOT game with faction from all the previous games included. I just want to play the Jade Covenant again.
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I'd do an all-star
 
Qarth was just about on the rise here, but I'm fine with a time-jump.

However, magic and technology should be level in some way for everyone.

If Braavos is investing heavily in artillery, they better have some kick ass artillery that lets them fight Wyverns and shit.

If someone has fantastical stuff, everyone should have some form of equally fantastical stuff.
 
Atomicwalrus said:
Magic had its flaws yes, but it wasn't that bad. Magic's uneven moderation can even be representative of cannon where magic ebs and flows over the years.
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Just chiming in since magic was kind of my favorite part of modding and also the one that I never got that sweet release on, but that ebb and flow you mention wasn't so much a tidal action as it was a change from fresh to salt water.

Mortis is right, magic is not a friendly source of power in GRRM's world. Setting the North aside, every use of power had its short term gains for long term losses, or long buy ins for little more than flashes in the pan amidst the pain and suffering. I had more people wave off attempts at gaining Ultimate Power than actually took me up on it when discussion of costs arose, or settled for the purely academic in lieu. Every meddler in the arcane had their due coming. Qohor's dragon horn was just as likely to destroy the city as it would bind dragons, and at best would just kill the user, maybe everyone in the immediate vicinity. I had a table, mostly bad, some grotesque, a little sliver of good. Water mages all slowly petrifying from the inside out, blood magic sapping your humanity, health, and sanity, diviners either going mad or blind for delving too deep, disease, ruin, devastation lurking just a few more steps down the path...

So, my advice. Make sure the Children of the Forest are fucking fae as hell: ancient, obtuse, and fickle. Qarths's internal divisions mean that any up and comer had better learn how to drink poison, eat needles, and nope daggers (or start sleeping with a patron who can). Your morose, introspective players are best suited to walking the path to completion because they can look at the balance tilting ever against them and accept it without a bitchfest. Sacrifice, suffering, loss: loving accessories to the setting's magic system.

It's like the Faceless Men, there's true power there but the price is seldom worth the lasting cost, even to the most broken of wretches.
 
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Mina said:
Just chiming in since magic was kind of my favorite part of modding and also the one that I never got that sweet release on, but that ebb and flow you mention wasn't so much a tidal action as it was a change from fresh to salt water.

Mortis is right, magic is not a friendly source of power in GRRM's world. Setting the North aside, every use of power had its short term gains for long term losses, or long buy ins for little more than flashes in the pan amidst the pain and suffering. I had more people wave off attempts at gaining Ultimate Power than actually took me up on it when discussion of costs arose, or settled for the purely academic in lieu. Every meddler in the arcane had their due coming. Qohor's dragon horn was just as likely to destroy the city as it would bind dragons, and at best would just kill the user, maybe everyone in the immediate vicinity. I had a table, mostly bad, some grotesque, a little sliver of good. Water mages all slowly petrifying from the inside out, blood magic sapping your humanity, health, and sanity, diviners either going mad or blind for delving too deep, disease, ruin, devastation lurking just a few more steps down the path...

So, my advice. Make sure the Children of the Forest are fucking fae as hell: ancient, obtuse, and fickle. Qohor's internal divisions mean that any up and comer had better learn how to drink poison, eat needles, and nope daggers (or start sleeping with a patron who can). Your morose, introspective players are best suited to walking the path to completion because they can look at the balance tilting ever against them and accept it without a bitchfest. Sacrifice, suffering, loss: loving accessories to the setting's magic system.

It's like the Faceless Men, there's true power there but the price is seldom worth the lasting cost, even to the most broken of wretches.
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I still am sad I never got to the pay off of having that statue of Chtulla be brought to evil Atlantis beyond the Sunset Sea with all the weirdness and horror I had building up there in the Valyrian game.
 
Wade Garrett said:
I don't recall Daena losing any of those things to a degree that was noticeable if she stood next to Maelys or Aethan.:V
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It was noticeable to those who knew her, like Aegon. But he just believed that she was going through a phase.
Theravis said:
I'd do an all-star
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Brightflame said:
I would throw my support behind this eagerly
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As the fool who needs to ask this question due to my lack of knowledge,

what is All-Star?
 
Wade Garrett said:
Letting players claim Factions/Characters from previous Games all brought together into the same scenario by a Swirling Plot Vortex.
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I really think this whole concept is doomed because it inevitably turns into a "my dad could beat your dad fight" especially if we go back to the older games.

I mean New Valyria had like a million men under arms and my Dothraki ate them alive, Qarth had dozens of Dragons and assorted shit because nobody was in that part of the world to pay attention as it ate empires. Westeros also had a bunch of dragon riders and large armies.

Like how do you bring in different factions when the games they were in just work differently. Like for the numbers game you can just argue that only a part of the faction came through but how do you deal with the fact that only a fraction is needed against some of the lower end factions.
 
Mortis Nuntius said:
I really think this whole concept is doomed because it inevitably turns into a "my dad could beat your dad fight" especially if we go back to the older games.

I mean New Valyria had like a million men under arms and my Dothraki ate them alive, Qarth had dozens of Dragons and assorted shit because nobody was in that part of the world to pay attention as it ate empires. Westeros also had a bunch of dragon riders and large armies.

Like how do you bring in different factions when the games they were in just work differently. Like for the numbers game you can just argue that only a part of the faction came through but how do you deal with the fact that only a fraction is needed against some of the lower end factions.
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I think appropriate moderation, part ISOTs and if necessary moderate editing of factions can solve any problems.
 
*grumble grumble*

I just want an order of back-stabbing morally grey Jedi Wizards in Qarth dammit.




Edit:But in all serious ess, as long as you have Dragons in ASOIAF games, your gonna have truly fantastical stuff like what the North has right now, because Canon ASOIAF is a world that has lost the magic when the dragons all died.

Looking at magic in Canon doesn't work to measure the impacts of magic and it's costs, when Magic has been incredibly diminished for generations. No shit it's going to cost so much and give so little, it's main sources, the dragons, have been gone from the world.

This of course doesn't explain the goddamn age of Heroes.
 
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THatWhichWillBe said:
*grumble grumble*

I just want an order of back-stabbing morally grey Jedi Wizards in Qarth dammit.




Edit:But in all serious ess, as long as you have Dragons in ASOIAF games, your gonna have truly fantastical stuff like what the North has right now, because Canon ASOIAF is a world that has lost the magic when the dragons all died.
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You realise that Canon ASOIAF also had the races defined by their magic use all but destroyed right?

The Children? Despite once blowing up a continent got the shit kicked out of them by cave men and are facing the end of their race.
The Valyrians? Blown apart with their entire continent when their blood magic finally failed them.
The Rhoynar? Their legacy is a plague.


Magic exists in ASOIAF, great and small it always has. But its not a good thing. Its not the Force, its not something that lends itself to Jedi its something completely beyond mortal comprehension and often utterly terrifying. I mean look at Harrenhal, or Wargs or Varys' background or anything to do with Valyria or the Others. The Return of magic is not a good thing in and of itself. There is a reason the Maesters tried to get rid of it.
 
Mortis Nuntius said:
The Children? Despite once blowing up a continent got the shit kicked out of them by cave men and are facing the end of their race.
The Valyrians? Blown apart with their entire continent when their blood magic finally failed them.
The Rhoynar? Their legacy is a plague.

Magic exists in ASOIAF, great and small it always has. But its not a good thing. Its not the Force, its not something that lends itself to Jedi its something completely beyond mortal comprehension and often utterly terrifying. I mean look at Harrenhal, or Wargs or Varys' background or anything to do with Valyria or the Others. The Return of magic is not a good thing in and of itself. There is a reason the Maesters tried to get rid of it.
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Yet their magic was good for centuries before that. If you can only call the Rhoynar's legacy a plague, then that ignores the impact their people and civilization have had on the history of ASOIAF, and the length of time Valyria was prosperous, and the Children of the Forest Helping build a wall to stop the Others. Magic doesn't HAVE to be a good thing, but that shouldn't stop people from having it BE a good thing.

If a magical accident destroys cities, magic should also be able to build them. If Magic ruins civilizations, it should also be able to save them. If Magic is a grand, neutral force, then it's only impact cannot be doom and gloom, because that is not grand unknowable, that is magic being a sentient force of dickery.
 
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THatWhichWillBe said:
But muh Magitech punk

Blood sacrifice reactors

Wildfire death-rays/flamethrowers

Rhoynish water magic turbines
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Even for me that's way too much.

Like sure it might work for some time, but you'll be exhausting your mages in menial, factory style work.

Ironanvil had an idea for a perpetual motion machine when I mentioned I could raise the dead. (Something I almost never did for obvious reasons.) Basically using an undead workforce that never tires and never sleeps.

When I approached Mina about it, I recall she said that the Children would be very against the idea, so I decided it wasn't worth antagonizing an ally over something that had the potential of going horribly wrong. Looking back on it, I am happy I didn't go for it. You heard what continued use does to blood mages and water mages. Imagine what it would do to necromancers?!
 
EliudFS1 said:
Even for me that's way too much.

Like sure it might work for some time, but you'll be exhausting your mages in menial, factory style work.

Ironanvil had an idea for a perpetual motion machine when I mentioned I could raise the dead. (Something I almost never did for obvious reasons.) Basically using an undead workforce that never tires and never sleeps.

When I approached Mina about it, I recall she said that the Children would be very against the idea, so I decided it wasn't worth antagonizing an ally over something that had the potential of going horribly wrong. Looking back on it, I am happy I didn't go for it. You heard what continued use does to blood mages and water mages. Imagine what it would do to necromancers?!
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Ever heard of Deep Rot?
 
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