@Tabula Rasa is there going to be a roll for the pact if we take it? And if there is can we use all the time echoes in our favor of said pact?
A Harry Potter Quest: He who was not
- Thread starter Tabula Rasa
- Start date
- Location
- Germany
But he would free a known murderer from his/her prison? It tried to kill him and is only now helpless. Even the changed pact only includes mention of harm to him and ignores everyone else it could and likely kill. But hey Jacob does not care about such things, right?
- Location
- USA
This is something to keep in mind, if it is Fae or Demon it will exploit any loopholes (and there will be loopholes considering our inexperience with Pacts).
This evil dungeon is going to be great for the exp if nothing else.
- Location
- Germany
This is a case where you know exactly as much as Jacob. I won't answer this one, all of this is past of the consideration.
There aren't going to be any rolls here. So, you don't really need to use them. You can use them when you choose to go deeper into the mountain next time, though.
Ok if these is a Fae or demon than making a pact and breaking it is a bad idea. Because than Jacob will still be on the hook for his part of the pack. We either kill it or make it our servant as we explore the expy dungeon of wonder. Also really Jacob should get some minions/meat shields for the exploring. No one we like and can afford to loose.
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Varder
Tired Cultist
- Location
- Hell
Is this how people understand that? To me it read more like the thing was protecting its home. Aggressively, yes, but given what happened with literally all other magical races, it's kinda justified.
Those DCs were strangely low though. If it managed to kill an entire group, it should have been much stronger than that, especially considering that Jacob has already been beaten pretty badly. But it's not like he actually suffers consequences for lost combat rolls so maybe that didn't matter.
P.S. Is anyone else surprised that Jacob was completely cold-blooded and calm when he tortured a living creature? I know I couldn't have done it at 13.
The creature has not left this place when it was free, meaning it has no interest in the outside world, and we do not know the nature of its encounter with the students it killed. It is possible that, either intentionally or due to a misunderstanding, they initiated hostilities and the creature attacked Jacob in preemptive self-defense, assuming he was like the last students it encountered.
You also assume the changed Pact would only include a clause not to harm Jacob, the clause could include not harming, killing, or otherwise inconveniencing any student, staff, or any persons otherwise associated with Hogwarts (maybe with a concession that it is permitted to non-lethally defend itself in the event that its life is in unquestionable peril). It could require that the creature does not leave or attempt to influence anything beyond its immediate living space. We have all the leverage here and the creature is desperate to escape its bonds. We could even threaten to leave the creature in its torment, only to return to reinforce its binding, so that it spent an eternity in suffering.
In theory, we add a clause by which the creature must fully and truthfully (without any deception, vaguery, or omission) its nature, history, and intentions and, should we still find it lacking, it will submit to either immediate execution or being returned to its apparently incredibly painful bindings.
Warmach1ne32
Machine of War and Quests
- Location
- Indonesia
Don't we have Imperio as Wizarding version of "Pact"? I think I also remember that there is a a form of contract that works kind of like this. I forgot if something like it exist in the Harry Potterverse, what that is but it is an equivalent to Nasuverse Self-Geass scroll. So I don't think it is worth it since the Wizarding world already have that option and we don't really need a familiar to do our bidding anyway. I mean what are we even going to use him for? So I'll vote for just killing him and give the book to Dumbledore, Learning Pact is not really worth the risk when Wizardry is soo multi-purpose once you are trained enough.
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- Location
- Where Jokes Die
Hoo hoo hoo hoo, this is FUCKING AWESOOOOOOOOOOOOME! WE GET FAMILIARS! Fucking FAMILIARS! I'M SO HYPED!
Don't really want our first familiar to be this abhorrent abomination, though. Can't find a moral justification to it, and it's likely some sort of Fae, and we all know how making deals with the Fae ends up.
Honestly I'm tempted to either walk away from it on the off chance killing it does something to us, or just putting it down outright and talking this whole Pact business over later on with a professional. Dumbledore or our parents; we can justify the former because of the dead students. Not sure about letter security with our parents, but I don't think the Ministry has any reason to begin searching letters just yet...
I'd also like to build a small marker for the deceased. What's your thought on write-ins, @Tabula Rasa?
Edit:
I actually want to try making a pact with either Peque (our owl) or Nelly the house-elf.
Don't really want our first familiar to be this abhorrent abomination, though. Can't find a moral justification to it, and it's likely some sort of Fae, and we all know how making deals with the Fae ends up.
Honestly I'm tempted to either walk away from it on the off chance killing it does something to us, or just putting it down outright and talking this whole Pact business over later on with a professional. Dumbledore or our parents; we can justify the former because of the dead students. Not sure about letter security with our parents, but I don't think the Ministry has any reason to begin searching letters just yet...
I'd also like to build a small marker for the deceased. What's your thought on write-ins, @Tabula Rasa?
Edit:
I actually want to try making a pact with either Peque (our owl) or Nelly the house-elf.
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Ok what I am getting is that humans are invading its home. This creature killed invaders into its home who had a book on dark magic. While yes the imp added to it magic is not really evil it is how you use it that is evil. I want to keep it and see what it does.
@Tabula Rasa if we keep it will it follow us around or do we only get it when we explore the dungeon?
@Tabula Rasa if we keep it will it follow us around or do we only get it when we explore the dungeon?
Chronobreak
Chara Appreciator
- Location
- Chicago
- Pronouns
- He/Him
Got some time on my commute.
There's really no point in killing this creature.
Let us not come at this situation from the perspective of a muggle, but from the perspective of a magus lord.
I see the sticking point clear as day. Grotesque and crude the creature is indeed, but the sticking point is that it has killed two Hogwarts student's, mutilated their bodies, and made a book.
Cleary, this is a wicked deed.
However, I'm willing to look past it. This is a dungeon. Within dungeons, there are monsters that may want to kill you, and whose home you are invading. This is just the way of things.
There's no great tragedy or surprise that these students died. They saw Helga's warnings, they thought they were hot shit, they got bodied.
This isn't an equivalent situation to Perenelle. Perenelle was actively malicious in her soul sucking. To be like her, Jacob would have had to commission the book himself. That's not the case. He stumbled upon a valuable resource and should be willing to use it unilaterally.
However, much like Perenelle, Jacob has the opportunity to learn the Dark Arts. Regardless of what happens to the creature, the moment Jacob puts a point in that skill, it's all over. He's a criminal practicing forbidden magic.
So the legal repercussions of the Pact are immaterial. Unless he burns the book, Jacob is gonna have to keep his activities a secret regardless. And there's a very good reason to keep the book, other than it being a shiny.
This Dungeon is a Dark place. And Dark must defeat Dark when your Jacob, because no way he can replicate the Power of Love that is the source of Harry's strength.
Morally, no skin off our backs. Hagrid, Hogwarts Groundskeeper, schoolteacher, and all around swell guy, is close friends with a clan of sapient, man eating spiders. Obviously, there are people willing to overlook these transgressions, even those of stunning moral character. I do not think sparing this Beast makes Jacob a bad person. What makes sense for a muggle does not make sense for a wizard.
Beside the obvious dangers of entering mortal combat with a creature that killed two Hogwarts students at once, betraying the creature would go against the spirit of the Pact. Magic is a living, breathing entity. A soft rule set rather than a hard one. It can make judgement calls, and I'd rather not betray the very essence of our brand new spell as our first usage of it. Very disrespectful to magic.
Sparing and recruiting the creature grants us a teacher, a navigator, and an inhuman ally, which Jacob has shown a fondness for. I like the image of Jacob with this creature bound to serve him more than me where he kills a potential source of knowledge out of obligation.
Jacob is not afraid of dying. He is not afraid of this creature before him.
To the fearless and persistent, to those of ambition and wit, options open that are impossible for others.
Let us cease the day!
There's really no point in killing this creature.
Let us not come at this situation from the perspective of a muggle, but from the perspective of a magus lord.
I see the sticking point clear as day. Grotesque and crude the creature is indeed, but the sticking point is that it has killed two Hogwarts student's, mutilated their bodies, and made a book.
Cleary, this is a wicked deed.
However, I'm willing to look past it. This is a dungeon. Within dungeons, there are monsters that may want to kill you, and whose home you are invading. This is just the way of things.
There's no great tragedy or surprise that these students died. They saw Helga's warnings, they thought they were hot shit, they got bodied.
This isn't an equivalent situation to Perenelle. Perenelle was actively malicious in her soul sucking. To be like her, Jacob would have had to commission the book himself. That's not the case. He stumbled upon a valuable resource and should be willing to use it unilaterally.
However, much like Perenelle, Jacob has the opportunity to learn the Dark Arts. Regardless of what happens to the creature, the moment Jacob puts a point in that skill, it's all over. He's a criminal practicing forbidden magic.
So the legal repercussions of the Pact are immaterial. Unless he burns the book, Jacob is gonna have to keep his activities a secret regardless. And there's a very good reason to keep the book, other than it being a shiny.
This Dungeon is a Dark place. And Dark must defeat Dark when your Jacob, because no way he can replicate the Power of Love that is the source of Harry's strength.
Morally, no skin off our backs. Hagrid, Hogwarts Groundskeeper, schoolteacher, and all around swell guy, is close friends with a clan of sapient, man eating spiders. Obviously, there are people willing to overlook these transgressions, even those of stunning moral character. I do not think sparing this Beast makes Jacob a bad person. What makes sense for a muggle does not make sense for a wizard.
Beside the obvious dangers of entering mortal combat with a creature that killed two Hogwarts students at once, betraying the creature would go against the spirit of the Pact. Magic is a living, breathing entity. A soft rule set rather than a hard one. It can make judgement calls, and I'd rather not betray the very essence of our brand new spell as our first usage of it. Very disrespectful to magic.
Sparing and recruiting the creature grants us a teacher, a navigator, and an inhuman ally, which Jacob has shown a fondness for. I like the image of Jacob with this creature bound to serve him more than me where he kills a potential source of knowledge out of obligation.
Jacob is not afraid of dying. He is not afraid of this creature before him.
To the fearless and persistent, to those of ambition and wit, options open that are impossible for others.
Let us cease the day!
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Nando
they, them
The Goblet of Fire is the magical contract thing in HP. And it's not really well-defined in canon...
And the
And Blood pacts are a thing, Dumbledore and Grindelwald had one, apparently...
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- Location
- Where Jokes Die
This is incorrect. The Dark Arts themselves are not (entirely) criminal. For the most part they're just frowned upon in Wizarding Society. It's the intent behind them that matters; you can use even the Killing Curse for a "good" purpose (such as when Snape killed Dumbledore to fool Voldemort, which was allowed since Dumbledore expected to die soon anyways and it was all part of the keikaku. TL note: keikaku means plan).
TlL;DR - Dark Arts are not inherently evil, and those who practice them are not cruel, conniving bastards one and all. It all comes down to intent. I think the only exception to the rule is the Horcrux ritual.
- Location
- Germany
Don't have time to answer everything, sorry guys. This one quick: What you are trying for is to have him help you I'm your titre explorations here. The imp will not cross into the Hogwarts section.
- Location
- Kazakhstan
I am more interested in other two members of the group. Their bodies are not there, so they are supposedly trapped the creature and either left or moved onwards. Why did they leave it alive? Did the creature tried the same deal with them?
I can think of one Slytherin student who learned to brand his followers in his latter school years.
Also, Jacob noticed that the creature resembles a house elf. Is the Pact the reason they are bound to wizards and serve them?
I can think of one Slytherin student who learned to brand his followers in his latter school years.
Also, Jacob noticed that the creature resembles a house elf. Is the Pact the reason they are bound to wizards and serve them?
Nando
they, them
Not sure if this intentional on our QMs side, but there are canon imps, and they sound way different from this creature: "Found only in Britain and Ireland, the imp has a slapstick sense of humor and will amuse itself by pushing and tripping the unwary."
I was using the Germanic version of imps which are let's Warner brothers Harry Potter/tinker bell and more assholes half the time . Imp - Wikipedia
In German lore they are not always evil but they are lesser demons. The thing is the students invaded its home and it killed the invaders. Also humans are the worst creature in the world. Always invading and enslaving the other magical races. While I am not justifying the Imps murder the students decided to explore a evil dungeon.
- Location
- SomeWhereElse
I'd rather not make a pact with an unknown magical creature in a spooky dungeon that a witch more powerful than us didn't want to explore.
Nothing about that screams good idea to me and the creature attacked us first only offering to make a pact after its life was in danger.
On the other hand I really want that book.
Nothing about that screams good idea to me and the creature attacked us first only offering to make a pact after its life was in danger.
On the other hand I really want that book.
- Location
- Spain
After skimming the fantastic beat section on the wiki, I think that the best matches we have for this creature are the Red Cap and the Erkling...
Besides that @Tabula Rasa Is there any reason we cannot take the skeletons of those poor dudes with us?
I mean human skeletons are fairly light, (between 10-14 pounds) and relatively easy to transport, so we could at least pack them in our coat/cape get them outside and give them proper burial...
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- Location
- Germany
We might think we are cunning with back-stabbing the critter after we free it, but I have the feeling the creature will be more prepared to act the second it's free.
The way it almost instantly jumped to this whole scheme makes me think it has a plan as well.
So let's be safe and just kill it.
The way it almost instantly jumped to this whole scheme makes me think it has a plan as well.
So let's be safe and just kill it.
Jacob is currently dead on his feet. The last thing on his mind will be to carry two skeletons all the way back to the castle.
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- Location
- Where Jokes Die
Not entirely sure about your phrasing here, do you mean Lily used Dark Arts to protect her son? If I recall correctly it was some bullshit "power of love" deus ex machina, which is really questionable (implies Lily somehow loved newborn Harry in that moment more than practically any other witch or wizard that ever fell to Voldemort).
The more I think about the more it seems to me that the imp (going with for now) was the wronged party. Let's look at the area. There is 2 dead students and a bound imp in cold iron chains. The thing that jumped out for me was the 2 dead bodies. But than they have a Book of dark magic. Ok Hogwarts once taught the dark arts not to big of a deal. But why do they have the cold iron chains. Some one planned to capture the imp and make it tell them stuff. It does not have much dealings with humans so it added to the book thinking that it could be used as a bargaining chip in the future.
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